Fluid In Cat's Chest - Advice Needed

[Antonio65]

@artiemom,
the vet who visited Pallina on Wednesday is her usual vet, the new one I had found in December has vanished in the air The last time he emailed me was a month ago, asked me if there was any news, I told him that we had a check-up and blood test on that very day, he asked me for the blood reports, and then was gone...
The university professor has visited Pallina 2 weeks ago, said he doesn't know what to do and told me to wait and see.

The pain kill the regular vet gave Pallina is the Tramadol. I learned that it is incredibly heavy on a cat's system the hard way.
A few hours after the shot Pallina looked totally stoned. She acted weird, she did strange things, her pupils were wide as never before. I'm sure she didn't know where she was and who we were. She didn't eat the whole day, and neither she used the litter tray. She just stayed in her bed, but wasn't sleeping, just staring at nothing. Sometimes it seemed as she was seeing things that weren't there.
At 10 pm I called the clinic and they told me that Tramadol occasionally can give these symptoms, but they are temporary and usually disappear in about 24h. They told me to keep a close eye on her and rush her to the clinic anytime if I had to see something strange.
Luckily it wasn't necessary. Yesterday in the morning she was still a bit confused, later in the afternoon she was better and this morning I think she was fine.
Of course I didn't use the four syringes the vet handed me!

The CBC is still fine.
The chemistry has somewhat improved in the liver department, but worsened for her kidneys
The values are as follows [NOW (Jan 8) (Dec 21)]
ALT 241 (was 286) (was 312) [10-60]
ALP 206 (was 157) (was 272) [10-150]
GGT 5 (was 12) (was 4) [0-10]
BUN 19.8 (was 28.7) (was 42.7) [10-30]
Crea 2.8 (was 1.9) (was 2.2) [0.5-2.0]

So it seems that the liver supplement has worked rather fine in the last two months, but the creatinine has raised a lot in a month time, I wonder if this is a consequence of the prolonged use of prednisolone.

 

[Jojo&Tutu]

How is Pallina doing now compared to before? Is there more or less fluid? I am really glad you have University vets nearby. They can offer the most educated with unusual conditions. Is Pallina on any kind of steroids to help if it is inflammatory such as a low dose budesonide? My prayers are with you for her getting better. My kitty Tutu is also on budesonide steroid low dose and clavomox antibiotic low dose to help with IBD, inflammatory liver and pancreatitis. It is good to know about communities of support for intestinal lymphoma which is very common in cats. My friend has two cats treated with chemo one already in remission the other tolerating chemo very well. Remission is very possible. I am very sorry about your losing your other cat Lola. You are very loving and caring for your cats and I know they are truly lucky for your care. My prayers are with you.

 

[Antonio65]

Pallina isn't showing anything different. She acts normally, she breathes normally. I check her breath nearly everyday when she sleeps. Last time yesterday, she had 24 acts per minute, evenly spaced and with a regular and perfect pattern.
The vet at the University told me to check on her and if I see any difference or trouble, then it's time for a new visit and draining.
We don't know how much fluid she has at the moment. The last time she was scanned it was about 100 ml, but they didn't drain it because I noticed that everytime she was drained, she had two bad days following that, with noisy breathing and bad shape. So we keep this resource as the last one.

When the vets at the facility in Belgium told me about that fluid (very little amount at that time), it was a surprise to me, because she hadn't shown any sign. And she never showed any sign during these months either, even when the drained amount was 140 ml, that is probably half of the chest capacity.
They told me that Pallina is able to compensate for that very well.

In the attempt to treat her for this fluid in the chest condition, she was also put on prednisolone for a month, without success, and two different diuretics didn't work, they only worsened her kidneys condition.

She was also taking supplements for her liver disease, but I discontinued them because she was vomiting every single day and I was sure that those supplements (Denosyl-like pills) were the culprits.

Now she's on omeprazole since last Friday to see if we can control her vomit, which happens only early in the morning, as soon as she wakes up.

I would go forward with the radio iodine therapy for your cat. A crazy thyroid does not only involves her heart, but her liver, kidneys and other vital functions too.
So, once the thyroid is fixed, many other trobles would fix too!

