Rivel hardly eating after visual introduction to new cat :(

[Hoboforeternity]

So today i got them relax around each other. With me as mediator. Rivel only hissed once, but i talked to her gently and slowly patted her head, while silver is just relaxing. Sleeping around each other is a great sign right?

They aren't fully asleep, they opened their eyes occasionally to peek each other but this feels so good.

All those extra work is finally paying off. I'm not confident leaving them unsupervised, but comes 2021 they probably will come to tolerate each other. Hopefully.

Also i am leaving the door open all the time again except Rivel's feeding time because she's always antsy about food.

 

[calicosrspecial]

Well, rivel would eat the new food that's been in the fridge overnight. That's that i guess. Just bored. The freshly opened food probably smells too good to resist, but since she ate the refrigerated version most of the time she had enough of that.

Great!! Cats can be like that. I know my inside cats are sometimes and my outside feral colony is terrible and gets bored easily.

I am so happy Rivel is eating well again.

Great job!!

 

[calicosrspecial]

So today i got them relax around each other. With me as mediator. Rivel only hissed once, but i talked to her gently and slowly patted her head, while silver is just relaxing. Sleeping around each other is a great sign right?

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They aren't fully asleep, they opened their eyes occasionally to peek each other but this feels so good.

All those extra work is finally paying off. I'm not confident leaving them unsupervised, but comes 2021 they probably will come to tolerate each other. Hopefully.

Also i am leaving the door open all the time again except Rivel's feeding time because she's always antsy about food.

WOW, they are GORGEOUS!!! Oh I LOVE them so much!!!

"So today i got them relax around each other." - Great

" With me as mediator." - Perfect. You are giving them confidence and helping them have a Positive Encounter. Great job!!

" Rivel only hissed once," - That is fine. Hissing is communication and as long as Silver respects the communication then it is fine.

" but i talked to her gently and slowly patted her head" - Exactly the right thing to do. Reassure, make it positive. As long as you are safe and not at risk of being hurt.

" while silver is just relaxing." - Wonderful. Silver is showing Rivel that Silver is not a threat, doesn't want to harm.

"Sleeping around each other is a great sign right?" - Yes, absolutely. A great sign. It is s Positive Encounter (nothing negative happening) and a positive association (the other cat is there and all is good).

"They aren't fully asleep, they opened their eyes occasionally to peek each other but this feels so good." - Totally normal but not always looking or looking away from the other cat is a sign of trust and confidence. No cat would look away or close their eyes from a potential threat.

"All those extra work is finally paying off." - YES!! I AM SO PROUD of you!!!

"I'm not confident leaving them unsupervised" - Yes, just keep building trust and making positive associations (using food) and positive encounters (trying to minimize or avoid negativity).

" but comes 2021 they probably will come to tolerate each other. Hopefully." - I am very confident they will be fine with your effort.

"Also i am leaving the door open all the time again" - Wow, that is good. ArtNJ would be very proud.

" except Rivel's feeding time because she's always antsy about food. " - That is fine. It is all about positive encounters (minimizing any negativity or avoiding it).

It sounds like you are doing an amazing job with them. GREAT WORK!!!! Keep up the great work.

 

[Hoboforeternity]

There are a lot of hissing today because i left the gate open, otherwise i think it's going well. So i should just let them hiss without intervention? To let them work it out themselves?

 

[susanm9006]

There are a lot of hissing today because i left the gate open, otherwise i think it's going well. So i should just let them hiss without intervention? To let them work it out themselves?

I would just let them hiss. It is just each telling the other to stay away and they need to get that out of their systems.

 

[Hoboforeternity]

I would just let them hiss. It is just each telling the other to stay away and they need to get that out of their systems.

I let silver out during playtime today. Doctor said don't play until tomorrow but she's getting bored in there to the point she's flinging her litter around.

There were hissing and rivel swatted the little one but i don't think claws are involved, unlike previously there were no furs flying.

