New kitten not interested in older cat

[catheetiem]

Good morning!! You guys were really helpful when my cat was a kitten, I'm hoping you might have some insight into our new kitten!!

We brought a almost 4 month old home on Saturday. He is very, very friendly and loves people. He has been living in the downstairs bathroom and spare bedroom, he hates this lol. Crying all the time nonstop unless you're in there with him. He seems to be pretty stressed, he only eats a little bit and is not really interested in playing. He will chase the laser pointer but that's it, won't engage with any other toys. He was at the vet yesterday and had no temperature, nothing in his poop, but the vet did find and treat ear mites.

We have started introducing him to our resident cat, Dexter, whos 2. We got the kitten as a companion for Dexter. So far things are going okay, Dexter is a little nervous by nature but has overall been very nice. A couple of hisses when first meeting over the screen, and a couple of (very, very light) swats when they've been out together. Dexter just mostly follows the kitten around everywhere and smells him, sometimes gets surprised and backs away quickly when the kitten approaches him quickly.

My issue is that this kitten isn't really that interested in Dexter. He really just wants to be around my boyfriend and I. He'll go near Dexter, but isn't really looking for interaction with him, but he comes to us and cries to be picked up. He'll get a little interested when I play with Dexter (dex loves to play fetch with his ball, the kitten later swatted the ball around a little after watching him)

So I guess my question is how do I encourage the kitten to take more interest in dex? Is this something that will just come with time, or might this just be how the kitten is? I feel awful that we brought this kitten here for dex and all the kitten wants to do is lay in our laps, while Dexter stands off to the side and watches.

 

[ArtNJ]

You don't need to encourage him, its been only a few days. Nature will do its course. It can take some kittens up to a week or so to get used to another cat, the humans and a new space. Beyond that, the kitten is never the issue. Since your two year old seems to be doing ok, the prognosis here is excellent and I suspect they will end up friends, which is always likely when the older cat is fairly young as yours is.

I suspect at this point you could just let them be together, at least when your around to supervise. Perhaps they need some more supervised time before trusting them to work things out. Either way, its highly likely this is headed towards friendship.

 

[Mamanyt1953]

Not much to add to this. It's pretty much a done deal! Just make sure that Dex gets plenty of attention so that he doesn't get jealous of...what is this kitten's name? I cannot keep calling him "Whatshisface!"

 

[catheetiem]

Thanks guys! They've been together supervised yesterday afternoon, yesterday evening, and this morning. This morning went okay at first, kitten was a little more playful, but I think they might have started fighting a few minutes ago?

Dex seems to get upset when the kitten goes in his taco truck (cardboard box with scratcher inside). The kitten was in there and dex started hitting at him inside the truck, pretty hard at times. The kitten hit back a little bit mostly hid. I got dex away and the kitten brought himself back in his room and I locked him in there. Here they are laying around right after the little fight:

Kitten doesn't have a name yet! Honestly he hasn't shown a lot of personality so it's been hard to come up with something. My bf keeps calling him Nandor, after the character "Nandor the relentless" in "what we do in the shadows" because the kitten is relentless when he wants attention lol.

 

[ArtNJ]

Not a real fight if its only swatting. Could have even been play. Since the kitten wasn't troubled afterwards (can tell from the picture) everything is fine. Sounds like its progressing well.

It can be hard to name pets lol! You'll get there.

 

[catheetiem]

So I'm actually running into some issues with the two of them last night and this morning.

To begin with, Dexter has been throwing up. He threw up Tuesday night around 8, last night around 6:30, and then in the middle of the night (while in bed with us alone, kitten was locked in his separate room) at like 4:30 this morning. He's been very out of sorts (doesn't really want to play, not happy, hiding out for some of the day, my bf calls him "mopey"). I'm assuming he's stressed and trying to adjust to having the new kitten around.

Last night and then today he seems to be getting somewhat aggressive though. He usually follows the kitten around everywhere and doesn't let him out of his sight. At times he has chased the kitten and jumped on top of him. Ears back, tail swishing, meowing, and hitting. Often if the kitten tries to get up and go somewhere dex will get up and physically block his path with his body.

Last night and this afternoon he has chased the kitten and bitten him (not super hard but a definite bite) and hit him quite a bit. The kitten seems to be reacting properly (rolling over and showing his belly) but dex just does it again a few minutes later.

Yesterday when the kitten was in his taco truck dex was hitting at him from all sides, reaching through the cutouts to get at him. He was hitting hard, actually moving the box around with the kitten in it. At one point the kitten cried out and at that point I got dex away.

It just seems to be escalating a bit, getting worse not better. I first thought dex was scared and shy, now he seems to be angry.