All the best for your Tutu!

 

[Jojo&Tutu]

Tutu is on zofran (ondansetron) 4mg tablet 1/2 pill per day (=2mg) for vomiting and it has helped her vomiting tremendously. She used to spasm in her bowel with bowel movements and throw up afterwards typically in the morning or with stress a few times a week and now for the first time in her life only a couple vomits a month!!! The zofran works. You might check into this. It relaxes the muscles and intestine a bit. She is also on Budesonide, a steroid that helps the bowel without too much aggravating other organs. It is specific for IBD. She is on .4 mg a day Budesonide. It is compounded into a capsule by a compounding pharmacy to get a low dose. It helps with IBD inflammation without affecting other organs as much as prednisone does. It helps inflammation. Any higher dose of Budesonide causes pancreatitis in her. She also takes Pepsid ac (famotidine) 1/4 of a 10 mg pill twice a day. She got off denosyl for liver years ago. She is also on .625 mg amlodipine blood pressure medicine compounded into a capsule once a day to help her kidneys but not good for Pallina as it can cause fluid build up in legs as per my own doctor. Perhaps once her thyroid is fixed Tutu won't need the blood pressure meds. The last thing Tutu is on is Clavamox antibiotic 62.5 mg pill twice a day mostly because of pancreatitis. Tutu's internal medicine vet is a former professor from University of California Davis. Cindy her vet said she can be on clavamox long term for life no harm but hoping we can get her off it once over the thyroid issues. Pallina has very similar conditions as Tutu so maybe some of this info on medications can help Pallina. I also add a tablespoon of organic pumpkin baby food into a 5 ounce can of cat food to help her constipation. Tutu is also on limited ingredient unique protein diet right now venison. She will probably switch proteins again in near future. Pallina is a beautiful kitty. I hope the thyroid treatment did not aggravate the fluid issue for Pallina. Here is a couple of my favorite pictures of Tutu. I taught color photography for years at the university and developed curriculum for the first college art course in digital photography internationally back in the 1980s. I was injured by illegal military radiation research 25 years ago but continued teaching design for many years. I have since retired. I believe with all my research that much of our and our pets health problems are because of the excess exposures to radiofrequency and harmonics from smart meters and excess cellular exposures. Get rid of your smart meter if you have one and put your phone on airplane mode when not in use. That might help your kitties the most!!!

 

[Jojo&Tutu]

View attachment 226366 View attachment 226365 Tutu is on zofran (ondansetron) 4mg tablet 1/2 pill per day (=2mg) for vomiting and it has helped her vomiting tremendously. She used to spasm in her bowel with bowel movements and throw up afterwards typically in the morning or with stress a few times a week and now for the first time in her life only a couple vomits a month!!! The zofran works. You might check into this. It relaxes the muscles and intestine a bit. She is also on Budesonide, a steroid that helps the bowel without too much aggravating other organs. It is specific for IBD. She is on .4 mg a day Budesonide. It is compounded into a capsule by a compounding pharmacy to get a low dose. It helps with IBD inflammation without affecting other organs as much as prednisone does. It helps inflammation. Any higher dose of Budesonide causes pancreatitis in her. She also takes Pepsid ac (famotidine) 1/4 of a 10 mg pill twice a day. She got off denosyl for liver years ago. She is also on .625 mg amlodipine blood pressure medicine compounded into a capsule once a day to help her kidneys but not good for Pallina as it can cause fluid build up in legs as per my own doctor. Perhaps once her thyroid is fixed Tutu won't need the blood pressure meds. The last thing Tutu is on is Clavamox antibiotic 62.5 mg pill twice a day mostly because of pancreatitis. Tutu's internal medicine vet is a former professor from University of California Davis. Cindy her vet said she can be on clavamox long term for life no harm but hoping we can get her off it once over the thyroid issues. Pallina has very similar conditions as Tutu so maybe some of this info on medications can help Pallina. I also add a tablespoon of organic pumpkin baby food into a 5 ounce can of cat food to help her constipation. Tutu is also on limited ingredient unique protein diet right now venison. She will probably switch proteins again in near future. Pallina is a beautiful kitty. I hope the thyroid treatment did not aggravate the fluid issue for Pallina. Here is a couple of my favorite pictures of Tutu. I taught color photography for years at the university and developed curriculum for the first college art course in digital photography internationally back in the 1980s. I was injured by illegal military radiation research 25 years ago but continued teaching design for many years. I have since retired. I believe with all my research that much of our and our pets health problems are because of the excess exposures to radiofrequency and harmonics from smart meters and excess cellular exposures. Get rid of your smart meter if you have one and put your phone on airplane mode when not in use. That might help your kitties the most!!!

