Small Cell Gi Lymphoma, Or Ibd + Polycystic Kidney Disease?

[alzycat]

Timmer Yoshi eats the Royal Canin High Energy GI canned food It really is expensive, especially at the rate she's eating. She's averaging about 1.5-2 cans per day (an underweight cat is only supposed to have 1.25 cans per day, and 1 can for a normal weight cat) but her vet and I agree that we should feed her as much as she wants while she has an appetite, because who knows what could happen with cancer and/or IBD.

I also want to express my condolences for your loss of Timmer. I'm sorry that his last day was so stressful but you really did the right thing by letting him go. In that moment he didn't know pain- all he knew was your unconditional love allowing him to be free, and I'm sure he's over the rainbow bridge now, being so thankful for this act of love

 

[Timmer]

@ alzycat - I was looking at that Royal Canin GI -- it is expensive. Oh for sure I agree feed the cat as much as he/she will eat. With Timmer, he was on prednisone. That will make them both eat and drink more. That's what our specialist said.
Thank you. Istill have a hard time every day missing Tim. It was helpful I got to talk to our vet on Friday again about it, because I was still so unsettled. He told me the outcome would have been the same no matter what or when he had been diagnosed. He wasn't responding to medication. At all. It would not have mattered if he had been diagnosed in the summer or at any time. Sometimes they don't respond. Just like people with IBD. Sometimes they don't respond to meds either and have to have their colon removed. It still hurts. LIke I went to buy cat food for my other cat today and started crying, looking at all the foods Timmer liked to eat.

 

[stephnstl]

Hi everyone, my 11 year old domestic long hair Yoshi was just diagnosed last night with either having small cell GI lymphoma (75% probability) or IBD + polycystic kidney disease (25% probability). I was hoping that someone could tell me their experiences with IBD and lymphoma, and if anyone could give me hope that she has IBD and not lymphoma.

Yoshi has been sick for about 2-3 months now. What started with diarrhea progressed to vomiting constantly and not eating. She had multiple blood tests, urinalysis, and ultrasounds done but nothing showed up being abnormal. I started treating her as if it was a dietary issue but no food helped change her diarrhea.

A few days ago the vomiting got even worse and she refused to eat anything. I took her to the vet yesterday to get fluids and gave them permission to run more tests. They did another urinalysis (came back normal), another blood test (came back normal), checked her kidney enzymes (came back normal), and finally did another ultrasound and took some x-rays. The ultrasound showed that her kidneys were abnormally shaped (this was noted before as well with her previous ultrasound, but since her kidney enzymes are normal the vets didn't look much into it), and one big change since the last ultrasound: her intestinal wall had thickened significantly. They thought that maybe they had missed this in the last ultrasound, or it just developed very fast.

So this leaves two diagnoses really: lymphoma, or IBD + polycystic kidney disease. Her abnormally shaped kidneys could be because of the lymphoma attacking her kidneys and changing their structure, or from the polycystic kidney disease. I know that the only way to get a firm diagnosis is with a biopsy, but the vets really don't want to do that with her because it's invasive, she's an older cat, and they believe her kidney issues would cause complications. Even with a proper diagnosis, she wouldn't be able to undergo chemotherapy because the damage to her kidneys will be rapid, and the chemo wouldn't really give her a better chance of surviving for a long time. It's also a very stressful and expensive process, and I don't want to have her last months (if it's lymphoma) with that much stress.

So the vet believes it is more likely to be lymphoma, based on the structure of her kidneys and her symptoms. BUT there is still the chance that it is IBD. What we're doing now is giving her anti-nausea medication, an appetite stimulant, and Prednisone. Basically the plan is to continue to try to get her to eat, give her the meds, and hope we can extend her life for as long as possible, as long as she is still happy.

Obviously I'm hoping that it is IBD and not lymphoma. Does anyone have any thoughts? I know that the chance of it being lymphoma is much higher, but I can still hope that she has years left with us. She's still at the vet getting fluids, but she ate a little bit and hasn't thrown up since yesterday afternoon (a big improvement). I got to visit her and she seemed very lively, cuddling, purring, meowing at everyone for attention. She did not look like a dying cat.

Thanks for reading, and hopefully someone can give me some insight about her condition. Even if you just have to be honest and reassure me that it is lymphoma, I would just like to hear some people's stories and opinions.

Your story sounds a lot like mine with Simon, but he was eating just fine and only had a few episodes of vomit. Mainly he had diarrhea for over a month and wasn't himself at all. You could tell he didn't feel good.

My little guy has suspected IBD. It's all an unknown without a biopsy but my guy is at least 15 and I won't do that. Because his lymph nodes were slightly enlarged they told me he could potentially have lymphoma, but the enlargement could have been due to the inflammation as well. So I'm where you are, in the dark.

