Struggling With Play Time

[Animal Freak]

Maybe, but it kept happening. You'd think they'd either stop doing it or get used to it.

The problem with Frost is none of the reasons really make sense. He's been healthy, no signs of pain or anything. He lets me brush him and basically do whatever I want. He's friendly and has never shown signs of insecurity, nor has he been given reason to be insecure. Neither of the other two have actively aggressively towards him other than a few small hisses from Ash.

Well the boys get it, especially Ash. It happens fairly often. But it's never happened to Ember. Her fur is short, so there's not really much for it to stick to.

I would say Ash is definitely not backing down anymore. The other night I heard hissing, but didn't worry too much. However, by the third hiss I decided to go out and check on them. Right about then there was this yowling noise. The only time I've ever heard any of them yowl is when Ash wants attention and that's a loud, mournful sound. This wasn't as loud, but angry sounding. I've no idea if it was him or Ember, but I've never heard Ember make such a loud sound. Even her loudest meow is pretty quiet. I went out there to see them in the storage room. Ash was standing between the cat tree out there and the door going into the kitchen. Ember was by the litter box out there and was actually the one trapped. That's not a situation I come across often. Frost was also out there just inside the room. But Ash had plenty of escape routes. He could have gone up the cat tree or out the room. He chose to stay there. I ended up stepping between them to keep it from escalating as they were growling at each other and I doubt it would have ended there. Ash wasn't budging and Ember felt threatened. Even if he did leave, she would have gone after him. Once they were no longer stuck there, I fed them treats.

Last night was similar. Some hissing followed by some yowling. Still don't know who did it. Went out there to see Ember by the dining room table, but she wasn't completely facing Ash. It almost made me wonder if she ran from him. But they ended up having a standoff and I sat out there talking calmly to them. Ash was in the kitchen and I didn't went to set anything off by going by him to get treats. Ash growled at her though and she responded with a growl of her own. She did go after him and slapped him, but he didn't leave. Then she took off and went around the table just to come back, but stayed near the table. Then I went and got treats and freeze dried beef liver fixed everything. It's really amazing how they go from tense, can't be within ten feet of each other, to totally fine and eating within inches of each other in a matter of seconds. Food solves everything. There was still some tension, but nothing severe. Ember went over and sat right behind Ash. He didn't move, but you could tell he didn't like it. His ears were tilted and his eyes were narrowed and sometimes he look over his shoulder at her. But she walked away and all was well.

Other than that there was one more incident with Frost. I don't know what he did. Ash was on the couch next to me, Frost was on the floor. He did something. Bit Ash's tail or whatever. Ash jerked around and made an aggressive sounding meow. Ember got tense. He growled at her. She slapped him. Then it was over. I hope Frost stops that. It's all minor, but I'd rather he didn't add to the tension.

 

[calicosrspecial]

Hahahahaha, but we are not thinking like cats...................

It could be other animals/ferals outside. It is probably something. You are right though it doesn't sound like the other things.

I think it was bad luck. It shouldn't happen for a long while I would guess.

Interesting. I wonder how they got in that situation. It is interesting Ash was like that. But maybe he didn't want to turn away and be attacked as you mention. I like that he isn't backing down much anymore but I don't want him to bully her. You did a really good job of diffusing the situation. And anytime they avoid a negative encounter it is a positive. And going forward Ember should learn to be careful in that area so hopefully she doesn't get trapped again.

There are some positives in that situation last night. Of course we don't like standoffs with growling BUT he didn't leave when she slapped him and then she took off but came back (who comes back if they are feeling threatened?). Then they eat together!! POSITIVE. Making a situation into a positive. You stayed calm which helped them. And yes, Ash would be tense with Ember right there but again nothing happened. So overall a really big positive in my view.

Yeah, that will do it. And Ember would react to that. But at least it ended without incident. Sure a slap but it didn't escalate. That is a really big positive. Yeah, some cats like to instigate. I have a feral like that and of course the other cat doesn't like it. It is almost like teasing to get some play going.

It sounds like you are doing a really good job. Keep up the good work!! The instigation stuff should lessen going forward.

 

[Animal Freak]

True.

Maybe. It seems sort of weird that they could be bothered by animals outside, but they aren't bothered when I volunteer at the animal shelter.

I wish I could do something to prevent her from being trapped, but it's a narrow room full of stuff. Literally all the walls are lined with stuff. It's a dead end and I didn't even think about the only two escape routes being right across from each other. Block off one and you likely block off the other. But there's nowhere else to put the litter box either.

Yeah, I can definitely see the positives. However, I have to admit it actually scares me more than when Ash would run. I got used to judging how bad the situation was and if my presence was needed based on the noises made, so when I heard that loud yowling I thought something really bad was happening. But then I got out there and they're just staring at each other. And it's unfamiliar territory. I don't know what'll happen if they do get in a fight. Will Ash run if it comes down to it? Will it be worse than ever because he doesn't run? I just don't know.

