Geoffrey Small Cell Lymphoma

[fionasmom]

You gave him the pred? It is a very powerful drug and whether or not he is on it may make a difference to his well being. This may be related to having tried to wean him off of it.

 

[mrsgreenjeens]

Hoping the 4 mg of Pred kicks in and he eats well tonight. Did you try giving him the S & C rabbit dry? My cats don't like it either way, but they eat any freeze dried raw much better UN-rehydrated for some reason. If he'll eat it, then you can try slowly hydrating it and using it in the dry form as a topper

 

[artiemom]

Yes, I gave him the 4m prednisolone. We will see what happens overnight.

I tried re-hydrating the Stella & Chewy's freeze-dried.. He did not like it.. I was hoping I could crush it, mixing it with his
RC PR...
mrsgreenjeens I will try that.. slowly...

I am just so confused and emotionally drained.. I really am... I love Geoffrey.. He is alert.. the only things are being constipated: Ie, poope every 2-3 days with moral and laxatone... and his lack of appetite.. Both very important to life.. dam.... I want him to stay with me for a while longer.. but... if this is his life... what type of a life is it??

I am not jumping into anything.. not at all...
I am planning to try the CBD oil.. read some Information about it, this afternoon.. It may help.. Geoffrey is so sensitive.. to both medicines and emotionally sensitive. That makes me think that the CBD oil may hep him-- n more ways than one... Will talk to Dr B about it... It is my last resort, besides giving a steroid, becoming a diabetic.. and/or decreased appetite, and running away from me because of pilling. I do not add anything to his food-- food aversion.

 

[FeebysOwner]

Let's see what happens with the Pred being re-introduced. He can be treated for diabetes, worst case scenario. Is he currently on an appetite stimulant? The CBD oil might not be a bad idea at all.

 

[LTS3]

Dr. B likely has no experience with any type of CBD as it's only been popular in the past couple of years. There's very few studies so far on how it works for pets and how safe it is to use. The AVMA has this info on using CBD for veterinary use: Cannabis use and pets

 

[FeebysOwner]

Courtesy of another member when I was researching CBD oil - they have used it for years.
CBD Pet Tincture with Hemp Oil - Organic, Non-GMO, Food Grade Ingredients (4cornerscannabis.com)
Cannabis 101: CBD for Cats | Boulder Holistic Vet

 

[daftcat75]

It is unfortunate that your vet cannot discuss CBD because it is not approved for veterinary use (and may still be schedule 1???)

Because one thing you need to be aware of is that CBD and prednisilone are detoxified by the same enzymes in the liver. What this means is that CBD may extend the amount of time it takes for his body to process pred.

I would treat CBD and pred as either/or rather than complimentary. Pred is going to be stronger, more effective medicine. I would give pred another chance with a more consistent and appropriate dose over a long enough time.

I don't remember G's dosing history. But it surprised me that he was weaned off it altogether. It also seemed like he was weaned off it rather quickly. My doc recommends a tapering of 25% every two weeks. It seemed like G was tapered faster than that. I'm not a vet obviously. But my experience and understanding would recommend that G return to 4 mg for two weeks before making any adjustments one way or the other. Then make the adjustments more gradual.

In the meantime, I would ask for a tube of Mirataz (the transdermal appetite stimulant.) It should be easy enough to give him a wet willy to stimulate his appetite. You could use the Mirataz for a few days or up to two weeks as long as he needs it. I like the transdermal because you can more easily take his dose down a notch by giving him less gel if he gets more crazies than necessary.

 

[tarasgirl06]

Big Sigh.... Geoffrey is not doing well. We finished with the experiment of discontinuing the pred. His last dose was Friday. Please forgive me if I am repeating myself...

Dam ... Geoffrey is not eating. No appetite at all.. I tried giving him some Orijen Freeze dried lamb treats, to see if it was nausea or fussiness... He loves the treats.. Not the RC PR Food.. dam
The most he is eating: 1/3 of a 5 oz can.. not enough for him.

I even mixed the treats with the dry food--not much success. Geoffrey wants the treats, only. I do not know if is he being fussy with his food, or he really has a decreased appetite. I am going for the decreased appetite. Geoffrey lost 1/2 lb over the past week.. dam... I can feel his spine.. dam.. He looks thin..

