The "What's on your mind?" Thread -2017

[arouetta]

I was scared over my lack of humanity when I woke up feeling nothing about the loss, nothing about Shadow not being there. It didn't take long though to realize the nothingness was a protection mechanism.

There were too many other things I needed, so I didn't pay the mail order pharmacy in a timely manner and there was a two week delay in shipping my medicine. My mood stabilizer and anti-psychotic, I had enough on hand, the antidepressant I'd just have to skip a few days. I've been doing so good that I thought I'd be just fine skipping a few days of my antidepressant, the depression is long past but it does well for my ADHD. Now I'm not so sure of that decision.

 

[Margret]

I'm not sure what kind of antidepressant they have you on, arouetta , but many of them take time to build up to a therapeutic level in the bloodstream, and time to leave the bloodstream when you quit taking them. However, it isn't recommended that you stop your antidepressants cold turkey. You may want to ask your doctor if you can have some sample packs to tide you over.

That numbness you report can be a protection mechanism, emotional "callouses" built up over time, shock, or the denial stage of grief. Or any combination of those. And it's all mixed in with the antidepressant, anti-psychotic, and mood stabilizer. You should probably report it to your doctor as it may indicate a need for some adjustment of your prescriptions. What you shouldn't do is feel guilty over it. We feel what we feel, and we don't have to justify it.

Margret

 

[arouetta]

I know what you mean about not stopping suddenly, but I've done this with the antidepressant before when I was forcibly switched to the mail order pharmacy, nothing other than being disorganized and forgetful, signs of ADHD. But the only stress then was screaming at the insurance company for suddenly jacking up my copay by three times the amount to force me to switch.

Samples? What are those? It's desipramine, it lost the patent decades ago, there's no samples produced for it. Unfortunately it's also an expensive generic, the $60 for 30 pills that the insurance company said is my local pharmacy copay doesn't cover the full cost of those 30 pills. It's between $3-$4 a pill, I did price it once because I swore the insurance company had to be making me pay more than full price for a decades old generic.

Kinda hard to not feel guilty. Because I do. I'm the one that made the choice to end her life and followed through with it. It doesn't matter that she was clearly in full agreement, I still was the one that held the power to make that choice and not turn back. Last night a co-worker asked me how I was doing, she didn't know about Shadow and I just blurted out, "I murdered my cat today, how are you?"

 

[Margret]

Oh, my dear! You know it's not murder! You wouldn't hold anyone else here to that standard. Don't do it to yourself. I know this decision always makes us feel guilty; generally in two conflicting ways at once -- Did I do it too soon? Did I wait too long? The answer is, you did it as soon as it became obvious to you that it was time; it's unreasonable to expect more (or less) than that from yourself. It was Shadow's time, and Shadow couldn't do it for herself, so you helped her. Isn't this what we always do for our cats? They can't open those enticing cans themselves, so we do it for them. They can't open that door by themselves, so we open it for them. They can't wake up the red dot on their own, so we do it for them. Sometimes, they get to the place where they can't make it onto the bed on their own, so we help them.

That said, no, you're not numb. Feeling guilty is the normal first response to euthanizing a pet. Your emotions are working properly. The grieving will happen in its own time, at its own pace, probably with or without the antidepressant, though it's obvious that you should get back on it as soon as possible. But please, do keep reminding yourself that this guilt is irrational.

Margret

 

[arouetta]

I gotta say, I think I'm understanding why assisted suicide laws are so firmly entrenched. It has nothing to do with the often trumpeted fear that someone will try to save Granny's inheritance from the nursing home by offing her and claiming she wanted it. It has everything to do with how strong the guilt would be afterward.

