Impossible Cat

[susieqz]

well, i got a few poor pics. i'l get more tomorrow, to
hopefully i'll get a good one.
pics are not easy because i can't approach her with a camera.
the rule here is i can never approach her. she can only approach me.
she won't run in teror anymore, but she will walk away faster than i can move.

 

[LeiLana80]

I do think it's important to point out that cats are nothing like dogs. Most dogs seem to be almost constantly head over heels for humans, wanting attention (verbal/physical) all the time. Cats? Cats are extremely independent. Some are more friendly than others. But they aren't constantly friendly like dogs!
They may be pleasant to be around, but don't want to be touched or in close quarters all the time. That is typical cat behavior. Some may be more needy (need more talking, petting), and others require much less of all that!
From everything you've said, Drifter sounds like a perfectly reasonable cat, honestly! haha
My youngest house cat (about a year old now, had him since 14 weeks) cannot be held/picked up. He only needs pets every few days, when HE asks for it. Other than that, he prefers to do his own thing and will run if I try to pet or pick him up. Not in an angry or scared way, just in a "I do what I want" way that is quite typical of cats!

I just want to make sure your cat expectations are okay!

Sometimes we are blessed with amazing cats that love to be held and snuggled and loved on. Sometimes we get the more aloof ones that are just independent- and that's okay too!

 

[susieqz]

what kind of pic do i need to take for somebody to tell me her age?

i believe her to be young adult, but i'm no expert.
i guess i think an older feral wouldn't cuddle.
by the way, she is cuddling every day now.
often twice or thrice/day
i try to make it as pleasant as i can.
i'm no longer gentle.
she gets a good rub down, which she enjoys.
she alternates cuddling with snacking.
we cuddle, then she breaks off n steps over to her bowl n chomps some friskies,
maybe has a drink. then she either walks away or comes for more cuddling.
since her bowl is inches from me, she usually comes to it, but sometimes looks at me n decides to come to
my arms instead.
the food is really the draw.
since she gets stroked while eating, cuddling n eating are intertwined.
it's all one thing.

 

[orange&white]

If she's a young adult, it will be hard to tell her age from a photo...maybe hard to tell in real life. Between 1 year and 10 years, healthy cats look pretty much the same. A vet could probably tell by looking at her teeth. You may be able to tell by looking at her teeth when she yawns. The younger they are, the more their teeth will be bright shiny white. Eating raw prey though will likely keep her teeth in great shape for years...so....hard to tell.

That didn't help very much, did it?

 

[susieqz]

if bright shiny white means young, it did.

her teeth are in great shape n whiter than mine, plus she really enjoys crunching her friskies.
i doubt she would ever enjoy canned food.
friskies are kinda messy tho. little pieces go flying outside the bowl.
you know, her actual food costs are low. i won't know exactly til she finishes the first 16 pound bag, bu tit's under $4/month.
a fair price for rodent control.
it's drugs n accessories that are hitting my wallet.

 

[maggiedemi]

Try a bag of Purina Cat Chow Complete in the blue bag. Demi used to love Friskies until he tried that, now that's his new favorite. For now anyway, he might change his mind next week.

 

[orange&white]

if bright shiny white means young, it did.

All young cats should have bright shiny whites. Some older cats will too, which is why I was saying that it can be hard to tell their age. When they eat live prey the fur and skin have a polishing action and crunching the bones scrapes off tartar. Older cats on raw food can have beautiful "young-looking" teeth. Neither kibble nor canned cat foods are great for their dental health unfortunately.

We still want to see the pictures!!!

 

[susieqz]

my old vet told me that kibble was important for dog's dental health.
that canned food was bad for teeth.
it should be the same for cats.
um, guys? this thing you have about catering to a cat's tastes?
about allowing a cat to refuse food?
that doesn't work here.
cats will eat whatever i buy, or starve.
friskies are already more expensive than many brands.
if she tires of them, she will just have to catch more mice.
she gets no vote in what i buy.

 

[orange&white]

Vets only take one class on pet nutrition during their years of education (it may be an optional class at some vet schools), and that class is taught by an employee of Hill's Science Diet. It's a racket. Vets are taught that dry food is good for pet's teeth, so that's what they tell clients. Most of them aren't trying to lie; it's just what they were taught. After vet school they don't have a heck of a lot of free time to independently study pet nutrition.

Anyway, even with my distaste for processed dry foods, I'd rather have people feed kibble and adopt a cat, than not adopt a cat.

 

[Willowy]

It used to be thought that kibble was good for their teeth. But they've done some studies since then and found that it doesn't do anything, except for special dental kibbles. It's like humans eating crackers---there may be a slight scraping action but otherwise no dental benefit. But since she eats prey, the muscles and bones will keep her teeth nice and clean .

 

[susieqz]

can anyone point me to a definitive study?
i'll go google it, but i doubt i'll find much.
i have known cats that have been fed friskies for their entire life.
they seemed healthy.
for that matter, our barn cats got friskies when the cows were dry.
mom thot it best.

well, i did a quick goodle search. nothing i found convinced me that wet is better than dry.
i am aware that it is an article of faith on this site that wet is better.
but, numbers of people believing something tells me nothing.
people can be wrong.
i see no definitive study that proves wet is better.
just because some cats don't drink enow, does not mean that all cats don't drink enow.
in the abscense of good science, your beliefs are only your beliefs. not facts.