But food definitely solves everything with them. Ember is extremely food motivated and they're all in love with these beef liver treats. They smell terrible, but they work. Everything else is forgotten as long as food is involved.

I'm sure Frost is trying to be playful, but it probably doesn't help Ash was sensitive about his back end area even before he got arthritis. It just got that much worse afterwards. And that's where Frost is targeting.

The good news is things seem... I don't know, calmer? It just... feels different. There aren't any major signs, but no more fights(knock on wood) and they seem calmer when their together. No snuggling or anything, but they've spent more time in the same room today than they have in a while. All three even ended up in my room together briefly. That usually only happens when they want fed.

Mixed news is Ember is even more of a brat than ever. It's sort of bad because she's getting on the counters and whatnot more, but I feel like it's a good thing too because she's getting up higher more and it seems like she feels comfortable to explore. I went out in the kitchen and turned the light on to see her in the sink. In the sink. None of them have ever done that before. I think she was getting food off of a spatula in there. Now we have to be careful about that. But she's also getting on top of my bookshelf every morning. It's kind of become a routine that I'd go in there to get my stuff to leave and she'll run up there to sit for a couple of minutes, looking down on me as I get ready.

Bad news is I don't know what to think of Ash at this point. A little while ago he peed on the rug I had in my bathroom by the litterbox. I couldn't tell what color it was though, but it was a somewhat small spot. However, I didn't know how old it was or how much was absorbed. So I threw that out and put down a puppy pad. He didn't pee on it for a while. We eventually even left a towel out. Nothing. Then I saw a pee spot on the puppy pad. It was a good amount and not a tinge of discoloration. I hate making assumptions, but I really don't think this is a UTI. It's way too sporadic. At this point he'd be peeing on basically any sort of bad or towel or rug he could find and it would be bloody. No other symptoms, no other issues.

Also, we're leaving. Not long. We're leaving Friday night and we'll be back Saturday night. But I'm nervous. It's been a long time since I've left them with someone else before and I've never left Ember with anyone but my mom. Stella is going to stay with my brother and his girlfriend and her two kids. We have someone else and her kid coming over to take care of the cats. I don't like leaving them with anyone, but leaving them with kids makes me especially nervous.

 

[calicosrspecial]

Typically it is the hormones they smell from outside cats vs shelter visits. And if they see as well as smell the cats that can have a big impact. It can be cats but also other animals.

Yes, all homes have that issue somewhere. Usually we go and use levels so that one can be on the floor and one can go high. Try to think as creatively as possible for that situation. But I know it is a tough spot. We all have those issues.

We don't know but with Ash standing up Ember will be less likely to chase/attack and therefore Ash shouldn't feel as threatened for his survival. Usually they work it out and not challenge each other and they avoid the fight (though they may make noise and even paw each other).

Yes, food is the best way to build trust among cats in my opinion. Being food motivated is GREAT!!! Yeah, the stinkier the better for cats. I look for the stinkiest food to trap ferals.

Yes, but Frost doesn't get it that it is not good. He thinks Ash is like the old days and playful. Ash will tell Frost not to do it though which Frost should eventually understand.

That is GREAT!!! Keep doing what you are doing because it is working!!!

Yep. sounds like 2 of my cats. Yep, bratty. My one girl goes everywhere she shouldn't and I can't change it.

Was it just outside of the litterbox? Usually when they go right next to it it days there is some negative perception with the box. Maybe someone scared him, maybe he had pain (from arthritis or something)? Doesn't sound like a UTI but keep an eye on him. I wonder if his arthritis was bothering him when he visited the litter box?

Well, it is only one day AND sometimes cat really behave when the parent is gone. I wouldn't worry as long as the people know cats. My guess is they will behave and do well. BUT they might be so excited when you get back that they may have excess energy they might get into it a little since they have excess energy from being so excited when you get back. BUT that happens all the time so it isn't something to worry about.

 

[Animal Freak]

Well, I'm glad they don't have a bad reaction when I volunteer. I enjoy doing it. It's almost surprising though, with how sensitive Ember tends to be.

Yeah, I just don't know. Maybe I'll try rearranging some stuff so they can go up on something, but there's just so much out there. It's a long, narrow room as it is.

They definitely seem to spend a lot of time sizing each other up and debating on fighting. I sure hope it doesn't go any further. They haven't been fighting though. In fact, Frost and Ash were playing. Well, Frost that they still were when Ash went trotting/running off. Frost followed and they went into the storage room. Ember ended up pursuing and I had a moment's worry that she'd attack because she tends to do that when they play. But she had stopped in the doorway and, while her tail was down, she seemed calm. I called her just in case though and she immediately looked at me, meowed, and came over. If she had been in that attack mode then she wouldn't have reacted to me.

