Started them on raw tonight :D

[gloriajh]

Yes, she has a waist again! She makes me smile all day long.

And she doesn't look as glossy in that 2nd photo because it's crappy photo.

But she is shinier and softer now.

As to Stan.. he's not opposed to a raw diet per se. He's just seen to many problems from homemade raw gone wrong, mostly people feeding just meat! So he's cautious, and I do understand.

Maybe after he observes your cat's health progress he'll be more encouraged to support raw feeding including helping people feed raw correctly?

 

[ldg]

Well, it's Lazlo's 11th Gotcha Day. Why do I mention that in this thread? Because 2 years ago at the end of this month, he was diagnosed with cancer. He was given 4 weeks to live without treatment. We opted for chemo, and towards the end of his treatments was when we began the transition to raw.

I don't know how much feeding raw has contributed to the length of his remission. But surely the high quality, fresh food, low-carb diet has SOMETHING to do with it. :heart2:

Happy Gotcha Day, Lazlo! http://www.thecatsite.com/t/261263/a-milestone-gotcha-day-for-lazlo

 

[melrai]

Well, it's Lazlo's 11th Gotcha Day. Why do I mention that in this thread? Because 2 years ago at the end of this month, he was diagnosed with cancer. He was given 4 weeks to live without treatment. We opted for chemo, and towards the end of his treatments was when we began the transition to raw.

I don't know how much feeding raw has contributed to the length of his remission. But surely the high quality, fresh food, low-carb diet has SOMETHING to do with it.

Happy Gotcha Day, Lazlo! http://www.thecatsite.com/t/261263/a-milestone-gotcha-day-for-lazlo

I'm so happy for you !!!!!!

WAY TO GO LAZLO 

 

[chloeg]

hi im new to this site,first time kitty owner and iv been reading a lot to get as much infomation as possible.

my baby has been eating dry kibble,wet pouches,fresh cooked and iv just today started her on raw chicken wings,

she absolutley loved it.

 

[ldg]

Hi chloeg, and welcome to TCS!

That's great she loves the raw chicken wings! No matter what or how you decide to feed her going forward, those will be great for her gums and teeth. Even better she loves them! :bigthumb:

Have you seen the raw resources thread? http://www.thecatsite.com/t/240809/raw-feeding-resource-thread

There are many helpful links in there, whether you're interested in feeding prey model raw or making your own ground food.

 

[chloeg]

thanx

.for infomation.im just a bit worried that she will get too used to raw and refuse  her kitten food with all the nutrients she still needs

 

[melrai]

thanx

.for infomation.im just a bit worried that she will get too used to raw and refuse  her kitten food with all the nutrients she still needs

If done properly, raw HAS ALL the nutrients they'll ever need.Its easy to start when they are kittens.

Look through the threads, there are a lot of start-up newbies to raw!

 

[ldg]

:nod: And several people weaning kittens from bottle to raw right now!

 

[chloeg]

hi.I read the articles and advice and decide to try raw, both Chloe and Cole love fresh chicken wingles,line cooked medium,can i give it to them raw?

I give good kibble,enough water and pouches every eve  and treats inbetween,4mnth male and 6 mnth female,CAN I give the minced,chicken,beef,RAW?

If cant give them an all raw diet what would be the best ,with relevant nutrients,in dry to give them daily,rayal canin,scientific hills,any advice???

raw is not difficult to feed them but I just dont want them to miss any nutriests they might need.Thank you,You inpu and advice would be appreciated

thank again

 

[chloeg]

hi what other raw meats are good for them.any advice welcome.thanx

 

[ldg]

I'll continue the discussion in your thread, so it's easier for you to follow your raw journey.

http://www.thecatsite.com/t/261623/new-to-site-new-cat-slave-just-started-raw-feeding

 

[ldg]

Well, not much has changed, but I figured I'd update.

The menu remains basically the same:

Menu 130807.JPG

• ldg
• Aug 7, 2013

For those that stumble on this thread and don't know, I split the red meat / white meat meals 50/50 twice a day instead of red meat at one meal and white meat at another because 1.5 years into raw feeding, Sheldon still cannot keep down an entire meal of red meat. :dk:

I do often combine the red meat with thigh meat instead of breast, and feed them bone-in meals at the dinner-time meal (with organs). Otherwise I balance their meat and organs with either eggshell powder or freeze dried bone (MCHA - the NOW calcium hydroxyapatite). I do two weeks of one, then two weeks of the other. When they get chicken wings as a bone-in meal, I skip the MCHA or eggshell for one meal; when they get quail, cornish hen, or bone-in rabbit meals, I skip the calcium supplement for two meals.

Only three cats eat both fresh liver and kidney:

Chumley
Billy
Ming Loy

Flowerbelle eats only liver, so I make it 10% of her diet instead of 5%.

Sheldon eats only freeze dried liver, so I make it a roughly 10% fresh equivalent.

Tuxie eats fresh kidney; he gets his 5% liver as a freeze dried equivalent.

Lazlo doesn't eat any organs, so he gets the same proteins, just no organs, and I use the CoTW supplement for him.