I've done all the tests you've done as well and the only thing I have not done is an endoscopy, which would be less invasive than a biopsy. It would help determine if he has lymphoma I'm told. Simon recently threw up even after taking the anti-nausea and that's what concerned my vet to think there could be another disease at play.

My vet did the same thing:
1. steroid to calm the system down and help the inflammation in the gut (& it seems to be helping because his stool has been normal for several days now)
2. anti-nausea if needed

I think it will be a waiting game unfortunately. If your cat continues to vomit & have diarrhea even with the meds then I think that tends to point toward lymphoma. I know it did in the case of a colleague's dog just a couple weeks ago.

It's tricky. My guy doesn't have kidney issues, but my female cat did and I had to put her to sleep just a month ago. :-( She didn't have issues with vomiting or diarrhea. She just lost her appetite and therefore lost weight. So my situation is a bit different from yours. However, I have some food for thought that may help you.

Tips I have:

• Keep a close eye on her hydration, appetite and overall behavior. Write it down. For weeks I have been documenting Simon's urine spots so I can see if there are any major changes that should cause me to be concerned. I never paid much attention before but now I have to. If i know what's normal then I'll be alerted when I'm not seeing that.
• Buy a cat fountain to get her to drink more. That worked wonders with my cats. I got the Catit brand.
• Food recommendation: My guy was on Hills ID & I don't think that was working for him at all. I'm still not 100% happy with the quality of cat foods out there, even prescription, but it was recommended to me that I try changing to Purina's EN prescription food. They have dry & wet and I give both. So far so good. I hope it keeps up that way. The only problem is that he loves it so much that he begs for it constantly. My next step was going to be to contact a nutritional consultant because even though it wouldn't cure his disease I wanted to ensure I was putting the best ingredients into his body.

Other thoughts:
Steroids increases appetite and thirst so if she is also on an appetite stimulant then she's getting double whammy I imagine. I'd defer to your vet, but I think getting her to eat is crucial. Not sure what the calories should be though. Ask your vet about that.

I'm glad to hear that with the fluids she is feeling much better and that since home she is doing better. Dehydration is awful. IBD is a very frustrating disease that will drive one crazy trying to find the right treatment, food, etc. I read a lot of stuff online that got me even more confused and upset. Make sure you are happy with your vet - their expertise and compassion. They should be able to help you focus on the immediate problem to treat and have a plan of action going forward.

 

[Timmer]

Good advice Steph. The problem with my Timmer was that he didn't respond to the steriods at all. I can't remember if I posted it, but I had a good talk with my vet on Friday, because I'm still so unsettled about letting Tim go. He told do NOT feel that there was anything more you could have done. If he had been diagnosed months ago the result would have been the same -- he didn't respond to the medication.
I think you can give every food on the planet to help and that's great -- give them whatever they will eat and be happy when they eat -- but getting that inflammation down is key.
One other thing the GI specialist did was having me give Timmer a B12 injection once a week. That seemed to help the first two times we did it and the last time it was like nothing. Tim's only problem was that he couldn't poop. His colon had swollen shut pretty much. It all happened so fast, that was what was so shocking for me. And I felt so helpless.

 

[stephnstl]

Good advice Steph. The problem with my Timmer was that he didn't respond to the steriods at all. I can't remember if I posted it, but I had a good talk with my vet on Friday, because I'm still so unsettled about letting Tim go. He told do NOT feel that there was anything more you could have done. If he had been diagnosed months ago the result would have been the same -- he didn't respond to the medication.
I think you can give every food on the planet to help and that's great -- give them whatever they will eat and be happy when they eat -- but getting that inflammation down is key.
One other thing the GI specialist did was having me give Timmer a B12 injection once a week. That seemed to help the first two times we did it and the last time it was like nothing. Tim's only problem was that he couldn't poop. His colon had swollen shut pretty much. It all happened so fast, that was what was so shocking for me. And I felt so helpless.

Sorry, I think I got mixed up and was respond to an original post back on 2015. New to this site.
Sorry about your poor Timmer. It is a helpless feeling not being able to control a disease and all you want to do is help them.

 

[alzycat]

stephnstl You replied to my post from a few months ago Thank you for sharing your experiences! I've had a ton of progress with Yoshi and she is doing fine now. I'm actually going to post an update since we went to the vet today in just a moment

 

[alzycat]

Yoshi Update:

First off, I'd like to thank everyone for their continued input and caring about Yoshi. I'd also like to thank everyone for sharing their stories on this thread- we can all learn a lot from each others experiences and I have definitely learned a lot from everything that everyone has shared I'd also like to apologize for being somewhat absent from the site lately- I got pretty busy in university for a few weeks there but I'm on a break now.

Yoshi had a check-up at the vet this morning and she gained almost another pound this month She is now 8.3 pounds, and the vet determined that she is at a healthy weight for her size. Yay!