 

[orange&white]

Those pet feed companies have huge profits to tell us through marketing what's healthy for our cats. They started telling people in the 50's that human food and scraps were not "complete", therefore not healthy...and of course they had the perfect solution: kibble. Now we have seen quite a few generations of obese cats prone to kidney disease, diabetes, digestive issues and other chronic health issues. Seems cat genetics are not improving (sort of like what we're seeing in humans after a few generations of convenient processed foods).

Does Dry Food Clean the Teeth? | Little Big Cat
What Dry Food Does to Your Cat's Teeth - Feline Nutrition Foundation
6 Reasons why dry food does not clean your cat’s teeth
Preventive dental care for your cat

Not trying to scare you away from buying Friskies for Drifter. She is catching some live prey which should help keep her very healthy.

 

[maggiedemi]

When Drifter catches a mouse, that is like a can of cat food, she gets her moisture from that. Indoor cats need canned food because they aren't getting any mice. Raw food (mice) brushes their teeth. Purina Cat Chow is the same price as Friskies here at Walmart.

 

[susieqz]

orange, thanks for the sites. i've scanned the first, which seems to undermine the belief that
dry promotes dental health. the other sites seem to address the same issue.
it does not say that wet is better than dry,
still, my kibble is only a supplement,
barn cats are expected to provide most of their food for themselves.
what my eyes tell me is that adding friskies to drifter's diet is making her thrive.
house cats may need wet food but that does not say anything about barn cats.

i am not saying your beliefs are wrong. i'm only saying that i see no proof one way or the other.
you have been very helpful to me, so please do not consider anything i say as a personal attack.
i consider you guys friends.

 

[susieqz]

thank you, maggie. that is what i believe.
no walmarts here but i'll check for that online.

 

[Willowy]

Yeah, for farm cat types, Friskies/Cat Chow is fine. They just need a bit to supplement their mouse catching . I feed my farm cats Cat Chow (because that's what Sam's Club sells, lol. I consider Friskies to be of similar quality). For house cats we have to get more complicated since we have to provide their entire diet.

 

[orange&white]

Wet processed food isn't any better for their teeth than kibble. There's nothing in it to scrub their teeth, and most manufacturer's add gums to the food to make it look like gravy or jelly that probably sticks to their teeth. Most cats eating all processed cat feed end up needing regular dental cleanings at the vets office, or the owners figure out how to brush the cat's teeth regularly.

We were an agrarian society for hundreds if not thousands of years before the industrial age brought mass-processed foods along with other "advances". People fed scraps and initial canned cat and dogs foods were absolutely intended to only supplement a diet of meat scraps and hunting prey. They were also mostly pure meat that went through the canning processing on a large scale, mimicking home canning foods in the kitchen. Most cats were either outdoor-only or indoor-outdoor back then.

The pet feed industry really exploded when Purina developed the processing technology for dry cat biscuits which were convenient, cheap and had a long shelf-life. That also came along about the same time as television with mass advertising and marketing "information" to educate us stupid idiots about what to feed a cat. Marketing is there to tell us what to think, with more than a bit of spin in favor of supporting the manufacturer's particular product. People bought it and unfortunately that's when we started feeding carnivorous cats a lot of carbohydrate flours...then people moved from the country farms to the cities and started keeping indoor-only house cats who didn't have opportunities to access natural food.

Feeding Drifter cat food as a supplement in addition to her hunting is a good thing. Your instincts are "old style".

I'm never offended by people having a different opinion than mine...I like people with strong opinions. Makes for interesting conversation.

 

[maggiedemi]

When I was a kid, our outdoor cats got mostly dry food. They caught their own wet food. They were really healthy, they never had dental problems. The ones that didn't get run over or disappear lived to be around 10-15 years old. I don't know their exact age because my parents didn't keep any records.

 

[susieqz]

i'm disappointed in drifter's hunting skills. she was chasing something all over the garden, missing every pounce. eventually, whatever is was managed to escape under my deck, inches from me.
this makes me want to break out the poison, but if i do that. drifter will be eating poison filled prey.
no wonder she was so thin when she got here.

what really gets me tho, is behavior that makes no sense at all.
lately, she comes every day, several times a day, to get cuddled. when she;s in the mood, she loves my touch.
she likes being in my arms. she likes being engulfed by me.
pretty odd for a feral cat.
at the same time, she can come to me for all this touching, but i can never get near her. when i try, she runs off.
i see no fear in this running. she is not afraid of me.
but she runs off because she doesn't want me near, while only minutes before she wanted me very near,
so, why does she do this?
early on in our relationship, this could be explained by fear.
also, if she is standing where she gets fed n it's supper time. i can walk right up to her, if i have her dish in my hand.
no running away when food is involved.
after i set her dish down, i can even stroke her as she eats, while i'm standing.
so, truly , she runs only if it's convenient to run.
if i can't understand this behavior, i can do nothing to change it.
right now, it's only irritating.
but if the weather is bad, i won't be able to offer her shelter.
has anyone run across this sorta thing before?

 

[maggiedemi]

Was it a chipmunk? A chipmunk got in our garage and no matter how hard they tried, my cats could not catch it, it was too fast. They hopped all around trying to get it. Yes, please do not use poison, especially not D-con type pellets. The mice don't just eat them all at once, they put them in their cheeks and spread them all over your property. You might put out more thinking they ate it all, but they just spread it all over and it's hard to find to get rid of it. I found this out the hard way.