Welcome to The Cat Site
your cat community
Interact with our community

Cat Breeder Red Flag?

Discussion in 'Showing and Ethical Breeding' started by Elexcia, Aug 9, 2017.

  1. Elexcia

    Elexcia Thread Starter TCS Member Kitten

    12
    10
    Aug 8, 2017
    Hi, guys! I have a question about a cat breeder that I've grown uncertain about. I have already put down the deposit and am supposed to be picking up the cat soon but the more questions I ask, the more uncomfortable I feel about the breeder.

    For starters, in the contract I signed, she mentioned nothing about neutering or spaying the kitten. When pressed, she said to spay it at six months. But then when I asked her if I could expect to get the kitten's registration papers when I pay for it, she said she wouldn't give me the papers without a proof of neuter from the vet later on. But again, none of this was ever mentioned in the contract I signed.

    Secondly, when I asked her what vaccines the kitten had already received, she said it received one at 8 weeks and shouldn't receive any more until it's settled in but I thought kittens were supposed to receive at least two vaccines before 12 weeks.

    These three things are making me feel really concerned about whether I've made the right choice choosing this breeder and this kitten. Please help. Thank you for reading/listening.
     
    Alejandra Rico purraised this.

  2. KatsPurrrsians

    KatsPurrrsians TCS Member Alpha Cat

    475
    209
    Jul 12, 2016
    The beautiful South
    The spay and neuter contact is actually indication of a very responsible breeder, why she didn't mention this when you signed your paper work- I'm sure I don't know.
    As far as the vaccinations, we usual do those around 6 to 8 weeks old and follow ups every 3-4 weeks until the kittens reach 16 weeks of age.

    Edit; If the kitten is let go prior to 16 weeks of age, it will be sent home with a vaccination log stating the dates and vaccines the kitten has received (signed by the vet or breeder) along with instructions to give the remaining vaccines.
     
    Last edited: Aug 9, 2017
    Elexcia, Alejandra Rico, pushylady and 2 others purraised this.

  3. abyeb

    abyeb Charlie's Purrson Staff Member Forum Helper

    6,932
    8,499
    Feb 18, 2017
    What organization is she registered with? I'd recommend calling the organization to verify the registration. It's normal for a breeder to withhold giving the new owner the papers until there's proof of spay/neuter, but I'd still check with the breed registry, just to be sure the papers aren't fake.
     
    Elexcia, Alejandra Rico and KatsPurrrsians purraised this.

  4. StefanZ

    StefanZ Advisor Staff Member Advisor

    21,848
    5,240
    Sep 18, 2005
    Sweden
    And also, its good to have this promise written down... So you GET your certificates when they spaying is done.
     

  5. Alejandra Rico

    Alejandra Rico TCS Member Super Cat

    1,051
    3,426
    Mar 27, 2017
    Asturias, Spain
    :yeah:
    Totally true. I do not know this person and I am new to cat breeding, as I do not plan to have any litters until Freya is 2 years old, so I have plenty of time to research and think about how do I want my breeding program and my relation with customers to be.
    However, I do think that the behaviour you are talking about is suspectful. One should not change the terms of a contract after signing it. It is unresonable, unfair and ilegal, and probably the worst way to become a popular trustworthy breeder in the Cat world.
    Registration papers can take a long time to be sent (at least, here in Spain and in Portugal) so you may not get them when you pick your cat, but if the contractual clauses about neutering did not include it for getting pedigree, then there is no legal base for breeder to not give them to you.
    This said, I would suggest telling breeder to give you your kitten already neutered and with registration papers when you pick him ir her and see how breeder reacts to this.
    If the answer is no, and does not offer reasonable alternatives, either you call a lawyer or look for a reliable breeder. I am sure someone in the forum can help you to find an ethical breeder if you ley us know the kind of cat you are looking for.
     
    Elexcia, StefanZ, KatsPurrrsians and 2 others purraised this.

  6. Elexcia

    Elexcia Thread Starter TCS Member Kitten

    12
    10
    Aug 8, 2017
    Thanks guys for your responses. I really appreciate it so much! Breeder doesn't believe in neuter before 6 months which is why I'm expected to do the neutering myself. But as I said, I was worried as neutering was never mentioned at all in the contract and was only brought up when I asked about the registration papers. Then I was told I could only receive them after neutering which is why I'm now nervous about the whole thing.
     

  7. Alejandra Rico

    Alejandra Rico TCS Member Super Cat

    1,051
    3,426
    Mar 27, 2017
    Asturias, Spain
    Run away.
    Six months old is old enough foro most male cats to start spraying and for some female cats to have their first heat. Both things are something you want to avoid by all means if you are not a breeder.
     

