I Have More Trust Issues Than This Feral..

[walli]

I also wonder about Walli being in her room and knowing Joey has the run of the house even tho she doesn't want to come out.
I don't know but it seems like they are not really fighting you may want to let it run its course to get that part over with.
But I know others will say just keep going.
If it's stressing you out keep them out longer to see if it subsides when they are out longer, so far Finn goes back right after an altercation.
I wonder what would happen if they got past the altercation?

I wouldn't want to give you bad advise tho, but I get where you are coming from. If it comes to biting that's where you want to stop for sure.

And about the resentment from Finn, I don't think cats think like us.
because I have felt guilty for Walli for a very long time now. I think I have been wrong thinking. I'm right there learning with you!

What do you think? Do you think they would get past the altercation part?

 

[Buffster7]

I also wonder about Walli being in her room and knowing Joey has the run of the house even tho she doesn't want to come out.
I don't know but it seems like they are not really fighting you may want to let it run its course to get that part over with.
But I know others will say just keep going.
If it's stressing you out keep them out longer to see if it subsides when they are out longer, so far Finn goes back right after an altercation.
I wonder what would happen if they got past the altercation?

I wouldn't want to give you bad advise tho, but I get where you are coming from. If it comes to biting that's where you want to stop for sure.

And about the resentment from Finn, I don't think cats think like us.
because I have felt guilty for Walli for a very long time now. I think I have been wrong thinking. I'm right there learning with you!

What do you think? Do you think they would get past the altercation part?

I know, it's a tough call. When it comes to Charlie, I think "the spirit is willing but the flesh is weak" - meaning he really wants to be friends, but then when Finn comes out of his room, Charlie often just goes into bullish stalking mode. Finn usually runs from him the first go, but then turns to face him. I'm pretty sure Charlie will retreat if he's challenged - he's actually a pretty fearful cat the minute his bullying is challenged. Now, if Finn will just let him retreat I think we'll be okay! Before, Finn wasn't allowing a retreat; he was chasing and continuing the challenge. Now that he's feeling better, I'm hoping he'll want peace more than he'll want to fight. I haven't allowed them to get to that point yet because I wanted to build up some traction on the good interactions.

I have company coming tomorrow and I need Finn's room. I'll have to keep Finn in his cage all evening and night tomorrow night and hope that he doesn't cry all night. In th meantime, my guest gets to sleep in the "cat room" with all the scratchers, cat tree, toys, fountain on the nightstand, and litterbox. All the decor has been removed and that room is bare bones now. This is dragging on and on and it's consuming too much time when I don't have enough, so I'm really considering just seeing what happens. But I know I'll feel AWFUL if something goes bad. The struggle. And you've been doing this so much longer, Walli! Hats off to YOU!

 

[walli]

I totally get it, with what I have been going through I agree, see what happens.
just be ready, you don't want them to brawl.

It has been so long for me I have no idea what would happen if I just let Joey in Wallis room, I can't do it for Wallis sake though. I am planning to socialize them outside in catios, It will be a couple months till I can get the new catio up, hopefully not longer than that!

Maybe next weekend when you are home to supervise?
Finn will be ok while you have guests.

 

[Buffster7]

Maybe next weekend when you are home to supervise?
Finn will be ok while you have guests.

Thanks, Walli. Finn is currently in his cage in my bedroom, will definitely wait til this weekend before trying anything. I'm too stressed out with school and I know that would transfer to them.

Here's a question for Jcatbird or anyone else who might know. Remember Charlie's kidney values came back borderline high, and you guys said that as long as he wasn't throwing up it wasn't an emergency? Well, I fed Charlie when I got home tonight and he threw up. I fed him again after that, and he threw that up as well. Granted, I was gone for a long time today and they went much longer between feedings than they normally do. I usually feed them at 5 pm and didn't get home til 8pm. My question: I have to be at school all day tomorrow, too. Is this now an emergency? If Charlie eats and keeps it down in the morning, are we safe to wait til Wednesday? Or do I need to drop him at the vet on my way to school? I hate the thought of him being dropped at the vet for the whole day and I don't know if I'll be done with school in time to pick him up - I really don't want him left all day, too stressful for him, unless it's really an emergency. I just don't know what the throwing up means or how significant it is, or at what time it becomes an emergency. Thanks, guys!

