Small Cell Gi Lymphoma, Or Ibd + Polycystic Kidney Disease?

[alzycat]

Hey everyone, I have some updates on Yoshi since she had her check-up at the vet today.
She has gained 1 pound in 2 weeks!! I am so happy. Her vet did a physical exam & said everything seems good, she said that it still feels like she has some liquidy stool in her, but her poops have been solid around 90% of the time so she said that's a great improvement. She still does have pudding poops every couple of days, but this is a huge improvement from diarrhea for months straight! She hasn't throw up for weeks now as well which her vet was very happy about. Her vet also reinforced everyone's advice on here, saying that she should just eat as much as she wants, & that I shouldn't worry too much about that hairball last week.

The plan is to keep her on the dose she is on now for another 1-2 weeks, and then cut it down to 1.25mg of the Pred twice a day. Her vet said that's when we'll really get an idea if this is lymphoma or IBD- if she reacts badly to the dose getting cut down, it's most likely lymphoma.

I also have to start giving her B12 injections I'm pretty squeamish so this is a little daunting for me. My vet did one with me though tonight & showed me how to do it, & then let me try one with just some saline & I did it! Yoshi was also an angel & didn't struggle at all, so that helped. They will just be once a week for 3 more weeks, and then onto a maintenance dose of once a month.

So good news all in all really! We don't have any definite answers yet but I'm just happy that she gained weight. Now we just have to wait to cut down her dose & see how she handles that.

EDIT: I forgot to mention that I did ask my vet about Leukeran, & she said she doesn't have a lot of experience with chemo drugs (she's pretty young), but has a wide range of sources of specialists and other vets who do. She said it really depends on my comfort level for if I'd be willing to let the vet give her something that the vet herself wasn't too familiar with. I said that we can just talk about that if the time ever comes where she may need something more than the Pred, but for now I didn't need a ton of info. If it ever comes to that then I'll ask other vets or get referred to someone else who knows more.

 

[artiemom]

Great News!!! so happy for you guys!!!

 

[Ginger Tabby]

Thank you. I'm glad that Yoshi is doing okay. The experience we have with our kitty may not be helpful to all because all kitties are different, but it's always good to share.

 

[Mamanyt1953]

What great news for Yoshi! Still that question, but...she is eating and gaining weight! Even if she should require chemo, the better shape she is going in, the better her prognosis overall! SO...we are going to keep candles lit that we are on the road to having this licked, but be mindful!

You will get used to the shots in no time flat! Just ask artiemom ! She was a bit concerned about doing the sub q's at first, and now she does them like a champ.

OOPS! Better get that candle going!

 

[alzycat]

Hey peeps.. I'm not really sure why but I have been super worried about her lately. She still seems to be doing fine; eating a ton, playful, but I haven't seen a solid poop from her in a couple of days & my dad told me that he saw her throw up a few days ago I took away the dry food I was leaving out for her just in case her tummy is too sensitive for it.. but I'm disappointed that she got sick & that she is having pudding poop again I'm worried that these are signs that her health is going downhill. Am I overreacting? Would it be normal for her to have some pudding poops and still vomit occasionally with IBD? I just can't shake the feeling that this is cancer.. for some reason I have a feeling that I just "know". I'm trying to enjoy my time left with her but I'm having anxiety of "knowing" (or at least feeling) that her time is running out. Just wanted to vent about that..

 

[artiemom]

Oh No...

Vomiting is pretty much a 'given' with IBD.. anytime.. and so are furballs...so hard to tell the difference..just have to wait it out.
Pudding poop would be a bit more towards the IBD line of thought.

I think I would talk to Yoshi's vet about this..Is she very experienced dealing with a cat having a diagnosis of IBD?? That is a big question; also, is there a specialist around where you can go for a second opinion, and one who is a bit more versed in IBD? I am thinking anInternal Medicine Specialist. I would take a copy of all of Yoshi's records, including a copy of, not just the reports of any x-rays.

I honestly feel that you need the reassurance of a specialist. I mean it. It could help you so feel better... and be a huge aid to Yoshi.

It could mean that Yoshi needs a bit more medicine. I forget what dose the pred is at, and the cerenia.

If you are not giving Cerenia daily, I would definitely do so.. run that by your Vet. Sometimes you need a bit of Zofran also --that is given twice a day.. but daily Cerenia could be enough.
And daily Pepcid AC is a good idea also. The usual dose is 1/4 pill twice a day.. I give 1/2 pill once a day..

And are you giving Yoshi a Probiotic. I really do feel that helps with pudding poop, primarily when you are feeding regular non-novel protein foods.

When Artie is flaring, I will give him a Cerenia, along with the pepcid.

Are you doing sub-q fluids.. these can help Yoshi feel better, especially if she is vomiting and having pudding poop. She could be a bit dehydrated..