 

[di and bob]

He's getting more used to the kitten and is trying to show him who's boss. There is one thing to look for. It Dex pins the kitten to the ground, swats him, fights shortly with him, the kitten squeals, and the kitten runs and hides for a minute BUT THEN COMES BACK, it is all normal. If the kitten starts hiding when he sees Dex and does NOT come out, he is really getting hurt. Kittens are VERY annoying to older cats and need manners taught. Kittens playing sound like they are killing each other, but they aren't. Dex needs the kitten to squeal and run away to teach him how rough to be, and the kitten needs it to be more restrained in his play too. You can separate them for a time-out if Dex seems too mean, it doesn't hurt. it is better to try to distract them from each other with a toy or a treat. Everything sounds normal to me, other than Dex throwing up. It could be stressful, so as long as he is eating and using the litter box, he should be fine. PS I get a couple of catnip-filled kickeroos, a long cat toy to bunny kick, and keep them around for times like this. Throw it towards Dex when he is fighting or stalking, and he will get his frustrations out on the toy instead of the kitten. They are wonderful.

 

[ArtNJ]

I suggest posting a video. Easier to host it somewhere else and just link it here.

I suspect the older cat is playing. It can really look off putting to folks that havent seen an adult play with a kitten. You wouldn't be the first, or even the 100th, poster here to not realize it was play.

 

[catheetiem]

I suggest posting a video. Easier to host it somewhere else and just link it here.

I suspect the older cat is playing. It can really look off putting to folks that havent seen an adult play with a kitten. You wouldn't be the first, or even the 100th, poster here to not realize it was play.

Thanks so much for your help! Here are some videos. They should all have sound, though idk if it's on automatically or not:

From yesterday, dex going after the kitten in the taco truck:


From this morning:

He chased the kitten upstairs, I brought the kitten back down. Dex followed and chased him upstairs a second time, and this is what happened after that (please excuse the mess in the bedroom! Dex threw up in bed last night and I was in the process of getting everything washed, emergency sheets on the bed haha):


And dex is just kibda seems miserable as a whole. Doesn't really want me to pet him, doesn't really want to play.

 

[Furballsmom]

Doesn't really want me to pet him, doesn't really want to play.

Dex, especially in the second one where the youngster is grooming not a foot away from him, is ok, not miserable (at least as far as the kitten is concerned). Rather, he's totally distracted from you and focused on the kitten.

I personally would also probably intervene when something like the kitten being trapped in the taco truck occurs, that was too rough and you took care of things at that point, but otherwise I'm not seeing anything particularly troubling either, similar to the posters above.

I may have missed it, if Dex has another day of throwing up are you taking him in to the vet? It could be unrelated to the kitten.

I also apologize if I missed it, are you using over the counter calming products? Not necessarily pheromone ones .. ..

He'll get a little interested when I play with Dexter (dex loves to play fetch with his ball, the kitten later swatted the ball around a little after watching him)

Keep doing more of this, and also when one of you has the kitten be sure the other one has Dex if he's willing, that sort of thing. Dex is like a jealous insecure little kid in a way, I think.

 

[catheetiem]

Dex, especially in the second one where the youngster is grooming not a foot away from him, is ok, not miserable (at least as far as the kitten is concerned). Rather, he's totally distracted from you and focused on the kitten.

I personally would also probably intervene when something like the kitten being trapped in the taco truck occurs, that was too rough and you took care of things at that point, but otherwise I'm not seeing anything particularly troubling either, similar to the posters above.

I may have missed it, if Dex has another day of throwing up are you taking him in to the vet? It could be unrelated to the kitten.

I also apologize if I missed it, are you using over the counter calming products? Not necessarily pheromone ones .. ..


Keep doing more of this, and also when one of you has the kitten be sure the other one has Dex if he's willing, that sort of thing. Dex is like a jealous insecure little kid in a way, I think.

Yeah, by miserable I mean like overall. Like just not himself. Normally he's a very happy, playful, affectionate, goofy cat. Since the kitten has been here I've seen none of that. He doesn't want to be pet, he doesn't really want to play, he doesn't want to sit with us. He either lays down off to the side (and won't come up to us when called, very unusual) or goes up to be in the bedroom by himself. If the kitten comes and sits by him and accidentally touches him, he gets up and moves 2 feet away and sits back down again.

Yeah there have been a few incidents in the taco truck. That last one in the video was the worst and I took it away after that.

That's good to hear though!

Yeah, he will go to the vet if he throws up again. He's thrown up 3 times so far (Tuesday night, 6 pm Wednesday night, and 4 am this morning)

No, I haven't. I've considered the diffuser thing but haven't gotten it yet.