I am finding that to be very true. Food changes their mindsets immediately. I can diffuse any situation as long as I have food in my hands.

Hopefully Frost will get the message sooner rather than later.

Lol. They are certainly brats. But oh well. I'm just happy she seems to be feeling more secure.

Yep. It was inches away. Too far to be accidental over the edge, but very close. I don't know. It happens so rarely that I don't think it's anything bothering him constantly. It was weird that he went on that carpet though. I almost made a vet trip right then because it's usually a bad sign when he goes on something other than a towel. It means he's getting desperate. It was weird for him to go on the puppy pad too. We've left them out before and he'd never used it.

Well, I can't say the people know cats. They only have a dog that they don't take proper care of, but their kid is excited to have the job. She's definitely one of the calmer kids, but it still worries me. She's young and I don't see her much to know a lot about her. There shouldn't be much to worry about though. It's one day, so even if they don't get played with or brushed it shouldn't be a problem. They barely play with me anyway. I'm worried Ember won't come out for them at all though. She's picky about who she comes out for. Then she won't get to play at all and will probably have extra energy. And she won't get any attention or have anyone to snuggle up to to get warm. But the cat-sitters are supposed to be coming over to learn about what to do.

The cats will probably be fine. They don't seem to have any problems if my mom and I aren't both here with them. That doesn't stop me from worrying though. Really, I'm not worried about how they'll get along. It's more of where the people can go wrong. And Ash is so sensitive. You have to be careful how you even touch him. Touch the wrong spot and you get bit. He doesn't bite hard, but it certainly doesn't feel good and it'll be worse if you try to pull away.

 

[calicosrspecial]

Yes, that is very good and tells me they are very secure/confident. Yes, it is great that Ember doesn't react negatively.

Just try to think of some way to provide another route if at all possible. I know it is hard.

Yes, cats will do that (sizing each other up). BUT when they choose not to fight then something is working. I am really proud of Ember for not attacking them when they were playing. And then she went to you and didn't get into a confrontation which is fantastic for all the cats.

That is so great and so important. Having something that distracts and builds positive feelings/encounters is so important. Keep using food to build trust.

Hahaha, yeah but he probably wont. Cats love to play and have fun even when told not to.

Yep. Total brats (at least in my household). I agree, it is really good that Ember is feeling that confident. That is a great sign.

When it is that close it could be a negative association with the litter box and typically is either pain or someone attacks them in the litter. Something like that. Now why it happens so infrequently I don't know. Usually it is more consistent if it was sustained pain. NOW it could be that Ember was around when he was going and maybe remembers her attacking him when he was in the box. Or a worker or someone scared him when he was in the box (or a loud sound) and there were workers outside at the time or some noises. It could be something like that.

As you mention it is just one day so it will not be that meaningful. They may just hunker down and then get excited that you are home. As long as they don't try to force attention on them etc and just lave them alone they will be fine.

Yes, they will be fine. I know, I always worry too. But things work out. Yes, making sure the people don't try to force any attention/petting/etc on them is really important so they don't have any worries or stress. I would just talk to them and let them know it is important to just feed them, give them water and clean the litter box and not try to touch them or anything. Now if they rub on them that is fine but not to reach out to them or anything. Just to let them be. Then when they come over with you around they can start to interact with them on a supervised basis.

 

[Animal Freak]

I'll try, but I don't know when I'll get around to it. It's been busy and it's going to remain a bit busy at least until after this trip.

Yeah, I thought it was great that she didn't get so tense and attack them. The fact that she responded to be me is wonderful. She gets in that focused state of mind where I can barely get an ear twitch from her. That's when I know she's debating on attacking.

I will.

Yeah, maybe. Though if it was going to be a worker I would have expected it to happen today. There were a bunch of people out there working on the road. They had our block blocked off and were rather noisy. But who knows? He's a cat. Cats will be cats. He does seem to have days where his arthritis is worse though. He's been doing okay recently, but it seems a bit back and forth.

I do worry about them trying to force attention on Ember. I'm definitely going to tell them to leave her alone unless she comes out. She gets fed in my room and she can stay in my room the whole time they're there if she wants. It would be good for Frost and Ash to get attention though. Ash doesn't always come out, but he never turns down attention. I'll probably try to find a soft brush. Then they can get the treat bag out and whoever is comfortable with coming out will. They know the sound of the treat bag. I'll show them the toys too so they can try playing, but they don't have to force it. I'd rather the cats didn't have pent up energy, but it's not a huge deal if they do.

Oh yeah! I forgot to mention that Ember and Ash were actually playing the other day. I worried for a split second that they were going to get in a fight, but I recognized the difference pretty quickly. It was brief, but still. It was a relief to see them interact in a non-hostile manner.