I got an order of Stella & Chewy's Freeze dried raw rabbit. I tried rehydrating, and adding it to his wet food... NO GO.. he sniffed; then walked away. I am taking all food over to him. Geoffrey has no desire to go over to his food.. dam

Demeanor wise, he is good.. alert, waling around, looking out windows-occasionally.. demanding to be brushed... but he is not eating and not pooping. He used to have a BM every other day.. Now it is every 2-3 days, with double doses of laxatone and 1/2 tsp miralax, daily... Something is wrong.. I know the Chemo could cause constipation; the same with the Cerenia, I gave for a couple of days.. not good.

I was so upset, that I went onto the "Laps Of Love". Geoffrey cannot continue this way... I took their quality of life test. Geoffrey scored an 11/22..... with the automated response of: We are concerned about his quality of life. He will decline over a short time frame.. not exactly their quote, but you get it...

I am seriously thinking of CBD oil, as a last resort. A friend gave me a link to a company she is using for her IBD kitty. I trust her.. I asked Dr B about it. Answer, from other clients: Dr B cannot guide me though it, but some other clients are using it..
I am going to call them tomorrow afternoon ... I also got a couple more companies from the Lymphoma Group on FB..

This is the last resort.. Geoffrey has a horrible diagnosis.. He does not seem to be responding positively to treatment. Dr B cannot understand him.. I cannot either.. It seems everything we are trying, has disastrous result.. I cannot afford the echocardiogram.. I told J (Dr B's secretary) about that.. she was ok with it.. I absolutely love her.. She called me AFTER her working hours.. I Love her. I was crying while I was talking to her..

Dr B is not in today. He called in late this afternoon for updates: as I was leaving messages. He will be in Tomorrow, Wednesday, afternoon. Dr B prescribed 4 mg of prednisolone to be given asap.. with an update tomorrow morning. He will call me tomorrow afternoon...

Geoffrey means so much to me.. perhaps too much.. He is supposed to be my ESA... But, I have been supporting him more that he has supported me... Not really, because I love him..

I feel cheated.. really cheated...
I had had Artie for 6 years... and not a good 6 Years. The first few years were wonderful..OMG.. Artie was my Soul Kitty.. always with me.. When I broke my upper arm, he would not leave my side..When I had pneumonia, he would not leave me... Then IBD and Megacolon (motility issues) kicked in-- and fast... I put him down on 5/23/18

I adopted Geoffrey 11/4/2018... just before my b-day... He was younger.. only 4 years old or so... He looked healthy, but skinny. I was a volunteer at the time. I needed time to get my apartment ready for him. I took him home the day before my b-day... I had a suspicion he may have IBD, because he vomited a couple of times while in the shelter..But he was Orange.. I fell in love with him..

Geoffrey was tuff from the beginning. I think he was either abused at one point or was completely afraid of people.. It took a lot of work, and Prozac to get him to the point he is now...He is my cuddle bug.. He loves me.. trusts me--you can see it in his eyes, and demeanor.
Now, I feel cheated,....... I really do.. I have worked so hard for my relationship with
Geoffrey... now I feel I am short changed.. Only 4 years with him...less than my Artie... dam. I wanted a younger kitty, so I would not have to go through the horror I did with Artie-- yet, G is younger and sicker.. It just seems to get worse...

I want a kitty in my life.. The way I am going, I don to thing the stars are aligning towards that. I need a kitty. I am alone..
I need someone to give me unconditional love....

Sorry if I am getting so maudlin.. so much down things.. I feel that way, today...
The "joys" of small cell lymphoma..

Sorry for the badness.. I have been tearing up all afternoon... I know life is not fair.. but I so much wanted a healthy kitty, for a while. Too much.. in such a short period of time.. feeling sorry for myself.. not right.. I have only had Geoffrey for a short period of time.. not even 4 years.. and it took almost a year to get him acclimated to me and love..

Pumpkin had diabetes.. was a sick kitten, nursed her back to health... bottle feeding...
Artie with his IBD, Megacolon-- motility issue, his heart arrhythmia...
Geoffrey with IBD, Small Cell Lymphoma, heart arrhythmia... possible diabetes... dam.
it just gets worse and worse...