I forgot to mention that Tutu is
3/4 Siamese 1/4 Balinese chocolate point and around 6 1/2 pound sometimes more or sometimes a little less. She looks good at 6 pounds 10 ounces.

 

[Antonio65]

Tutu is on zofran (ondansetron) 4mg tablet 1/2 pill per day (=2mg) for vomiting and it has helped her vomiting tremendously. She used to spasm in her bowel with bowel movements and throw up afterwards typically in the morning or with stress a few times a week and now for the first time in her life only a couple vomits a month!!! The zofran works. You might check into this.

This could be a very useful tip, I will forward it to my vets if the omeprazole doesn't work. We're at the beginning with this med, I'll give it a couple of weeks to see if it is effective.
Pallina sometimes throws up right after the tray in the morning, or she gose to the tray right after her vomit, so the two things might be related, and this is similar to Tutu's condition.

She is also on Budesonide, a steroid that helps the bowel without too much aggravating other organs. It is specific for IBD. She is on .4 mg a day Budesonide. It is compounded into a capsule by a compounding pharmacy to get a low dose. It helps with IBD inflammation without affecting other organs as much as prednisone does.

I'll take note of this too, in case her IBD gets out of control. She's currently rather fine with it, though her vomit could be induced by the chronic IBD.

She is also on .625 mg amlodipine blood pressure medicine compounded into a capsule once a day to help her kidneys but not good for Pallina as it can cause fluid build up in legs as per my own doctor.

This was the med that was given to my other cat, now at the Bridge... I know it well...

I also add a tablespoon of organic pumpkin baby food into a 5 ounce can of cat food to help her constipation. Tutu is also on limited ingredient unique protein diet right now venison. She will probably switch proteins again in near future.

I used to add some seeds of psyllium until a month ago, I had been doing that for nearly 4 years, then I discontinued them too in the attempt to spot what was causing her vomit.

As for the smart meters, we don't have them here. As for the smartphone, there are so many other radiation emitting devices around... the wireless modem, the surveillance cameras, the cordless phones, mine and others' around me... so I think that my smartphone is the least of the problems.

Take care of your wonderful Tutu, she's gorgeous!

 

[Jojo&Tutu]

