My cat is Satan himself, I need help!!!

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angelwngs

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The above poster, Deborahlee, may be on to something here. It is in my opinion as well that your kitty knows he is not really understood and feels the resentment towards him. We can't hide those inner feelings from our pets, they just know. Also, carting him back and forth from you place to your bf's place is not a good idea at all while you are trying to settle him into a new home, life and environment. He is confused, and feeling quite stressed. If his tail is swishing all the time, then that is a sign of confusion, agitation and possibly feeling very insecure OR he is unwell and needs to be checked.

I think there is a lot going on in his little head and he needs much more stability than he is receiving and a lot more patience. You have only had him a couple of months if that and he has been mishandled, carted from place to place and has been scolded consistently. Might this not be the right kitty for you and your bf? Part of me gets the feeling you don't want a cat at all, especially this one. He knows this.


I have one cat who is easily overstimulated and is quite aggressive at times with biting. I know the signs and have learned how to redirect his attention onto something else. To deflate the oncoming bite or slash. Cats are all different with greatly varying personalities and limits.

In your situation, though, I think the underlying problem is instability, insecurity and feeling a bit scared. Things only you can change for him.
I don't know why people keep saying I am carting him back and forth between places when I stated previously already that me and my boyfriend aren't together anymore and he is staying solely at my place now.
 

stephiedoodle

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There is no need to become defensive angelwings it could simply be that people have missed that part of the post or skim read please remember we are all trying to help you with you're problem and you have been very defensive or so it seems to me. I hope you are starting to see some results using the advice given.
 

MoochNNoodles

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I don't know why people keep saying I am carting him back and forth between places when I stated previously already that me and my boyfriend aren't together anymore and he is staying solely at my place now.
I think because your thread is getting longer now it's getting harder to follow unless you are reading slowly.  I would suggest using the multi-quote feature also when you are replying.  I think it'll help things flow.  (PM me if you need any help with that; as I know its a little different depending on whether you are using the desktop or the mobile version of the site.)

It is going to take time for Ace to come around.  Cats just don't adjust like humans do.  Even in the best of situations some cats take months to fully settle.  I would look at it as if you are starting over from day one and realize that some mistakes have been made that he is going to have to deal with.  You've been given lots of helpful advice on how to help Ace; but it's going to take time and patience.  What's done is done; we are hopefully helping you move forward. 

I think you've already learned that pointing a finger is a trigger for him.  He has a fear of hands.  So I would avoid using your hands when correcting him.  When you are using your hands to pet him; make sure your movements are calm and gentle and as non-threatening as possible. 

It's only been a week and a day since your first post in this thread and a lot has changed in a short time.  For a cat; this is like it's only been a day or less.  Cat's really take time to process things.  Please be patient with him; you need to earn his trust and it will take more than a few days to accomplish that. 
 

mservant

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First of all, from what I've seen here, things didn't start out well from the beginning.  And by spanking him, you probably made it worse because now he's afraid of you.  He's going to bite you before you hit him to protect himself.

It also sounds to me like you are angry and resentful, and also impatient and if your boyfriend feels the same way, the cat senses it and is scared as well.

....

You are never giving the cat a chance to feel safe and secure. 

And if you see him as satan, he's' going to act like satan.

Because you made the situation worse, you probably have to back off and start all over and get him to trust you.

.........

And you need to answer the following question honestly...

Do you think the cat is biting you out of aggression, to hurt you or keep you away, or do you think the cat is biting out of playfulness (all kittens learn to bite by playing, some never grow out of it or aren't taught to).

Because depending on the answer to that question, the strategies you'd take to stop the behavior are different.

I also would not recommend biting then cat back for a lot of reasons, one very important one would be not getting hurt yourself.

Answer that question honestly and then I can tell you what my opinion is about what to do. 

PS:  Stop shaking your fingers at him.  That's an aggressive gesture and he's reacting to that as well.  Anything like that near his face will be seen as aggression.

Start by putting your hands towards him palm up, coming in from under his chin.  You need to be patient since he needs to learn to trust.  All you are teaching him now is that hands are to be feared.
The above poster, Deborahlee, may be on to something here. It is in my opinion as well that your kitty knows he is not really understood and feels the resentment towards him. We can't hide those inner feelings from our pets, they just know. .............. He is confused, and feeling quite stressed. If his tail is swishing all the time, then that is a sign of confusion, agitation and possibly feeling very insecure OR he is unwell and needs to be checked.

I think there is a lot going on in his little head and he needs much more stability than he is receiving and a lot more patience. You have only had him a couple of months if that and he has been mishandled, carted from place to place and has been scolded consistently. Might this not be the right kitty for you and your bf? Part of me gets the feeling you don't want a cat at all, especially this one. He knows this.


I have one cat who is easily overstimulated and is quite aggressive at times with biting. I know the signs and have learned how to redirect his attention onto something else. To deflate the oncoming bite or slash. Cats are all different with greatly varying personalities and limits.

In your situation, though, I think the underlying problem is instability, insecurity and feeling a bit scared. Things only you can change for him.
Some very positive advice has been given in this thread but as progress doesn't feel like it is being made at this stage I agree with others, there is a need to start from the beginning.

Angelwngs, perhaps the first question to think about again and confirm is if you really do still want this cat and are willing to try and start again with him.  It sounds very much as though your relationship started off on the wrong footing for what ever reasons, and early advice that people around you were giving resulted in your cat becoming increasingly fearful and aggressive in attempt to protect himself.  

What ever this little cat's experiences were before he arrived with you, from the way he is now being described he sounds very stressed, frightened, and confused.  As others including deborahlee and feralvr have said, your cat will pick up on your emotions and frustrations and this will add to the mixed and aggressive messages he has been getting - from the spraying, spanking, pointing fingers and various other responses he has experienced.

If you do want to see if things can be turned around, and for this young cat to settle and calm down so that you can see his personality (not some terrified young cat constantly trying to defend itself)  then starting from very basic behaviours for both of you is necessary.  I understand that he is now settled in your own home and not moving from one place to another.  It will also be necessary to keep your responses and behaviours consistent for him to learn from you and to start trusting you. This well need you to be patient and to stick with the advised responses even when you do not see an imediate change.  He needs to see a consistent change from you first or he will continue to defend himself in the only ways he knows how - biting and scratching.

If the answer to the first question is yes and you are prepared to put in the work to consistently control your responses to your cat then:

Do you think he is biting out of aggression or out of playfulness as @deborahlee asked?  Or - do you think there is a combination of these?

If you do wish to keep this cat, are prepared to put in the necessary work consistently so that you can begin to communicate with each other then we have something to start work on in a positive way.
 

mycatsinthetub

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I had a demon cat too. She bit. She clawed. She peed on the bed. She screamed at me a few times (which is eerie as hell). She climbed the curtains and doors. Hauled a turkey out of the water it was defrosting in. She refused to share the room her litter box was in.

It was crazy.

I found spending time being calm with her, playing games for hours, feeding her a few feet away while I sat and read, and generally just enjoyed her presence. I'd flick a toy back and forth as I read a book or watched TV, made sure she had plenty of places to hide, sleep, and climb on that she would be left alone there (a safe space), and let her have her space (relocated one of the litter boxes to a different room for my boy kitty).

Almost 2 years later she is a sweet kitty that follows me around and chats with me. She likes to give hugs. Still really enjoys having her own space (on top of my kitchen cabinets, I put a few beds up there, and some toys.) Planning a catwalk later so it's easier for her to get up and down. She doesn't seem to have an issue with the vertical leap, but it makes me nervous.

She also really likes music.

I'd stop spraying you cat immediately. Hissing works well in my experience. Mostly I find being calm and joyful helps. Don't play with your hands. Play with toys. You aren't the toy. Cats make great companions, but like any friendship you have to actually try to relate to each other, and sometimes that takes a reset.

I have a Havanese and my red kitten was bought to be her friend. They really enjoy playing with each other and have comparable interests and energy levels.
 
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angelwngs

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Some very positive advice has been given in this thread but as progress doesn't feel like it is being made at this stage I agree with others, there is a need to start from the beginning.

Angelwngs, perhaps the first question to think about again and confirm is if you really do still want this cat and are willing to try and start again with him.  It sounds very much as though your relationship started off on the wrong footing for what ever reasons, and early advice that people around you were giving resulted in your cat becoming increasingly fearful and aggressive in attempt to protect himself.  

What ever this little cat's experiences were before he arrived with you, from the way he is now being described he sounds very stressed, frightened, and confused.  As others including deborahlee and feralvr have said, your cat will pick up on your emotions and frustrations and this will add to the mixed and aggressive messages he has been getting - from the spraying, spanking, pointing fingers and various other responses he has experienced.

If you do want to see if things can be turned around, and for this young cat to settle and calm down so that you can see his personality (not some terrified young cat constantly trying to defend itself)  then starting from very basic behaviours for both of you is necessary.  I understand that he is now settled in your own home and not moving from one place to another.  It will also be necessary to keep your responses and behaviours consistent for him to learn from you and to start trusting you. This well need you to be patient and to stick with the advised responses even when you do not see an imediate change.  He needs to see a consistent change from you first or he will continue to defend himself in the only ways he knows how - biting and scratching.

If the answer to the first question is yes and you are prepared to put in the work to consistently control your responses to your cat then:

Do you think he is biting out of aggression or out of playfulness as @deborahlee asked?  Or - do you think there is a combination of these?

If you do wish to keep this cat, are prepared to put in the necessary work consistently so that you can begin to communicate with each other then we have something to start work on in a positive way.
Yes I do want the cat. I would never get rid of him unless I had to. Also I think he does it out of aggression and play.
 

stephiedoodle

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In the moments when you think he is being agressive try and lure him to a safe spot (maybe with some tasty treats) perhaps his safe spot could be highest point on the cat tree (if he has one) and then leave him there to calm down when he comes down if he feels/looks significantly calmer try playing with him with a wand toy get really high sprung and really wear him out until hes really panting for breath we do this every night with Lilly now as shes a scratch in a shouter when shes left alone in the lounge during the night burning off that energy allow us and our daughter to get some uninterupted sleep perhaps when Ace is worn out he might be a bit more receptive to petting. Maybe open you palm and hold it face up and let him sniff to see its safe and let him come to you if he puts his little furry head in your hand give his little chin a tickle. If he reacts well reward the good behaviour. If the reaction is negative give a firm no or maybe a momma cat hiss and then redirect his attention back to some toys. But keep your emotions in check remember animals can sense when we are happy, sad, angry, scared or resentful and they will react in kind. So best way to elicit a happy and kind response from ace is to be happy and kind with him but when there is negative behavior give him a firm and stern 'telling/showing' that this is not what you expect or want from him. I'm so glad to see you are willing to work with Ace rather than send him away.
 

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Someone here (maybe in a different thread) suggested blowing at the cat when they're being aggressive. Just air from your mouth, not too harshly. I started doing that with Oliver when he begins to get a little too aggressive with his play (being MOST FEROCIOUS!, as we call it), and he backs right off. It's usually accompanied by a look that conveys "WTH, mom?" But then he goes on playing, a little more calmly. Sometimes I have to blow a time or two before he gets it, but yea... super easy and not traumatizing. And not an act of aggression from his point of view, which is important.
 

mservant

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Someone here (maybe in a different thread) suggested blowing at the cat when they're being aggressive. Just air from your mouth, not too harshly. I started doing that with Oliver when he begins to get a little too aggressive with his play (being MOST FEROCIOUS!, as we call it), and he backs right off. It's usually accompanied by a look that conveys "WTH, mom?" But then he goes on playing, a little more calmly. Sometimes I have to blow a time or two before he gets it, but yea... super easy and not traumatizing. And not an act of aggression from his point of view, which is important.
Blowing in a cat's face does sometimes get them to halt what they are doing and pull back, and it may work for Ace, however given some of his experiences so far it might be worth starting with methods that do not require such close face to face contact in case he finds this threatening.  It would certainly be a technique to use if he was up near your face and looking over excited. 
 

laralove

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Blowing in a cat's face does sometimes get them to halt what they are doing and pull back, and it may work for Ace, however given some of his experiences so far it might be worth starting with methods that do not require such close face to face contact in case he finds this threatening.  It would certainly be a technique to use if he was up near your face and looking over excited. 
It doesn't require getting right in the cat's face. Breath carries a distance. 
 

mservant

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Apologies now - this is going to be a long post.


Can I make a start by suggesting we call your cat Ace, as you chose to when you adopted him.  His previous name suggests to me that maybe he didn't have an easy time and perhaps didn't learn all the lessons he could have done, and he now has some catch up learning to do.  You can all learn about each other and find calm ways to communicate and let each other know what you do and don't want from each other.  You all need to understand each other and know where the boundaries are.  You are responsible for Ace and it is very important that you are consistent, calm, and clear in your communication so he can feel calm and learn from you.  This will not be easy because all of you have some not so positive habits and experiences to shake off.

A lot of the Cat Site articles talk about understanding your cat's behaviour and communication.  One useful web page a friend sent to me is the wikihow - how to communicate with your cat.  It gives a nice straightforward introduction plus illustrations to: cat vocalizations and what they usually indicate, what  their body language looks  like and what it can mean, face to face / eye contact and what this means to your cat, and how be aware of your vocal communication and how to use this with your cat.  This could be valuable reading for you as it should help you understand, and describe to others, what Ace is doing, for example when you have been petting him and then he goes to bite you,  or if you playing and he bites or scratches.  Even being aware of what his posture and tail and ear positions are when he is walking or running about your home or sitting on the floor are useful. 

If you have a look at the wikihow article and have a think about what you are seeing and hearing with Ace.  Also think how you could use your voice differently, and some words you can use for him to get to know, to start to change what he seeing and hearing when he is around you.

Secondly,  and very importantly I believe your responses to him when he bites and scratches you need to alter so that this pattern of behaviour can change.  Ace needs to feel you are calm, he is not being punished, but that what he has just done is not OK.  This is easier said that done when you have a one year old + cat biting in to your arm or leg but it is really important if you want it to stop.  