 

[Jewely]

Hi! I can tell you from my experience if my boy goes too long without eating, he will throw up.
Also, depending on when you cleaned out the guest room and rearranged Finn into your bedroom, he could have picked up on the changes and is just stressing. Most cats don’t like change. Both of those circumstances could cause vomiting in my boy.
I’m sure Jaycatbird will know more, but that’s my sensitive guy. He’s nine but he’s always been sensitive to change. The going too long without food I’ve noticed for about two years maybe.

 

[Jcatbird]

I would make the judgement about a vet visit based on his all around behavior. This is my personal checklist for my kitties.
Eating okay?
Drinking okay?
Urinating properly?
Been very long since a proper pee?
Pooping properly?
Been very long since a proper poo?
Lethargic?
Moving around well? ( acting stiff, weak or clumsy)
Meowing more than usual?
Seem in pain?
Ears feel warmer than usual?
Sneezing, coughing, breathing seem off?
Nose running?
Eyes running or matted? Pupils equal/normal?
When you pull scruff up does it quickly return to body? ( skin pulled up that does not bounce right back can indicate dehydration)
Weight dropping?
Severe itching?
Any lumps, bumps, cuts or scratches?
This is very basic but it helps me when I get worried.
If I check more than one of these things as being off, I call the vet.
Throwing up is something cats do. It can be a hairball, stress, or many other things. With the test result on Charlie I would mostly want to know if he is peeing well and drinking well. He did eat, even though he threw up. I know he had a small weight loss when he was last checked but unless you see more, that would not figure in right this minute.
His blood level can be affected by so many things. Including a little dehydration. Without further tests there is no way to know if the results indicate anything more. In other words, is he okay besides throwing up today? If he seems fine otherwise and he was my kitty, I would feel he would be okay to go Wednesday. If he throws up all he eats or drinks or shows any other symptoms, I would take him in. Especially if he is not peeing/pooping. Warm ears are something that may take some time for you to learn about. Knowing how they normally feel is kind of like feeling the forehead of a child. It isn’t an acuurate thermometer but can tip you off to a fever.

As for letting Finn out again, get Charlie checked first! If he is fine then give the guys a chance to see how they do when you are relaxed and have the time to devote to doing the release. Finn is safe and well where he is until you can focus on having him out. At some point you will need to step back to see what they do. They have made great progress with sitting together and bunny watching. They may tussle back and forth a little while but unless it is a real fight, you have to take a leap of faith. Even if they do have a fight, you just return to previous status and continue a while longer before trying again. It won’t be the end of the world if they disagree. Forward and back happens. We have all experienced it but cats are really loving creatures by nature and I have yet to find a situation that we couldn’t work through.

I am having lots of trouble getting alerts and posting on site. If you need me, please tag, PM or post on my thread. I will always answer if I see the request. Always! Let me know how Charlie is doing.
BTW..... my company has to love kitties! Lol Cats rule!

 

[Buffster7]

Thank you guys so much!! Charlie did eat this morning and he kept it down, so I feel much better! I bet it's just stress after me being gone for 12 hours and then having a strange person in the house, poor guy. He does not have any of the symptoms listed, Jcatbird, thank the Lord!

My company loves cats and she herself has 3 cats and 2 dogs. I had to put Finn in my (very nice and large) dog crate last night because he was so distraught in his cage after I turned the lights out that I was afraid he'd fall off of one of the shelves and injure himself. He wailed from the time I got home to after I turned the lights out, so for almost 4 hours straight last night. I put Charlie in my room with door shut and let Finn out to explore for a while, and it was constant meowing. Anxiety? He's peeing and pooping and eating just fine. But even as he's exploring the house, it's constant meowing - one after the other. I put ear plugs in to sleep last night, and when I woke up this morning he's still quiet (dog crate is covered with blankets). Phew.

