Booboo is confusingly not well

[mrsgreenjeens]

Mews, my kidney cat (not really CRF, just in the beginning stages, thankfully) is 15ish. We "adopted" him from a friend of a friend... 8 years ago, and she wasn't quite sure how old he was. But the Vet's best estimate at that time was around 7. But he has other issues, cannot seem to tolerate ANY antibiotic (you may have read about him on some other threads), chronic constipation (thank God for Miralax...I cannot believe even missing one dose makes him have problems!), cannot take Pepcid AC, and unfortunately, seems to throw up froth at least once a day even though I try and try to keep small amounts of food in him at all times, and in general, just doesn't seem happy anymore. But that's a whole other story!

Snickerdoodle, anxious to hear the results from Boo's appt. You should be home by now...maybe you're typing as I am

Also, glad he's loving his new "tent"!

 

[mews2much]

That is the problem with Coco also.
She can only take Baytril or Doxy.
The other antibiotics make her sick.
She also takes Miralax.
Snicker
The bun is high but I think you are right it is from eating the other food.
My Coco only gets the kidney foods.
Good Luck at the vet tomorrow.

 

[otto]

Snickerdoodle, anxious to hear the results from Boo's appt. You should be home by now...maybe you're typing as I am Also, glad he's loving his new "tent"!

I think the appointment is tomorrow, Friday.

I too will be waiting anxiously for a report!

 

[mrsgreenjeens]

You mean it isn't Friday??? Bummer!

 

[snickerdoodle]

In one hour I will take him the 26 minute 15 mile ride to the new vet. I AM SO NERVOUS. I have taken my meds (I am ok to drive no worries) so hopefully my HR will go down and he will not notice. I have packaged up some Purina for him to put in his crate and a bowl of water for while we're at the vet's office. Hopefully he won't need either of them, but I felt so bad after taking him to Schmunk and waiting four hours, goodness knows how bad he has to pee (He never goes before we go somewhere!)

I would put litter in there, it is a large carrier (Too big for him really) but I am not sure if that will make him even more nervous, food, water, litter, what are you doing? Sending me away!?!?

..Anyway. He's doing pretty good today. Was purring like mad, almost grunting and drank some water from the tub. Got his fluids, ate his few pieces of treat but refused his Hi Tor. I need to open a new can. I am opening a new can nearly every day. Some days he will eat the fridged Neo microwaved for 9 seconds, some days he looks at me like I'm insane.

I only have 11 cans left. We are going through them too fast and wasting too much. I wish they made smaller cans or something.

Anyway, as soon as I get back and get him settled in I will update ASAP. I have money enough for the exam (Between 44-55 bucks) but I know she will want to do some sort of panel. Let's hope whatever it is it is cheap or she will let me open a small tab (Doubtful, but I can hope)


Thanks guys!!

 

[otto]

He really doesn't need all that in his carrier. I would just put a towel in the bottom and leave it at that. Bring the porta-potty and offer it to him in the consultation room after his exam.

I'll probably be gone before you get back but you ca be sure I'll be checking here as soon as I get home!

 

[snickerdoodle]

Okay Otto. I will ditch the other stuff. I will bring a smaller version of his litter box for after his exam. That is a good idea. What in the heck would I do without you guys.

<3 <3

 

[mews2much]

I hope everything went well.
I take my Coco when I go to cat shows and leave her at the hotel.
She threw up 3 times on the way home last weekend.
You do not need all those things when you go to the vet.
I just take a blanket.
Long car rides can make CRF cats throw up.
I hope you get good news.

 

[mrsgreenjeens]

I agree. The only thing I put in any of their carriers is either their blankets, or some of our dirty clothes, like our T-shirts, so (hopefully), they will be more content. Sometime I put in both (like for Sven, since he's bony and needs more cushioning!)

 

[snickerdoodle]

Well, good news and bad news, but I think mostly good. First of all, I love this new vet to death. She is awesome. She listens and she explains everything. I knew most of what she was talking about since doing my research. I am so exhausted so I may forget some things but will try to get everything.

