My Cat Sassy - With Chronic Kidney Disease :( Need Advice/opinion.

[miguel99nyc]

our 18 year old cat has had kidney disease for several years, and has been on sub-q for several years. he got a little worse, then we changed the frequency of the sub-q fluids, and now he's actually better just from that. he eats a little better, too. so if your cat is in that early stages, it's not a death sentence. HK went from stage 2 to stage 3, then back to stage 2, where he's stayed ever since.

i've been told that cats with kidney disease sometimes have some nausea caused by an acidy stomach. when HD doesn't eat, we give him half the vet's recommended dose of pepcid (we have it compounded with chicken flavor), and within a couple hours he's eating. when that doesn't work, he gets 3 mg of cerenia, which is an anti nausea mediation, and within an hour, he's chowing down.

Really?? is that even possible? to get into stage 3 and back to 2? seems strange... more like one of those probably rare situations which I doubt ill have that luck

 

[mrsgreenjeens]

yes, our girl did the same thing.

 

[cat princesses]

Oo, supplement? what kind?

Standard process renal for cats here is the link Standard Process - Feline Renal Support

I was buying from my vet it was about 16.99 for the bottle I believe you can also order online

 

[miguel99nyc]

So here is an update.

She has been doing quite well to today. Been eating regularly, drinking probably back down to normal amounts of water and urinating her normal amount as before. Overall been doing just great from what Ive seen.

Only issue is now today, this morning, she was hungry so she ate , well Drank some water first, then gave her meal...her typical friskies canned wet food and she ate normally (not slow or any faster i think), then she finished, walked away from her bowl when down and literally stepped out to hallway and threw up her food entirely. She eats the Prime Fillets so its those chunky strips. And that all came out as it was when out of can fed to her. So is it a lack of digestion or the beginning signs of this kidney disease? She doesn't look sick either and in fact because she threw up her food now shes asking for food because Im assuming shes hungry? I always placed some dry foood like...a teaspoon worth (very little) as she likes to eat few bits of dry food along with her wet. And so I did that this morning but she left the dry food and only ate the wet which was a bit strange.

 

[mrsgreenjeens]

When cats throw up their food almost immediately like you describe, they are actually regurgitating it rather than vomiting. This is probably not related to her kidney disease. Sometimes one of mine does this, and it's usually because he's either eaten his food too fast, or he ate too much. If Sassy drank first, her tummy could have been just a tad too full and this caused the regurgitation when she ate. Or sometimes hairballs can cause regurgitation. I wouldn't worry too much about this one incident. If it continues, then contact your Vet to see if they want to make any changes or check her out.

BTW, it is perfectly ok to give them more food after they've done this.

 

[miguel99nyc]

Yeah that is what I actually was reading up on, about eating too much or maybe was the water.

She was just sitting around for abotu 15 minutes and then was meowing at us (like she does) for when shes hungry. So I gave her the Patte kind and she ate it just fine with no vomiting. So maybe just eating too fast perhaps.

 

[mewcatmew]

If your cat won't eat K/D, try a different brand. My old cat would not eat the science diet, but loved the purina kidney diet. Royal canin makes a kidney diet food as well.

 

[miguel99nyc]

If your cat won't eat K/D, try a different brand. My old cat would not eat the science diet, but loved the purina kidney diet. Royal canin makes a kidney diet food as well.

Believe it or not, ive tried those also, purina, royal canin, etc. Even other brands with less phosphorus and/or protein but still did not even lick it. Just a sniff and walks away.

 

[mewcatmew]

Have you seen this list?

Tanya's Comprehensive Guide to Feline Chronic Kidney Disease- Canned Food Data USA

 

[happilyretired]

I've had two CRF cats (lost second one last week), and Tanya's site is invaluable. However, my vet told me that it's impossible to predict how any specific cat will respond. My first boy was diagnosed at age 7. He remained stable for the next 6 years and then 'crashed' and was gone within 2 weeks. I adopted my second guy when he was 6, and I noticed the early signs almost immediately, so I have no idea how long he had the problem. Blood tests confirmed my observation.

