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Coffee's ears go back when Pika gets too close also, which I think means SHE isn't playing?
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Months Of Cat Introduction
- Thread starter metonymforlove
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Hi. Just sharing I’m having the same problem as you are now except mine is over a month now. I totally feel you on this. It is stressful and also sad for the less dominant cat to always be locked up in the safe room. Mine were not newly introduced but have been living together for 6 years until a stray cat entered my house in March. That’s when everything went downhill. Meffy suddenly doesn’t recognize her buddy Meimey, attacks her and they get into an ugly cat brawl. I have separated them since then and thing don’t seem to get any better.
Just when I think Meffy has calmed down and ready to move to the next step, she would attack Meimey and we’re back one step again.
Just when I think Meffy has calmed down and ready to move to the next step, she would attack Meimey and we’re back one step again.
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Well! Here's to SEEING GOOD PROGRESS for all of us! 
I'd be curious to hear how your situation works out too. It sounds frustrating that your kitties got along fine before too... fingers crossed!
I'd be curious to hear how your situation works out too. It sounds frustrating that your kitties got along fine before too... fingers crossed!
blumarine916
I think it is called redirected aggression, you may want to look into that, she is attacking what is close but that is not the problem.My cat Joey has redirected aggression towards me because he is frustrated being separated from Walli, He is an aggressive player, and Walli being a Feral doesn't really know play yet.
shoot I can't remember the thread but
di and bob
posted about scruffing a cat that is being aggressive, you grab the bag of their neck, not real hard and you don't lift them off the ground, you can lift their front feet off the ground but it's not a violent thing, it's what their mother would do to teach them.hopefully di and bob will pop in and explain further otherwise check out redirected aggression
Hi! Scruffing is for when a cat attacks you personally. I suppose it would work if you can grab the aggressor safely by the loose skin on the back of their neck and hold them still until they quiet. Say NO loudly or hiss. You don't lift them by the scruff that would hurt. This is what mama cats do to discipline. I think your cats sound perfectly normal. Most females hiss, swat, and growl at boys, that is what they do! Mine took a year before everyone settled, ( the two families we brought together) and what you describe is still going on between a mama and her sons. They pounce and she yowls and they roll. 4 years now. It is how all my females act!
Coffee's ears go back. You have to let them speak to each other. To communicate they use body language. Putting her ears back is one to signal to him her mood at the moment. It doesn't mean she wants to fight, though it could move that way. It can mean 'don't jump on me' 'give me some space.'
Progress in all cultures with all species requires communication. If you stop the communication, you prevent progress, you actually prevent them becoming friends. Here's a little something that might help. Remember elementary school when boys fought with each other when they first met only to become friends later? It's kinda the same with cats.
BUT here is a huge thing that you need to remember. Whatever happens Coffee is the teacher. That means she will tell Pica to do stuff and to not do stuff when to human eyes it looks like he's doing nothing wrong.
They will wrestle and sometimes scream and break apart. The scream is one telling the other, 'stop that, that was too hard." It doesn't mean they aren't friends anymore, or that they don't want to play, even a minute later. If they couldn't tell each other stop that they wouldn't be able to play.
If people could do something similar in conversation since people don't usually wrestle friendships could be saved.
Progress in all cultures with all species requires communication. If you stop the communication, you prevent progress, you actually prevent them becoming friends. Here's a little something that might help. Remember elementary school when boys fought with each other when they first met only to become friends later? It's kinda the same with cats.
BUT here is a huge thing that you need to remember. Whatever happens Coffee is the teacher. That means she will tell Pica to do stuff and to not do stuff when to human eyes it looks like he's doing nothing wrong.
They will wrestle and sometimes scream and break apart. The scream is one telling the other, 'stop that, that was too hard." It doesn't mean they aren't friends anymore, or that they don't want to play, even a minute later. If they couldn't tell each other stop that they wouldn't be able to play.
If people could do something similar in conversation since people don't usually wrestle friendships could be saved.
