Relative Pushing For Declaw

[Purr-fect]

Declawing is really "denuckling".

Like others here, the thought sickens me.

It literally took our cats all of 10 minutes to learn to use their 3 new scratching posts.

Emotions aside.....you have an important challenge here.

If you want to save her kitten from pain and suffering, you will have to change your friends mind.

You will have to sell to her, the acceptance of not declawing.

In order to do that, you need to know WHY she wants to declaw her kitten, and then remove that reason (s).

Crash course on sales.......you must meet 3 criteria when making your pitches....
-is this message for me
- is what she or he is saying true
-are they on my side

When making your arguments, your relative must subconsciously be saying "yes" to thise questions or you wont be able to sell her.

It sounds like her main concern is her furniture. I suggest buying a quailty scratching post and teaching her kitten to use it. The best post I have found is called .......the ultimate cat scratching post.

Find out her reasons for wanting to deknuckle and then tell us.

We might be able to provide methods to overcome her objections.

What is her"why"?

 

[AmyTheKittyMommy]

Purr-fect You’re absolutely right, I need to know her reasons before I can attempt to persuade her. As English class taught me, “know your audience; tailor your message accordingly.”
I just sent her a message under the guise of my mother being curious about “why declawing is a good option”. Perhaps she’ll tell me her reasoning. I’ll update if I get any response.
Last night I watched the Paw Project in full, since I had spare time. It was excellent. Though in some places I wish that it had explained things more clearly for those not familiar with declawing, it did eventually make it clear. I wonder if sending her it would be useful... but then, that depends on her sitting through the whole thing. Perhaps I’ll link her to it along with a brief note and some images. So she at least can absorb some basic information when reading. Then I’ll add some more links in case she wants to learn more. We’ll see.
I think her main arguments to me were: “it protects furniture, I did it to my last cat and he was fine, if a good vet does it it is fine, claws hurt, everyone does it.” We will see what she adds, but on the vet issue I have a dilemna. I highly doubt she will believe me over a supposed “professional who will put her animal’s health first” when I explain that the procedure being performed is not in fact in the animal’s best interest, but in the best interest of her vet’s pocketbook. She seems to believe vets only do what is good for their patients. Unfortunately, some vets do not. I think that makes it even sadder to me. People trust these professionals with their animal’s wellbeing, and they mutilate them because it brings in billions a year or they genuinely don’t care. I know there are vets who do care and hate declawing, but the organizations that represent vets have defended declawing and opposed cities who banned it. Does anyone know of any good sources by vets about the horrors of declawing? I’d like a few, so she can see it isn’t just one vet.

 

[Purr-fect]

It protects the furniture.........you buy a couple of posts and train her kitten to use them.

I did it to my last cat and he was fine......... 12 years isnt a long natural lfe for a domesticated cat in my experience. Her cat probably wasnt fine with deknuckling. He wasnt able to tell her that. Try to find info showing health complications, pain, suffering, increased health care costs as a result of the proceedure.

Everyone does it......no they dont anymore. New info has shown its not necessary, painful, and crippling.

if a good vet does it, its fine..........vets in general in canada, dont do it anymore and discourage it.

Claws hurt......yes thats part of their purpose. But cats can be trained NOT to hurt. My big guys NEVER, EVER have intentionally hurt us. They KNOW when to stop applying pressure and know what is ok and what is not. And we have taught them that fingers are not toys. And in return we play with them and use their toys we we play with them.

I think denuckling a cat is partly done because the owner is lazy and doesnt want to train them. If you are willing to help train the kitten, it might convince the relative to not have the proceedure done.

Your relative may not even read the links you give her if the 3 questions I listed arent answered "yes"

Is she doing it to save her money....is that a motivation.

 

[LTS3]

What's more important? Furniture that can be replaced or a cat's well being? Does this relative have children? Children bounce on the furniture, bang their toys against them, spill drinks and food on the sofa, etc. You would discipline a child for bouncing on the sofa and make it clear that it is a no-no. You'd do the same with a cat but in a different way and definitely without pyshical punishment.

Trimming a cat's claws can help minimize damage to furntiure. There are aslo claw caps that can be put on. Providing scratching posts will satisfy a cat's natural urge to scratch. A DIY scratcher can be made cheaply if one does't want to spend money at a pet store.

Declawing doesn't save money. You might not have to replace furniture but you may end up with vet bills that are more expensive than furniture. And money for any cleaning products or professional services if the cat ends up peeing all over the house and ruins the hardwood floor or carpet or walls because the cat will no longer use the litter box.