Neither of them would eat any of the renal food, even the commercial brands that are low phosphorus, and my vet emphasized that it was important that they eat--no matter what it was. Both adored Fancy Feast, and that's what they ate. For the second one, I added a phosphorus binder. But he declined steadily, and when he stopped eating, even SubQ fluids didn't help. I only had him for 19 months.

So I'm convinced that once CRF takes hold, it's impossible to predict the course it will take for any individual cat. My view is that what's important is that they are loved and cherished until the end. And that they not be allowed to suffer too long.

Near the end, both cats could tolerate those Fancy Feast 'broths' that come in a pouch. They are not a meal replacement, but I knew the end was near, and I gave them what they liked and could tolerate. Hartz makes a similar product as a Bisque and Stew--they loved those, too. When they would not touch these [literally 'feared' all food], I knew it was 'time.'

 

[miguel99nyc]

Sorry to hear about your two cats . At least yes, you loved and cherished them until the end, in which what I'm trying to do as well.

Yeah my cat's bloodwork as posted initially (from June 22nd) didn't really show kidney disease yet. Just in her urine so Vet confirmed its in the very early stages and to just change diet. (which I'ved now tried various commercial foods as well from list on Tanya site) but no success. So I'm just feeding her the Friskies she loves canned food.

*Update*

So Yesterday morning she had thrown up her food right after eating, almost as if it wasn't digested because I still saw the chunks from her Prime Fillets. Then maybe 10 minutes later she wanted to eat, gave her a Patte instead to be easier digesting, so she ate it was just fine.

Now this morning, she had come to my bedroom wake me up (as she always does) meows asking for food...but then out of nowhere she threw up what seemed water. Maybe she drank water? I have no idea but she did throw up a good amount of just clear liquid/water. But again, she was hungry so she ate just fine right after. But now this is 2nd day in row she vomit or regurgitated...but unlike yesterday was the food in morning, this time was just water. She ate fine and did not throw up the food after either today so its confusing...

 

[zygote]

Sometimes with kidney cats, acid can build up in their stomachs when empty and they can throw up clear liquid. Might be worth it to ask your vet about giving an antacid at your next visit, or feeding her once in the night to keep her stomach from getting too empty.

 

[miguel99nyc]

Sometimes with kidney cats, acid can build up in their stomachs when empty and they can throw up clear liquid. Might be worth it to ask your vet about giving an antacid at your next visit, or feeding her once in the night to keep her stomach from getting too empty.

Ok definitely will check. It was a lot of liquid though. Literally as if she might have just drank water right before throwing up. I would think acid would produce less amount? But yes something I will have to get it checked.

Im just also a little affraid now because up to yesterday she was doing fine, and overall is ok. I'm going away on a trip tomorrow and returning following Tuesday. While away I have other family members coming over to feed her but just don't want her to get worse while going away. It's so strange how her throwing up symptom is showing up right before the trip...get's me in that worried state. Wish it kinda acted up sooner so I had the time to take her to vet before leaving but now there isn't chance/time until I return.

 

[meimipop]

Sorry to hear about Sassy. I have an 11 years old cat who's been diagnosed with CKD stage 2 for five years now. He also had periods where he regurgitated very often, I worried about stomach acid but the issue was he would usually drink too much water in one go (often straight after eating), which caused the regurgitation. However his weight and appetite have remained unchanged and his blood levels have been pretty stable throughout, sometimes even gone back down to normal levels at certain points. He eats RC renal food, mixed with a more palatable digestive RC food that he likes.
Sadly I also lost another cat to CKD and he had a very rapid decline instead, it's really impossible to know how it can affect each cat.

 

[miguel99nyc]

Sorry to hear about Sassy. I have an 11 years old cat who's been diagnosed with CKD stage 2 for five years now. He also had periods where he regurgitated very often, I worried about stomach acid but the issue was he would usually drink too much water in one go (often straight after eating), which caused the regurgitation. However his weight and appetite have remained unchanged and his blood levels have been pretty stable throughout, sometimes even gone back down to normal levels at certain points. He eats RC renal food, mixed with a more palatable digestive RC food that he likes.
Sadly I also lost another cat to CKD and he had a very rapid decline instead, it's really impossible to know how it can affect each cat.

Hi there,

Sorry to hear about your kitties as well.