Otherwise after meeting, i gave them both their dinner (separately) but they all go back to their respective beds.

 

[calicosrspecial]

There are a lot of hissing today because i left the gate open, otherwise i think it's going well. So i should just let them hiss without intervention? To let them work it out themselves?

"So i should just let them hiss without intervention? To let them work it out themselves?" - This is where Cat and Kitten intro experts are best to answer. Since I personally think it is different between cat/kitten and cat/cat.

Hissing is communication and teaching so if the hissing is respected and understood then it is fine. IF it escalates into something serious and you see changes in behavior then I think it needs to be more controlled. BUT I think others are better than me with cat/kitten intros.

"I let silver out during playtime today. Doctor said don't play until tomorrow but she's getting bored in there to the point she's flinging her litter around." - Why did the doctor say wait until tomorrow to play?

"There were hissing and rivel swatted the little one but i don't think claws are involved, unlike previously there were no furs flying." - It is good no fur was flying. Rivel is probably teaching Silver manners.

"Otherwise after meeting, i gave them both their dinner (separately) but they all go back to their respective beds." - I think this is very good. To let them know all is ok, they have their good food (positive association) and that no negativity continued (not that what Rivel did was really negative).

ArtNJ will hopefully weigh in as well.

 

[Hoboforeternity]

Why did the doctor say wait until tomorrow to play?

She got vaccinated on saturday morning. I think it's just standard procedure on their part to tell people wait until the cat is doing physical activities after vaccine. On reality, like rivel did, they bounce back after a day and get bored after if you don't play.

 

[calicosrspecial]

She got vaccinated on saturday morning. I think it's just standard procedure on their part to tell people wait until the cat is doing physical activities after vaccine. On reality, like rivel did, they bounce back after a day and get bored after if you don't play.

Ok, yes, I understand.

Keep up the great work with them.

 

[Hoboforeternity]

I let silver explore today on her own. There's minimal hissing except when silver got too close to the coffee table and silver hid under the couch immediately.

Rivel isn't as agitated, her tail isn't puffing out too.

 

[calicosrspecial]

I let silver explore today on her own. There's minimal hissing except when silver got too close to the coffee table and silver hid under the couch immediately.

Rivel isn't as agitated, her tail isn't puffing out too.

"I let silver explore today on her own." - Ok

" There's minimal hissing except when silver got too close to the coffee table and silver hid under the couch immediately." - Just take it slow and reassure Rivel that everything is ok. Distract Rivel in order to help Silver feel more comfortable.

"Rivel isn't as agitated, her tail isn't puffing out too." - That is very good.

The kitten/cat intro people might have a different take so let's see what I say.

Sounds like everything is normal and going well. Keep up the great work.

 

[Hoboforeternity]

Ah shit here we go again. Rivel won't eat again unless it's new or i spend half an hour coercing and offering food with my hand. The broth doesn't help much this time too.

It might be time for tough love, but bleh, i cannot do it. I am just worried she might get sick for real if she doesn't eat.

 

[Hoboforeternity]

Uuuh i am angry enough to make her go cold turkey. I can't figure this girl out why is she doing this???

 

[klunick]

Ah shit here we go again. Rivel won't eat again unless it's new or i spend half an hour coercing and offering food with my hand. The broth doesn't help much this time too.

It might be time for tough love, but bleh, i cannot do it. I am just worried she might get sick for real if she doesn't eat.

What size cans do you feed her? Can you try the lid idea that was suggested earlier so the food doesn't have to be refrigerated? Not sure what else to suggest. She is going through an adjustment period and is acting out. Hopefully once she is resigned to the fact that Silver isn't going anywhere, she will stop.

 

[Hoboforeternity]

What size cans do you feed her? Can you try the lid idea that was suggested earlier so the food doesn't have to be refrigerated? Not sure what else to suggest. She is going through an adjustment period and is acting out. Hopefully once she is resigned to the fact that Silver isn't going anywhere, she will stop.