View attachment 226366 View attachment 226365 Tutu is on zofran (ondansetron) 4mg tablet 1/2 pill per day (=2mg) for vomiting and it has helped her vomiting tremendously. She used to spasm in her bowel with bowel movements and throw up afterwards typically in the morning or with stress a few times a week and now for the first time in her life only a couple vomits a month!!! The zofran works. You might check into this. It relaxes the muscles and intestine a bit. She is also on Budesonide, a steroid that helps the bowel without too much aggravating other organs. It is specific for IBD. She is on .4 mg a day Budesonide. It is compounded into a capsule by a compounding pharmacy to get a low dose. It helps with IBD inflammation without affecting other organs as much as prednisone does. It helps inflammation. Any higher dose of Budesonide causes pancreatitis in her. She also takes Pepsid ac (famotidine) 1/4 of a 10 mg pill twice a day. She got off denosyl for liver years ago. She is also on .625 mg amlodipine blood pressure medicine compounded into a capsule once a day to help her kidneys but not good for Pallina as it can cause fluid build up in legs as per my own doctor. Perhaps once her thyroid is fixed Tutu won't need the blood pressure meds. The last thing Tutu is on is Clavamox antibiotic 62.5 mg pill twice a day mostly because of pancreatitis. Tutu's internal medicine vet is a former professor from University of California Davis. Cindy her vet said she can be on clavamox long term for life no harm but hoping we can get her off it once over the thyroid issues. Pallina has very similar conditions as Tutu so maybe some of this info on medications can help Pallina. I also add a tablespoon of organic pumpkin baby food into a 5 ounce can of cat food to help her constipation. Tutu is also on limited ingredient unique protein diet right now venison. She will probably switch proteins again in near future. Pallina is a beautiful kitty. I hope the thyroid treatment did not aggravate the fluid issue for Pallina. Here is a couple of my favorite pictures of Tutu. I taught color photography for years at the university and developed curriculum for the first college art course in digital photography internationally back in the 1980s. I was injured by illegal military radiation research 25 years ago but continued teaching design for many years. I have since retired. I believe with all my research that much of our and our pets health problems are because of the excess exposures to radiofrequency and harmonics from smart meters and excess cellular exposures. Get rid of your smart meter if you have one and put your phone on airplane mode when not in use. That might help your kitties the most!!!

Suggest to your vets the Zofran and Budesonide. The budesonide might help the bowel inflammation and general inflammation and if low dose enough won't aggravate other organs. It is gentler than prednisone. The famotidine (pepsid ac) is an antiacid that might also help IBD. The psyllium husk just caused my cat constipation. The little bit of pumpkin baby food no more than one tablespoon per 5 oz. can of cat food is gentle and with zofran relaxing the intestinal muscles a bit her stool comes out much more easily. I hope this helps Pallina!!! This is per 15 years experience with IBD withTutu and trying a whole lot as per her internal medicine vet. You are lucky no smart meters. This country is nuts with them. They are 24/7 harmonics and high frequency on everything metal in the home. The plumbing, gas and electric lines, the rebar in the slab, the mattress springs. I keep a lot unplugged when not in use. I am thinking I will have to move into the country to reduce Tutu and my exposures.

 

[Jojo&Tutu]

I woke up this morning thinking about Pallina. I reread your site trying to think of any of my experiences that might help you. One thing I remember is stopping ranitidine because of problems it caused but I don't remember why. I just remember it was bad. The 1/4 of 10 mg pill of famotidine (Pepcid ac low dose) works better for her as an anti acid. A higher dose famotidine caused liver values or pancreatitis to elevate. You might switch over to low dose famotidine. Too high of a dose of steroid can cause pancreatitis hence my vet recommended lowering to .4mg budesonide. This helped lower her pancreatitis values to almost normal after they were quite elevated. The advantage of prednisone is that it does affect more areas of the body but disadvantage that it can increase pancreatitis. The advantage of budesonide is that it mostly only affects the bowel but too high if a dose does cause pancreatitis. Sometimes they start on a higher dose steroid and slowly lower it. Sometimes they dose a steroid every other day but it didn't work for Tutu. If Pallina is on a high protein diet it can cause Bun or Creatinine to elevate which is in a sense normal but look at the bun/creatinine ratio to see if it is ok. That is key. Around three months after I 131 treatment thyroid should stabilize at a new level so if lower it could affect kidneys function. She might need a tiny bit of thyroid meds. With the thyroid reduced and the diuretic and appetite stimulant that reduces fluids it might be too much fluid reduction for her kidneys to work well. Someone on this catsite wrote about a new appetite stimulant called Entyce which might work differently and might not reduce fluids on the kidneys as an antihistamine does. (I am not sure). Remember that with IBD Triad disease (liver,bowel and pancreatitis involved is called Triad disease) and kidney disease it is all a balancing act. Too much of fixing one thing can throw off another. That has been my experience. Keep an eye on thyroid levels which if low can throw off kidney function.

 

[Jojo&Tutu]

I also add that with the fluid lung issue I am not sure how to factor that in as I have no experience with that. But perhaps the one vet specialist who said some fluid is normal is something to consider.
Wishing you and Pallina well.