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Hi there! We are going through a similar introduction with an older resident cat and a fearless, high-energy younger cat. We are seven weeks in and ours is progressing a little faster than yours, but I work from home so have been able to do things like feed them small portions 5-6 times a day to accelerate getting them acclimated faster.
I have never owned two cats before, so the biggest learning curve for me has been getting used to how violent cat play appears to be. It's really scary having them launching themselves at each other and rolling around on the ground and the noises that sometimes come with it.
But we're on week three of letting the cats be out and open with each other during the day and nobody has died yet. In fact the younger kitten seems to be picking these 'fights' on a regular basis because she wants to practice her skills, and the older cat is happy to oblige and roughly show her who is boss. When he doesn't want to play, he hides.
Sometimes things get a little rough. Both of these cats are strays and I suspect they weren't well socialized as kittens and perhaps separated from their moms too early because they have had to learn basic things like not using their nails with us that most cats already understand. So sometimes the play fights get a little intense but they seem to be learning over time how much is too much and teaching each other what is okay and what is not.
I'm just writing this to let you know that things got better in our household once I let go of some of my personal fears and anxieties and let the cats work things out in their own special way. We are still taking precautions and only allowing them to be unsupervised for shorter periods right now, and breaking up anything that gets CRAZY (there's been a couple). But the trajectory now seems to be much better now that the cats are allowed to claim their space, express their language, and adapt to each other's existence.
I have never owned two cats before, so the biggest learning curve for me has been getting used to how violent cat play appears to be. It's really scary having them launching themselves at each other and rolling around on the ground and the noises that sometimes come with it.
But we're on week three of letting the cats be out and open with each other during the day and nobody has died yet. In fact the younger kitten seems to be picking these 'fights' on a regular basis because she wants to practice her skills, and the older cat is happy to oblige and roughly show her who is boss. When he doesn't want to play, he hides.
Sometimes things get a little rough. Both of these cats are strays and I suspect they weren't well socialized as kittens and perhaps separated from their moms too early because they have had to learn basic things like not using their nails with us that most cats already understand. So sometimes the play fights get a little intense but they seem to be learning over time how much is too much and teaching each other what is okay and what is not.
I'm just writing this to let you know that things got better in our household once I let go of some of my personal fears and anxieties and let the cats work things out in their own special way. We are still taking precautions and only allowing them to be unsupervised for shorter periods right now, and breaking up anything that gets CRAZY (there's been a couple). But the trajectory now seems to be much better now that the cats are allowed to claim their space, express their language, and adapt to each other's existence.
I've read through the whole thread, and Pika sounds like an *awesome* cat!
My feeling is that Coffee wants to play (rolling in front of her, etc), but on her terms, and also possibly never really learned how to play with another cat. So, like us dumb humans, she mistakes playfulness with aggression.
Regarding how much time it can take.....it can be a while! It was almost 1 year with my current crew of 4 before I came home and found them all sleeping peacefully on the same cat tree.
As you've learned, there is probably little reason to keep the cats physically separated now. As long as you have trees, shelves, and places that Coffee can go, defend, and escape from, they can define their relationship with each other at something better than "two cats enter, one cat leaves" )))
Finally, you will never succeed at teaching Pika to leave Coffee alone, but you can teach Coffee to be more confident and playful in Pika's presence. Often, the answer to fixing the relationship between a highly energetic / dominate cat, and a lazy submissive one, is to focus on playing with the 'weaker' cat! Get Coffee to play, aggressively, with an interactive toy will remind her that "hey, I'm a fearsome predator!! I'm not prey!"
My feeling is that Coffee wants to play (rolling in front of her, etc), but on her terms, and also possibly never really learned how to play with another cat. So, like us dumb humans, she mistakes playfulness with aggression.
Regarding how much time it can take.....it can be a while! It was almost 1 year with my current crew of 4 before I came home and found them all sleeping peacefully on the same cat tree.