160gr can. 1 can each cats/day
Yeah, i store the can whole inside an airtight tupperware. It doesn't seem to help with the oxidation process and the loss of "freshness".

I ended up hand feeding her too this evening. There is still a possibility of medical issue, but she's still an active girl. Chased and killed down a cockroach today and vet visit is very stressful for her, she usually will hide a day or 2 after vet only comes out to eat and use the toilet, so if it's a false positive it feels like i am just subjected her to further stressor.

I did talk with the vet when i got silver vaccinated, and another time via phone. She said she can't be sure, but since rivel is still active and she actually still have appetite and want to eat (with extra steps) she said i shouldn't worry too much. Like you said, a period of adjustment, but we wouldn't know for sure, but at this point i feel like giving rivel more stressor is going to be counter productive. I will communicate with the vet if something else happens.


Also C calicosrspecial i don't know if they are playing or fighting.

One try to ambush the other and swat. It doesn't escalate but there are also some hissing. I tried to get the interaction on camera but failed as elusive cats are. Like they know they are being recorded and do nothing.


First rivel hid behind a wall and wait until silver comes, then jump out, swatting her, doesn't looks like she used any claws, but the smaller one backed off and rivel hissed.

After tha, rivel got some zoomies and then sat for a while. Soon after silver hid inside the bathroom. Rivel checked the bathroom and as soon as rivel turned around, silver comes out and swatted Rivel's tail, then rivel hissed, the smaller one backed off.

I can't really tell the difference exactly, but a cat fight in my mind would be those demonic scream and wrestling each other into a tazmanian devil like tornado on the ground.

 

[Hoboforeternity]

So yeah, i separated them after that. But i don't see standing fur or puffy tail.

 

[calicosrspecial]

So yeah, i separated them after that. But i don't see standing fur or puffy tail.

Ok, the video is short but that didn't look like an issue. I assume Rivel chased Silver. We want to try to avoid that but that was not an issue.

"Ah shit here we go again. Rivel won't eat again unless it's new or i spend half an hour coercing and offering food with my hand. The broth doesn't help much this time too." - Ok. Just keep trying.

"It might be time for tough love, but bleh, i cannot do it. I am just worried she might get sick for real if she doesn't eat." - Please do not worry. If she is hungry she will eat and it will take a while for her to get sick. And if she is eating her dry/hard food and drinking then she should be fine.

"Uuuh i am angry enough to make her go cold turkey. I can't figure this girl out why is she doing this??? " - Please try not to be angry. I KNOW it is frustrating but they are cats. Cats can be like this. She could be bored with it, she could just not be hungry, etc. But at this point I would not be worried.

Remember, cats take on our emotions so the more stressed and angry we the humans are the more they can be and they can then so bad behavior.

"It doesn't seem to help with the oxidation process and the loss of "freshness". " - Does the food look different later in the day?

"I ended up hand feeding her too this evening." - Ok. Where are you feeding her? Try to feed her in her favorite place or the normal place. And try to feed at the same time as usual. Since cats like routines.

"There is still a possibility of medical issue, but she's still an active girl." - Yes, but it doesn't sound like a health issue. Is she eating her dry/hard food like normal? Drinking like normal? Using the litter box like normal? Is she still acting normal? No hiding, no lethargy?

"Chased and killed down a cockroach today" - OK, she likes to hunt still.

"and vet visit is very stressful for her, she usually will hide a day or 2 after vet only comes out to eat and use the toilet, so if it's a false positive it feels like i am just subjected her to further stressor." - Yes, let's make sure she really needs a vet visit then. I don't think she does now. I think it is something other than health.

"I did talk with the vet when i got silver vaccinated, and another time via phone. She said she can't be sure, but since rivel is still active and she actually still have appetite and want to eat (with extra steps) she said i shouldn't worry too much. Like you said, a period of adjustment, but we wouldn't know for sure, but at this point i feel like giving rivel more stressor is going to be counter productive. I will communicate with the vet if something else happens." - Ok, I agree with the vet. No need to worry right now.