I have never, ever in my life had an animal put down before. Never once. My parents did with one dog, but I wasn't taken along, I was in school when they went. There were a few badly injured animals when I was very young that it would have been a cruelty to take them on an hour's drive to the nearest vet (assuming the animal could possibly survive the hour's long drive, like the kitten who climbed in a car engine and was in the wrong spot when the fan motor turned on) and my family were hunters, if you get my drift. Most of our pets just disappeared, probably coyotes. And there was that one cat I took in that died of natural causes, we ended up having to give the companion cat to a new home. So this was my first time making the choice of euthanasia.

And Montressor and I are sharing a can of tun right now, he's not nearly as frantic as usual and actually walked away after getting a taste, and has walked away again. And he's pretty old himself. He probably doesn't have much time left before I have to do this all over again.

And tuna.....I needed a quick protein meal and nothing's quicker than a can of tuna. But I'm crying because Shadow would have been at my feet meowing non-stop, and she was the only cat to get the privilege of eating it off my fork, which I would then use for my next bite. Yeah, I swapped spit with a cat.

 

[kashmir64]

I have a different view on things. I have had animals put down, and I've seen others die a horrible natural death. I have never felt guilt over the ones I had put down. I felt, as their protector, it was my job to make sure that they did not suffer. I was lucky enough to know when it was time and took the responsible action. Just knowing that they did not suffer while their bodies shut down or the cancer was taking it's toll on them, actually gave me some peace and closure.
Part of being a responsible pet parent is to never let them suffer when they are terminal and can't be helped.
IMO, you did make the right choice, although a tough one.

 

[kashmir64]

So, I called the shelter to make sure that their website is up to date (it's updated every hour) and to make sure Sable (my tortie foster) was not there.
Apparently, she was back, but only for a short while. She had escaped during one of the thunderstorms. The owners had been trying to find her all night. Animal control picked her up and took her to the shelter.
But, because she has a microchip, she is back home. The owners are keeping a serious eye on her to make sure it doesn't happen again. I let the shelter know (again) that I will adopt her immediately if the need arises.

I'm so glad she seems to be safe.

 

[Margret]

arouetta , it's certainly the toughest decision I've ever had to make, and the first time you have to do it it is somehow shocking how quick and easy it is. I always thought "put to sleep" was a euphemism, and I hated it. It wasn't until I had to have it done myself that I realized it's actually an accurate description.

For what it's worth, in those states that do have assisted suicide laws there are strong protections against the feelings of guilt you mention.

1. It isn't up to the relatives. This is done only on the request of the patient.
2. It isn't friends or relatives who provide the assistance; it's a doctor, and all doctors are free to opt out.
3. In general, it isn't up to one doctor. Several doctors must agree that the patient is terminal and has good cause to want to end it.

My maternal grandmother died of ovarian cancer, shortly before I was born. My Aunt Leonne, who was also a physical therapist, took care of Grammy during her final illness. Throughout most of that illness Grammy declined any pain medications, because she wanted to be totally present in her life for as long as she was still there, but the pain was steadily increasing and Leonne knew that the time was growing close when her mother would say "Yes" when asked if she wanted something for it, so Leonne called her brother, Uncle Myron, who was a cardiologist, and told him the time was close. Myron asked Leonne whether she knew how to give shots, and when Leonne said "Yes" he said, "Okay. I'll call the prescription in to your local pharmacy so you'll have it when Mom needs it."

Aunt Leonne picked up the morphine from the pharmacy, and the next day Grammy asked Leonne to give her something for the pain. Leonne gave her a shot, Grammy relaxed and let go, and passed away. Please note; the morphine did not kill her. It wasn't that big a dose. The thing that killed her was the cancer. All the morphine did was to take away the pain, so that Grammy could finally relax.

Aunt Leonne came to my mother afterwards and begged Mom to forgive her for "killing" their mother. My mother, of course, informed Leonne that she had done exactly the right thing, and that she (my mother) would have done the same had she been there. But it's experiences like this that are one of the main reasons people with terminal cancer have so much trouble getting adequate pain relievers even today. There is a deeply ingrained fear that relieving pain is tantamount to killing.