As you've learned, there is probably little reason to keep the cats physically separated now. As long as you have trees, shelves, and places that Coffee can go, defend, and escape from, they can define their relationship with each other at something better than "two cats enter, one cat leaves" )))
Finally, you will never succeed at teaching Pika to leave Coffee alone, but you can teach Coffee to be more confident and playful in Pika's presence. Often, the answer to fixing the relationship between a highly energetic / dominate cat, and a lazy submissive one, is to focus on playing with the 'weaker' cat! Get Coffee to play, aggressively, with an interactive toy will remind her that "hey, I'm a fearsome predator!! I'm not prey!"
From this limited info, I'd guess Meffy has felt very territorially challenged since the stray came inside. And that instinct is overriding everything else. Are you site and scent swapping? Or is Meffy always in her safe room? How are feeding exercises going?
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Pika sounds a lot like my Momo. He's 10 but doesn't know it.
We're almost 3 months in with introductions to our resident cat Olive, who has had the same reaction as your Coffee--not interested in playing, thank you very much. I too think the playful cat gets frustrated at the resident cat's reaction and that's when things escalate. This process feels hopeless sometimes and requires tons of patience, which has never been my strong suit, but let's hope in both our cases these kitties work it out! You've actually encouraged me, because if in another month we're where you are, I'll be delighted. Good luck!
We're almost 3 months in with introductions to our resident cat Olive, who has had the same reaction as your Coffee--not interested in playing, thank you very much. I too think the playful cat gets frustrated at the resident cat's reaction and that's when things escalate. This process feels hopeless sometimes and requires tons of patience, which has never been my strong suit, but let's hope in both our cases these kitties work it out! You've actually encouraged me, because if in another month we're where you are, I'll be delighted. Good luck!- Thread Starter Thread Starter
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Just wanted to post a quick update.
Most people seemed to be of the mind that I just let them free together, so I've been doing that more often... I usually stop Pika from actually reaching Coffee when he gets into that "intense stare and stalk mode" though because that has always ended badly - this means I am on constant surveillance, which can be exhausting - but I'm so determined to make this work that I am willing to sacrifice my sanity for a couple of months at least.
Because they've been out together more often, I have been less careful. Sometimes they will even touch noses (although usually Coffee just hisses and walks away afterwards. Sometimes, if Coffee feels Pika is getting too close, she will rush up to him and swat at him aggressively. Sometimes, Pika will get into stalker mode and completely fixate on Coffee (I stop these by tying Pika up to a harness when he starts to rush at her- he has been responding to this. Now, if he starts going after her, all I have to do is shake the harness and he backs off).
Today, while I was pre-occupied, Pika went into stalker-mode again and just RUSHED at Coffee. She screamed bloody murder and the two were rolled up in a ball scratching at each other. For some reason, Pika is such a chill cat that I can just grab him away (despite all the things I've read that say to not do this). He is a little more squirmy than when I usually pick him up (normally he just complies with anything and everything with ZERO fussing), but not enough for me to get scratched. I noticed he had a red scratch on his nose. I'm assuming I don't have to treat it because I get scratches like that all the time just from accidental play/feeding, but I don't like that claws are out and blood is being drawn.
Is it normal for two cats who are able to roam around and ignore one another for some of the time to then get so aggressive out of nowhere? Please tell me it gets better..... T-T
It has now been FIVE WHOLE MONTHS, and although I see progress, I wonder if I will always have to be hypervigilant in case they fight. I'm wondering if I have to give Pika up at this point for everyone's sake. I adore him (he is currently sprawled across my lap), but also don't feel it's fair for him or for Coffee to always be so stressed out?
Thanks in advance for any insight!
Most people seemed to be of the mind that I just let them free together, so I've been doing that more often... I usually stop Pika from actually reaching Coffee when he gets into that "intense stare and stalk mode" though because that has always ended badly - this means I am on constant surveillance, which can be exhausting - but I'm so determined to make this work that I am willing to sacrifice my sanity for a couple of months at least.