The video looked like play to me.

"One try to ambush the other and swat." - Yes, it depends but if fur isn;t flying and there isn't really a fight then it is ok. SO, how they act after is what is important. If they act like normal after the "fight" then they are telling us it is not a big deal. If they are scared, hiding, going outside of the litter box, etc then it was a more serious fight.

" It doesn't escalate" - Ok, VERY good. Tells me it is play.

" but there are also some hissing." - Yes, hissing is communication so what happens after the hissing that is what is important. So if the hissing is respected then the hissing is not bad.

" I tried to get the interaction on camera but failed as elusive cats are. Like they know they are being recorded and do nothing." - Doing nothing is a good sign. IF there were real problems they would be doing something.

"First rivel hid behind a wall and wait until silver comes, then jump out, swatting her, doesn't looks like she used any claws, but the smaller one backed off and rivel hissed." - Yes, that sounds like play.

"After tha, rivel got some zoomies and then sat for a while." - OK, yes, that suggests it was play.

"Soon after silver hid inside the bathroom." - Ok

" Rivel checked the bathroom and as soon as rivel turned around, silver comes out and swatted Rivel's tail, then rivel hissed, the smaller one backed off." - OK, SIlver was playing. They are learning how to play. Really cute it sounds.

"I can't really tell the difference exactly, but a cat fight in my mind would be those demonic scream and wrestling each other into a tazmanian devil like tornado on the ground." - Yes, you are exactly correct. A real fight is really scary. It doesn't sound like Rivel and SIlver are doing anything other than playing.

"So yeah, i separated them after that. But i don't see standing fur or puffy tail." - Ok, the video was fine.

Just keep trying to make them be together in a positive way and to make a positive association. Anytime they are together and things are going well it builds trust and confidence between them.

I wouldn't worry about Rivel eating at this point. Just try your best. That is a pretty big can so it is hard to get a cat and a kitten to eat it all in a day. As long as Rivel is eating her dry/hard food and drinking and using her litter box like normal and acting normal then she should be fine.

Keep up the great work!!

 

[ArtNJ]

On the scale from hisses to yowling and screams, that video sounded somewhere to the right of your garden variety hiss. But then again, the kitten was rushing right in Rivel's face. So not great, but not shocking either. Maybe where your at, supervised together time, is the right answer for now. At some point soon though, you might need to leave them together during the day. As long as your sure they aren't going to fight, thats how real progress gets made.

As far as the food, you definitely need to be careful about babying a cat because cats can develop all sorts of weird rituals around food if their human accomodates them. That said, I haven't re-read this whole thread and I'm uncertain if this is stress related. Changes in eating behavior are pretty normal with a background level of stress from a new cat. Can you move the food dish further from the kitten somehow? Feed in a room with a closed door? I'd prefer those steps to hand-feeding, because you don't want to create some burdensome habit/ritual that will be hard to get rid of.

 

[Hoboforeternity]

Can you move the food dish further from the kitten somehow? Feed in a room with a closed door?

I already fees them in separated room and further from where the kitten is. She WILL eat them normally with freshly opened can, but with anything over than 8 hours, she won't eat unless i persuade her. (Aka hand feed)


One thing i noticed is if i give her the old food, she sniff around a bit, then makes burying movement like she does with litter. Does she think it's shit or what??? If you offer her new food, she sniff, lick then proceed to eat.

Absolute last resort is switching to something like fancy feast that is 85gr can instead of 160. That option is less economic because 160gr can cost around a dollar, and fancy feast is 85gr and cost around $ 0.80, which is half the size but not the price.

It wont bankrupt me, but it's still a significant increase in cost.

 

[ArtNJ]

Try sprinkling a little water in and mixing/mushing it up with a fork; sprinkling in a few pieces of dry is optional. Of course, this gets to be a PITA and a ritual as well, but it beats wasting food.