Guar Gum and Agar Agar

[Show Me Your Kitties]

So it appears Teddy and Finny are sensitive/allergic to turkey, chicken, lamb, and eggs (so far).

My options are limited food-wise. They hate Rawz now, I can't find Feline Natural's Venison flavor anymore, and they've never been a fan of beef (so MeatMates is out since that is literally the only protein they offer my boys can eat).

I have avoided gums ever since getting them off Fancy Feast a few weeks after adoption, but I'm kind of backed into a wall now. I will eventually try making my own food, but until then I might have to go against my discomfort with feeding gums. Trade one evil (allergies) for another (gums).

My question is, what is everyone's current opinion on the two gums listed in the title? I heard Guar Gum is a soluble fiber, and there hasn't been much research on Agar Agar on whether or not it negatively affects cats' health overtime, at least as far as I know.

It seems whenever I finally find food without gums it has veggies and fruit or something else horribly unnecessary in it.

I'm gonna look over the ingredient list on this site when I get the time, but just wondered if anyone could ease my mind about feeding foods with either of these gums.

Thanks

 

[Furballsmom]

Do you have any wiggle room that you could alternate feeding foods with those two ingredients?

what is everyone's current opinion

I personally have other ingredients that I really try and avoid, depending on what The Furred Creature allows me to do

 

[She's a witch]

Yeah I also feed food with gums because that’s the must if I want to keep big rotation. I hate this though. I understand the guar gum is somewhat better, based on Dr Pierson’ opinion, but unfortunately, the otherwise better food seems to have agar agar, which loosens my boy’s stool, just as carrageenan does. I still occasionally use it as it doesn’t have such effect when rarely fed.

 

[Show Me Your Kitties]

Do you have any wiggle room that you could alternate feeding foods with those two ingredients?


I personally have other ingredients that I really try and avoid, depending on what The Furred Creature allows me to do

It might be hard considering how little food there are without gums at all, that also doesn't have other stuff in it like veggies/fruit and aren't the proteins they are allergic to I'd rather not feed them anything with gums at all, but idk what to do.

I am going to look into making my own and how I can do that with my budget. Also EZ complete has chicken liver so I need to also find an alternative to that.

I feel like my head is gonna explode lol

 

[Show Me Your Kitties]

Yeah I also feed food with gums because that’s the must if I want to keep big rotation. I hate this though. I understand the guar gum is somewhat better, based on Dr Pierson’ opinion, but unfortunately, the otherwise better food seems to have agar agar, which loosens my boy’s stool, just as carrageenan does. I still occasionally use it as it doesn’t have such effect when rarely fed.

Yeah, I really like Hound and Gatos protein options because it's not just turkey and chicken and beef like so many other cat foods, but it has agar agar in it. I'm wary of that stuff honestly.

 

[She's a witch]

Yeah, I really like Hound and Gatos protein options because it's not just turkey and chicken and beef like so many other cat foods, but it has agar agar in it. I'm wary of that stuff honestly.

I was going to recommend Koha but yes, they use agar agar too. So does Kiwi Kitchens.
How about ZiwiPeak? Although they use chickpeas and i personally avoid it more than gums...
Some Instincts could be option but again, pees...
Good luck with the homemade!

 

[Show Me Your Kitties]

I was going to recommend Koha but yes, they use agar agar too. So does Kiwi Kitchens.
How about ZiwiPeak? Although they use chickpeas and i personally avoid it more than gums...
Some Instincts could be option but again, pees...
Good luck with the homemade!

If it weren't for the chickpeas I'd be all over ziwipeak. I love their recipe minus that one ingredient. Though I can't remember if they have non chicken/turkey/lamb options.

My boys do eat the air dry food, although I'm gonna have to change it to the single protein venison bag since they eat the lamb/mackerel and the chicken...

I also tried the non gum koha can (I think it was the duck or turkey stew) and they wouldn't even lick it...

 

[BaileyCat]

When I fed canned, it was impossible to avoid all the ingredients that I wanted to avoid. Rotating brands helped with not having to feed all the same "evil" ingredients all the time. At one point, only one food contained carrageenan. A person can only do SO much.

