Giada is always hungry

[She's a witch]

yes, I’m aware that label says it’s good for treating, but in my vet’s experience it’s rarely the case that topical dewormers are effective in existing infestation of GI parasites, even if the label claims it is. Especially that, although they’re supposed to last a month, after two weeks, when the larvae’s appear, it’s not necessarily strong enough to kill all of them, some would survive and the cycle continues. Hopefully it won’t be the case with Giada though and stronghold will be enough!

 

[She's a witch]

It’s actually something I somewhat experienced when it comes to ear mites; my girl had it and was given Stronnghold, it helped for a few weeks but they returned; only direct ear ointment helped. Despite label saying it “treats&prevents” ear mites.
i guess it’s all a matter of how severe the infestation is.

 

[MissClouseau]

In the last week she had some bad poops, so we had it tested and the lab found roundworms(*), so the vet dismissed the issue as a consequence of the worms, but the worms are present now, she's been constantly hungry for several months

I asked the vet whether this Stronghold was good for treatment or it was for prevention only, and he said something that I should have known before, because it's written on the box ( ) and says "treatment AND prevention" of parasites of many kinds, including the Toxocara Cati.

I'm actually going through things with worms right now with Hima AND Stronghold. Hima has been on Stronghold every month through the summer, I only stopped in September or October. Around the same time twice there was foul odor from her right after she pooped in the yard (I never see her poops.) I didn't make much of it but about 1-2 weeks later I saw something exactly like this. It was just smaller (not my picture!)
:

I think fair to say it was a worm. Still unclear what kind of worm it was. I got her dewormed with Profender and trying to catch her poop to take to the lab to re-check if it worked well.

Sorry I'm writing long but before this months ago, a vet told me Stronghold didn't work for worms and that it "doesn't have an ingredient to kill worms." At first I thought she was being ignorant because the box says it treats roundworms, hookworms etc but then again, after this incident I checked the ingredients of all actual dewormers and Stronghold doesn't have ANY ingredient of them. So it makes me think She's a witch is right. Once I get Hima's poop tested to check if I will get any new info, I will email and ask Stronghold out of curiosity too.

 

[She's a witch]

I checked the ingredients of all actual dewormers and Stronghold doesn't have ANY ingredient of them

Stronghold wouldn’t have the same ingredients I think because it works topically and through bloodstream rather than in the GI truck, so it’s different chemical process. I believe it does work for GI worms, but it’s simply weaker and not enough to kill existing worms AND their “offspring”, which is crucial to stop the cycle. Imo it’s convenience comes with a price. Personally, for any existing GI worms I’d use oral pills rather than any topical solutions.

 

[MissClouseau]

Stronghold wouldn’t have the same ingredients I think because it works topically and through bloodstream rather than in the GI truck, so it’s different chemical process. I believe it does work for GI worms, but it’s simply weaker and not enough to kill existing worms AND their “offspring”, which is crucial to stop the cycle. Imo it’s convenience comes with a price. Personally, for any existing GI worms I’d use oral pills rather than any topical solutions.

I checked other topical dewormers too like Profender and Broadline. Both have praziquantelum for example and praziquantelum exists in the pill worm dewormers I checked too. (Like Caniverm for example.). They have at least one more ingredient for worms. Stronghold only lists Selamectin as its ingredient.

 

[MissClouseau]

And I totally agree with oral dewormers being better. Hima got such awful diarrhea and tummy ache after Profender it was scary. Nothing close had happened with a pill dewormer.

 

[She's a witch]

I checked other topical dewormers too like Profender and Broadline. Both have praziquantelum for example and praziquantelum exists in the pill worm dewormers I checked too. (Like Caniverm for example.). They have at least one more ingredient for worms. Stronghold only lists Selamectin as its ingredient.

indeed! but I've also checked that selamectin alone should be effective for roundworms (according to some studies, my vet's experience is different as I mentioned). Interestingly, even Wikipedia says that "It treats and prevents infections of heartworms, fleas, ear mites, sarcoptic mange (scabies), and certain types of ticks in dogs, and prevents heartworms, fleas, ear mites, hookworms, and roundworms in cats ". Maybe my vet created that entry lol.