These are deep problems. I believe that suicide is a fundamental right, but it's not in the constitution and I can understand why it's illegal. Most often it seems to happen simply because puberty is hell on earth, and pubescent children don't understand that it's something they can grow out of. So legislators who want to prevent those tragic deaths make laws against suicide, because legislation is the only tool they have, never mind that it doesn't work.

These are heavy questions, and I doubt that there's any way to answer them as a society; they're too dependent on the individual's conscience. But I am totally convinced that when all hope of health is lost for an animal, and the pain stops being manageable, the last loving gift we can give our pets is an easy end. And yes, we hurt like hell afterwards, but after afterwards, when we've done our grieving and the loss isn't so near, we can look back and remember that, because we were there, our loved ones had gentle deaths.

Take your time. Grieve. Celebrate the wonderful kitty that Shadow was, and the wonderful kitties that Montressor and Midway still are, and help them to get through it. It does get better.

Margret

 

[Alejandra Rico]

I was scared over my lack of humanity when I woke up feeling nothing about the loss, nothing about Shadow not being there. It didn't take long though to realize the nothingness was a protection mechanism.

There were too many other things I needed, so I didn't pay the mail order pharmacy in a timely manner and there was a two week delay in shipping my medicine. My mood stabilizer and anti-psychotic, I had enough on hand, the antidepressant I'd just have to skip a few days. I've been doing so good that I thought I'd be just fine skipping a few days of my antidepressant, the depression is long past but it does well for my ADHD. Now I'm not so sure of that decision.

I don't know if this helps, but odd reactions towards death are kinda common.
I laughed at my grandma's funeral. I am not a monster, I loved her so much, and I was truly very sad but there was a momment in which my brother whispered something and suddenly everything was just too absurd, unreal and a total nonsense. How could she be dead? I was just 18, I wasn't in town to say goodbye to her, she was fine two weeks before when I last saw her...etc.
I laughed too when mom told me (I was 13) that she has put yo sleep our Schnautzer Bosco (bones' cancer). It didn't make sense. How could she do such a thing without telling me? I had been the one taking care of him for months, cleaning the open wound in his front paw four to five times a day, sitting on the floor so he comido rest his head on my thighs.
So, as you can see, I have a very strong Negation reaction when It comes to death of my loved ones. Weaking up feeling nothing just means that you got some extra time to think before pain catches you. You pay for those painless momments with an even more intense pain later on. I know this by personal experience.
Please, don't feel gilty for having a brain that is trying to protect you as best as It knows. It is not fair, as that is just a defense against something too traumatic to deal with at the momment.

 

[arouetta]

Thank you Margret . Your story explains my current feelings, your aunt's feelings.

But one correction, there is no legal assisted suicide. The terminally ill person must take the prescriptions him or herself. Assisted suicide would be crumbling up the medicine and putting it in the feeding tube when the ill person can't physically do it anymore. Basically legally it's murder, even if it's well-known the person wanted that. You either off yourself or they stop life support and let your body die on its own. If something goes wrong and your body won't die, no one can assist you in committing suicide. And that's the part that hurts me. Shadow didn't take the medicine herself, I had to arrange it. I had to make it happen.

And thank you Alejandra Rico . I didn't realize that there could be weird emotional reactions and weird emotional displays.

 

[Willowy]

there is no legal assisted suicide

Canada and Colombia (and Japan, theoretically, but it hasn't been ruled on by their supreme court) have legal active voluntary euthanasia. Meaning that the physician can actively administer the drug under certain circumstances. But anyway, yeah, just me being pedantic again. . .

I kind of prefer having pets put to sleep, as opposed to a "natural" death. I don't like surprises, so finding them dead in bed isn't what I prefer, and I hate watching them die when they do go naturally. It always takes too long even if they aren't suffering. Maybe it's because I have so many pets and have experienced all the ways of losing them? Idk. I don't feel guilty about euthanizing an old or sick pet at all. I think it would kill me if a healthy pet had to be put down because of aggression or something. But when they're incurably sick it just seems like the best gift.