Is someone trying to tel me that I should not have any more kitties?? I wonder.... I have spent so much money on them.. not to mention my emotional attachment to all of them.. I take things hard.. this is not right.. sorry.. I am feeling sorry of myself.. and for my baby boy...... whom I love...

Since Geoffrey loves the lamb treats, can you get some lamb wet cat food to try him on? Or, if he can have chicken, chicken & lamb? If not, are the treats the kind you could moisten and/or combine with water and blend to make a gravy-like treat? Are there Churrus or NalaCo lamb varieties you could offer him?
As to your sharing life with a cat, personally, I couldn't live without cats in my life. No matter how many losses there have been -- and there have been many over my entire life -- it does not ever mean I could stop sharing life with cats. They give unconditional loyalty and love, beauty, grace, and so much more, like no one else. Whether I've been in a relationship with a human or not, I always need cats in my life. It sounds like you do, too. And our health -- anyone's health, no matter species, age, or anything else -- is the luck of the draw. We never know. When we adopt, we do so for LIFE, through thick & thin, in sickness & health. For the most part, I have had very good luck and healthy, long-lived cats, almost every one of them straight off "the street." A few have been adopted from friends, rescuers, or shelters. I would never deny a cat a loving home, or myself a loving relationship with a cat. I hope and pray that, whatever is in store for you and Geoffrey, you won't, either. We do what we're able to do, with great love.

 

[Furballsmom]

They give unconditional loyalty and love, beauty, grace, and so much more, like no one else.

 

[maggie101]

I soo wish for you and Geoffrey to feel better. I was just reading about a sub for prednisolone and cbd was mentioned

 

[daftcat75]

I soo wish for you and Geoffrey to feel better. I was just reading about a sub for prednisolone and cbd was mentioned

You can ask the doctor about budesonide which has local rather than systemic action. It’s like an ingested topical, if that makes sense. This would allow G to continue on steroids while reducing the diabetic risks. I don’t know if budesonide has the munchies side effect of pred. You may need Mirataz if you go that route. But since pred was working for him, I would see about 4 mg for two weeks. Give it time before making another change. Then make that next change gradually. At the end of the day, you should listen to the doc over internet strangers. But you can certainly write down these concerns for the next time you talk to him.

1. CBD and pred. He can’t comment really on CBD but he should be able to at least tell you if he thinks this is a dangerous combination given G’s history and CBD’s interaction with pred.
2. In fact, you should run all his prescriptions against a drug interaction database like this one. Even though this refers to THC interactions, CBD and THC are chemically similar and will have similar interactions.
Cannabis Interactions Checker - Drugs.com
3. Pred dose and length of dose before adjusting. Pick a dose and give it two weeks.
4. Mirataz for appetite stimulation
5. Budesonide instead of pred if diabetes a concern of pred.
6. Possibly ondansetron instead of Cerenia? I find Betty’s appetite is negatively affected by Cerenia and responds positively to ondansetron.

 

[Margot Lane]

I can’t vouch for anything on the above list, but, my vet says some pred is needed, and that consistency is key.

 

[tarasgirl06]

You can ask the doctor about budesonide which has local rather than systemic action. It’s like an ingested topical, if that makes sense. This would allow G to continue on steroids while reducing the diabetic risks. I don’t know if budesonide has the munchies side effect of pred. You may need Mirataz if you go that route. But since pred was working for him, I would see about 4 mg for two weeks. Give it time before making another change. Then make that next change gradually. At the end of the day, you should listen to the doc over internet strangers. But you can certainly write down these concerns for the next time you talk to him.

1. CBD and pred. He can’t comment really on CBD but he should be able to at least tell you if he thinks this is a dangerous combination given G’s history and CBD’s interaction with pred.
2. In fact, you should run all his prescriptions against a drug interaction database like this one. Even though this refers to THC interactions, CBD and THC are chemically similar and will have similar interactions.
Cannabis Interactions Checker - Drugs.com
3. Pred dose and length of dose before adjusting. Pick a dose and give it two weeks.
4. Mirataz for appetite stimulation
5. Budesonide instead of pred if diabetes a concern of pred.
6. Possibly ondansetron instead of Cerenia? I find Betty’s appetite is negatively affected by Cerenia and responds positively to ondansetron.