As far as feeding raw and you looking for an alternative to Ez Complete, Aluntrin is a great option. (KnowWhatYouFeed.com). It is less expensive also. I've used it for many years.

Good luck!

 

[Show Me Your Kitties]

When I fed canned, it was impossible to avoid all the ingredients that I wanted to avoid. Rotating brands helped with not having to feed all the same "evil" ingredients all the time. At one point, only one food contained carrageenan. A person can only do SO much.

As far as feeding raw and you looking for an alternative to Ez Complete, Aluntrin is a great option. (KnowWhatYouFeed.com). It is less expensive also. I've used it for many years.

Good luck!

I almost miss my blissful ignorant days. Not knowing what I know now was less stressful lol

Does the alnutrin have egg in it?

 

[BaileyCat]

Without Bones:
Ingredients: Egg yolk powder, calcium carbonate, taurine, iodized salt, vitamin E, iron amino acid chelate, copper citrate, manganese amino acid chelate, zinc oxide, vitamin D3, vitamin B12, vitamin B1.

You have to add liver to boneless meals.

With Bones:
Ingredients: Egg yolk powder, taurine, iodized salt, vitamin E, iron amino acid chelate, copper citrate, manganese amino acid chelate, zinc oxide, vitamin D3, vitamin B12, vitamin B1.

I'm glad you asked! I have a dog that is allergic to chicken. All but one symptom cleared up, when I stopped feeding her raw chicken or raw chicken organs. Once in a while she still has a runny eye. I figured we cross-contamintated (using the same serving spoon) when dishing out her meals and the cats. I didn't think about the egg yolk in the Alnutrin!

I almost miss my blissful ignorant days. Not knowing what I know now was less stressful lol

I soooooooo can relate! However you will be AMAZED by the changes you see in your cats, once you make the switch. Eyes on the prize.

 

[Show Me Your Kitties]

Without Bones:
Ingredients: Egg yolk powder, calcium carbonate, taurine, iodized salt, vitamin E, iron amino acid chelate, copper citrate, manganese amino acid chelate, zinc oxide, vitamin D3, vitamin B12, vitamin B1.

You have to add liver to boneless meals.

With Bones:
Ingredients: Egg yolk powder, taurine, iodized salt, vitamin E, iron amino acid chelate, copper citrate, manganese amino acid chelate, zinc oxide, vitamin D3, vitamin B12, vitamin B1.

I'm glad you asked! I have a dog that is allergic to chicken. All but one symptom cleared up, when I stopped feeding her raw chicken or raw chicken organs. Once in a while she still has a runny eye. I figured we cross-contamintated (using the same serving spoon) when dishing out her meals and the cats. I didn't think about the egg yolk in the Alnutrin!



I soooooooo can relate! However you will be AMAZED by the changes you see in your cats, once you make the switch. Eyes on the prize.

So I guess I have to find a recipe that uses individual supplements and follow that. Unless there is another thing like alnutrin and ez complete that is egg allergy friendly.

They already eat raw, but they've been eating turkey/chicken...so on the bright side they already really enjoy raw and are used to it.

 

[BaileyCat]

There are pre-made raw foods that I feed that are 80/10/5/5. No supplements are included. I have been told that I don't have to add any. Sometimes I do. Sometimes I don't. Sometimes I just add taurine.

Another reason I continue to rotate. Only now, I rotate batches... what is included (or not in) a batch of raw.

I do NOT advocate feeding an unbalanced meal. However, there is a bit of wiggle room. IMHO. Cats, in the wild, don't measure out each meal.

 

[lisahe]

Yeah I also feed food with gums because that’s the must if I want to keep big rotation. I hate this though. I understand the guar gum is somewhat better, based on Dr Pierson’ opinion, but unfortunately, the otherwise better food seems to have agar agar, which loosens my boy’s stool, just as carrageenan does. I still occasionally use it as it doesn’t have such effect when rarely fed.

Yes to this -- I agree that guar gum is better. And yes to agar agar causing problems: our cats both barf when they eat it. (The agar agar bothers both; the green-lipped mussels that are in many of the foods we feed with agar agar also makes one of our cats barf.)

