Hare Today grinds, bone percentages?

[peaches08]

Oh good point. Whole animal - cleaned unless otherwise stated. No guts (and probably bled?

). Maybe no head, or hooves, etc..... I don't even have that email any longer, that laptop crashed.

If you're not going to use them as all-the-time food, that's what I'd do. In fact - it is what I do.

Then that is what I'll probably do.  This whole iodine or not (rabbit and thyroid gland?), enough liver or not, do I add taurine...man, boards were easier than this.

They love their chicken.  Every time I give them something new or something they haven't had in a while, I wonder if they'll balk at their chicken the next time.  They never do.  If anything, they balk at new things.  So I try to make sure they get a little variety but that they know chicken is "home."  Chicken I can debone more if needed.  I need to remember that, especially since 2 Cornish hens are in the fridge defrosting for grinding tomorrow.  I am NOT deboning a single bone out of those tiny birds.  It ain't worth losing a finger.  I've got 2 days left of chicken then I need to make chicken, and I'll just skim a few more bones out.  The recipe is bone heavy even with 25% bone out, I remember running that by mschauer before. 

Taking a deep breath...then deciding on Alnutrin or Dr. P's + manganese.  I don't see the need to add glandulars to HT grinds...or should I?  OMG...

 

[alistair]

Hmm - Tracey definitely said ~20% for the poultry though, including chicken, so perhaps it's not whole animal?

Which would make sense, as H-T does still need the full set of supplements, thus implying that it is not - on its own - a complete meal. However, perhaps we add supplements purely to compensate for nutrients lost in the grinding process.

No the meat + bone + organs are not the whole animal. HT does sell whole carcass grinds though. I would think they are complete and balanced without supplement added but you would have to ask Tracy.

 

[alistair]

Is it just the bowl that's an issue?  Or storage space in the freezer after portioning?

Just the bowl. I suppose I could go buy a bigger one. Amazon must love me

 

[alistair]

I ended up buying 8 qt mixing bowls on Amazon for about $10 each, and mixing all of the same protein at once - ie: the Hare-Today grind and the boneless. It'd be the same as your current method (dump meat, pour water+Alnutrin, stir, portion out), just in larger quantities. Also, if you're doing multiple pounds of the same protein, it'll decrease the amount of time you spend making food compared to mixing/portioning the meat one pound at a time.

Yeah a bigger bowl might save me time anyway.

 

[peaches08]

I thought all of the HT mixes were whole animal?

If so, according to mschauer's work with USDA data, a chicken is more like 32% bone: http://www.thecatsite.com/t/263570/composition-of-proteins-bone-skin-fat

Again thanks for posting this chart!  I made Cornish hen today.  2 hens (meat/bone/skin) were 3.5 lbs.  I added 1.5 lbs of chicken gizzards and dropped the bone percentage only to 27.3% if my calculations are correct (using mschauer's 39% bone).  This is for occasional meals only, Cornish hen is pricy!

 

[abby2932]

 
Again thanks for posting this chart!  I made Cornish hen today.  2 hens (meat/bone/skin) were 3.5 lbs.  I added 1.5 lbs of chicken gizzards and dropped the bone percentage only to 27.3% if my calculations are correct (using mschauer's 39% bone).  This is for occasional meals only, Cornish hen is pricy!

Peaches, are you adding organs to this recipe too? Just curious because I may want to copy your recipe 

 The cornish hen at the Asian market that I went to yesterday was pretty cheap and I may want to try it some day. Also, did you remove any bone, or did you leave it all in there?

Thank you!!

 

[peaches08]

 
Peaches, are you adding organs to this recipe too? Just curious because I may want to copy your recipe 

 The cornish hen at the Asian market that I went to yesterday was pretty cheap and I may want to try it some day. Also, did you remove any bone, or did you leave it all in there?

Thank you!!

No problem!  I use the little Tyson Cornish hens from the grocery store.  The only organ I add is liver (the hens have no organs with them).  I use Dr. P's recipe, but I add manganese (1-10mg capsule per 10 lbs) and Nutricology Immoplex Glandular supplement at 1 pill per lb of meat/skin/bone. 

I didn't remove any bone, I was afraid of adding a finger.  

  So yeah, I left all the bone in them.  I went by mschauer's chart about the bone percentage being 39%.  39% of 3.5 lbs of hen is 1.365 lbs of bone, and 1.365 lbs of 5 lbs (3.5 hen + 1.5 gizzards) comes to 27.3%.  Unless my math is off?

 

[abby2932]

Thank you!

Your math is correct. Isn't 27% bone still pretty high for a meal though? I guess since it's only an occasional meal, it's not such a huge deal.

Thanks again for sharing, I will save this somewhere that I can easily find it later

 

[peaches08]

Thank you!

Your math is correct. Isn't 27% bone still pretty high for a meal though? I guess since it's only an occasional meal, it's not such a huge deal.

Thanks again for sharing, I will save this somewhere that I can easily find it later

Yeah, I think 27% is pretty high!  I used to just cut the Cornish hen up in chunks with poultry scissors and serve it that way (39% bone), so I guess I'm still ahead of the game?  I guess my freaking out and wondering about the percentages of bone in HT grinds is kind of silly since my cats didn't get constipated on Cornish hen alone.

Oh, and the Cornish hen is just something to throw in a couple of meals a week.  The main stay of their diet will remain chicken thighs even once I start getting some HT grinds.  My job can't start soon enough.

 

[alistair]

Am I supposed to be adding egg yolks in addition to Alnutrin?

 

[peaches08]

Am I supposed to be adding egg yolks in addition to Alnutrin?

Since there's egg yolk powder in the Alnutrin, I'd say probably not.

 

[abby2932]

hmmm....My cats get Rad Cat in the morning and HT ground with Alnutrin in the evening. These both include egg yolk. I still give them 1 egg yolk a week. (split into 2 feedings, so 1/2 yolk per cat twice a week)

Am I giving too much yolk?

 

[peaches08]

I make homemade and I add 18 egg yolks to about 15 lbs.  The Cornish hen I added 6 yolks to 5 lbs.  But all 3 of mine are heavy shedders so...?

 

[alistair]

Since there's egg yolk powder in the Alnutrin, I'd say probably not.

yeah I also give them a small amount of salmon oil everyday so that should be sufficient

 

[alistair]

Double post

 

[alistair]

Anyone get their Alnutrin from the manufacturer? HT is expensive for only 35 servings

 

[abby2932]

With shipping from the manufacturer, it is practically the same price. (the one for meat/bone/organ) The manufacturer says their bag makes up to 44lb of food but they are including the water you are going to add. It is still only going to be for 35 pounds of actual meat/bone/organ mix. I think it is $5 cheaper from the manufacturer but then shipping is about $5 so it evens out to be the same as Hare Today.

 

[alistair]

Bummer [emoji]128513[/emoji] All the prices at HT seem fair to me except the supplement

 

[ldg]

http://www.knowwhatyoufeed.com/shop_online.html The one without any source of calcium (which is what is used for the meat/bone/organ mixes) adds approximately $0.50 to the cost per pound.

 

[alistair]

My cat Sunny who has had a problem with soft stools in the past, is having normal BM's with the HT rabbit 15% bone. However, he has gone the the litter box to pee twice today and he normally pees about golf ball or slightly bigger sized clumps but today they have been less than half that. Is there any concern for urinary trouble with high bone percentage? I know too much phosphorous can be a problem.