Because they've been out together more often, I have been less careful. Sometimes they will even touch noses (although usually Coffee just hisses and walks away afterwards. Sometimes, if Coffee feels Pika is getting too close, she will rush up to him and swat at him aggressively. Sometimes, Pika will get into stalker mode and completely fixate on Coffee (I stop these by tying Pika up to a harness when he starts to rush at her- he has been responding to this. Now, if he starts going after her, all I have to do is shake the harness and he backs off).
Today, while I was pre-occupied, Pika went into stalker-mode again and just RUSHED at Coffee. She screamed bloody murder and the two were rolled up in a ball scratching at each other. For some reason, Pika is such a chill cat that I can just grab him away (despite all the things I've read that say to not do this). He is a little more squirmy than when I usually pick him up (normally he just complies with anything and everything with ZERO fussing), but not enough for me to get scratched. I noticed he had a red scratch on his nose. I'm assuming I don't have to treat it because I get scratches like that all the time just from accidental play/feeding, but I don't like that claws are out and blood is being drawn.
Is it normal for two cats who are able to roam around and ignore one another for some of the time to then get so aggressive out of nowhere? Please tell me it gets better..... T-T
It has now been FIVE WHOLE MONTHS, and although I see progress, I wonder if I will always have to be hypervigilant in case they fight. I'm wondering if I have to give Pika up at this point for everyone's sake. I adore him (he is currently sprawled across my lap), but also don't feel it's fair for him or for Coffee to always be so stressed out?
Thanks in advance for any insight!
We never had huge fights, but Gohan chasing new kitty Olive lasted more than 6 months, and we weren’t relaxed for probably 9 months.
Olive has now been with us 1.5 years and she’s trying to play with him and chase him - no supervising or vigilance. Obviously every situation is different but Gohan is quite particular and we were worried and discouraged. In our case it worked out. They are still evolving their relationship but we let them work it out.
Olive has now been with us 1.5 years and she’s trying to play with him and chase him - no supervising or vigilance. Obviously every situation is different but Gohan is quite particular and we were worried and discouraged. In our case it worked out. They are still evolving their relationship but we let them work it out.
It's not great that Pika got scratched, but at least Coffee was fighting back and not just letting Pika attack her. 
I can't remember if this has come up before or not, but have you tried Feliway? I haven't used it, but some members find it helps. There's also calming treats and collars. So something you might want to look into.
I can't remember if this has come up before or not, but have you tried Feliway? I haven't used it, but some members find it helps. There's also calming treats and collars. So something you might want to look into.
Sounds normal to me.....Pika wants to tussle and Coffee, being the typical diva female, doesn't. He needs something to play with. Get a Kickeroo on Amazon and throw it towards him when he is in his stalking mood. They are a great distraction. Get two and keep one steeped in catnip in a plastic bag to keep them refreshed. He's really not being aggressive, he's being ornrey and knows it gets to Coffee. In time it WILL get less grequent, my cats grew up together and still tussle once in a while, hair flying and scratches!
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Thank you for the responses! I do play with Pika, but he seems to have lots of energy and a very high prey drive (growls during play, drags toys around in his mouth - growls if you get too close, etc.) I have also tried Feliway, but it didn't seem to do very much for them. I will just keep going with the current routine and hope things gradually get better. KarenKat's post about taking 9 months is a little encouraging. I hope we can be free from constant surveillance by then! Thanks for the insight everyone!
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I have always been discouraged when posts like these go silent, so I wanted to make sure to give an update!
It has now been almost SEVEN months since we brought our then 9 month-old male cat Pika into our household with a then 5 year old female cat Coffee! Pika refused to leave Coffee alone, and Coffee was VERY upset about having a new cat. I think Pika just wanted to play, but would sometimes get frustrated and fights - with scratches and screaming (from Coffee) - broke out a couple times. Poor Pika had a scratch on his nose for weeks after one of their brawls.