  8. Elexcia

    Elexcia Thread Starter TCS Member Kitten

    12
    10
    Aug 8, 2017
    Oh dear, that's what I read online too re: 6 months but I wasn't sure if it was enough of a red flag and I really wanted to trust her :(
     
    Alejandra Rico purraised this.

  9. 1CatOverTheLine

    1CatOverTheLine TCS Member Top Cat

    8,676
    34,347
    Feb 6, 2017
    .
    @Elexcia - Perhaps I missed it, but I don't believe that you've mentioned the breed. Certain breeds - brachycephalic breeds especially - benefit from an owner waiting until six months to spay or neuter, simply because their airways are often very narrow, and, of course, narrower still in kittens. Anesthetising a tiny Persian kitten, for example, requires far more skill than the same procedure would several months later.
    .
     
    KatsPurrrsians, abyeb, Elexcia and 1 other person purraised this.

  10. Elexcia

    Elexcia Thread Starter TCS Member Kitten

    12
    10
    Aug 8, 2017
    It is a Persian. I didn't know that the breed made a difference!
     
    Alejandra Rico purraised this.

  11. Alejandra Rico

    Alejandra Rico TCS Member Super Cat

    1,051
    3,426
    Mar 27, 2017
    Asturias, Spain
    That is true. However, a good breeder would have explained this to you instead of saying that she does not "believe" in neutering before 6 months old.
     
    1CatOverTheLine and Elexcia purraised this.

  12. Elexcia

    Elexcia Thread Starter TCS Member Kitten

    12
    10
    Aug 8, 2017
    Unfortunately, I'm still not sure what to do. Do you think it's too much of a red flag that neutering wasn't mentioned at all until I brought up papers? Or is it nbd?
     

  13. abyeb

    abyeb Charlie's Purrson Staff Member Forum Helper

    6,932
    8,499
    Feb 18, 2017
    Would you mind telling us who the breeder is? Give a link to the website? I agree it seems odd that this wasn't mentioned in the contract.
     
    Elexcia purraised this.

  14. Elexcia

    Elexcia Thread Starter TCS Member Kitten

    12
    10
    Aug 8, 2017
    Of course! I've PMed you!
     

  15. Alejandra Rico

    Alejandra Rico TCS Member Super Cat

    1,051
    3,426
    Mar 27, 2017
    Asturias, Spain
    I would say that at this point it all depends on how much are you in love with the kitten, how important are those papers to you and if you mind about losing the money you paid for securing the cat.
    If you are seriously in love with the Kitty and pedigree papers are not super important to you because you can see he is a purebreed even if he isnot registered, then you can go on. The breeder may give you the papers after all. You can ask her to sign a new contract including the spaying clause so at least you have some legal protection if she doesn't give you the papers.
    If you are not super emotionaly involved with the kitty yet and you can afford losing the money you have already paid... Well, surely someone will tell you a couple of names of Persian breeders un your area who are ethical and reliable.
     
    1CatOverTheLine and Elexcia purraised this.

  16. Elexcia

    Elexcia Thread Starter TCS Member Kitten

    12
    10
    Aug 8, 2017
    It's not so much the papers I mind, just scared that one red flag might be a sign of more to come? But maybe I am overthinking it? I do love the cat.
     

  17. Alejandra Rico

    Alejandra Rico TCS Member Super Cat

    1,051
    3,426
    Mar 27, 2017
    Asturias, Spain
    Ok, I can understand that. You have been watching pictures of your kitty for some time now and you already feel bound to him.
    Have you been allowed to visit the breeder and see where do cats live, how they behave am so on? If not, will you have the chance to do so? Is the breeder allowed you yo visit and interact with the cats, at least you can be sure that this is not a bad breeder but maybe just someone new who is learning about contracts and is not yet doing things as well as she should on the legal spectre.
     

  18. Elexcia

    Elexcia Thread Starter TCS Member Kitten

    12
    10
    Aug 8, 2017
    I haven't visited but I will ask if I can.
     
    KatsPurrrsians and Alejandra Rico purraised this.

  19. 1CatOverTheLine

    1CatOverTheLine TCS Member Top Cat

    8,676
    34,347
    Feb 6, 2017
    Indeed; you'll find countless articles, scholarly papers, and at least one full book on anesthetizing brachycephalic cats and dogs:

    Anesthetizing brachycephalic - Google Search

    .
     

  20. Elexcia

    Elexcia Thread Starter TCS Member Kitten

    12
    10
    Aug 8, 2017
    Very helpful information, thank you for sharing!
     

Share This Page

  1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies.