Reintroduction with cats - moving forward

[klunick]

I hope you find success. I unfortunately know what you are going through as I am currently trying to reunite my two. I do a different reintroduction as most recommend but it is always hard when you have to deal with it. I also have a "starer". Gracie will stare at Boone for no reason but I think it's because she is a jerk. She has runt syndome and is just mad that she never got bigger. Good luck with getting yours back together. My journey seems to be almost over so I will be rooting you on.

 

[Alldara]

Hopefully these help a bit too!
Most cat body language needs to be taken in context so that can be a bit of a learning curve.
For example tail wagging is agitated, but that would be because of irritation or positive agitation like during play.

 

[Jessica_Merlin_Meep]

We’ve got a new video!
Things look pretty good like this. We had to give white cat a break because he gets poop zoomies and was racing around yowling - tabby was weirded out lol. On weekends we are working on several hour long sessions a day like this, where we just chill and hang out as normal, play with them, eat lunch, etc

 

[Mamanyt1953]

Thanks for the photos! I understand now that the staring is natural and to let them be cats more. I don't understand cats (I'm a dog person, lol), so it helps to learn more about them.

Oh, there's a good bit of that going on here at TCS, and that's what we're here for! Dogs and cats are SO different! I am very thankful that I grew up with both, and with a father who understood animals to an uncanny degree. He's the reason that I can sit in the yard with a handful of birdseed, and have the birds eating from my hands.

That newest video is EXCELLENT!

 

[silent meowlook]

You’re doing great, as are the cats. Just stay out of their space a little bit like I said before. Give it a week, then try lifting the gate. The big thing to remember is keep your energy chill. If something does happen, don’t yell or get in the middle of it. It just makes it worse.

Are you having each cat live on the other cats side? That should be done. They both need to be comfortable in both areas.

In the video, the Medicine Hat cat ( white with black hat) looks a little agitated, but it isn’t directed at the striped cat. Although the striped cat lays down to appear small and non confrontational. He isn’t to worried though, because he remains there.

 

[Jessica_Merlin_Meep]

You’re doing great, as are the cats. Just stay out of their space a little bit like I said before. Give it a week, then try lifting the gate. The big thing to remember is keep your energy chill. If something does happen, don’t yell or get in the middle of it. It just makes it worse.

Are you having each cat live on the other cats side? That should be done. They both need to be comfortable in both areas.

In the video, the Medicine Hat cat ( white with black hat) looks a little agitated, but it isn’t directed at the striped cat. Although the striped cat lays down to appear small and non confrontational. He isn’t to worried though, because he remains there.

Yes they do live on either side of the gate!
We are trying to have at least 3-5 good sessions in a row with this gate before we lift it (we are currently doing 1-2 hour sessions every day. We are on our 10th one right now.) Right now either cat will run at the gate to see the other and end up scaring the other one. How can I alleviate this?

 

[klunick]

Yes they do live on either side of the gate!
We are trying to have at least 3-5 good sessions in a row with this gate before we lift it. Right now either cat will run at the gate to see the other and end up scaring the other one. How can I alleviate this?

I had this problem when I would open the basement door to let Gracie back up. She would come up before Boone knew she was there and it would scare him. Is there a way to block the lower part of the gate and wait until they are both at the gate together before lifting the covering? That way both will know beforehand that the other is there and it won't freak them out to have the other come running up at them all of a sudden.

 

[Jessica_Merlin_Meep]

I had this problem when I would open the basement door to let Gracie back up. She would come up before Boone knew she was there and it would scare him. Is there a way to block the lower part of the gate and wait until they are both at the gate together before lifting the covering? That way both will know beforehand that the other is there and it won't freak them out to have the other come running up at them all of a sudden.

So this isn't at the initial part of the session. We let them sniff at the start, give them a lickable treat, give them some play and then sort of "live normally". It's during the rest of the hour where they'll just sort of eyeball each other or stare, go off to eat, potty, chill and then one cat will come at the gate (I think it's to play, to be honest, but it startles the other cat).

 

[klunick]

So this isn't at the initial part of the session. We let them sniff at the start, give them a lickable treat, give them some play and then sort of "live normally". It's during the rest of the hour where they'll just sort of eyeball each other or stare, go off to eat, potty, chill and then one cat will come at the gate (I think it's to play, to be honest, but it startles the other cat).

Probably fear that an attack is coming. Any sudden movement by Gracie would make Boone freak out and he was for certain not ready to play her when she was ready for play. He still isn't and will hiss at her because he is afraid it's a trap. I have been trying to intercept Gracie when I see her coming up to Boone quickly so that he has time to realize that an attack isn't coming.

 

[Jessica_Merlin_Meep]

Probably fear that an attack is coming. Any sudden movement by Gracie would make Boone freak out and he was for certain not ready to play her when she was ready for play. He still isn't and will hiss at her because he is afraid it's a trap. I have been trying to intercept Gracie when I see her coming up to Boone quickly so that he has time to realize that an attack isn't coming.

oh I understand! That makes sense. I will try to intercept from now on when I sense it coming.
How long have your cats been separated??

 

[klunick]

oh I understand! That makes sense. I will try to intercept from now on when I sense it coming.
How long have your cats been separated??

Right now, they are only separated when I am at work or asleep. The latest fight happened about a month ago. But this isn't the first one. Sometimes they have to be separated for several months and sometimes only a few days. It really depends on Boone. Gracie is ready to make up right after the fight. Boone holds grudges. I let him decide when it's time to start trying to get them back together. When he starts standing at the basement door, I know that there is a chance he wants her around again. I monitor their interactions and when I see Boone has had enough, I put her back downstairs. They are fine with each other 99% of the time now and pretty much ignore each other.