She is still having intermittent soft stools, and I told the vet about how I've seen it worsen throughout the day as she eats. She also thinks it could be an issue with the food (possible a chicken intolerance) so we decided to change it up to a novel protein once we're done with this batch. She also recommended feeding her less at a time to see if that helps.

But other than that, there has been no vomiting, no lethargy, she is still taking the pills very well and she is going to be getting the B12 injection once a month now. I feel like I've mastered giving the injection and can do it by myself now, and it's not stressful for either of us

She is on a maintenance dose of the pred at 1/4 a tablet twice a day, and she is doing fine on that dose.

So based on the fact that she is doing so well, the vet is kind of stumped on the odds of lymphoma now. She said that because of the way her kidneys looked on the ultrasound she was so sure that it's lymphoma, but her progress is going so well that it's getting difficult to guess what it is. She said we could take more blood or do another ultrasound to check on how things are going with her kidneys, but we decided it's not worth it since it's so stressful for Yoshi and wouldn't change the outcome anyway. She's doing great for now so that's all that matters She said that it's possible that if it is lymphoma, the pred could have put her in remission, but that would only last a few months. She said around April we'll be able to get a better estimate of what's going on, so now we just keep on waiting.

 

[Mamanyt1953]

I will take that! And thank goodness for it! Thank you so much for that update. I treasure every bit of good news we get from our kitties who are having health issues.

 

[stephnstl]

Good advice Steph. The problem with my Timmer was that he didn't respond to the steriods at all. I can't remember if I posted it, but I had a good talk with my vet on Friday, because I'm still so unsettled about letting Tim go. He told do NOT feel that there was anything more you could have done. If he had been diagnosed months ago the result would have been the same -- he didn't respond to the medication.
I think you can give every food on the planet to help and that's great -- give them whatever they will eat and be happy when they eat -- but getting that inflammation down is key.
One other thing the GI specialist did was having me give Timmer a B12 injection once a week. That seemed to help the first two times we did it and the last time it was like nothing. Tim's only problem was that he couldn't poop. His colon had swollen shut pretty much. It all happened so fast, that was what was so shocking for me. And I felt so helpless.

Poor Timmer. So sorry to hear this. It's torture seeing our sweet babies have to go through sickness and we can't explain it to them. It's such a helpless feeling like you said. We don't want our babies to hurt even for a minute, but unfortunately we are severely limited in our control over such matters. I keep telling myself I just have to love Simon in every way I can and give him the best quality of life that I can offer within my control.

 

[Timmer]

That's right Steph. That is all you can do, and I know that you are, because you are on here, asking questions and advice. It means you care. I had an alleged "friend" scream at me that I spent so much money on Timmer when I could have gone out and gotten another cat. 1. It's none of her business. In fact, she has no idea how much money I spent on him; and 2. How cruel can you be? We are no longer friends, needless to say. Some folks are clueless.
I hope it works out with your kitty. Have you tried the B12? He really did feel good after getting those. I gave him the shots at home, once a week. Then the chemo was every 72 hours and he got 5 mg. prednisone every day.

 

[Mamanyt1953]

I had an alleged "friend" scream at me that I spent so much money on Timmer when I could have gone out and gotten another cat. 1. It's none of her business. In fact, she has no idea how much money I spent on him; and 2. How cruel can you be? We are no longer friends, needless to say.

Good God. Well, in her world, friends are replaceable, and sure enough, she was replaced.

Yes, Steph, here we all do everything possible for our cats, as you are doing. That candle is staying lit!

 

[Timmer]

Good God. Well, in her world, friends are replaceable, and sure enough, she was replaced.

Yes, Steph, here we all do everything possible for our cats, as you are doing. That candle is staying lit!

View attachment 220363

Amen, Sister!

 

[alzycat]

Hey everyone.. decided to make my monthly appearance on the site tonight I do still love this site but I've just been so busy lately it's hard to make time to come on. But my lack of posting should indicate that Yoshi is still doing fine, & she is It's April now, & that's when the vet said we'll get an idea of what's going on since it's been about 5 months since her "diagnosis" but it has been over 6 months now since Yoshi's symptoms started. She is still doing great! We haven't been back to the vet since February but I'm pretty sure she has gained more weight (she's actually getting a bit on the chubby side!) & her symptoms are still pretty much gone. She does have an episode of hairballs/vomit about once every few weeks, but it's always a small amount and she bounces right back afterwards. She is still having those intermittent soft stools... I tried to change her to a novel protein, very slowly introduced it, but she threw up twice in a few days after she started eating it so I put her back on her old food. Oh well- this might just be a thing that doesn't go away She doesn't seem to be bothered by it at least, and it's only every few days. Other than that she is playful, cuddly, and doesn't seem to be in any pain. She's still on a maintenance dose of 1/4 tablet of Pred 2x a day.

 

[Mamanyt1953]

~does happy dance (with walker, yet!)~ Oh, this is excellent! So far, so very, very good!