The method I used may not be the BEST in terms of creating a SUPER WONDERFUL human/cat relationship, but it has allowed for some good improvement between the kitty interactions. Because Pika is pretty fearless and has almost 0 displays of anxiety, I have been using a harness and leash to train him (this probably would not have worked if he was a scaredy-cat because leashes would just cause fear).
Whenever he goes after Coffee, I put him in his harness/leash and keep him next to me (or tied to the couch) for 15 or so minutes. Because he is such a curious kitty who likes to move around, he began to hate the harness because it restricted him. Every time he would approach Coffee, all I had to do was shake the harness. If he caused a fight, I just put him in his harness (no leash) and gave him a time out in the bathroom for longer.
This was honestly super exhausting because I had to be on a CONSTANT LOOKOUT to make sure no fights broke out. I was always watching them when they weren't taking naps to make sure Pika was aware of the harness if he tried to go after Coffee. During this time, I let them approach each other as long as Pika didn't get into his "pounching" stance. He only got the harness if he started pouncing OR would REFUSE to leave her alone after 3 or more warning hisses from Coffee. If Coffee swiped at Pika first even though he was just walking by and paying her no attention, she got time out too. Of course, we did treats/feeding and playtime training to develop positive feelings/etc.
The result so far:
They don't need as much supervision from me anymore. I only have to scold one or the other maybe twice during the day (nighttimes are still a little bit of a struggle because Pika seems to know I'm not awake enough to get the harness but we are definitely getting there).
Yesterday, Coffee let Pika sniff her booty for a good 5 seconds without fussing. They often give nose kisses to each other (sometimes Coffee hisses after these but not always), and life is just easier for all of us. We aren't quite there yet, but I definitely foresee continued improvement and hope! Thanks for all the help and insight everyone!
It has now been almost SEVEN months since we brought our then 9 month-old male cat Pika into our household with a then 5 year old female cat Coffee! Pika refused to leave Coffee alone, and Coffee was VERY upset about having a new cat. I think Pika just wanted to play, but would sometimes get frustrated and fights - with scratches and screaming (from Coffee) - broke out a couple times. Poor Pika had a scratch on his nose for weeks after one of their brawls.
The method I used may not be the BEST in terms of creating a SUPER WONDERFUL human/cat relationship, but it has allowed for some good improvement between the kitty interactions. Because Pika is pretty fearless and has almost 0 displays of anxiety, I have been using a harness and leash to train him (this probably would not have worked if he was a scaredy-cat because leashes would just cause fear).
Whenever he goes after Coffee, I put him in his harness/leash and keep him next to me (or tied to the couch) for 15 or so minutes. Because he is such a curious kitty who likes to move around, he began to hate the harness because it restricted him. Every time he would approach Coffee, all I had to do was shake the harness. If he caused a fight, I just put him in his harness (no leash) and gave him a time out in the bathroom for longer.
This was honestly super exhausting because I had to be on a CONSTANT LOOKOUT to make sure no fights broke out. I was always watching them when they weren't taking naps to make sure Pika was aware of the harness if he tried to go after Coffee. During this time, I let them approach each other as long as Pika didn't get into his "pounching" stance. He only got the harness if he started pouncing OR would REFUSE to leave her alone after 3 or more warning hisses from Coffee. If Coffee swiped at Pika first even though he was just walking by and paying her no attention, she got time out too. Of course, we did treats/feeding and playtime training to develop positive feelings/etc.
The result so far:
They don't need as much supervision from me anymore. I only have to scold one or the other maybe twice during the day (nighttimes are still a little bit of a struggle because Pika seems to know I'm not awake enough to get the harness but we are definitely getting there).
Yesterday, Coffee let Pika sniff her booty for a good 5 seconds without fussing. They often give nose kisses to each other (sometimes Coffee hisses after these but not always), and life is just easier for all of us. We aren't quite there yet, but I definitely foresee continued improvement and hope! Thanks for all the help and insight everyone!