There are probably vet written articles about why declawing is inhumane. I found some vet school articles on thes ubject:

Feline Destructive Behavior
Tufts Position on Declawing - Tufts Catnip Article
Alternatives to Declawing - Tufts Catnip Article

And these:

Position Statement on Declawing Cats
Declawing - Making a Humane Decision - MSPCA-Angell
Declawing cats: Far worse than a manicure : The Humane Society of the United States
How Much Money Does Declawing Cats Cost?

IMO, if the relative can't be bothered with cat claws and pontentially damaged furniture, then a kitten isn't the right pet. A pet that doesn't have claws () or stays in a cage all day (say, a hamster) would be more suitable.

 

[AmyTheKittyMommy]

She does not have children, but she does have another cat (who unfortunately has already been declawed, I had no idea she’d done it to him until afterwards), two dogs, and a bird.
I’ll send those links to her, thank you.

 

[AmyTheKittyMommy]

Well, she texted me back, and I quote:
“No, you’ll just send me research! ”
Not sure how to proceed from here. I haven’t sent her any “research” yet.

 

[tinydestroyer]

Part of the reason this is going to be so difficult is not just because you have to sell her on the idea of declawing as inhumane, but you have to get her to face the inhumane treatment she has already taken part in with her current / former cats. While educating and rationally addressing each of her concerns is part of the puzzle, the larger part of it will be for her to accept what she's already done. This is not an easy thing for a person to face, and generally cognitive dissonance sets in as a defense mechanism to keep a person from havng to accept and deal with guilt. Rather than believe she's done something cruel to her own animals, it is much easier to believe her own narrative. This is the main reason I suggested manipulating her environemnt by getting other people around her to talk about it without any specific reference to her behavior. It might be easier for her to deal with this guilt, and come around to another way of thinking about declawing, on her own.

 

[AmyTheKittyMommy]

I unfortunately live far from her and am not connected with any of her friends, though that would be effective. She’s surrounded by people who tell her declawing is okay or even beneficial, like her vet. I’m afraid I may not be able to change her opinion at all, but I gave it a try after her last message.
I replied to her explaining that I knew she cares about her cats very much, and that I just wanted to send her some information about declawing, what it is, and what it does, so she can make an informed decision. I also noted that most vets will not explain what declawing is or how it can hurt cats. I linked her to the Paw Project and asked her to watch if she had time. I tried my best to be civil and explain my intentions while not making her feel blamed.
She replied: “I have seen the pictures and stuff. Both the cats I declawed lived long lives with the front being declawed. I would never hurt my cats. It’s just a choice my spouse and I prefer.”
I have no idea what to say to this. On the one hand, I have arguments about how one can survive a long time even in pain or having been mutilated, how cats hide their pain, how this choice they prefer does now have the best interests of the cats in mind... but I refrained from responding until I know how to proceed.

 

[Purr-fect]

Since you are so far away, there may not be much you can do.

Ask her what additional steps she is taking to her her newly deknuckled kitten deal with the pain of using the litter box.

She cares about her furniture, so ask......What will she do if it just starts peeing and pooping outside of the box........and on her furniture.

 

[AmyTheKittyMommy]

Thing is, she doesn’t think there’s anything wrong with it. She sees her two cats who were “fine” and therefore concludes it isn’t bad. I don’t know if telling her that cats hide pain would do anything. Or telling her that if I cut off her fingertips, she might be able to live a long life too, but that she shouldn’t be forced to do that. Declawed can live a long life, and maybe you don’t see how hard it is, but it is unnecessary and painful. If you care more about your couch than your cat, please don’t get a cat, is how I feel.
I’m so frustrated and upset, as I don’t know how to get through to her. If she thinks it’s fine, I have no clue how to convince her it isn’t fine. Reading online resources shows me that she and others have an idea in their minds and they refuse to deviate from it. They make arguments that make sense to them but make me gape.
How can you justify an act of cruelty with the fact that your poor cat was lucky enough not to suffer as much as others? How can you say it’s fine just because the cat wasn’t limping or biting, when you have no idea how terrified that cat was waking up with no claws, how confused it was when it couldn’t have a nice stretch or groom or grasp a toy well? How can you say it’s fine when you’re literally doing something that makes the cat relearn how to walk? For the sake of your couch?!
I’m still not so sure of how to reach out to her, but I’d like to try one last time. It’s up to her if she closes her mind, or listens and considers what I’ve said.