 

[Show Me Your Kitties]

There are pre-made raw foods that I feed that are 80/10/5/5. No supplements are included. I have been told that I don't have to add any. Sometimes I do. Sometimes I don't. Sometimes I just add taurine.

Another reason I continue to rotate. Only now, I rotate batches... what is included (or not in) a batch of raw.

I do NOT advocate feeding an unbalanced meal. However, there is a bit of wiggle room. IMHO. Cats, in the wild, don't measure out each meal.

I would honestly feel better using supplements and following a recipe exactly (other than removing allergens) because my biggest fear of going homemade is doing something wrong and unknowingly making the boys malnourished.

 

[Show Me Your Kitties]

Yes to this -- I agree that guar gum is better. And yes to agar agar causing problems: our cats both barf when they eat it. (The agar agar bothers both; the green-lipped mussels that are in many of the foods we feed with agar agar also makes one of our cats barf.)

Maybe I just need to find food where the guar gum is far down the ingredient list...

 

[LTS3]

Maybe I just need to find food where the guar gum is far down the ingredient list...

There's a location key on the ingredient spreadsheet and a detailed list on the very last tab Gums start at column AA.

There's a TCS thread on gum-free foods if you want to take a look at that as well:

Wet Food Without Carrageenan Or Guar Gum

So I am learning that these two ingredients are popular thickening additives in a lot of wet foods and they are not great options. Do you guys make sure what you feed your cat doesn't have these? I'll admit, my new addition thinks Meow Mix Simple Servings wet food is pretty fantastic, but I...

thecatsite.com

Feline Instincts makes an egg-free pre-mix to use with raw meat: Egg Free Raw Meat Cat & Dog Food Premix - Feline Instincts Further discussion of raw / home cooked diets and pre-mixes should be taken to the Raw and Homed Cooked forum

 

[BaileyCat]

I would honestly feel better using supplements and following a recipe exactly (other than removing allergens) because my biggest fear of going homemade is doing something wrong and unknowingly making the boys malnourished.

I TOTALLY understand! Fear of screwing up is what kept me from feeding raw for a very long time. In fact, I still worry a bit. And I've been feeding ground raw for close to 10 years!

Like I mentioned, some say a person doesn't have to add any supplements if feeding 80/10/5/5. Others say you should. I could give you more examples, but I would just stress you out more.
The supplement info is from what I consider very reliable sources... but who is actually correct?

 

[BaileyCat]

Further discussion of raw / home cooked diets and pre-mixes should be taken to the Raw and Homed Cooked forum

Oops. Sorry. I was typing and editing as you posted.

 

[lisahe]

Maybe I just need to find food where the guar gum is far down the ingredient list...

Yes, that's one approach! But given your cats' problem proteins, you're already starting with a limited pool of ingredients, so that further reduces your choices. Reduced choices are a big reason we feed a lot of freeze-dried raw food. I know raw food, including freeze-dried, isn't for everybody but our cats really love pork, so they get one meal a day of Primal freeze-dried pork, which has no gums, thickeners, or other things our cats can't/won't eat. I can't say I'm thrilled about all the ingredients, but pretty much any food (other than custom homemade) has its compromises. There may well be something in here that you can't/won't feed and your cats might not like freeze-dried raw food, but this is just a suggestion, another sort of "mode" of food. Primal makes a fairly broad range of foods and there are other brands.

 

[Show Me Your Kitties]

There's a location key on the ingredient spreadsheet and a detailed list on the very last tab Gums start at column AA.

There's a TCS thread on gum-free foods if you want to take a look at that as well:

http://[URL]https://thecatsite.com/threads/wet-food-without-carrageenan-or-guar-gum.396855

[/URL]

Feline Instincts makes an egg-free pre-mix to use with raw meat: Egg Free Raw Meat Cat & Dog Food Premix - Feline Instincts Further discussion of raw / home cooked diets and pre-mixes should be taken to the Raw and Homed Cooked forum

Thanks I'll take a look!