 

[Antonio65]

I think fair to say it was a worm. Still unclear what kind of worm it was. I got her dewormed with Profender and trying to catch her poop to take to the lab to re-check if it worked well.

So, you're saying that Profender might work better, or that you were expecting that it would work better?

after this incident I checked the ingredients of all actual dewormers and Stronghold doesn't have ANY ingredient of them. So it makes me think She's a witch is right. Once I get Hima's poop tested to check if I will get any new info, I will email and ask Stronghold out of curiosity too.

Thanks, it will useful to have different opinions from different parts of the world.

 

[Antonio65]

I checked other topical dewormers too like Profender and Broadline. Both have praziquantelum for example and praziquantelum exists in the pill worm dewormers I checked too. (Like Caniverm for example.). They have at least one more ingredient for worms. Stronghold only lists Selamectin as its ingredient.

I would have liked to use Broadline, but it's out of stock and the manufacturer has stopped the production and doesn't know when they resume it.

 

[MissClouseau]

So, you're saying that Profender might work better, or that you were expecting that it would work better?

Profender is more effective than Stronghold as it contains more than one ingredient to treat worms that pill dewormers also contain. Also Profender treats for more kinds of intestinal worms, i.e. tapeworms. BUT, Profender caused the most side effects in Hima than all the topical or pill form treatments of any kind. There are some really awful reviews about it online too. I still have couple Profender at home but I'm saving it for the situations there is no other option, e.g. impossible to pill the street cat residents of the yard so it has to be topical. Otherwise, I agree with She's a witch pill dewormers are better. At least was with Hima. Less side effects.

 

[MissClouseau]

I forgot to say! Advantage Multi strikes as it could work better than Stronghold for GI worms. Unlike Stronghold it has more than one ingredient which somewhat gives me more assurance. (Imidacloprid for fleas, moxidection which said to treat heartworms and some GI worms.) And for what it's worth, I actually applied Advantage Multi on Hima back in March and didn't see any signs of worms in the next few months. I can never be sure though as I don't see her poops.

I still think pills are the most effective and health-wise safer but I myself will apply Advantage Multi again in January-February as I can't pill Hima and don't want to take her to the vet so much during the pandemic. (They don't allow humans in the exam room.)

 

[Antonio65]

I forgot to say! Advantage Multi strikes as it could work better than Stronghold for GI worms. Unlike Stronghold it has more than one ingredient which somewhat gives me more assurance. (Imidacloprid for fleas, moxidection which said to treat heartworms and some GI worms.) And for what it's worth, I actually applied Advantage Multi on Hima back in March and didn't see any signs of worms in the next few months. I can never be sure though as I don't see her poops.

I still think pills are the most effective and health-wise safer but I myself will apply Advantage Multi again in January-February as I can't pill Hima and don't want to take her to the vet so much during the pandemic. (They don't allow humans in the exam room.)

I have never used Advantage, I used to apply Advocate, though, and I think it was great.
I will ask my vet as soon as I have the chance. I wouldn't like to disturb him so often

I consider myself lucky, because over here, despite the tragic situation for the virus, people are still allowed in with their pets and in all exam rooms. Actually I am at the vets' nearly everyday (different place than where I take Giada to) for the number of stray kittens I'm dealing with lately.

 

[Antonio65]

Two weeks after the first application of Stronghold.

Her poops are way better, and they were good after the first couple of days already, so I think that either the Stronghold worked fine, or that she didn't need it at all.
What hasn't changed is her appetite, still crazy and endless. As it has been for the past 11 months!

She's literally starving to death about 15 minutes after her meal, and if food isn't coming straight away, she starts searching the house and knocks things down in the attempt to find something to eat.
This morning she knocked down a souvenir ornament we had on a shelf. Broken! And I haven't found all the pieces
I hope my wife doesn't find it out soon, I have a few things to repair with the Loctite glue already because of this kitty.

I also thought the food I was feeding her isn't enough, and I made a little research. I'm feeding her about 230-240 kcal a day. Her RER should be 170 kcal, but because she's a very young cat, tables say that RER has to be multiplied by 1.2, which would be 205, so I'm feeding her more that she should need anyway, considering that I would like to keep her lean and not let her get overweight or obese.