 

[tinydestroyer]

Unfortunately, I don't know that she'll come around either, but I applaud you for trying. Even if she does eventually change her mind, it will likely take some perseverance. We all know how complex family dynamics can be; you're admirable for taking on this cause, and sticking up for what you believe.
Since she's a relative, are you in contact with the spouse? Maybe he / she would be more willing to listen? If you could contact them in a non obtrusive way, that might be another avenue to explore.

 

[AmyTheKittyMommy]

I wish that were an option, but her spouse is even more cemented on declawing if that’s a thing. Basically, his philosophy is “my pet, my house, and I can do whatever I want with them.”
When another relative asked about how to keep a cat from scratching furniture, without missing a beat, he replied “get those damn claws out.”
I think I’ll continue to politely try to educate her. I don’t want to make her upset or complicate family dynamics, but it’s as if she’s shut herself in a dark closet with her opinion and refuses to see anything else.
I wondered if this link might prove useful? Or if there is a better one to refute her argument that “cats live long lives after declawing.”
My Declawed Cat | Meow Lifestyle

 

[tinydestroyer]

I think that's a great link. Coincidentally, I too have a vintage green velvet sofa that I adore. Unscathed by cats. It's a great post if she'll read it. Ultimately, she's more likely to read something you say to her than a link. I know you said you don't want to ruin your relationship with her, but you could try saying everything you outlined against declaw in your earlier post. Sometimes an impassioned argument, thoughtfully delivered, can shock someone out of their denial. But it really depends on your relationship with her. Keep up posted

 

[AmyTheKittyMommy]

I’ll formulate a message and run it by you guys. I’m too scared of making her defensive or mad and having her completely close up. My only chance is to be kind and diplomatic, I think.

 

[lalagimp]

I had to just give up. Some people can see the light with some light education and go "oh no i had no idea" while other people are very firm in their upbringing and understanding of what's normal and not normal with cats. I don't think you are going to get through, but hopefully you've presented your case enough that maybe now she will leave you alone about getting them declawed, so you don't have to hear it anymore.

 

[Purr-fect]

I’ll formulate a message and run it by you guys. I’m too scared of making her defensive or mad and having her completely close up. My only chance is to be kind and diplomatic, I think.

This is why you have to win her confidence, she has to feel that you are on her side and she will benefit from your information. Until then she will shut you down, become defensive and eventually angry.

Make a list in your mind of the real reasons she wants to declaw the cat.

Is she especially proud of her furniture.
Is she scared to stand up to her husband
Is she afraid the cat will scratch her or others.
Is she trying to save money by avoiding potential furniture damage.
Is she lazy and not willing to train the cat to scratch a post.
Is she genuinely ignorant and simply thinks she is doing no harm.
Does she not inderstand it isnt just the claws that are removed.
Does she just not care.
Has she ever loved her cats or are they just animals to her.

If you continue to try to change her mind without understanding what arguments you will have to make, I dont think you will be successful.

If nothing else. ...even if the kitten is declawed, at least it wont be cold, hungry, alone, feral ect.

 

[Lari]

I once heard a senator say that the vet community was actually the biggest opposition to declawing being made illegal in the United States. There are many vets who refuse to declaw; however there are many who still view the procedure as part of their practice's bread and butter. Spays and neuters are seen the same way. I wouldn't take my cats to a veterinarian who declaws. No way.

I am all of a sudden feeling rather lucky, because my vet not only doesn't declaw, but is literally in walking distance from my home. And I didn't realize how rare that is in the US. Which makes me really sad.

 

[Elfilou]

Should have her watch the Jackson Galaxy episode with the declawed cat with litterbox issues.

Honestly this makes me sick to my stomach and I have respect for how calm you've remained. I have no patience for people like this and would've probably picked a fight with this woman - which woulf have solved nothing.

You have a chance to try and convince her that you're trying to tell her for HER wellbeing ("If you declaw you are risking behavior issues") and the cat's ("If you declaw the cat will suffer").

Good luck. I need to lie down after reading this LOL. I honestly feel nauseas and very sad.

 

[Norachan]

Well, she texted me back, and I quote:
“No, you’ll just send me research! ”
Not sure how to proceed from here. I haven’t sent her any “research” yet.

Does she mean she wants you to send her research by veterinarians on the negative impacts of declawing?

I can help you find that, if you think she'll read it.

Threads about declawing have come up before and I haven't been able to find any research that suggests declawing is beneficial to the cat. It's a quick-fix for people who are too lazy to train their cats to scratch in the appropriate places, but it can cause far worse behaviour in the long run.

You should challenge her to find research that says cats benefit for being declawed. (and I don't mean that being declawed is better that being re-homed or dumped)

 

[AmyTheKittyMommy]

That would be great, Norachan .