 

[calicosrspecial]

I don't think it is urgent so don't worry. Just keep thinking about it.

Yes, fantastic. That tells me that any problems are not that serious.

Arthritis would do it as it would be uncomfortable and then it could be a negative association. And if some days are worse then others it could just be a bad day. It could be that simple. It usually is pain driven when they go right next to the box.

Yes, everything on the cat terms. So if they know everything needs to be on the cat's terms and not to force attention etc then it will be fine. Yes, it would be nice if they didn't have excess energy but even if they are drained they be excited when you get back and something minor might happen. But I wouldn't worry about it if it happens because there is a good reason.

GREAT!!!!! YES!!!!! That is a great sign and they will be fine. I love to hear that. It is a time like this where a person knows all will be well!!! Fantastic!! Great work!!

 

[Animal Freak]

Sorry about my sudden disappearance. I didn't mean to. I had intended on getting on Thursday as my last time, but I was just so busy getting ready to leave that I didn't even get on my laptop until a bit late. By that point, I didn't feel like doing much. We got home around 6:30 last night and were exhausted.

I also thought of Ash's poop problems causing him to go outside the litter box. He was getting turds stuck to him rather frequently, but I honestly have yet to so a correlation. I think he's had poop stuck to him more often than he's peed outside the litterbox. I know he got a turd stuck shortly before I left(Thursday?) and peed on the puppy pad shortly after I got home(not sure when, but suspecting during the night last night). So I'm not sure if it's a possibility at all, but thought I'd mention it anyway.

If it is pain, do you think there's anything we can do about it? I mean, if we can confine it to puppy pads then it's not the end of the world, but I try to avoid throwing things away. I don't like being wasteful and sending everything to the landfills.

Well, everything has gone well enough since I got home. No fights or anything. Everyone is getting along fine. It's like nothing ever happened. Even Stella got over it rather quickly. I was worried because my brother's girlfriend had said that Stella had attached herself to her hip and wouldn't let her go anywhere without whining at the door. That's exactly how she used to be with me, so I thought she might revert back to that for a little bit, but she's done fine. A little more excited after we got home from the store today perhaps, but that's it. And Ember might've been a little clingier than usual, but honestly it's so subtle you have to look for it to notice. And even then it might just be me looking for a difference. The most noticeable thing, however, was that last night Ember would come over to me every so often and meow, but would only linger for a quick scratch on the head. She didn't really seem to be looking for attention.

But not everything went perfectly. I knew trusting those people was going to be a mistake. I never wanted to leave them in the hands of a small child to begin with. Her mother came over Thursday, but the child was busy and couldn't come. So I told her mother everything and I swear she interrupted me every five seconds. I knew she wasn't listening to me. But I thought it would be fine. I had intended on writing everything down anyway. I wrote the instructions on a notepad on the fridge, which mysteriously disappeared. I also put sticky notes on everything. I labeled the dry food, the wet food, which wet to feed when, and how much to use. I showed her to amount of glucosamine to give Ash which probably wasn't even enough. I don't measure at this point. I just kind of sprinkle it on. Well, she went ahead and fed them Saturday night even though it was too early and we had already told her she didn't need to feed them then. I came home to food piled in their dishes right up to the rim, though I'm surprised they hadn't eaten it. They aren't usually apposed to early meals, but we've never fed them that early. They had a ton of dry food even though I had specifically said(and wrote) that the evening meal is only wet except for Frost who only needs a tiny bit of dry in his to get him to eat. Ash's food was basically covered in glucosamine. It was beyond just a little too much and she says she "just kind of sprinkled it." Apparently we have very different definitions of the word "sprinkle." It was absurd. It should be common sense that one cat doesn't need that much food even without instructions. And it really bothers me that she went so over on the glucosamine. I had to look up if a cat could overdose on it and what signs there might be. Fortunately, it sounds like it's really hard to overdose on it and the symptoms are just diarrhea and vomiting, but there wasn't any information on what we should do if there are symptoms. But you shouldn't ever do that with medication. I mean, that could be deadly. It was a lot. Probably three times as much as what he usually gets and I think that's generous. And I did find some soft poop when cleaning the litterboxes, but not much. It was lucky that they hadn't eaten. Frost's bowl was the only one touched, so I was able to scrape out the dry food and fix it, but I'm surprised no one vomited their food up after gorging the night before. Unless she just didn't tell us they did.

Sorry to go on like that. I am, if you can't tell, very irritated by it. I don't trust easily and I was reluctant to let anyone take care of them. It's frustrating that the one time I do let someone else do it, it's done wrong.

 

[calicosrspecial]

That is ok, don't worry. I thought you might be busy before your trip.

It could be that. Anything that could cause a negative association. So it may be caught in his fur and it is uncomfortable and then he has to be brushed etc. And he gets a negative association. And since he probably only goes once a day it could be sometime after that incident that he goes outside. It is an interesting theory and it could be the reason. Try to keep it in your mind and see if there is any correlation.