As far as not pooping.. the dry food could be a cause of that also.. Can you try to feed Yoshi canned food? Dry food is really not good for IBD. Or will Yoshi eat some pumpkin?
Make sure it is the plain pumpkin--not the pie filling with additives.
Or pick up a jar of baby food squash..

Also, what dry food are you feeding? Yoshi could have an allergy to one of the proteins or one of the ingredients in the food--even if it is a highly rated, or high price food.

Have you tried a novel protein food? If it were me, I would.. just to see if it would help things out.

IBD is a very vicious, confusing, stress inducing disease; just when you feel it is under control, BAM, it returns with a vengeance. It is so frustrating.

There are many good days, with bad days in-between . You just need to find the correct
"Formula" for Yoshi... it is a lot of trial and error.

As far as it being cancer; my thoughts.. IBD can morph into Small Cell Lymphoma. It is not always a definite possibility, but it can..

Please do not focus on that.. IBD and SCL are treated in just about the same ways.. If the IBD is not under control with meds and food, then the option is for chemo, irregardless if it is SCL or not.

This is why I am suggesting you find a specialist. An Internal Medicine Vet. IF there is a Vet school near you, then you should have access to one. I just feel this is important for IBD treatment and for all other serious diagnosis that a cat may have. These Vets have been trained as a regular Vet, then have gone on with specialized training in an entire host of weird diseases~~ they are specialists and can come up with some phenomenal treatment plans.

Definitely call Yoshi's Vet and ask her what for advice. We can tell you a bunch, but ultimately, we cannot prescribe... you know that.. just saying...

On the positive side: Yoshi is eating, playing, running around.. that is awesome! a Sick cat will not play.. please remember that.. my IMVet always has to remind me of that.. and that a very sick cat will not be eating and drinking.. I kind of need to put things in perspective..

((Hugs)) and hopefully this helped a bit...

 

[alzycat]

artiemom Thank you for the help. She isnt on Cerenia or anything like that now since there hasnt been a need- that was the first incident of vomit in almost 3 weeks & she has been eating fine so i assumed she wasnt nauseous.. I will talk to my vet about it though & see what she says. There is an internal vet near me, but i just dont know what else they could tell me.. Im not doing a biopsy or chemo so I'm not sure what it could change. You're right though, they would probably be able to prescribe or tell me things my regular vet can't. Ill look into getting an appointment with them, especially if she doesn't have a solid poop soon. The only issue is that it's too far of a drive for Yoshi- it would be way too stressful for her, so it would just be me going to talk to them.

She Is eating primarily wet food, and has been for a few months now. I was just leaving dry food out for her in case she got hungry during the day when I wasn't there, but I took it away once i found out she threw up. Right now she is only eating the prescription wet food, around 1.5-2 5.8oz cans a day at 180 calories per can. I tried to give her pumpkin but she really hates it.

She isnt getting sub q fluids but I dont think she is dehydrated.. She is eating a ton of wet food. I dont really see her drink from her bowl too often though.

I did try a novel protein but she just loves the wet food from the vet so she refuses to eat anything else really :/ I just figured I would keep feeding her the food she loves and eats the most of so she can gain more weight. I have S. Boulardii for her but haven't given it to her in a few weeks. I was going to this morning but on the bottle it says to "talk to a health pracritioner" if you are taking it & have a suppressed immune system.. Would she have a suppressed immune system with her condition? I give her fortiflora because she loves the taste of it but i know it doesn't do much.

I appreciate your kind words.. I know that she is okay right now but my mind cant stop imagining the inevitable.

 

[artiemom]

Oh Sweetie, I feel so bad for you.. you are really stressing yourself out. Please try to relax a bit.. Yoshi can pick up on your vibes..

Ok.. Let's see: Paramount with getting an appointment with an Internal Vet Specialist is taking Yoshi in for an exam. Yes, I know it will be stressful, but sometimes it is needed.
How far is the IM Vet? I drive my guy 50 minutes to see his, sometimes a bit longer.

Can you buy some Feliway Spray, spraying it into her carrier about 20 minutes before putting her in it. I also keep the carrier out, in plain site 24/7 so Artie will get used to seeing it, and not freak out when it is time for the Vet. I also cover the carrier with a tower or blanket while we are in the car.

Yowling is just a normal occurrence of taking a cat to the Vet.. It is nerve stressing to us, but it is just something that you have to deal with, in order to provide good care.

Run this idea over with your regular Vet. She may agree it is a good idea..at least to settle you mind and help you with understanding things.-- just my opinion..
Actually, my regular vet feels it is great that I am taking Artie to a specialist. I give her updates. She loves the fact that she can even learn things through Artie's medical care.

It is sometimes really good to have some Cerenia on hand, just for times like this.
Pepcid AC is also another drug that you can give daily, if you are not already.

Eating 1.5-2.5 cans a day is awesome!! good appetite. I would want it to be less than 1.5 cans a day.

Yoshi is eating, great---not dehydrated, no sub-q's...

S. Boulardi is for diarrhea. I do not think I would use it for just pudding poops, unless it goes on for a while. I would try a good probiotic, to start with.. something like Proviable.

If you do decide to give the S. Boulardi, begin with just a tiny bit, sprinkled on her food.Go slowly with it.

FortiFlora is not a great probiotic.. it is ok,, but not all that good. Many Regular Vets usually use that as a go to.. but in actually it is not all that great. It contains 'animal digest'.. who really knows what that is made up of..

I hope I am not stressing you out.. not my intention to do so..

I will suggest a FaceBook group, to join: IBDKitties they are awesome. A great, helpful group of people, who all love their kitties.. and have tons of experience.
Their website is: IBDKITTIES.com An enormous amount of information on IBD. It is like an encyclopedia for people who have IBD cats.

((hugs))

 

[alzycat]

Thank you so much for your help artiemom , and sorry for being absent for the past couple days. I needed a couple of days to just try to come to terms with the situation & monitor Yoshi more closely. I don't want to get too personal, but I do have an anxiety disorder so times like this are always a bit tough (as they are for everyone). I also haven't experienced a lot of loss yet in my life (thankfully)- my two childhood dogs passed away within 5 weeks of one another last year, and that was really my first experience with losing a lifelong pet. As much as I loved them and I grew up with them, they were the "family dogs", while Yoshi is only my cat, and my first lifelong pet that I have been the majority caretaker for. I've seen people on here use the term "soulmate kitty"- that's definitely Yoshi for me. It has just been a very new experience to me to be dealing with a sick pet & trying to understand her mortality while being the sole person making decisions regarding how the rest of her life is going to be.

I took at step back & tried to get the negative thoughts out of my head and really just monitor Yoshi more objectively. That incident of vomit last week was still the first, and there haven't been any since, so I'm taking that as a good sign. I suppose that I need to remind myself that a sick kitty will vomit every so often, whether it's cancer or IBD.

She also is having mostly solid stools again once I took away the dry food, so that's good. She is still healing so I think I need to be more patient with her progress & not get down in the dumps (no pun intended) when her stools aren't perfect. If it is IBD, it'll probably be a long, frustrating road (as it has been for many people- you included) to find the things that don't upset her tummy at all.

I'm supposed to go back to the vet for a check-up for Yoshi in a few weeks, so as long as she seems okay until then, I'll wait to talk to the vet about all my concerns until her appointment. She seems better now that I took away the dry food, so maybe her tummy just didn't like it. Where can the probiotic you mentioned be picked up? Or do you order it online?

You definitely did not stress me out I just need to be more patient I think, & not expect the steroid to make everything perfect right away.

 

[PushPurrCatPaws]

alzycat - are you keeping a diary of Yoshi's daily health, etc.? As long as you don't get overly involved in taking health notes, I've found that it is really helpful to document when this/ that/ the other happened, what was fed when, and so forth. When I've had a lot of anxiety over some health issues (like with my last cat), I found that keeping a "health and medicine/ food diary" really helped to vent the stressful feelings. And an added bonus was that I could relay detailed things to the vet when needed.

 

[alzycat]

PushPurrCatPaws No I haven't been doing that, but that's a great idea! I'll get started on it today

 

[artiemom]

Glad you took some time to 'step back'. I have to do that occasionally, also..

Yes, you do have to be patient with IBD; and as I have to keep reminding MYSELF, that normal kitties do vomit!! They have the periodic fur ball or just an 'off' day. Please remember that.

The probiotic I am using is Proviable. You can order it from Chewy.com much less expensive than getting it at the Vet.

Forti Flora, while advertised as a probiotic, is really not a good one. Yes, cats do love the taste of it. If you have it in the house, you can use it as a 'topper' for days when Yoshi's appetite is low.

Yoshi may be allergic to an ingredient in the dry food. They are notorious for having a ton of stuff added, to make them palatable for cats.

I think PushPurrCatPaws had an excellent idea about journaling Yoshi's responses.
I do that myself. I have one calendar for poop, one for food and I have a flow sheet for Artie's daily medications. Do not let yourself get carried away with documenting things..
I know I can, and it becomes a huge mess ~~ I can understand it at the time, but try to explain it is horrendous because I have too many things going on. Try to simplify it.

And Please try to just enjoy Yoshi.. enjoy her good days.. when she has a bad day, please do not automatically jump to the conclusion that she has cancer.. Please..
Be good to yourself.. Remember, Yoshi is a sponge.. she can feel your anxiety.. I understand.. Artie is always near me when I am sick or upset.

I see you posted while I was typing. I will check out your thoughts.