A friend of mine asked if I wanted to go to Palm Desert in November. I LOVE going to Palm Desert in the winter! These cats are so highly strung right now that I honestly don't think I can go. Until they're integrated I couldn't possibly ask a sitter to deal with this. I don't know anyone who likes cats THAT much. I will see about getting this integration process started over the weekend. I need to regain some traction in my own life again, this cat business has been ruling my life since July. Thanks so much for your input, Jewely, and thank you so much for ALLLLL of your help, Jcatbird !

 

[Jcatbird]

Well......I like cats that much. Sorry I am so far away but honestly, they need the consistency of having you there for awhile. If we lived near each other I would happily kitty sit though! Of course, then there might come a day when I asked you just how much you like my kitties! Crash course!

I am glad Charlie did keep his food down. You might want to keep that check list for any future times when you get worried. I still go down the list any time I get worried about a kitty. It just kind of reminds me of what I need to stay aware of if the adrenaline of being concerned leaves me frazzled.

 

[walli]

I would cat sit too!
fyi: I found a cat sitter to deal with my situation, so it is possible!
It was a waitress at the ihop who started a pet sitting business, Cat lover who had brought in a stray before so she was totally open to it.
She loved Joey! and he loved her too!

 

[Buffster7]

Of course, then there might come a day when I asked you just how much you like my kitties! Crash course!

I would cat sit too!
fyi: I found a cat sitter to deal with my situation, so it is possible!

You guys are GREAT!
Jcatbird, it's a pity we don't live closer, because I would love to meet your clan, and you can bet I would step in and give you a much-needed break!
Walli, I might be tempted to abscond with Joey. I've seen that tail, now, I cannot be trusted.

I just had to pop in and say hi and say thanks! I will be scarce over the next few weeks as I get through midterms and my first clinical rotation, but hope to have some good news about introductions soon. On a side note, I've killed two brown recluse spiders just walking across my kitchen floor in broad daylight in the last week! I know I have them in my crawl space, but they're usually reclusive and I've not had to kill them out in the open as frequently as this. Are they a threat to cats - anyone know off the top of your head?

I hope you ladies are doing well! Looking forward to catching up around here as soon as I have a chance.

 

[Jcatbird]

Yes. They will bite the kitties. Fortunately they are reclusive. You could put out some traps for them. The little box traps that are used for roaches and other critters that have a small sticky pad inside might work. Put them where the kitties can’t get them. I use Victor lighted flea traps to catch all bugs but with kitties tempted to paw at the sticky part, I shut the traps inside a carrier so the cats that are tempted cannot get a paw stuck on the pad. When I first got them a cat, or two, ran through the house with a white sticky pad on their paw. Most now know better but new kitties are kept separate from them. I love the traps. They are great indicators of anything that is around. Fleas jump in but they don’t jump out!
We’ll look to hear from you AFTER midterms. Concentrate on that and post if you need us. Good luck!

 

[Buffster7]

You guys! I'm beside myself with relief. With the help and coaching of Jcatbird, I got the nerve to try again and hang in there through the re-introduction. I honestly don't think I would have been able to do it without that help, I mean it. So much anxiety! BUT...they've had a few disagreements and one fur-flying episode but overall they are really doing well! I cannot believe the comfort level they've achieved in just 2 days!

They are still territorial and grouchy and sometimes a little growly with each other, but it passes. Today the bunny saved the day - they forgot all about each other and were so focused on the bunny that Charlie jumped up on the top perch which used to be "his" spot but Finn has since gone to great lengths to claim - and Finn didn't fuss and they actually shared the perch for about 2 seconds before Finn jumped down. A couple minutes later he decided he wanted another look, so he jumped back up, and I got a pic! I am giddy!

