My Cat Sassy - With Chronic Kidney Disease :( Need Advice/opinion.

[miguel99nyc]

Hello everyone.

So this is my cat Sassy. For the most past she seemed ok in past weeks/months. Just maybe in past few weeks I noticed her appetite diminish slightly...ate most of her wet food would at times leave crumbs and small bits. But before then she would eat just fine. Then maybe i didnt recall to well her body shape but seemed bit she lost bit of weight as when she walks...you can tell shes rather skinny but towards the rear / tail area/rear legs. But forward from that she seemed ok. So I was wondering maybe if its age? Shes just turned 15. But regardless I wanted to be sure so I took her to vet last Saturday, June 17th. They did bloodwork and uyrinealsys and this past Monday doctor confirmed Chronic Kidney disease I was hoping for it come out normal...and her just being age or just maybe the heat or humidity affecting her hair? Again she really doesnt have any symtoms. MAYBE just slight water increase but not much. Urines normally, nothing more or extra. no vomiting. Maybe I noticed her sleeping a lot more but again, thats the reason why I decided to get her checked.

Below are the results so wanted to get feedback incase maybe, just a SLIGHT maybe its a misdiagnose and perhaps its something else? When the vet told me this, it broke my heart as I know its progressive, no cure, thus meaning, death is coming. When? well we don't know but to try and slow it down with diet he said. So I wanted to get input from you guys. I would reallly appreciate it. PLus looking at her hair in images below (just took these shots) if it means other than kidney disease? or is she just on her way to dying Its such a hard time now...especially when I already had to put another cat to sleep last October because he wasn't recovering from a inner ear infection and costs of MRI was through the roof .

 

[miguel99nyc]

Sorry here are the results.

 

[mrsgreenjeens]

Hmmm.....I've had three kidney cats and I'm honestly not seeing kidney disease in these lab results. Yes, the urine specific gravity test shows she's very close to the bottom of the "norm", which could be the beginning, but her creatinine is still good, and her BUN/Creatinine ratio is still good, which are good signs.

When my last kidney cat was first diagnosed, both her BUN and Creatinine were above the normal ranges. She lived 3 more years after that, if that helps you any . It is true that there is no cure, but it is also true that normally it's not an instant death sentence.

Normally a change in food is the first thing that is done when it's thought a cat has kidney disease. Often that's all that's needed for quite some time.

Here is a website that has tons of information regarding kidney disease in cats. It's my "go to" on that topic. Tanya's Comprehensive Guide to Feline Chronic Kidney Disease - Everything You Need to Know to Help Your Cat

 

[miguel99nyc]

aww that does help a bit thank you! That's what im saying too everything so far is on the norm. Even her phosphorus is not even near high end. Shes going back tomorrow for a blood pressure check just in case. What's your opinion on her hair?

Plus My greatest fear, if what my vet said is true about we can delay this disease slow it down through diet...she's a REALLY picky eater. The ONLY thing she has eaten all 15 years is Friskies can ( I know its not good )...in particular Prime Fillets Chicken. She just LOVES it. Anything else i tried in past years...she'd sniff and walk away. Vet wants to put her on K/D but...i jus tknow she will reject it. My other cat took C/D for his urinary tract and she didnt even like the smell of it...my other cat that passed away last year was on W/D and I/D years ago and i tried make her sniff that or taste but nothing.

I did do some reasearch...and I think as far as diet goes...the less phosphorus the better?

 

[mrsgreenjeens]

yes, with kidney disease, the lower the phosphorus in the food the better. And you are correct in that many cats do not like the kidney diet. BUT all is not lost as you can actually add phosphorus binders to her food if necessary and she can continue to eat the same food. First though, call the manufacturer and ask what the phosphorus content is in it on a Dry Matter Basis. If it's under 1% that's not too bad. Some of the Friskies canned food is pretty low on that scale, so you may luck out.

None of my kidney cats ever used phosphorus binders, and also didn't necessarily eat low phosphorus foods. They were also picky eaters. We just did the best we could. When they really started balking at even their normal food, then we just tried to ply them with any and everything we could find just to get them to eat. I think you're a long way from that yet. Check out that website though, because they have all kinds of hints on that too, as well as food listings in order of the amount of phosphorus in them.

As far as how her fur looks, I can't really see that it looks bad . Is she still grooming herself?

 

[miguel99nyc]

As for the phosphus, i found a chart with ALL the foods i think but says like phosphorus in mg per 100kcal or something. So not sure how that 1% comes into play there. Is there maybe specific mg amount?

And yeah she still grooms herself, but just her hair seems messy or broken up ...which was sorta smooth months ago. That was like my first kinda signal to take her just incase.

 

[Ardina]

I've got to agree - I don't see much indication of kidney disease in the lab values. Creatinine is an estimate of how well the kidneys are functioning, and it's perfectly fine - excellent even for a 15-year old cat. Can you ask your vet why he thinks she has CKD?

 

[miguel99nyc]

Ardina-

Yes I will be going Saturday for a blood pressure check on her.

He told me it was because her urine was dilute, and as you see in lab result says cloudy?

But that was all. And I thought maybe its just one minor thing and her kidney is fine but he said no 100% her kidneys is not functioning well anymore...so...thats why im bit confused. We only chatted for few min on phone..but saturdya will be in person.