Edit: thanks, I will keep trying to get them to play together. Unfortunately the kittens absolute favorite toy is a laser pointer, but Dexter absolutely hates them, they freak him out and make him anxious

 

[Furballsmom]

he gets up and moves 2 feet away and sits back down again.

Goodness what a crank-a-puss!

Seriously though, what happens if you follow him into the bedroom? Does he let you pick him up and love on him?

 

[Hellenww]

For less than a week they are doing great!

He's interested, wants to play, but not sure about her. Even the swatting at the Taco Truck didn't look like he was trying to hurt her but get her out so he could chase his new toy.

She looks nervous but still lays down and relaxes in the same room. In the bedroom she was fine with being near him even though he swatted at her and half heartedly tried to bite her. She knows he's not trying to hurt her but that's a very big paw coming at her.

He'll learn that he has to be gentler if he wants her to play. She'll get bigger and the play will be more equal.

Patience and maybe give her more places to hide. I usually suggest boxes with opening too small for the bigger cat but it doesn't look like that would work with Dex.

 

[catheetiem]

Goodness what a crank-a-puss!

Seriously though, what happens if you follow him into the bedroom? Does he let you pick him up and love on him?

Yeah he's very dramatic lol.

Dexter? No. He is upset and avoids my hand and gets a little fresh when I try to pet him. Kitten is always happy to get love from people and seeks it out almost constantly

 

[catheetiem]

This was just a few minutes ago:


I thought they were just playing at first but when they were at the stairs it seemed like maybe they weren't?

 

[FeebysOwner]

Hi. Didn't read all of the details above, admittedly. All I had to do was read your initial post, see the timeline, and then watch some of the videos.
Dexter was in essence 'in shock' at first, hence the reason for less of a reaction to begin with, and now that he has had time to assess the situation, he doesn't like it - and it is affecting his health, via vomiting and avoidance to you. You are also not doing any favors to the kitten in terms of how this is impacting him. Constant stalking from Dexter cannot be consider positive. Back off the introductions to the beginning.
How To Fix An Unsuccessful Cat Introduction – TheCatSite Articles
How To Successfully Introduce Cats: The Ultimate Guide – TheCatSite Articles
How To Introduce A Kitten To An Older Cat – TheCatSite Articles

 

[Furballsmom]

when they were at the stairs it seemed like maybe they weren't?

I agree, that looked not so good, and it ties into what FeebysOwner is saying but I also agree with Hellenww

 

[ArtNJ]

It does seem the big guy might be a bit stressed, but things aren't all bad. These videos are a very dramatic example of what I call the biological hard wiring protecting kittens from adults -- the fact that even when they are stressed and want the kitten gone, even when they charge and swat, the stressed adult never actually hurts the kitten. He could *easily* kill the kitten. Instead, he very deliberately is not even hurting the kitten. He is just trying to send a message and get the kitten to go away. The kitten is clearly not bothered at all in some of the videos. Even though he hissed in the earlier videos, he is just hanging around the big cat like he doesn't have a care in the world. That tells the big cat is not crossing any lines and the kitten just isn't scared of him.

Because of the biological hard wiring, this situation is completely safe, and it would be possible to try and let them work things out. And they probably would. The last video actually looked fine to me, and if it was just that one, I'd be confident it was normal playing. So maybe they are already working things out.

Nonetheless, the earlier videos did look a bit like "get the hell out of here" message sending. There was no hisisng by the big one though, (it was just the kitten hissing, right?) so I'm not totally sure even about those. Anyway, backing up a bit can't actually hurt anything. The protective biological hardwaring lasts until about 6 months or so, so taking a little time to back up will leave you with plenty of time where you don't have to worry about actual fighting. So I don't disagree with the above learned posters that backing up a bit is reasonable. Worst case it doesn't help and you'll have to give them time to work it out on their own thereafter.

 

[danteshuman]

If they were my cats? Dexter would get the house all to himself half the day. The kitten & Dexter would only be together when I was awake and there to supervise...... but the kitten would get to run around the house for the rest of the half of the day; with Dexter in your bedroom. When the kitten is with the adult cat keep a large piece of extra thick poster board handy to block line of sight or keep the kitten within arms length at all times. I would also have two wand toys going or some hexabug cat toys running around so hopefully the aggression can be funneled there.

Maybe even don’t let them see each other for a week? So your stressed adult cat can calm down?

I’m a worrier though.

 

[danteshuman]

Oh and maybe ditch the taco truck and go for large tunnels so the kitten can not be trapped? Or those triangle or square tunnel scratchers?