Well, if it is pain then we would have to see the cause. It could be crystals. Do you know if he drinks enough? The vet has a solution if it is crystals. It could be his arthritis which the vet may have another idea to help in addition to or in replace of the glucosamine. See if there is any sign of him walking different or moving around or laying down differently. My best guess is that it is probably pain driven but the pain just happens fairly infrequently. If it starts happening several times a week then I would say we have to get him into the vet and see the cause. My second guess is that maybe Ember scared him when he was in the box or stared at him and he had some fear and that is why he goes outside once in a while. It doesn't seem like a UTI but always look for that.

That is great!!! It sounds like they did really well. That is fantastic!!!

Oh my. Well, the excess food is not too bad but the excess glucosamine that is not good for a number of reasons. It sounds like the cats didn't overdo it though. And I am glad that the risk of overingesting the glucosamine isn't too bad. It sounds like the way they acted when you got back was ok so they got through it but next time they will have to pay more attention to your directions. Whew, I am so glad they are ok. It is so hard to find people.

No, please, you do not have to apologize. I would have been so upset also. I know how frustrating it can be and how worrying. Sadly, this is so common. It is so hard to find someone you can trust and will do everything right. People just don't always pay attention because they are too busy etc. I know the feeling. If they weren't feeling well they would have shown you when you got home so the cats got through it. Thank goodness. Now they are in great hands again!!!

Are they still feeling ok? And acting normal?

 

[Animal Freak]

I'll certainly keep an eye out. It should be fairly easy to find out. We cut the fur off his back end before we left, so he shouldn't be getting poop stuck to him. I hope that's the reason. At least it would be an easy fix and wouldn't require a vet trip.

I have no idea how much he drinks. He's the reason we have two fountain bowls and increased the amount of wet, but he still finds a way to get UTIs. He gets about half of 3oz. can of Fancy Feast in the morning with a little bit of dry (very small amount) and I try to add a bit of water with it. I split half a 12.5oz. can of American Journey among the three of them in the evening. I almost never see him drink though. But at the same time, I'm gone most of the day and sleeping at night and there's no way I can see both the bowls at the same time. I'll keep an eye on him though. He's done fine thus far and hasn't shown any signs of discomfort. He let me brush him no problem last time. We just can't really afford to run a bunch of tests to figure out what the cause is. I wish we could, but it's hard enough dealing with his UTIs. So it would be best if we could at least narrow it down somehow.

It was a lot of food. Their bowls were completely full. It was enough for both of their meals and maybe then some. And I know at least one of them has a history of gorging and then getting sick. The glucosamine really freaked me out though. I had no idea what it could do at that amount. I just knew some medications could be deadly. I'm glad it's not one of them.

Well, I'm not giving second chances. It was hard enough trusting them the first time and they messed up. It could have been worse, but it was still pretty bad. Especially with this bunch. Ember is already overweight and will make herself sick, Ash has been obsessing over food and doesn't need anywhere near that much dry with his health problems... If they're left again I'll probably just ask my friend. I'll need to remind her to make sure she remembers, but she'll do what I ask.

It's definitely hard finding someone worth trusting. I have limited options too since I don't have many friends and I'm not close to most of my family. I'm glad they're all alright though.

They seem fine. I haven't been home long now, but no signs of illness or anything. Frost is using my arm as a pillow, Ember is on the arm of the couch, and Ash is curled up the cave/bed. Stella is sleeping at the end of the couch.

 

[Animal Freak]

I wanted to mention this before I forgot. It's not urgent, but important enough that I didn't want to take the risk. Well, I'm hoping it's not important at all. I should have noticed earlier and I sort of did, but I didn't think too much about it. Ash has been losing quite a bit of fur lately. I've been finding little clumps of fur all over the house constantly. Today he kept forming these loose knots in his ruff. They weren't tight, just barely formed. I was able to kind of tug them out. Barely any pressure at all. But it happened three times in a matter of hours and I was just pulling clumps of fur off of him. I vaguely noted there being fur everywhere last week, but wasn't too worried about it because it's not like he never loses fur. But it's not like he's losing the entire coat. It's just coming out in random clumps. I haven't noticed any extra fur when brushing him and I gave him a bit of a brushing tonight to check. It was totally normal except I got a clump off of his side which is unusual. His fur on his sides never knots.

I don't know what's causing it though. He doesn't seem stressed. He's been letting me brush behind his legs without a problem. It's been going on since before we left. There haven't been any issues between him and Ember. In fact, I saw him give her a bit of a grooming as she walked by today. He's been going for Ember's bowl(she doesn't leave anything behind) and he's using the litterbox in my bathroom, so he isn't avoiding my room. There's no change in his personality. He did get a little bit cuddling last week and was actually laying on/next to me, but I figured it was just because it was cold and Ember hasn't been cuddling with him. And it's awfully cold for him to be losing fur. It's not like it's spring when he blows his coat, which doesn't usually come out in clumps like this.