I will repeat much of what others have said here but I want to treat this as a fresh start: Cats do not understand punishment, they will not translate something you do to them in one setting to something they have done in another place or at another time - if you use time out it needs to be immediate and short in duration for them to calm down and not as a punishment (a couple of minutes at a time not more). They will interpret any forced action like your holding their head, body or paws, sudden movements, direct eye contact, loud voices and shouting, screaming, hitting in any way, firm grips and holds, any hold on the scruff of their neck, water spray (if they dislike water), and biting as acts of aggression.  In response they will defend themselves and attack.  It is also very easy to shift quickly from playing in to an aggressive situation if a move has been misinterpreted, and this is most likely to happen when Ace is either very excited or very anxious as I think he is at the moment.  If you move suddenly towards him, move in a jerky manner, shout or scream, get hold of him tightly or suddenly, or look him directly in the eye when playing he could misunderstand what you mean because his brain is on high alert. Then he is likely to attack you to defend himself. Because he is anxious and very alert to any sign that he might be scolded or hit it is very important you learn what those cat communications are and to watch for changes in Ace that show he is getting scared or over excited.    This is the reason things like pointing fingers and shouting do not work well for telling a cat you want them to stop biting or scratching. A short blow in the face might work or it might be taken as an aggressive move.

To change the pattern of behaviour you need to work on the calm, ignore response.  

Unless he is breaking your skin you follow through these stages:

1.  Be quiet.

2.  Freeze, first push VERY slightly in towards him with the part of you he is biting or gripping in to and then stay very still.  Remain silent, still, and wait as long as you need to for him to release.  Do not move the other parts of your body he isn't latched on to, you need to stay still and try to relax.   This is a good time to practice slow breathing and trying to relax tensed muscles! It may sound ridiculous but think yoga meditation with a cat latched on to your arm or leg, or just in front of your face and your eyes closed.

3.  If his bite or claw grip is hurting you significantly then continue to follow advice as point 2 but  use a selected word or sound that you keep and use only for when he is hurting you.  'OW', 'OUCH', 'ARGH', 'EE'.  One syllable sounds that are pretty automatic when you are hurt are best.  Avoid 'NO' as most cats are selectively deaf to that word as it is used very frequently and on most occasions does not need an immediate response.  Ace needs to learn that when you use this word or sound he is hurting you and he needs to stop quickly.  Say this word firmly but not loudly or shouting. It should sound firm and controlled, a lower tone / pitch is best.

4.  If he does not release continue to remain completely still but repeat the sound or word that you have chosen. Do so every 30 seconds or so.

5.  If Ace releases his grip but then immediately or shortly afterward comes back in again you repeat your response calmly and from stage 1.

6.  If the behaviour is repeated beyond a third time and /or he is becoming more excitable you should lift him up firmly and put him on the other side of a closed door / or remove yourself if he does not like to be lifted or you feel this would make him feel more threatened. After 30 to 60 seconds check by opening the door to see if he looks calm and if he does then open the door and give him the option of coming back in to your space.  If he chooses not to do this it is best not to go after him.

7.  If he comes back in and the biting or scratching begins again you go back to stage 1 and repeat the process.

8.  If Ace comes in with an aggressive attack and draws blood I suggest this is the only time you respond by removing him by releasing his grip.  You need to quietly, and as gently as you can, prize his mouth or paws off you without gripping in a sore way or moving very suddenly.  Try to keep movements smooth and fluid rather than jerky.  Once you get him off you you either place him on the other side of a door or you go, stay separated for a minute and then look to see if he has calmed.  If not you close the door again and wait a further minute.  He will eventually either calm or walk off and busy himself in something else - that is fine.

Think about the process from 1 to 8, along with the cat communication information and see if you and your boyfriend can try and make a start on this from now.

If you are petting and touching him you could try doing this with a feather wand or similar toy and gently touch different parts of his head, limbs and body to see how he reacts: which parts he seems to like being touched and which bits he doesn't.  Which bits he reacts playfully to, or aggressively to.

It would be good to know how your experience of this goes, and also some information about what toys you have and what Ace likes.  This is about getting to know Ace. 


You want to be able to reward Ace when  he is behaving in ways that you want to encourage:

What toys and games does he seem to respond positively to?

What food and treats does he like?

Also

Where in your home does he feel safe / hide /r go to be on his own?

Where does he like to sleep?

Does he have any funny habits, what are they?

Does he do anything cute?

What times of day and or night is he most playful and energetic?

Does he play on his own or only if you play with him?

And last but not least:  Do you have any cute photos of him that you could share with us?
 

mservant

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It doesn't require getting right in the cat's face. Breath carries a distance. 
I have included the idea of blowing in the face in options for detering but suggest it depends on individual cat reactions.  Some do not respond at all to this technique while others dislike it and respond straight away understanding what you want. Equally, depending on what a cat has experienced in the past, even if not close up it could still seem quite threatening, like a hiss, and this would particularly be if there were direct eye contact.  Ace may react very well to a short blow of air, or he may not.  It is one more thing to try out.  My concern at this stage is his aparent level of anxiety and any short, sharp actions even those as simple as blowing at him may raise his  anxiety further.

If I blow gently at Mouse, either close up or from a distance, he rolls over and thinks he's about to get petted. 
 
 
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stephiedoodle

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Apologies now - this is going to be a long post.


Can I make a start by suggesting we call your cat Ace, as you chose to when you adopted him.  His previous name suggests to me that maybe he didn't have an easy time and perhaps didn't learn all the lessons he could have done, and he now has some catch up learning to do.  You can all learn about each other and find calm ways to communicate and let each other know what you do and don't want from each other.  You all need to understand each other and know where the boundaries are.  You are responsible for Ace and it is very important that you are consistent, calm, and clear in your communication so he can feel calm and learn from you.  This will not be easy because all of you have some not so positive habits and experiences to shake off.

A lot of the Cat Site articles talk about understanding your cat's behaviour and communication.  One useful web page a friend sent to me is the wikihow - how to communicate with your cat.  It gives a nice straightforward introduction plus illustrations to: cat vocalizations and what they usually indicate, what  their body language looks  like and what it can mean, face to face / eye contact and what this means to your cat, and how be aware of your vocal communication and how to use this with your cat.  This could be valuable reading for you as it should help you understand, and describe to others, what Ace is doing, for example when you have been petting him and then he goes to bite you,  or if you playing and he bites or scratches.  Even being aware of what his posture and tail and ear positions are when he is walking or running about your home or sitting on the floor are useful. 

If you have a look at the wikihow article and have a think about what you are seeing and hearing with Ace.  Also think how you could use your voice differently, and some words you can use for him to get to know, to start to change what he seeing and hearing when he is around you.

Secondly,  and very importantly I believe your responses to him when he bites and scratches you need to alter so that this pattern of behaviour can change.  Ace needs to feel you are calm, he is not being punished, but that what he has just done is not OK.  This is easier said that done when you have a one year old + cat biting in to your arm or leg but it is really important if you want it to stop.  

I will repeat much of what others have said here but I want to treat this as a fresh start: Cats do not understand punishment, they will not translate something you do to them in one setting to something they have done in another place or at another time - if you use time out it needs to be immediate and short in duration for them to calm down and not as a punishment (a couple of minutes at a time not more). They will interpret any forced action like your holding their head, body or paws, sudden movements, direct eye contact, loud voices and shouting, screaming, hitting in any way, firm grips and holds, any hold on the scruff of their neck, water spray (if they dislike water), and biting as acts of aggression.  In response they will defend themselves and attack.  It is also very easy to shift quickly from playing in to an aggressive situation if a move has been misinterpreted, and this is most likely to happen when Ace is either very excited or very anxious as I think he is at the moment.  If you move suddenly towards him, move in a jerky manner, shout or scream, get hold of him tightly or suddenly, or look him directly in the eye when playing he could misunderstand what you mean because his brain is on high alert. Then he is likely to attack you to defend himself. Because he is anxious and very alert to any sign that he might be scolded or hit it is very important you learn what those cat communications are and to watch for changes in Ace that show he is getting scared or over excited.    This is the reason things like pointing fingers and shouting do not work well for telling a cat you want them to stop biting or scratching. A short blow in the face might work or it might be taken as an aggressive move.

To change the pattern of behaviour you need to work on the calm, ignore response.  

Unless he is breaking your skin you follow through these stages:

1.  Be quiet.

2.  Freeze, first push VERY slightly in towards him with the part of you he is biting or gripping in to and then stay very still.  Remain silent, still, and wait as long as you need to for him to release.  Do not move the other parts of your body he isn't latched on to, you need to stay still and try to relax.   This is a good time to practice slow breathing and trying to relax tensed muscles! It may sound ridiculous but think yoga meditation with a cat latched on to your arm or leg, or just in front of your face and your eyes closed.

3.  If his bite or claw grip is hurting you significantly then continue to follow advice as point 2 but  use a selected word or sound that you keep and use only for when he is hurting you.  'OW', 'OUCH', 'ARGH', 'EE'.  One syllable sounds that are pretty automatic when you are hurt are best.  Avoid 'NO' as most cats are selectively deaf to that word as it is used very frequently and on most occasions does not need an immediate response.  Ace needs to learn that when you use this word or sound he is hurting you and he needs to stop quickly.  Say this word firmly but not loudly or shouting. It should sound firm and controlled, a lower tone / pitch is best.

4.  If he does not release continue to remain completely still but repeat the sound or word that you have chosen. Do so every 30 seconds or so.

5.  If Ace releases his grip but then immediately or shortly afterward comes back in again you repeat your response calmly and from stage 1.

6.  If the behaviour is repeated beyond a third time and /or he is becoming more excitable you should lift him up firmly and put him on the other side of a closed door / or remove yourself if he does not like to be lifted or you feel this would make him feel more threatened. After 30 to 60 seconds check by opening the door to see if he looks calm and if he does then open the door and give him the option of coming back in to your space.  If he chooses not to do this it is best not to go after him.

7.  If he comes back in and the biting or scratching begins again you go back to stage 1 and repeat the process.

8.  If Ace comes in with an aggressive attack and draws blood I suggest this is the only time you respond by removing him by releasing his grip.  You need to quietly, and as gently as you can, prize his mouth or paws off you without gripping in a sore way or moving very suddenly.  Try to keep movements smooth and fluid rather than jerky.  Once you get him off you you either place him on the other side of a door or you go, stay separated for a minute and then look to see if he has calmed.  If not you close the door again and wait a further minute.  He will eventually either calm or walk off and busy himself in something else - that is fine.

Think about the process from 1 to 8, along with the cat communication information and see if you and your boyfriend can try and make a start on this from now.

If you are petting and touching him you could try doing this with a feather wand or similar toy and gently touch different parts of his head, limbs and body to see how he reacts: which parts he seems to like being touched and which bits he doesn't.  Which bits he reacts playfully to, or aggressively to.

It would be good to know how your experience of this goes, and also some information about what toys you have and what Ace likes.  This is about getting to know Ace. 


You want to be able to reward Ace when  he is behaving in ways that you want to encourage:

What toys and games does he seem to respond positively to?

What food and treats does he like?

Also

Where in your home does he feel safe / hide /r go to be on his own?

Where does he like to sleep?

Does he have any funny habits, what are they?

Does he do anything cute?

What times of day and or night is he most playful and energetic?

Does he play on his own or only if you play with him?

And last but not least:  Do you have any cute photos of him that you could share with us?
Everything MServant has said here I think should be spot on in helping you and I also second the plea for more info on Ace other than his naughty behavior tell us about all his redeeming qualities :)
 
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  • #75

angelwngs

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Apologies now - this is going to be a long post.


Can I make a start by suggesting we call your cat Ace, as you chose to when you adopted him.  His previous name suggests to me that maybe he didn't have an easy time and perhaps didn't learn all the lessons he could have done, and he now has some catch up learning to do.  You can all learn about each other and find calm ways to communicate and let each other know what you do and don't want from each other.  You all need to understand each other and know where the boundaries are.  You are responsible for Ace and it is very important that you are consistent, calm, and clear in your communication so he can feel calm and learn from you.  This will not be easy because all of you have some not so positive habits and experiences to shake off.

A lot of the Cat Site articles talk about understanding your cat's behaviour and communication.  One useful web page a friend sent to me is the wikihow - how to communicate with your cat.  It gives a nice straightforward introduction plus illustrations to: cat vocalizations and what they usually indicate, what  their body language looks  like and what it can mean, face to face / eye contact and what this means to your cat, and how be aware of your vocal communication and how to use this with your cat.  This could be valuable reading for you as it should help you understand, and describe to others, what Ace is doing, for example when you have been petting him and then he goes to bite you,  or if you playing and he bites or scratches.  Even being aware of what his posture and tail and ear positions are when he is walking or running about your home or sitting on the floor are useful. 

If you have a look at the wikihow article and have a think about what you are seeing and hearing with Ace.  Also think how you could use your voice differently, and some words you can use for him to get to know, to start to change what he seeing and hearing when he is around you.

Secondly,  and very importantly I believe your responses to him when he bites and scratches you need to alter so that this pattern of behaviour can change.  Ace needs to feel you are calm, he is not being punished, but that what he has just done is not OK.  This is easier said that done when you have a one year old + cat biting in to your arm or leg but it is really important if you want it to stop.  

I will repeat much of what others have said here but I want to treat this as a fresh start: Cats do not understand punishment, they will not translate something you do to them in one setting to something they have done in another place or at another time - if you use time out it needs to be immediate and short in duration for them to calm down and not as a punishment (a couple of minutes at a time not more). They will interpret any forced action like your holding their head, body or paws, sudden movements, direct eye contact, loud voices and shouting, screaming, hitting in any way, firm grips and holds, any hold on the scruff of their neck, water spray (if they dislike water), and biting as acts of aggression.  In response they will defend themselves and attack.  It is also very easy to shift quickly from playing in to an aggressive situation if a move has been misinterpreted, and this is most likely to happen when Ace is either very excited or very anxious as I think he is at the moment.  If you move suddenly towards him, move in a jerky manner, shout or scream, get hold of him tightly or suddenly, or look him directly in the eye when playing he could misunderstand what you mean because his brain is on high alert. Then he is likely to attack you to defend himself. Because he is anxious and very alert to any sign that he might be scolded or hit it is very important you learn what those cat communications are and to watch for changes in Ace that show he is getting scared or over excited.    This is the reason things like pointing fingers and shouting do not work well for telling a cat you want them to stop biting or scratching. A short blow in the face might work or it might be taken as an aggressive move.

To change the pattern of behaviour you need to work on the calm, ignore response.  

Unless he is breaking your skin you follow through these stages:

1.  Be quiet.

2.  Freeze, first push VERY slightly in towards him with the part of you he is biting or gripping in to and then stay very still.  Remain silent, still, and wait as long as you need to for him to release.  Do not move the other parts of your body he isn't latched on to, you need to stay still and try to relax.   This is a good time to practice slow breathing and trying to relax tensed muscles! It may sound ridiculous but think yoga meditation with a cat latched on to your arm or leg, or just in front of your face and your eyes closed.

3.  If his bite or claw grip is hurting you significantly then continue to follow advice as point 2 but  use a selected word or sound that you keep and use only for when he is hurting you.  'OW', 'OUCH', 'ARGH', 'EE'.  One syllable sounds that are pretty automatic when you are hurt are best.  Avoid 'NO' as most cats are selectively deaf to that word as it is used very frequently and on most occasions does not need an immediate response.  Ace needs to learn that when you use this word or sound he is hurting you and he needs to stop quickly.  Say this word firmly but not loudly or shouting. It should sound firm and controlled, a lower tone / pitch is best.

4.  If he does not release continue to remain completely still but repeat the sound or word that you have chosen. Do so every 30 seconds or so.

5.  If Ace releases his grip but then immediately or shortly afterward comes back in again you repeat your response calmly and from stage 1.

6.  If the behaviour is repeated beyond a third time and /or he is becoming more excitable you should lift him up firmly and put him on the other side of a closed door / or remove yourself if he does not like to be lifted or you feel this would make him feel more threatened. After 30 to 60 seconds check by opening the door to see if he looks calm and if he does then open the door and give him the option of coming back in to your space.  If he chooses not to do this it is best not to go after him.

7.  If he comes back in and the biting or scratching begins again you go back to stage 1 and repeat the process.

8.  If Ace comes in with an aggressive attack and draws blood I suggest this is the only time you respond by removing him by releasing his grip.  You need to quietly, and as gently as you can, prize his mouth or paws off you without gripping in a sore way or moving very suddenly.  Try to keep movements smooth and fluid rather than jerky.  Once you get him off you you either place him on the other side of a door or you go, stay separated for a minute and then look to see if he has calmed.  If not you close the door again and wait a further minute.  He will eventually either calm or walk off and busy himself in something else - that is fine.

Think about the process from 1 to 8, along with the cat communication information and see if you and your boyfriend can try and make a start on this from now.

If you are petting and touching him you could try doing this with a feather wand or similar toy and gently touch different parts of his head, limbs and body to see how he reacts: which parts he seems to like being touched and which bits he doesn't.  Which bits he reacts playfully to, or aggressively to.

It would be good to know how your experience of this goes, and also some information about what toys you have and what Ace likes.  This is about getting to know Ace. 


You want to be able to reward Ace when  he is behaving in ways that you want to encourage:

What toys and games does he seem to respond positively to?

What food and treats does he like?

Also

Where in your home does he feel safe / hide /r go to be on his own?

Where does he like to sleep?

Does he have any funny habits, what are they?

Does he do anything cute?

What times of day and or night is he most playful and energetic?

Does he play on his own or only if you play with him?

And last but not least:  Do you have any cute photos of him that you could share with us?
Q: What toys and games does he seem to respond positively to?

A: He really likes the laser pointer. He likes the fishing pole toys.

Q: What food and treats does he like?

A: He prefers soft food over dry food. I have some treats called "Friskies Party Mix Mixed Grill Crunch (Chicken, beef & Salmon flavors)" that he likes.

Q: Where in your home does he feel safe/hide/or go to bed on his own?

A: The window sill, under the bed, under the couch (because I have a fouton).

Q: Where does he like to sleep?

A: The window sill, under the bed, under the couch (again I have a fouton), in the tub, on the bathroom floor, in the bathroom sink, and like I mentioned in another thread his litter box as well.

Q: Does he have any funny habits, what are they?

A: Sleeping in the litter box, sleeping in the bathroom sink, trying to get into the shower WHILE I'm showering, trying to drink the water from the sink when I am brushing my teeth, drinking the water left on the bathtub drain.

Q: Does he do anything cute?

A: Curling up on me or my boyfriend and letting us pet him. When he plays with the raindeer stuffed animal he has claimed as his he bites it and rabbit kicks it a lot.

Q: What times of day and or night is he most playful and energetic?

A: Between 7pm-12am.

Q: Does he play on his own or only if you play with him?

A: He will sometimes play by himself usually with the stuffed raindeer he claimed as his or some plastic balls with metal balls inside that make them jingle. He likes to pick things up a lot and carry them around.

Q: Do you have any cute photos of him that you could share with us?

A: Yes, and once I figure out how to post them I will. Also, can I post pictures of him in this thread?
 
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angelwngs

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I have included the idea of blowing in the face in options for detering but suggest it depends on individual cat reactions.  Some do not respond at all to this technique while others dislike it and respond straight away understanding what you want. Equally, depending on what a cat has experienced in the past, even if not close up it could still seem quite threatening, like a hiss, and this would particularly be if there were direct eye contact.  Ace may react very well to a short blow of air, or he may not.  It is one more thing to try out.  My concern at this stage is his aparent level of anxiety and any short, sharp actions even those as simple as blowing at him may raise his  anxiety further.

If I blow gently at Mouse, either close up or from a distance, he rolls over and thinks he's about to get petted. 
 
Ace doesn't respond well the blowing in his face. It doesn't make him stop, it just makes him bite more.
 
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angelwngs

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When we first brought our cat home from the shelter a long time ago he was like this. Maybe you should try even a string to play with him. 
We have played with him with a piece of rope plus we play with him with fishing pole toys.
 

mservant

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  Lots of Ace games and toys.  You can run him to the ground and hardly get of your seat if you're lucky....  no doubt it would take hours though.  He does sound pretty cute when he's not biting.   Carrying little soft toys around is something a lot of cats do, people often call them lovies.  It's like a little security thing.  My friend's tuxedo cat still does it and he's in his late teens.

The wet food is healthier than dried so you're doing good there (unlike me), it just makes it harder in terms of playing and rewarding with food.

With the laxer toys some cats get a bit stressed with them as don't understand why there's nothing to catch at the end of the game / when they get to the dot.  It can add to the fun if you get one of the Party Mix treats Ace likes and have it ready for when you want to take a break from the game or finish it. You put it down carefully when he's following the dot and then end the game with the dot on the snack so he gets his reward.  The other thing you can do with the laxer toy is if Ace is like many other cats and his ears prick up and he comes running the second he hears the sound of the keyring or whatever the toy is on / sound of you going in to the place you keep it.  If you can get him to associate the sound and respond quickly it is a way to divert him if he starts to have that look like he is going to attack.  Like Mouse would be quietly sitting on the other side of the room and I'd be watching TV or on the computer and I'd see him start to look like he was in hunting mode, his face would change and he'd shift his position ready to leap or pounce towards me: before take off you go for the laxer toy and it can avert at least some attack moves.

Mouse does that drinking water from round the bath and sink drains. 
  I have to make sure I rinse any traces of soap n stuff away so he doesn't drink anything he shouldn't.  He used to hang about when I had a shower until he lept in by accident before I got under the shower and gave himself a fright, and because the bath was slippy he couldn't get out - now he stays clear....Do you let Ace drink the water when he comes in when you're brushing teeth and stuff?  You could also try offering him tumblers of the water when he's around you like this, so he sees you fill them and then hold it tilted for him to taste, or turn the tap on to a slow drip for him to lick at while you are there.  Another way of bonding and building up trust that he is welcome and you are offering him stuff when he is choosing to be around you and is calm.  

The evening lively time is pretty common and if you are around gives you a good chance to burn off some of his energy and interact with him.  How long are you playing with Ace for each day, and is it in one session or a number of times through the day or evening?  Do you ever play with him with things like the feather wand until he chooses to stop and lay down, possibly panting a little?

It is good he has his safe spaces around your home, and places he likes to sleep and feels safe to do so.  Does he have any places he can go to that are up high, like high shelves, or a high cat tree?  Even the tops of kitchen cupboards which a lot of cats choose to do.  Cats often like to be up high to watch over their home territory and it can also help to give them a sense of security. 

How is the biting and scratching going this week?  How are you responding when he does this now?  (If the blowing triggers more attack you are right to avoid).

I would love to see a photo, and I remember it took me a while to figure it out.  Now there's no stopping me.  If you look at the icons along the tool bars across the top of the reply page, in the strip what has the smiley in it the first icon looks a bit like some hills and a moon or sun.  Click on this and you should get a pop up box asking if you want to upload.  All you need to do is click on upload and it should give you the option to upload from your device. Select the picture/s you want, click on upload and it then takes  minutes for the picture to upload - there's a bar that will let you know when it's done.  Then choose whether you want small, medium or large.  Medium is good.  Next and you should be done and the picture appears in your post.  Fingers crossed.
 

stephiedoodle

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It''s lovely to hear a bit more about Ace that does not involve is very naughty side
I think ace would really benefit from playing with a feather wand until hes lying down and panting a wee bit like @MServant has described as this will then give ace a good oldfashioned wear out and he should relax a little you could possibly sit next to him during this time and maybe keep it at that for a while and then when he doesn't seem to begrudge your pressence maybe try a little bit of petting.

But how is Ace doing with his biting and scratching I hope with trying some of the adviced provided you have seen a marked improvement. I know all to well that blowing in the face does not work with every kitty when they are intent on biting. I tried it with Lilly and believe you me she just latched down harder thankfully shes only drew blood from me by biting once and that was when the poor dear broke her leg boy did she not want to go see a vet. I'd found a nice sharp 'Ouch' or 'Yow' works well with lilly she lets go and then all I have to do is very slowly and calmly pull the bitten limb away. Likely hood is as said many times and you are probably sick of hearing it by now but Ace won't understand his little teeth hurt your sensitive skin. He after all has his thick fur and undercoat to protect from such attacks. I hope to hear again soon about ace's progress and see some adorable pictures of the boy. Much vibes for Ace
 
 and a hug for you as i really believe you are so nice for trying with ace when so many would give in
 
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