Finn is back in his room for now because he has NO manners and won't stay out of my food while I'm eating dinner, regardless of how firmly I say "NO" and remove him from my plate. I finally gave up and put him back in his room. I just had to pop in and share the good news!! And to thank Jcatbird again for allllll the patience and help you have given!

 

[Jcatbird]

Awwwwww! Look at them! That makes me melt. From the beginning of your descriptions of Charlie and his reaction to Finn when he was outside I have felt that he wanted a buddy. It looks like they are both so happy bunny watching together. I know this has been a rocky path and there are still a few pebbles along the way but you climbed all the mountains! I thank you for the appreciation but you should be patting yourself on the back! Big time! The patience all came from you. You did all the work and made them understand as well as feel the love. That video and the pictures made me soooo happy! That last photo is one that will remain framed in my mind. Bravo to you, Charlie and Finn! I’m holding a kitty and doing a happy dance! Thankful for the bunny too! Keep coming bunny!
Best news ever!

 

[pearl99]

Wow how exciting! Amazing amazing. "...but it passes..." those are some priceless words for all your hard work and patience. Can't wait for more updates.

 

[rubysmama]

What a great update !!!!
Love, that last pic of them together on the cat tree.

 

[shadowsrescue]

What a heartwarming update! Yea for Finn and Charlie!!!

 

[Buffster7]

From the beginning of your descriptions of Charlie and his reaction to Finn when he was outside I have felt that he wanted a buddy.

Yes you did, and I think he did, too. I think he was starting to get depressed living here all alone; he had stopped playing and really just laid around all day and seemed a little listless. He has perked up since Finn has been here.

He's still really hissy with Finn, but Finn is really pouncy, so Charlie has to warn him. Finn's also really territorial and has claimed ALL the litter boxes as his own, even Charlie's! If he so much as hears Charlie scratching in one, Finn is off on the hunt and will pounce him. Not quite sure what to do about that. Overall, I think they're well-matched. If Finn weren't so cocky I honestly think Charlie would bully him.

Wow how exciting! Amazing amazing. "...but it passes..." those are some priceless words for all your hard work and patience. Can't wait for more updates.

Thanks so much, Pearl99! I'm amazed, too!

What a great update !!!!
Love, that last pic of them together on the cat tree.

I have a video of the two of them in it again today that I will post!

What a heartwarming update! Yea for Finn and Charlie!!!

Thanks so much, Shadowsrescue! Your help along the way has also been tremendously helpful and very much appreciated! I finally ordered some of the Charlotte's Web for Charlie. My brother stopped by yesterday and also thought Charlie looked like his joints were struggling. I'm hoping this CBD oil will help - thanks for the recommendation!

I had a study group over today, and I'm afraid Finn and Charlie were a bit of a distraction. They still fuss, but they fuss less each day and they recover quickly. Charlie reluctantly shared his tree today..

 

[Jcatbird]

That is too funny! Charlie was keeping Finn in his place! Kind of,” If you want to be up here, don’t stand over me! Lay down and chill!” It sounds like they are a big hit with everyone. No surprise there. Charlie did air bites too. He is teaching Finn the rules. Each time I see more progress.
Who knows, maybe one of the members of the study group will decide they need a kitty too! If you get exposed to such great purrsonalities, it can be contagious!

 

[pearl99]

Such an adorable video. Doing so well.

 

[rubysmama]

I have a video of the two of them in it again today that I will post!

Oh, adorable. Just 2 brothers annoying each other.

Finn's also really territorial and has claimed ALL the litter boxes as his own, even Charlie's! If he so much as hears Charlie scratching in one, Finn is off on the hunt and will pounce him. Not quite sure what to do about that.

That, unfortunately, could become an issue. Especially if Charlie starts having litter box avoidance issues. Hopefully it won't come to that. How many litter boxes do you have?