 

[calicosrspecial]

Yes, let's hope it is that. Keep an eye on it and let's see.

Usually each cat has a way of peeing that can be identified. Place, way, amount, things like that. Can you tell the difference between each of them? If so, can you compare how much he goes vs how much the others do? That is a good amount of wet food which should give him a lot of hydration. Right now it isn't happening often enough to be a worry but we need to watch it. It is good he let you brush him without issue but that wasn't right before or right after he went outside of the box, correct? It could be flaring up once in a while. Maybe next time he goes outside of the box try brushing him and see if he seems to be uncomfortable.

That is awful. Some cats will devour everything. But maybe they are not doing that anymore? Yes, thank goodness the glucosamine isn't a bad issue. Whew.

I think that is a good idea. It is too bad it happened this way. But at least the cats got through it without any issues.

It is so hard. Even friends and family are not always the best. It is very hard.

I am so glad that they are ok. That actually sounds really good. Everyone seems really happy you are back home!! That is GREAT!!

By the way, it is really cute Ash groomed Ember when she walked by. That tells me a lot about them. Fantastic.

I was going to ask about stress but in the next paragraph you don't think it is that. Honestly, I do not know what that might be. I would post on the Health section and see what others might say. I am sure someone has encountered that before. It doesn't sound too bad but it might be something (an allergy or something). Or an autoimmune thing but it doesn't seem like any of his behavior is different so it can't be too bad. But I would post and let's me know what they say. Usually if it is serious there are other symptoms.

 

[Animal Freak]

I honestly never even thought about that. It figures cats would be that specific, but thinking back on it he does always do the same thing. I can't say it's the same for every litterbox, but for the one in my room he goes in and faces the back and, when done, jumps over the (rather high) back in order to circle back around, crawl halfway back in to cover his urine/feces. That means he usually goes towards the front, so I will have to start keeping an eye on that. I haven't noticed the other two. I don't see them in the litterbox often. They all seem to go in the morning around breakfast time, but it's dark and I can't see. However, the amount on the puppy pads(and towels) has been quite a lot.

No, I can't say I brushed him around the times he peed and I certainly wouldn't eliminate the possibility based on that alone, but it seemed like a good sign that he lets me brush him. If I catch him peeing outside the litterbox again, I'll try to remember to brush him afterwards.

I don't know. Ash seems more obsessed with food than ever. It's amazing that they hadn't eaten yet. It was certainly too early, but they don't usually turn their noses to food. Especially not Ember.

Well, I don't know about them, but I know I missed them while I was gone. I know it's unreasonable and I've been gone longer, but there's something different about being so far away.

It was cute. They seem to be progressing pretty quickly now. They're getting along and it's been really peaceful. Even Frost doesn't seem to be hissing so much though it still happens. Sometimes Ember wants to play with him and he just wants nothing to do with it. But it's fine if it's his idea, of course.

Ash laid on my lap today. That makes three times in less than a week. Maybe something really is wrong with him. Lol.

I'll do that. I think it freaked me out with everything else going on. I'm afraid it's all related, but I just can't see the lines connecting the dots. But the timing seems off on pretty much everything. It's just that he's been targeting Ember's food even before Frost's now and I don't know if he's that desperate for more food or he just "discovered" her food and she finishes faster than Frost, so he has to get there quicker.

Speaking of Ash trying to get Ember's food, I witnessed a sort of funny stand off between them. Ember was almost done with her food since she finishes shortly after Ash. He went to get her food and did it slowly. Took a few steps, stopped, took a few steps, stopped. He just slunk his way closer and closer. When he got within a couple of feet of her, she looked up and stared at him for a moment before going back to eating. He got a little closer. She stared at him again. It got so intense I half expected a fight to break out right then and there and almost interfered. But then she gave this litter chatter-y meow and went back to eating. So he got a bit closer. Again, she stared at him. Then she gave another little meow and he actually jumped as though he expected to get attacked. But she just went back to eating. In the end, she let him get right up to her bowl. I didn't expect that. It was like she knew that, no matter how close he got, he wouldn't dare steal her food. And he didn't. He sniffed around her bowl and almost put his head in it, but then he just turned around and left. I'm glad I saw it though. Now I know he's not actually getting her food and it gives Frost a better chance to eat.

 

[calicosrspecial]

Just try to keep an eye on see how his compare to the others. If it is the same then he is probably getting enough hydration. It will tells us more about the situation and what it might be.

Ok. Yes, try brushing or really watching him to see if he has any sign of being uncomfortable. Do we actually know it is him? Are we assuming or do we know? Knowing how and where they go helps us understand who it might be. Sometimes we think it is one cat and find out it really is another. It is never easy.