 

[alzycat]

artiemom I'll look into getting Proviable! Thanks for the info I'll try not to get too wrapped into documenting things- probably just how much she eats in a day as well as how her poops are going. Luckily she doesn't have a ton of meds right now (just the pred and b12) so that's easy to keep track of. It'll be a great way to see if she changes as well when I cut down the Pred next week.

You're so right that I shouldn't jump to that conclusion. It's hard to keep out of my mind but really is unrealistic to assume when she just has one little incident. I just realized that she also eats pretty fast so that vomit could have been from that too.

Thanks for the help, as always

 

[alzycat]

Okay.. she just threw up again It looked like her food that she ate a few hours ago, and smelled like it too. She let out this loud yowl before vomiting, which I've never heard her do before. There was a lot of vomit

She was shaking afterwards too... that was about 15 minutes ago and she seems a bit better now, but I've never seen her shake before. She didn't ingest anything that could have been poisonous; I've been with her all night.

I was contemplating taking her to the emergency vet in case she was in pain and needed something to help her, but she seems better now... tired, but not shaking. I'm supposed to feed her in 15 minutes and give her the evening dose of Pred but I don't want her to throw up again

 

[PushPurrCatPaws]

I'd really recommend a re-check with your vet. If she's not on an anti-nausea and not being given fluids anymore, and vomiting, etc., I think the vet needs to know about this.

 

[artiemom]

I have to agree with PushPurrCatPaws Yoshi needs an anti-nausea med, and most likely sub-q fluids... she is probably dehydrated.

Your Vet needs to know of this, and needs to give you the proper meds...

She needs to be on anti nausea... and perhaps steroids... for a while.. not just for a day or two.. she needs to be on it for a long time--weeks, to get her insides time to calm down.

 

[alzycat]

artiemom and PushPurrCatPaws , I called my vet this morning but she is unfortunately away until Monday. They have on file that she was on anti-nausea meds before so the receptionist is going to talk to another vet to see if they can prescribe them- she said they would call me back later today.

After she threw up last night, the shaking stopped after about ten minutes.. she wasn't hungry about an hour later when it was time to give her the Pred, so I had to ball it up in some cheese, but she did eat it. A few hours later she was super hungry again & ate half of a can, so she did eat the normal amount yesterday. She also hasn't had any diarrhea- solid poops only for the past few days.

She was really affectionate and cuddly this morning but her appetite wasn't too great (she did eat a lot last night before bed though). She probably ate around a quarter of a can or maybe a bit less, but she ate her dose of Pred so hopefully that'll get her appetite up. My boyfriend is home so he will try to feed her again soon.

Today is also the B12 day so hopefully that'll perk her up when I give it to her tonight- otherwise, hopefully I can pick up some meds for her, & I'll talk to them about sub-q fluids too.

Thank you both for the help

 

[Fuchsiaslove]

I agree with them about the anti-nausea and the sub-q fluids! That being said, Edgar is on Cerenia but was still smacking and walking away from food, seemingly nauseated, Mon-Wed morning. After sub-q fluids and Cerenia by injection he came home ready to eat. I think his appetite came back due to the fluids, but he still needs to be on Cerenia-because he's getting chemo. As long as she's eating something is good! I add water or broth to Edgar's food. Just a Tablespoon or two each meal.

 

[alzycat]

Well, the other vets at my clinic said that I could bring Yoshi in to get an injection of Cerenia, but they weren't comfortable sending me home with pills until they confirmed with Yoshi's vet (this was on Thursday). I said that I would, but once I got home, Yoshi was waiting by the door meowing like crazy at me asking for food, and she ate a whole can in one sitting! I actually took it away from her because I was afraid she was going to throw up just from eating so fast! I decided to cancel the injection because she seemed to be feeling better, and I'm more comfortable waiting to talk to her primary vet anyways.

Since then she has been great again- maybe the B12 shot is helping her feel better. All weekend she has been eating around 2 cans of food a day, pooping normally (all solid), and has not been sick. This cat has me on a roller-coaster of emotions

Her primary vet is going to call me on Monday, so I'll fill her in on the vomit on Wednesday as well as the decrease in appetite Thursday morning, & I'll see what she says & go from there

 

[Fuchsiaslove]

Hi! I hope your talk with the vet goes well. That's good news about Yoshi getting her appetite back again. I'm with you on the roller-coaster

To answer your question, I totally spy on Edgar's poop's. It may be constipation because he is refusing the commercial cat food again and his poop is always smaller when eating meats. I know when it hurts him because he goes right next to the toilet. When the poops are normal he goes in the box. He has only had diarrhea a few times in, almost, 9 years. I'm going to look into adding some psyllium husk to his food. It is hard deciding what to do or what is right. Sometimes he flat out denies food with supplements and I don't know if it's from nausea or the added supplement. I miss the days of raw feeding when he just wolfed it down the second I released it.

Thinking of y'all and wishing you an up day!