But yeah, guilt is part of the natural grieving process. Let it come, let it go, it will pass.

 

[arouetta]

Canada and Colombia (and Japan, theoretically, but it hasn't been ruled on by their supreme court) have legal active voluntary euthanasia.

I live in the US so I was thinking of US laws and the mindset of people in the US when they scream about how Granny will be forced to be dead for the inheritance.

But yeah, guilt is part of the natural grieving process. Let it come, let it go, it will pass.

I hope the guilt passes soon.

 

[artiemom]

arouetta One thing I have learned about grief: Everyone grieves differently.. It is not up to you nor anyone else to judge how you feel. There is no set time limit on grief. It just happens..

Know that you did the best for your Shadow. You loved her, you took good care of her... she knew love because of you.. she will always be with you..Do not have any regrets.. none.. you did the best you could... (hugs)

If you do not feel as if you are grieving appropriately, then I will suggest to you to read
Kubhla-Ross's Book on the 7 stages of dying.. It deals with grief. Or the Tibetan book of Death..
These explain how the stages are. They do not have to occur in any specific order; they just happen...These helped me a bit, after my mom died.

You are probably still in shock and disbelief.. that is natural...

I kind of know where you are coming from. I had to put one cat down. It was really my mom's cat. I was in charge of her healthcare. She had a seizure, and other major issues, diabetes included. She was in the hospital for almost a week. Finally the Vet called and said there is just too much going on with her..that it was her time. I went over after work, spent a couple of hours with her, in a side room, and then I let them take her. I could not face being there during her last moments. I feel guilty about that to this day..

Be good to yourself... take your medications.. do not stop taking any of them, especially at this time.. Shadow would not want you to suffer at all, due to her. She understands...

Yes, even flippant remarks are a form of grief.. A Grief that is not really focused in the 'normal' human sense of grieving.. You are not crying, carrying on.. you are just mad and upset at what happened and that you had to be the one doing it...

Do not think of yourself as strange..... we all are, in one way or another..

I do not know if this has helped you at all.. but.. I hope it did, at least a tiny bit..

 

[arouetta]

I'm going to be gone from the forum a while. I was told to remove my signature. Fine, I did, great, love that people didn't want it. But I don't feel like dealing with that sort of crap.

 

[artiemom]

arouetta Were you told to remove your signature or to just edit it?

According to what I saw on other's post, they brought up the fact that the dates were incorrect... I do not remember what else you had in your signature.

You may just be a bit oversensitive right now...

Did any of the moderators contact you about removing it? or editing it?

think things over.. do not do anything rash or hasty.... if you need a break, then go for it, but know that people care about you...

 

[Mamanyt1953]

Darlin, I think that in your pain and grief, you misread that post. He only suggested changing the dates of Shadow's beautiful life. Take a break if you need it, but don't leave us. We love you and would miss you so. And we all loved your signature, for that matter. HUGS

 

[Margret]

I hope the guilt passes soon.

It will probably come and go. The problem with the stages of grief is that they sound so organized. The reality is that you can be in bargaining one day, and acceptance the next, and back in bargaining the day after that.

I've posted this before, and I'm sure I will again. Here's what I know about grieving.

• It hurts as much as it hurts. This means that you don't listen when someone says "It was just a cat!" Shadow was a "she," not an "it," and she was a member of your family, not "just" anything.
• It takes as long as it takes. Everyone grieves in their own way and their own time. If anyone says to you something like "It's already been 6 weeks (6 months, a year, whatever), don't you think it's time to let go?" the correct answer is "No." You've already let Shadow go. It will never be time to let her memory go. And your grief for her will go on its own when you're finished with it.
• There are no shortcuts and no bypasses. The only way to the other side of grief is straight through the middle. This is why it's so important not to try to cut your grieving short; doing so only means that you never finish grieving.