Are they eating ok now? Normal?

Oh, I don't think it is unreasonable. It is very easy to really miss them fast. The bond is really strong. They really are a loved family member for many of us.

I think it is awesome. And cute!!! I love to hear that. Sure they have moments (we all do) but they have a fundamental love and respect for each other. And I don't get a sense they have any real fear anymore which is fantastic. It sounds like a wonderful family THANKS to what you have done. As a person adds cats it almost get exponentially more difficult. So the work you have done is fantastic. It is not easy. Hahahaha, yes, some cats don't always want to play but it is good Ember tried.

Wow, that is great. He LOVES!!! Wait until Ember wants to join in and you have them both on you. Yes, it does happen!! I think he just loves you.

It is tricky. Cats LOVE what isn't theirs so it is very common for a cat to want to eat others food. But it is tricky to know if it is that or something more. The key is to observe and see if anything is out of the ordinary. Since it is getting colder now he could just be more hungry to "bulk" up for winter. Just keep an eye on him and see if he is acting differently. Lethargic, etc.

WOW!!!! THAT is AMAZING!!! You did it!!! They are all good. It is those moments where we say "we have success". Of course they can still have ups and downs but it is just that. They accept each other. Wow, I LOVE this!!

GREAT work!!!

 

[Animal Freak]

I'll do that.

I guess I can't say I'm absolutely positive it's him, but it's extremely likely. He certainly has a history while neither of the other two do and they don't have any other symptoms that could make me think it is them. Especially with how long it's been going on. And I did catch him peeing on a towel once a little while ago which was too close together to be coincidence, but far enough apart I can't be positive. I can't really see either of the other two doing it without something seriously being wrong and there just haven't been any signs. I know they're good at hiding things, but it seems like there would have to be something.

Yeah, they're all as eager for food as ever. I saw Ember considering jumping up on the counter to get some chicken we had out. Would have been our fault of course, but I was proud when she came to me when I called.

They really, really are. Honestly, sometimes something happens or I just take a moment to think about it, and it surprises even me how much they mean to me. And that's saying something because I know they mean a lot.

I think we got lucky with them. I know they have their issues and they don't get along perfectly, but I realize it could be a lot worse. This site helped me realize that. I really do have this site and all the wonderful people on it to thank. You've helped me through a lot--not just with your advice but also with helping me feel better about myself and what I can do for them--and others have helped without even knowing it. I come here and read everyone else's situations and I realize mine isn't so bad. If I hadn't come here, I really probably wouldn't have three cats. I would have given up.

Lol. Yeah, I've already had Frost and Ash. Once I had Ash laying over my hip and stomach and Frost on my chest. So far Ember has mostly avoided being with me when other cats are around(though the dog is a different matter entirely--Stella she'll just lay on), but she does seem to be gaining confidence. She got on the printer on the computer desk today. I told her to get down. Repeatedly. She laid down, looked at me, and meowed. She did eventually get down to come get some attention though.

Alright, I'll watch him. He certainly hasn't been playing much, but I've bugged him enough to convince him to the past couple of nights. Not really running, but it's something. I have to dig some old toys out. If they aren't all broken. I've gone through three different ones recently.

Yeah, it was pretty impressive. I have to say, I expected Ember to be more protective of her food. But she's really been doing good lately. Getting into more trouble, but I'm okay with that if it means she's feeling comfortable.

 

[calicosrspecial]

Given that it sounds like it probably is him. Just keep an eye on them. Especially keep an eye on them when you find that he went outside of the box.

That is good. It is really good Ember listened. Wow, to go away from food is great!!

I know exactly what you mean. Sometimes we can take them for granted then we stop and realize how special they are. When that happens it is pretty cool. That realization. Hard to explain but I know exactly how you feel.

That is so sweet. Thank you. I don't think you would have given up on them. I know you would have figured out how to get them to get along. But it is really nice to hear that maybe some of us could help speed it along. Anytime a cat has a better life it really is a wonderful feeling. But it was you who really made the difference. You deserve the credit.

That is so cool. Yes, Ember is gaining confidence. It is not easy for a cat to come into a situation where 2 cats are so close. But you have done a really good job helping her get her confidence. Hahaha, sounds like a few of my cats to meow (like what do you mean I shouldn't be here). Hahahahaha

Does he seem different at all? In playing or does he seem more sensitive or cautious? Or is he just into it? Yes, they can be tough on toys.

It is really impressive and it says so much about them. Food is really the most important thing because it is survival. But when they share it tells you they care about each other and they are secure in their food source. It is fantastic. Yes, getting into trouble is a sign they are feeling more confident. Sometimes I wish mine were less confident !!! Hahaha, just kidding, I don't mind as long as they are going to get hurt.