I wish my cat could eat the renal food, as mentioned before, I tried various commercial brands that are on lower end of phosphorus and protein but no success. I know its best she eats what she likes to eat, but at the same time, fear it would speed up the process of the disease which kinda sucks. Renal food Im sure is designed to slow it down...but again my cat just dislikes every other food out there. VERY picky she is

 

[foxxycat]

See if the vet will give prescription to start Pepcid AC in the evening before the morning or the morning. it's not unusual for kidney kits to have stomach upsets in the morning. my elder angel Floey responded very well to Pepcid ac. Don't use the cream in the ear=it doesn't absorb at all-we tried with floey and it didn't work. Transdermal gel. We couldn't pill her so they sent us home with vial and needles. she used to get Cerenia and Pepcid once a day and sub fluids in her last days=she had kidney disease where her urine never concentrated enough. But if pilling is too hard ask about injections-it's very fast and less tramatic than pilling.

If you do pill-get some empty gel caps #3 or #2 and a pill popper/buster and butter. it makes it go much easier. Don't mix Pepcid AC with food-it's very BITTER tasting.

hoping you find out what's going on!

oh and we raised the food dish off the floor onto a shelf thingy and it helped with the vomiting. if they eat too fast you can put a golf ball in the dish making them slow down with eating.

 

[happilyretired]

I'm concerned about the initial diagnosis of CRF. The bloodwork you posted didn't indicate it as a certainty, and perhaps there's another cause of the poor appetite/vomiting that your vet didn't consider because of the assumption of CRF.

My boys didn't show any symptoms at all until they were well into Stage 2, and then it was mainly drinking a lot of water and not being able to concentrate their urine. One rarely vomited at all, and the other didn't vomit until well into Stage 4.

Your Sassy may have an entirely different problem (e.g., a blockage of some kind), and in your situation, I would get a second opinion.

 

[miguel99nyc]

I'm concerned about the initial diagnosis of CRF. The bloodwork you posted didn't indicate it as a certainty, and perhaps there's another cause of the poor appetite/vomiting that your vet didn't consider because of the assumption of CRF.

My boys didn't show any symptoms at all until they were well into Stage 2, and then it was mainly drinking a lot of water and not being able to concentrate their urine. One rarely vomited at all, and the other didn't vomit until well into Stage 4.

Your Sassy may have an entirely different problem (e.g., a blockage of some kind), and in your situation, I would get a second opinion.

Thank you for your opinion.

In response, she was diagnosed with early stages of CKD back on June 22nd. And weeks before, and until now she has not been vomitting or lack of appetite even after diagnoses. Only reason I had brought her in was to just get her normal check up, plus I thought she had lost weight and her hair was looking abit off, not smooth and shiny as it was before. So doctor ordered the urine test and blood work on June just to see if anything shows up. So turned out that her urine wasn't as concentrated and it was cloudy. So he said it was very early stages of CKD.

Today I had emailed him about the vomitting starting up as of yesterday only, just once. And today just being water. He said he doesn't know with high certainty and so he recommended getting an ultrasound of the abdomen. I'm guessing in this ultrasound, we will be able to see everything as well no? And confirm once and for all?

 

[happilyretired]

Miguel-
I'm certainly not a vet, but I still that your vet's diagnosis was premature. It's also possible that the disturbances in the urine show first, before the bloodwork is more serious. It just seems that with such an early stage, the vomiting is not characteristic--that usually comes much later, so she may have CRF, and this vomiting may be unrelated and something that can be helped.

I hope he can see 'everything' on the ultrasound, and it should confirm CRF. My last cat had significant blood tests to confirm CRF, but my vet suggested the ultrasound to see of there was actually some issue that could be corrected--there wasn't, so if there's some other issue with your cat, it should show on the ultrasound.

I wish you and Sassy well; it's not easy for either of you.

 

[foxxycat]

The ultrasound will be able to see what size the kidneys are and if there's anything else going on. Plus not a bad idea to look at the stomach/intestines/liver/etc etc. Just gives a bigger picture to see what could be going on.

Did they want to do antivomiting meds or Pepcid? Other times vomiting could be food allergy or a blockage. Has she eated anything she shouldn't? But blockage usually is continuation of vomiting instead of intermittent. This is a puzzle for sure. I would hope on the ultrasound just for peace of mind.