 

[Ardina]

Yes, her urine concentration is on the low end of normal, which can be an early indicator of CKD. If she does have CKD, it's at a very early stage, which means there's a lot you can do to prevent progression.

 

[miguel99nyc]

Oh so yeah then it can be CKD then in its early stages. Perhaps her concentration will go even lower

 

[mewcatmew]

You could ask about a SDMA blood test to help confirm early kidney disease. Have you tried making your cats food smellier? Adding warm water to it, etc to make it more appealing to eat? The blood tests are in normal range, so that is great news. If it is early kidney disease, there are definitely things you can ask about. Prescription foods, medications, etc.

 

[foxxycat]

If you can-maybe an ultrasound on kidneys-I don't see kidney disease either in those values. My elder girl had very low specific gravity on her urine but her levels were on the high normal- we kept her on wet food and she lived another 4 years-didn't get sick until 2 months prior to passing-there's lots of things you can do to help the kidneys function better but I wouldn't start fluids until the numbers are higher.

I would ask for ultrasound of kidneys & organs if you still don't feel comfortable. That's a very quick way to take a peak at what exactly is going on with kidneys.

 

[mrsgreenjeens]

As for the phosphus, i found a chart with ALL the foods i think but says like phosphorus in mg per 100kcal or something. So not sure how that 1% comes into play there. Is there maybe specific mg amount?

When looking at the chart on this page, I'd simply try to make sure the phos is no great than 1.0
Tanya's Comprehensive Guide to Feline Chronic Kidney Disease- Canned Food Data USA

 

[cat princesses]

Please join Tanya's renal cats they are the pros regarding kidney disease.
Here is the link to their site. You have to click on the left side to request to join the group first.
Tanya's Comprehensive Guide to Feline Chronic Kidney Disease - Everything You Need to Know to Help Your Cat
I think the labs look great! I dint see kidney issues at all and my cat had renal disease for six years.

 

[miguel99nyc]

Thanks for advice guys.

So I just took her yesterday, and her blood pressure was normal. The only thing vet said while he the blood work numbers show normal, he looks at the specific gravity of urine. He said normal should be around 1.035 but since her's at 1.018, she's in the very early stages of her kidneys failing. Something about being 60% or so failing. So for now he just recommened this K/D food and to go back in about 3-4 months to get re-checked. If her numbers to get worse and stays closely the same, then go back in 6 months after.

I tried giving her the K/D food and just as i suspected, just walks away from it. I even tried mixingi it in to her Prime Fillets from friskies (which she loves) and she barely ate it combined. Im assuming she smellled/taste the other food in it... So this will be tough . Definitely don't want to accelerate her disease

 

[miguel99nyc]

And as for that food chart on Tanya's site. It's still bit hard to relate to it because it doesnt list all of the wet food.

Im using this site: Cat Food Database

There lists I believe every brand with every can possible. But here though, lists in mg per 100k cal or something. So I wanted to see if anyone knew about that mg count rather then the 1.00 and under for phosphorus?

 

[mrsgreenjeens]

Honestly, I can't figure out just how to read that chart...wish I could because it's really neat how you can sort it! However, what I did was go to the chart on Tanya's page and found a food that was at 1.01 phos and was able to finally find a match on the chart YOU are using and the phos is 256. So I figure you should look for something that has phos of about 255ish or less. Not sure which prime fillet Sassy likes...is it the Chicken in Gravy? It's not too much higher. If you could possibly add a little bit of egg whites to it, that might help. Either cooked or uncooked. What that will do is increase the protein, which is fine at her stage, and they will then bring down the amount of phos, since eggwhites contain very little phos. I used to do this with my girl's food. She liked pate, so I could actually put her food in a blender and blend in the eggwhites so she didn't notice. I'd buy the carton of pure eggwhites (absolutely no seasonings or anything added) and use those.

 

[miguel99nyc]

Hello,

Yes, it's the Chicken and Gravy she loves the most.

And that's exactly what i started to do! Sorta look at 1.0 phos and match that same can to that chart which was around 230-250ish roughly. But then here is my next series of questions...

1.) Some of these cans, particularly Friskies are 5.5 oz cans...and Im sure some of the cans on Tanya's page are the 3 oz cans. So in that 3 oz. case, and say it had a phos of... 0.80 lets say. Then that 0.8 would be like...1.1 or something if its a 5.5 oz can? The conversion there? or if they would to have 3.oz cans of that 0.8 phos, then thats like 1.6 phos if its two of the 3 oz. cans?

2.) and also, how much should I be feeding the cat. Like that Chicken Fillets, it shows 274 phos but that's for ONE 5.5 oz can? She would eat one entire can a day. Is that too little or too much? Shes about 11.5 lbs. How much oz. of food should she eat?

 

[mrsgreenjeens]

1) I'm pretty sure it doesn't matter the size can doesn't matter.

2) Feed her an amount where she at minimum maintains her weight. You don't want her to lose any, that's for sure. If you can even get her to gain a little, that would be good, because most kidney cats eventually will lose, no matter what you do. So....since every cat metabolizing differently, only you can be the judge of the amount. Don't feed her any less though, even if you add in the eggwhites. That's my opinion

 

[miguel99nyc]

If size doesnt matter...then how does say tanyas numbers relate to whether she eats a can or two of them in a day?

And average wise, is there like an amount she should be eating rougly?