 

[Animal Freak]

I will.

It's really impressive for Ember. She's highly food driven and she does love chicken. It was good chicken too.

It is hard to explain. It's something you have to feel for yourself to understand it and it's wonderful when you do. They're really amazing.

Well, if I hadn't found this site then it certainly would have been a lot tougher, that's for sure. I am very grateful for all the help I've received. I'm not much a people-person and tend to think of humans rather negatively, but I was able to find people that I can't think negatively about on here. Everyone is so kind and patient. It's very different from the dog forum I'm on.

She's a wonderful little cat. I couldn't accept doing anything other than my best to give her a good home. She certainly deserves it. Ember has taught me a lot about accepting them as they are and not expecting things from them. It makes it all the more special when they decide to lay on or even just next to me.

She's not quite ready to share me though. She's giving the boys this wide-eyed look because she wants to be on my lap and they're right next to me.

Ember has been getting into all sorts of trouble though! She now immediately goes into the laundry room and goes behind the washing machine. Fortunately she comes out quickly or, if not, then when I call.

He seems very bored. Like I'm the lamest person he could think of to be playing with. He comes into the living room and then sits there and does his best to ignore the toy. Though he gets pretty into it if I can convince him to play. And he's been playing on his own a bit. I saw him and Ember running through the house not that long ago.

They really are getting along great right now. All of them. Ash is getting snugglier. He walked over the dog and laid down right next to her, inches apart. He just laid on Frost though Frost has since left. And Ember has now decided she wants to be on my lap enough she doesn't care Ash is right there.

 

[calicosrspecial]

VERY impressive!!

SO TRUE!!! VERY special.

It is funny, you seem to social to me. The way you come across here is so different than how you say you are. It is very easy to view humans in a negative way but not all humans are. But the good ones like you are rare. The people on here are really great, I totally agree. It is too bad on the dog site. I wonder why? Dog owners (of which I am one as are you) are also cat owners a lot of the time. The tone here is positive so maybe the moderators and the tone of the site?

Ember is special, I can feel that. She reminds me of one of my own. Cats are unique and some are just special in their own way (not that the others aren't but in a different way). You are so right, it is important to see them for what they there are not try to mold them into something else. Their uniqueness is special. Yes, that trust and love (being next to or on a person) is really heart warming and special. I sometimes just look at them and melt!! Hahahahaha. They are pretty fundamentally wild so that trust is pretty special.

Hahahaha, well of course!! She really does sound like one of mine........

I know, everywhere you don't want them to go they will. At least Ember comes when called. 2 of mine have no desire to listen to me when they are where they shouldn't be. Even for food. They are so stubborn and strongwilled. You are lucky with Ember, you have done something right!!!

Hahahaha, he probably wants real mouse or bird. It is good that you can get him going though. Yes, another cat is always a good option to live prey. Mine were playing with each other so much today, I actually had to tell them to cool down. WILD is an understatement as to how they were.

That is so awesome. That sounds like how we dream it will be!!!

 

[Animal Freak]

I am very different in real life. Well, at first. I tend to do better one-on-one and online is a bit easier. It gets better with time too. We've been talking long enough that I'm pretty comfortable. And I judge people pretty quickly. I mean, it's hard to explain. I consider myself pretty open minded, but even online I can usually tell if I'm going to like someone or not almost immediately. So, if I'm talkative then that's a good sign.

The dog site is very unfortunate. I mean, I understand they want to best for the dogs. I totally get that. But they don't seem to understand that harshly judging someone immediately isn't how you convince them you're right and they need to change their ways. If you do things their way then everything is great, but if you don't then you're a terrible dog owner, even if it's only because your new to it and don't know what you're doing. I think part of it might be because dog owning itself is going through a transition. Everyone used to be pro-Cesar Millan, but now they're started to go against him, so you tend to be judged pretty harshly if you agree with him. Really, they have good messages, but they go about it the wrong way. The tone of the site certainly went wrong somewhere.

Oh, yes! Ember gives me that wide-eyed stare(I thought cats didn't like being looked in the eyes?) with all the innocence in the world. Even though she isn't all that innocent. Her meow especially gets me though. She has the saddest sounding meow I've ever heard. I wouldn't want her to be anything other than she is. Well, I'd like her to have all the confidence she possibly can, but other than that.

Lol. She's a funny little cat.

That's the boys. I don't allow them in the laundry room because they don't listen. Well, Frost will sometimes. It just depends on the situation and his mood. But Ember gets away with a little more because she's a slow explorer and she used to run off if I took half a step towards her when she would go in the laundry room.

Oh, I'm sure Ash would love a real mouse or bird. I remember the days we'd get mice. Waking up in the middle of the night to Ash growling under my bed because he had a mouse...I do wish they played more. With each other or with me. But they play sometimes. Ash usually goes running through the house at least once a day.