Just thanking you, daftcat75 for this very helpful information. You have lots of experience and lots of helpful suggestions. Hoping Cindy sees this and hoping it may help Geoffrey.

 

[artiemom]

Had a nice, long for him, talk with IMVet late this afternoon. I checked in with his secretary earlier this morning and through out day. Dr B is so dedicated, almost OCD!! He checked in, on his way into Angell.
Dr B is very conscious of my finances. He thought about doing an Ultrasound, to see if the cancer has spread, to cause the inappetence; but then said no. It would not really change management. We know he has cancer. What difference knowing if it has metastasized? Treatment would be about the same. It would be money which I cannot afford.

Dr B consulted with an oncologist there. They are both stumped! She said that it could be the cancer spreading.. suggested ultrasound, a change in chemo --- one which was once a week, with weekly blood tests. Dr B said, No, because it would just stress Geoffrey out even more.. and he is not about to do that to him. Geoffrey is so emotionally sensitive.
I immediately agreed with Dr B.. I would never do that to Geoffrey, never mind the expense.

New Plan:
All of this began as the prednisolone experiment was ending.. and worsened as the pred stopped. We did this experiment with the pred because Geoffrey was very lethargic, eating me out of house and home, and was spilling some glucose in urine.Dr B wanted to see if he would be ok with either no dose or a low dose. Now we are certain it was the dose of prednisolone. We are back to pred, but not for as high a dose. Beck to twice daily. I am get urine test strips to check his urine, if I am able to. . He will be on this dose for a bit..
It seems he needs some sort of steroid.. Instead of staring. new drug, we are doing this.
If he responds positively.. we may switch him to another steroid.

As for the Zofran: Yes, it could help, along with the Cerenia, but we would never find out the main source of this current issue. It could mask things. Dr B is into changing one variable at a time, wait and see. Personally, I do not feel the Cerenia helps Geoffrey... but...

Food: anything he will eat!! Not just the prescription food, all is open to him.. Yes, I know. sounds like the end, but he has to eat.
I do not have any fancy feast or tiki cat in the house.. But I have the case of RAWZ Rabbit... expiration date 2025.
Opened it up: Geoffrey went wild for it! It looks good to me. He inhaled 1/3 can in no time. He wanted more, but I shooed him away.

CBD oil: Dr B is not a fan of it. He does not know anything about it. He feels it is over hyped. Ok.. last resort--if needed.

He did ask if Geoffrey was my only cat. I said, yes. I was afraid to find out why he asked that question.

This is my roller coaster life.
I swear this cat is going to cause me a heart attack or stroke. I mean it.. or a nervous breakdown.

 

[daftcat75]

I’m glad some cat likes the 2025 Rawz. Maybe if I withhold rabbit altogether for long enough, Betty might forget how much she preferred the 2023 cans. Maybe she’ll give Mouser a second chance too.

 

[tarasgirl06]

daftcat75 "With cats, one never knows, do one?" So it's entirely possible. No harm in trying...
artiemom No, Cindy, that's not going to happen. Try some different foods on Geoffrey. We each have our own preferences and requirements but I'd try various foods, as high a quality as possible. Nothing wrong with Fancy Feast. For us, it's Blue Buffalo and Soulistic, which is available through Petco and petco.com. Most of the latter are seafood formulae but there are a few meat and poultry formulae as well.
If he needs pred, he needs pred. As to the other things, I'd trust his doctor and also your own intuition.
One step at a time. One day at a time. Geoffrey loves you very much and you love him very much.

 

[maggie101]

Hello artiemom ! I hope you and Geoffrey are doing better. Best of luck to both of you. What have you decided? My cat has not thrown up and is eating better since on pred

 

[artiemom]

We changed Geoffrey over from prednisolone to Budenside. Only 2 doses, so far, but he seems not to be as lethargic.. Fingers crossed.
I pray he does not turn diabetic. As I explained to his IMVet; That is the line. I cannot allow him to go through this.. His life will be revolving around medications, blood sticks, injections. No.. I cannot do that to him. I promised him I would not.