Spooky is off on her own planet. She will only eat freeze dried liver, and with no regularity. I offer it to her numerous times a day as a treat, and sometimes eats it and sometimes doesn't. I found a cod liver oil supplement I like, and asked mschauer to run the numbers for me. It works to meet her vitamin A need, and doesn't provide too much vitamin A if she DOES eat her liver. So I just pill Spooky once a day with the cod liver oil pill.

Flowerbelle is the only one that gets krill oil. She still hates it, so I went back to just pilling her with it. None of the vets think the problem she has with her throat (http://www.thecatsite.com/t/253783/opinions-please-is-flowerbelle-having-a-mild-asthma-attack) have anything to do with her being pilled or is affected by it. So I pill her with the krill oil capsule. She has to take her blood pressure medication anyway. I'm good at pilling, it's not stressful. :rub:

For whatever reason, everyone is eating sardines they way they should, so I'm happy about that!

I still "hide" the egg yolk in the ground food, which is why it's there four meals a week. I stopped bothering with ordering tripe - Chumley is the only one that really loves it.

Three main changes:

Digestive enzymes. When Ming Loy had her bout with pancreatitis (induced by a virus we now know), the vet suggested digestive enzymes. So I got the prozyme, because I had Mercola digestive enzymes, and everyone hates them. Ming Loy and Spooky had very tight tolerances for calcium, and would get constipated easily. Since putting everyone on digestive enzymes, no one has gotten constipated. :dk: NO idea if there's a relationship - but no one is on pumpkin any longer (and I had to give it to Spooky regularly for a while there, or she'd have an issue again).

Probiotic. I've switched probiotics. I used to use Natural Factors acidophilus+bifidus in goat milk (double strength, 10 billion CFU). It is basically acidophilus, rhamnosus, and bifidobacterium. I've switched to the Nexabiotic 20 strain. The human dose is two capsules, 30 billion CFU. It has those strains - and obviously more. I switched because it includes S. boulardii. S. boulardii is active against clostridium strains and coccidia - both potential common problems in raw meat. The acidophiuls and Bifidobacterium are active against salmonella and e. coli - so including the S. boulardii provides better "coverage" against potential nasties. I give this every day, twice a day, 1/2 capsule, which totals 15 billion CFU. When first on probiotics, Chum got 10 billion 2x a day, and this isn't causing any poop or tummy problems, so I'm sticking with this for him. For the other cats, I may give them just 1/4 capsule. It's just easier to measure out a half cap though. :lol3:

Freeze Dried Organs. I've mentioned this in other threads, but when I can afford them, I stock up on Nutricology beef brain, spleen, beef kidney, pancreas, and thymus. I sprinkle one capsule of something, just rotating, on the last meal of the day for everyone. Oh - except the beef kidney. Everyone that hates kidney hates it freeze dried too. I just have it as a topper for Tuxedo.


Lazlo still has the "fussies" where he won't finish meals. I don't fight it any more. I just stick his bowl up in a cabinet and offer it to him again, every half hour or so until he finishes. He and Tuxie had the hardest time moving to timed meals, and I think this is a hangover from that rather than his being nauseous. Tuxie finishes his meals, so I just give Whole Life freeze dried chicken breast treats a couple of times a day, and he's happy. ... one of the advantages of working from home.

I did stop trimming the meat as much as I was, so I've had to adjust portions.

Billy has gained weight back. I don't know how much. He's still got a waist, and he doesn't look "fat." I just know he's gained some of the weight back I worked so hard to get off of him. He's my most active kitty - with the slowest metabolism. So odd. :dk:

Chumley is fat. He just loves food SO much, and I spoil him. :anon: BUT... I'd rather have him healthy, so I started cutting back his portions just last week. I'm doing it very slowly. I don't have a scale, so have no idea how much he weighs. I just know it's too much.

 

[otto]

Always glad to see an updated thread. I like reading your menu but am ever curious about portion sizes. My cats eat such small amounts.......

 

[ldg]

Right now, Lazlo, Tuxedo, Sheldon, Spooky, and Chumley eat 1.25 ounces meals. Billy eats 1.125 ounce meals, though I really need to start giving him randomly sized large/small meals again. That's how we took the weight off him. Flowerbelle and Ming Loy eat 1 ounce meals.

That dinner time meal when I give the organs (fresh or freeze dried), I don't do an exact subtraction of meat, and I haven't adjusted the amount of organ for the smaller meal portions (Most of them used to get 1.5 ounces per meal). I give Ming Loy and Flowerbelle 7/8ths of an ounce of meat and their organ. I give Tuxedo and Chumley 1 1/8 ounce of meat and their organs, and I give Billy 1 ounce of meat and his organs. Shel gets 1 1/8 ounce of meat and his freeze dried liver.

The organs I don't measure individually. I bag up 1.2 ounces of liver and 1.2 ounces of kidney. I give Tuxedo an outsized portion of the kidney, and give a little more to Chumley and Billy than Ming Loy. I give Flowerbelle an outsized portion of the liver, and give a little more of what's left to Chumley and Billy than Ming Loy. I know it works out to more than 5% for those that *should* be eating 5%, but I'm confident it's not "too much" to be a problem.