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This is super weird but I have an older female cat named Poki and just adopted a younger male cat named Chai..... the reversed name sort of similarity is funny but the situation is the same. Poki doesn't really know how to play with another cat, and Chai is an energetic boy who was well socialized with other cats. I let them sniff through the door day 2 and he was super chill but she was very hiss hiss. However he would not look at her and walk slowly past her when she would growl or hiss. Now he knows she is just all bluster and telling him what to do so he doesn't mind trying to play with her more and she is making signs of wanting to play, like looking after him with ears perked, cleaning in front of him, rolling around, eating near each other, etc. She still growls and perches looking at him like a gargoyle but they get along and I have only had Chai for 2 weeks.
Now.... I am not sure how I have done this. Poki was adopted last October and it took about 4 months for her and my previous cat who was not interested in her to learn to coexist by having separate sleep areas and general avoidance. My cat Aerowyn had cancer and had to be put to sleep last month, so I adopted Chai a bit quickly. Poki had difficulties more towards me than other cats when I got her, being fearful and afraid of being hurt therefore lashing out with aggression, so she does sort of the same with Chai but without the biting because he listens to her mostly but he really loves to follow her, wants to play with her, even tried to get in the cat bed with her the other day, though usually he lays down right beside it. (She smacked him like 'what the heck you are so rude get out')
I keep an eye out but maybe it has a bit to do with me? I make sure they have their own areas and play time together and alone, and I just stay super chill, which I know is hard to do. Like if a dog ran up to me barking I can just turn on my 'I am ignoring you and am very chill' personality but that is developed from years of social and crowd anxiety so the animal has little to know energy to feed off of. This has taken at least 2 decades and therapy to develop, lol.
I'm not sure if anything in this post is actually helpful to you, my tablet battery is dying and I wanted to reply quickly so it might be a bit incoherent
Now.... I am not sure how I have done this. Poki was adopted last October and it took about 4 months for her and my previous cat who was not interested in her to learn to coexist by having separate sleep areas and general avoidance. My cat Aerowyn had cancer and had to be put to sleep last month, so I adopted Chai a bit quickly. Poki had difficulties more towards me than other cats when I got her, being fearful and afraid of being hurt therefore lashing out with aggression, so she does sort of the same with Chai but without the biting because he listens to her mostly but he really loves to follow her, wants to play with her, even tried to get in the cat bed with her the other day, though usually he lays down right beside it. (She smacked him like 'what the heck you are so rude get out')
I keep an eye out but maybe it has a bit to do with me? I make sure they have their own areas and play time together and alone, and I just stay super chill, which I know is hard to do. Like if a dog ran up to me barking I can just turn on my 'I am ignoring you and am very chill' personality but that is developed from years of social and crowd anxiety so the animal has little to know energy to feed off of. This has taken at least 2 decades and therapy to develop, lol.
I'm not sure if anything in this post is actually helpful to you, my tablet battery is dying and I wanted to reply quickly so it might be a bit incoherent
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Is that Poki in your picture? Coffee is a kind of a tortoiseshell too is why I ask (ticked torbie to be exact). Pika is a gray/white tuxedo! That's good to hear that your kitties are doing better. At week 2, Coffee was still growling and hissing at me (despite being so loving normally) and she had only seen Pika's face once or twice XD. I'm hoping that it's just taking longer because Coffee has NEVER been around another cat since she was 8 weeks old and is confused. She is SOOOO much better now though. She even seems to have become more playful with people and is less shy around guests.
A family member hit her once for being a diva after moving to America so she kind of went from from social kitty to shy kitty after the long plane ride and rude welcome. I was upset at the time, but she seems to be returning to her old self after spending time with Pika strangely enough. Pika also never groomed himself and would be a mess after eating. I'm not sure if he's learning from Coffee (she is a neat-freak), but he is grooming himself WAAAAAY more lately. XD