One of the reasons you feel guilty is that your subconscious is trying to protect you from vulnerability. If this was somehow your fault, if there was some way to avoid it, that would mean that you could prevent it from ever happening again. Sometimes it seems better to feel guilty than to feel vulnerable. (Incidentally, this is one of the reasons people so often blame themselves after they've been raped.)

Grief has a tendency to ambush us; you'll be walking through the grocery store and see the cat food aisle and burst into embarrassing tears, for instance. My personal experience indicates that this happens less often if I set aside some time every day specifically for grieving. The ambushes seem to be your grief's way of getting your attention, so they're less likely to happen when you actually are paying attention.

Losing a loved one, of any species, is a kind of amputation. Shadow had a place in your heart, and now there's a Shadow-shaped hole there. That hole will never be filled. But, like any amputation, there are two ways it can go. You can let the wound fester and become toxic, or you can take care of it so that it heals cleanly and gradually becomes less painful. Grieving is the way you take care of it. It's not fun, or easy, but it is necessary work, and if we intend to live long lives it's work that we must learn to do. I'm in my mid-sixties now; I've lost 5 dogs, 4 cats, and both parents, and my husband's health is bad enough that I'm likely to lose him, too, some time within the next decade, and that doesn't even mention the friends I've lost. But my health is good enough, and my genes are good enough, that I likely have 30 or more years left to me, and I want to continue to have room in my life for joy, so I do my grief work, when and as it becomes necessary.

And, by the way, while you're grieving, be gentle with yourself. You may find that you forget things easily; anticipate this and make lists. You may find that you snap at people. Apologize, but don't add it on to the burden of guilt. Try not to make any major decisions right now, or any major commitments. In short, cut yourself some slack. And you know that we're all here for you when you need some shoulders to cry on.

Margret

 

[LTS3]

I am so with Lyft, the ride share service. I had to go to the doctor's right after work today and while the public bus kind of goes there, it's a PITA from where I work. So I took a Lyft ride. No problems at all getting there. After the doctor I stopped by Wegmans to pick up some grab and go meals and a few groceries. There is a public bus stop about a mile away but the bus runs infrequently and the next one wasn't for another hour. So I requested another Lyft ride. The driver got within a block and then cancelled the ride I requested another ride but this time the GPS put in the wrong address and I didn't realize it. So the driver ended up at the wrong location a few blocks away. I did call and told the driver my exact location but he cancelled the ride. I requested a third ride with the correct address and the same driver accepts the ride. Five minutes later I got the text saying he had arrived but since I was at the main entrance which is at the back of the complex I needed to call him and let him know. Before I could do that, he marks the ride as completed and I got the payment screen for $7.85 There is no way to exit out of the payment screen to request another ride or to dispute the charge I ended up calling a local taxi company to get a ride home. I checked my email when I got hom and there was one from Lyft apologizing for the cancelled rides but had no other info (copy and psted from the email: We noticed your recent Lyft experience was less than perfect because there were a few cancellations when you requested a ride. We’re sorry for letting you down. We know situations like this are extremely frustrating, and we’re hard at work to make sure this doesn’t happen again. Thanks for hanging in there!)

I am just so with Lyft right now. I filled out that support request form and detailed what happened and that I was NOT going to pay $7.85 for a ride I never got picked up for. I can't use the app now because the payment screen is still there. Hopefully Lyft will cancel the charges.

 

[Margret]

What a bummer, LTS3 ! That's just so incredibly unprofessional of that driver, and it's obvious Lyft doesn't really have customer service in mind with its app, or there would be a way to dispute the charge. I hope you at least get a good night's rest; don't let it keep you up fuming.

Margret

 

[LTS3]

Good news: I got an email from Lyft's customer service. The person apologized for the cancellations and the charge. She said the driver "accidentally" started and ended the ride. How does that happen if there is no passenger? It was price surge time (at 3:30 pm??) so maybe the driver wanted the extra money? The charge has been removed from my account.

Anyways, I'm glad this has been resolved