I didn't mention it, but I am still giving them egg yolk lecithin daily (1/2 cap for everyone except Shel, Tux and Laz, who get 1 pill daily. In the peak of hairball season, the half cap kitties got half cap 2x a a day, and the three boys got 1 pill 2x a day).

I'm also giving everyone (except Lazlo, who gets CoTW) the homemade supplement.

 

[mrsgreenjeens]

Always good to get an update. 

Got a question for you.  If you once thought Krill Oil helped Billy lose weight, and you think he's gaining again, why not give both Billy AND Chumley krill oil and see if it'll help them lose again?

My Darko is slowly gaining again too, and I think it's because I took him off Krill Oil and put him on Salmon Oil.  I didn't do it on purpose, but ordered the Salmon Oil for Callie, but she HATED it (so did Tinky), but Darko went nuts for it, so I thought "why waste it"?  Now I almost wish I had

Anyway, food for thought...

 

[ldg]

It didn't help Billy lose weight. :lol3: I tried it because it helped Bugsy (Carolina's kitty, for those that don't know) lose weight. So as Flowerbelle is the only one that needs it for her joints, I spend less using the salmon oil for the others.

And Chumley's problem is simple: too many calories. :anon: I just need to cut back his portion size. :rub: He's not too upset about it... :cross:

 

[gwensavluver]

Hello, I'm "G" & this is my 1st post. Also, don't kill me for being a dog-obedience/behaviorist at one time, lol! I've got an f4 Savannah who can't tolerate ANY TYPE of raw diet, & during my days w/ the canine school, being between Aspen & Vail w/ many wealthy dog owners, I've seen every type of raw diet fad there is. I'm not saying its ALL a fad, but I think it gives the owners a feeling of better pet-ownership or love to feed a raw diet. There are so many excellent pre-made foods out there that its a little above & beyond to feed only raw, UNLESS you have a cat w/ special dietary needs. But that's just my two cents, no disrespect intended :~P

 

[peaches08]

Hello, I'm "G" & this is my 1st post. Also, don't kill me for being a dog-obedience/behaviorist at one time, lol! I've got an f4 Savannah who can't tolerate ANY TYPE of raw diet, & during my days w/ the canine school, being between Aspen & Vail w/ many wealthy dog owners, I've seen every type of raw diet fad there is. I'm not saying its ALL a fad, but I think it gives the owners a feeling of better pet-ownership or love to feed a raw diet. There are so many excellent pre-made foods out there that its a little above & beyond to feed only raw, UNLESS you have a cat w/ special dietary needs. But that's just my two cents, no disrespect intended :~P

Welcome! Even though this is a cat site, many members here have dogs, birds, ferrets, rabbits, etc.

Speaking for myself only, I do feel better as a cat owner for researching diets and feeding my cats species-appropriate foods. Am I perfect? Absolutely not. But I prefer to prevent problems through better nutrition rather than medicate for problems that could have been avoided such as diabetes, CRF, and others. I don't like what is considered "pet grade" foods so I don't expect my cats to either.

This forum also supports home-cooked foods if you're interested in that for your Savannah cat. There are several very experienced members who can help you find a good fit for you.

Oh, and for the record I'd rather a cat eat almost anything instead of starve. I've personally purchased Meow Mix in attempts to get my CRF kitty Grey (RIP) to eat on her own. My new cats thankfully love raw so I feel that I got lucky there. They are on raw only, partly because they get diarrhea on most commercial foods and this is more cost effective for me.

 

[ldg]

Welcome! Even though this is a cat site, many members here have dogs, birds, ferrets, rabbits, etc.

I grew up with dogs, not cats. We just worked such long hours, a dog didn't fit into our lifestyle... and then a cat adopted us, one thing led to another, and we have cats, not dogs.

For me... the journey to raw was a fairly long one. And ultimately it was researching what's in pet foods - and the fact that it would cost me less to make my own than buy the canned foods without ingredients I didn't want - that led me to making my own.

I also think of it like this: there are many excellent processed human foods too; things you can microwave, or add water to and boil... but I feel so much better when I eat fresh fruits and vegetables; when I get the bulk of my nutrition from the food I eat rather than eating highly processed foods with vitamins added. I wouldn't want to live on only dry cereal or canned stew, no matter the quality.

My cats clearly feel the same way, only for them, as obligate carnivores, the equivalent of fresh fruits and vegetables is fresh meat, bones and organs. It could be they'd thrive the same way if the meat and organs were cooked, I really don't know. It was an extra step I felt wasn't necessary.

I felt the same way you did. Until I saw the difference in my cats eating homemade, human-grade, fresh food. It's also nice to know I'm not imagining the differences: my vets see them too.

I know quite a few people who feed their dogs raw, but don't feed their cats raw. :dk:

 

[gwensavluver]

Thank you for the "Welcome " & now that I've spoken to a few of you, I'm excited for many more intelligent & kind conversations! Glad I joined!