She's driving me crazy, I'm telling you. I'm exhausted after only one hour in the morning. It would be wonderful if there was a pill that reduces her appetite a little.

 

[FeebysOwner]

Sorry this is not getting any better with Giada. I know you said she had some food sensitivities, but perhaps you could look around for a suitable higher density food?

The other thing I came across was a condition called psychogenic abnormal feeding behavior - obsessiveness over food and signs of pica - primarily stress induced from 'hard times' in cat's early life. Some suggest it could also be caused by a mental disorder - but, frankly I think the two are pretty much one in the same.

There are tons of articles on this condition - below is a link to just one of them, but it also includes a load of additional related links at the bottom of the article. And, it contains a link to a scientific study in the Journal of Veterinary Behavior, which I also included the link below. Just keep in mind, this data does cover many medical aspects as well, so be patient while you read.
Psychogenic Abnormal Feeding Behavior in Cats - Archie Cat

(PDF) Successful treatment of abnormal feeding behavior in a cat | Marco Bernardini - Academia.edu

 

[Antonio65]

I fed Giada two meals half an hour apart before midnight, last night.
We've been woken up by her loud yowls and screams at 4:30am. We got up, fed her an early breakfast, she was hungry again at 6:30am, new little breakfast for her, only to be woken up again at 7am...

I had hoped that the presence of a new tender tiny cute kitten might distract her from food, but no.
She gets a much higher calories intake than her needs, but it seems it's never enough.

 

[Antonio65]

She gets in trouble, and I fear that one of these days she gets in real trouble because she goes and touches dangerous places and things.

As I had foreseen, Giada's obsession with food has got her in trouble!
On Friday my wife brought home a small plant of Winter Jasmine. The plant would sit indoors, waiting to be put outside on the next morning, and Giada had the brilliant idea to chew on one or two flowers.
We didn't realize.
On the next morning she wasn't so interested in food as she had been in the past year. Though it was what I was dreaming of, it was clear enough that something was really wrong. She wasn't eating her wet food, and the dry food was just putting her off. She was too quiet and lethargic, we couldn't recognize her. We were wondering what had happened, when we saw some fragments of flowers near the plant!
I called the clinic right away, they told me to keep an eye on her and if any strange symptom was showing up, I had to rush her to the clinic. Apart from the lack of appetite, no other symptoms appeared. Three hours I called the clinic back, just to reassure them things were fine after all.
On Sunday morning she threw up some stomach juices, and a couple of hours later her legendary appetite resumed.

Things are now back to normal, but what a scare we had! Right on the day of her first anniverary in our home!

 

[FeebysOwner]

I am glad Giada got through that, but sad that you are still battling with her eating issues.

 

[minish]

I'm so sorry that Giada was in trouble and happy that it turned out OK. I've been following this thread and I think minish has a similar situation though less severe. She's been with me almost 6 years since kittenhood and wants to eat at least 1.5 times more than she needs. If left to her devices she eats twice what she needs. Much more so after she slowed down, towards age 2. I guess it's a combination of hormones and psychology. If I can keep her active, play and tire her a lot, it's easier. I guess food became a way for her to seek attention as well as being "always hungry". She keeps asking despite being full sometimes.
It's a difficult situation but I am sure you will find ways to manage it. Just don't expect an ideal situation. In my experience, that never happens

 

[Antonio65]

Things aren't improving.
We've adopted a new kitten, and after a period of separation and introduction, the two cats are spending a lot of time together, sleeping, playing... fighting...
I thought this would have kept Giada busy and focused on different aspects of life, but I was (partly) wrong. Yes, she is rather busy interacting with the kitten, but then comes the moment when she gets obsessed with food again, and it's when she would walk on the ceiling to find something to eat.

To add disaster to disaster, the new kitty is even worse!
She doesn't scream, yell, or torment me with continued request for food, but she eats just everything, there's nothing that repels her, so the risk is that she might eat even harmful foods. I caught her trying to bite a chocolate bar!!!

It's my fate... Probably this is what happens when you bring home cats that were living on garbage...