He did have some very strange behavior, over the past 10 days. When he was lying on top of my bed, I would stand in the doorway, talking to him.. or just looking at him.. He did the 'slow blink' to me.. a few times. (as Jackson Galaxy would say: that is a cat's way to tell you that he loves you, or a cat's Kiss. He has not done that before; even when I tried doing it to him. This time he was doing it on his own. Then he rolled over on his back... . This happened on several days.
I took it to say Geoffrey wanted me to know that he loves me.

Also he is refusing all the prescription food, and is exclusively eating RAWZ rabbit. He really seems to like it. I do not have any dry.. but he is exclusively eating wet.. on his own.. Today, it will be an over an entire 5.5 oz can. I hope my order comes in on Monday. I put it on a rush... I am so grateful that I ordered a case of it, a few months ago.

I have not been home much today. In and out.. Right now, he is on his rug, in front of the electric fireplace, lying on top of his pickle... with his mustache nearby.

So, it is one day at a time with him. The ImVet's associate is covering the ER this week-end. The IMVet will be back on Monday. That is unusual for him. I think it may be a scheduling change because there are several Jewish holidays upcoming. I pray nothing happens when he is not working.

I went on a Trolley Ride this morning.. all around my city, showing the historical sites. It was so interesting.. a beautiful day, gorgeous, sunny, a great breeze.. a good day for a open window trolley car ride. I sat next to the window. Our historian is a real historian. A former teacher, who went on to become an associate professor at a college. He is from my City. It was so good. Home for a while.. just resting.. then off the Mass. I want to sleep in a bit tomorrow. I have not been sleeping well.
and my psyche needs a break.
I think I am going to meet a friend for a late lunch.. in fact, I am getting a text about it now...

Thank you for asking.

I am glad your baby is doing better on the steroid.. just make sure it is prednisolone. It is metabolized better than prednisolone, in kitties.

 

[maggie101]

We changed Geoffrey over from prednisolone to Budenside. Only 2 doses, so far, but he seems not to be as lethargic.. Fingers crossed.
I pray he does not turn diabetic. As I explained to his IMVet; That is the line. I cannot allow him to go through this.. His life will be revolving around medications, blood sticks, injections. No.. I cannot do that to him. I promised him I would not.

He did have some very strange behavior, over the past 10 days. When he was lying on top of my bed, I would stand in the doorway, talking to him.. or just looking at him.. He did the 'slow blink' to me.. a few times. (as Jackson Galaxy would say: that is a cat's way to tell you that he loves you, or a cat's Kiss. He has not done that before; even when I tried doing it to him. This time he was doing it on his own. Then he rolled over on his back... . This happened on several days.
I took it to say Geoffrey wanted me to know that he loves me.

Also he is refusing all the prescription food, and is exclusively eating RAWZ rabbit. He really seems to like it. I do not have any dry.. but he is exclusively eating wet.. on his own.. Today, it will be an over an entire 5.5 oz can. I hope my order comes in on Monday. I put it on a rush... I am so grateful that I ordered a case of it, a few months ago.

I have not been home much today. In and out.. Right now, he is on his rug, in front of the electric fireplace, lying on top of his pickle... with his mustache nearby.

So, it is one day at a time with him. The ImVet's associate is covering the ER this week-end. The IMVet will be back on Monday. That is unusual for him. I think it may be a scheduling change because there are several Jewish holidays upcoming. I pray nothing happens when he is not working.

I went on a Trolley Ride this morning.. all around my city, showing the historical sites. It was so interesting.. a beautiful day, gorgeous, sunny, a great breeze.. a good day for a open window trolley car ride. I sat next to the window. Our historian is a real historian. A former teacher, who went on to become an associate professor at a college. He is from my City. It was so good. Home for a while.. just resting.. then off the Mass. I want to sleep in a bit tomorrow. I have not been sleeping well.
and my psyche needs a break.
I think I am going to meet a friend for a late lunch.. in fact, I am getting a text about it now...

Thank you for asking.

I am glad your baby is doing better on the steroid.. just make sure it is prednisolone. It is metabolized better than prednisolone, in kitties.

That is great news!!! I am going to try rawz on her again but only buy one can to be sure. Something she used to like then decided she didnt

 

[dustydiamond1]