 

[Jessica_Merlin_Meep]

So aggressor cat (the tabby) is very hyper interested in the white cat, if white cat is playing or moving too fast aggressor cat climbs the gate. This behavior hasn't subsided in over ten sessions. We try to play with him by the gate and he's mostly uninterested, he just wants to stare at white cat. He also rushes the gate when white cat approaches it, scaring white cat into running off. We are working to alleviate this but what does this mean in the long run? When we put them in the same room he will likely want to rush him but is it to attack or is it to play? I can't tell if this is their "normal" and comfortable behavior to move on to the next step. I genuinely can't tell and I am growing frustrated and tired with the whole process, seeing as we have been doing this for years. How can he be so uptight about this other cat after literal years? His ears aren't back and he's not puffed up or anything when he does these things but it is evidently startling to the white cat.

Do we hover at the gate? Do we not hover? Do we let them do whatever the heck they want in the 1-2 hours of open door time we have? I understand playing with them and feeding them and doing treats by the gate but we can't and won't sustain that for hours at a time. The hour long sessions were to get them used to each other more and just get used to them being there but now it seems as if tabby cat is getting agitated that we keep doing this and he can never get to white cat.

Just losing hope in things.

 

[Alldara]

I always sit at the gate. I settle in with a book or my phone and relax. I might play with the cats. Trying to get them to play (on their own with you) is very good. It helps them to learn one another's play body language.

Usually, if the cats become secure enough in seeing one another, they shouldn't charge. However, initially, they need distractions during their meetings without a gate. A meal, a play, some birds to watch....


Are you still site swapping?
Are you doing the shirt trick where you build family scent?

 

[Jessica_Merlin_Meep]

We are still site swapping daily and I haven't done the shirt trick but I figured since they are site swapping so regularly their scent is on everything. They tend to roll around on the same spots anyway.
We've been trying to play and we do feedings and treats by the door but aggressor cat is a tough one to crack. He has a focus and determination like I've never seen in a cat.

We will work on sitting at the gate more. We've been trying to just live life and let them see each other but I was worried about hovering too much but also not being there enough.

 

[Alldara]

The point of the shirt trick is to make them REALLY smell the same. And also like their humans... their humans being high-reward. On the non-recognition thread many posters saw big changes with this trick. Scent swapping doesn't truly accomplish it.

For our pets we are their confidence They look to us, our body language to know to be brave. They have their own thoughts and feelings on things....but they do look to us as well.

Talk to them about one another. Narrate. Use consistent language. Worst case, pet the staring cat's nose. It will cause him to blink. Pets, skritches and talking to him will help relax him.

 

[Mamanyt1953]

Worst case, pet the staring cat's nose. It will cause him to blink.

Now, THERE is a trick that's going into my arsenal!

 

[Jessica_Merlin_Meep]

You may have seen my posts before about reintroducing my two male cats together, who have been separated for quite some time now.

Well, I think we are ready for in-room introductions and we are very stoked and also very nervous! We have seen JG's advice on in-room stuff, so we are going to start with treats on each side of the room and slowly increase time together, but I have a few things I'm concerned/confused about:
1. One of my cats (aggressor cat) is DIFFICULT to distract. Treats can only go far enough. Toys? For the most part, forget it. You can distract him for a few moments with a toy but when he's got that laser focus on, there isn't much to do to take him from that. Any advice here?
2. We obviously can't hold them while they eat/have treats/play on their respective sides of the room, but when is nose to nose contact acceptable? According to JG guidelines, you move the bowls/activity closer together each day that it goes well, but I know the cats are going to want to touch and smell each other. Do we just desensitize them being in the same room before we let them do that?

Any other advice at all is appreciated! This has been a long time coming and we are scared, but I hope that things can go well so we can live normal lives again.

 

[Furballsmom]

Hi

Honestly, I'm thinking that JG's advice regarding your second question may not work, at least not yet.

However, there's no way to know for sure how your aggressor kitty is going to be when he's in the same room now.

Let me post these - you may already seen them, but even if so the information might be helpful for someone else

How To Successfully Introduce Cats [The Ultimate Guide] - TheCatSite

How To Fix An Unsuccessful Cat Introduction - TheCatSite

How To Safely Break Up A Cat Fight - Effective Techniques - TheCatSite

Have you tried this?
either with real vanilla (rather than synthetic) or raw coconut (which still has fragrance) ;
From member valanhb;
You put a dab of vanilla extract under the chins, at the base of their neck (by the spine) and at the base of the tail (again, on the spine not the underside of the tail!) of all of the cats to make them smell the same. Cats recognize each other by scent, so if that kitty smells the same as "me", then he must be a friend. Kitty logic at it's finest.
This trick works when introducing cats into the household as well, or during a reintroduction after a redirected aggression event.

 

[Mamanyt1953]

And for future reference, when you do go to a face to face, just to be safe, have a large floor pillow or a large piece of sturdy cardboard handy. Should an actual fight break out (not the norm, but not precisely rare, either) you can place the pillow or cardboard between the two of them, then use it to herd whichever cat is easiest away. You very likely won't need it, but IF you do, it can save you some inadvertent injuries.

 

[Jessica_Merlin_Meep]

Update: here is our first face to face without the gate. Aggressor cat seems to charge there in the beginning it my husband is able to redirect him and they eat their treats. I was nervous to put white cat down after that but he was content eating it the treat in my arms. How are the cats looking in the video? Any advice? We were very nervous!