She went off his previous electrolyte panel from last week and wanted to keep the stress to a minimum. She was concerned about his enlarged kidney on the right side and did an ultrasound, and then told me about how he has two round things in the bottom of that kidney. She believes they are stones. She gave me options about the stones, all out of my price range by several thousand dollars. Also, I would not want to put him through the stress of any surgeries. They keep the use of metacam to a minimum there and she was the first to mention only using isofluerene (SP, the gas sedative, anthesthesia stuff)
instead of Ketamine and Valium. She had no idea what Amforol was or Kanamyacin, and said she would research those. She was also very concerned about his dental and then separate tooth extraction that I was suspicious may have either brought the CRF out into the open or caused it, (or made it worse or whatever) She agreed it was suspiciously coincidental

She also felt of that "Extracted" tooth and said it felt like they had left part of the tooth in there. I am not happy about that, but he was beginning to get ill with the doctors so they concentrated on the big tasks at hand.
They stuck a needle in his bladder and got a urine sample. She is testing it for bacteria and will call me back in a couple days (Perhaps Monday or Tuesday) to tell me if he needs to be on antibiotics. Everything she said was exactly in line with Tanya's CRF site and this forum's members experiences. I was thrilled to be hearing what I had been reading for so long.

She wanted to take his blood pressure, which didn't go well when they took him away from me. I suggested bringing him back into the room with me and let me assist, he may act better, and he did much better. She said his blood pressure was 160 and she was surprised, she said that was very good considering the stress he was under and how far I had driven, etc.

She wants to do Epogen (sp) and said she will write me an RX and we can get it filled at a local pharmacy. It costs 50 dollars vial approx, but said it would last "awhile" I am not sure how long that is. But she said it would help him with his anemia, which she was most concerned with. 13% was very low and she did not like it at all.

The enlarged kidney, she also mentioned it could possibly be cancer. His whole kidney could be have cancer. She gave me the options there but understood my financial situation, and also that it would not be fair to put Boo through that after all he had gone through. We discussed his previous horrors at an ER clinic and his subsequent bladder surgery and p/u surgery. She was shocked to hear that happened and saddened. I really like her.

Boo did very well. They put him back in his carrier so we could talk and he started scratching like crazy. Stupid me, I said "Boo!" quietly, but firmly, and then realized, DUH, he is PEEING. I told her he would NOT pee for her in a cup and never pees at the vets. WEll, I was wrong. He peed on his rug in there and I took it out. Then he collapsed.

This was one of those episodes like he's done here after running up and down the steps. His feet slid out from under him and he just laid there breathing hard for about 1 minute until he came to. She was halfway in the carrier with him the entire time to observe, so at least she got to see it happen.

She wants to continue the 100mL a day. She could not help me correlate why he would be drinking so much water if he was on LRS and not saline solution. If he was on saline solution she would attribute more water drinking to the saline solution, but since he was on LRS, she has no idea why his water drinking has come down with the decrease in daily fluids. She said every cat is different and she couldn't personally say that what the previous vet said was wrong (She was trying very hard not to bad mouth my previous vet, they may not each other or something, I don't know, or just trying to generally be professional. Me, on the other hand, I had a hard time biting my tongue :T Sorry)

Basically we are maintaining. For some reason her scale said he weighed 6.4 pounds. My old vets scale said 7.6. I will have to buy a baby scale to get an average here because this was over a pound in difference and it bothered me terribly.

On the ride back home he laid in the carrier most of the way until we turned into the neighborhood. Somehow he knew he was home and stood up. He ate, drank, and rested in the window. I had to go back out to a friend's house to deliver some things and run my usual Friday errands.
When I got back about 4 or so I was all over him and took him outside for a bit. He enjoyed it. Unfortunately the new tomcat came up but was gentleman enough to stay off the porch. He is very starved for attention and I am sure he was a house cat not too long ago. He is very well kept. OT, sorry.

Boo came in, because I am so exhausted and couldn't stand the 84 degree heat outside, even though it was nice in the shade, but I was falling asleep and the mosquitoes were coming out. He grumbled quite loudly when he got a good look at the tom cat.

Then he came up stairs with me and I was sitting here int he computer chair, and wandering around my chair. So I picked him up and leaned back and put him on my chest. He never stays long. This time he stayed for nearly 45 minutes (It felt like forever, I was soooooooo sleepy and tired, it was so hard to keep stroking his head)
He actually dug his claws (kneading) into my chest and eventually laid his head down. This is a one in a million time thing he does. I was very pleased. He was purring. He seems content. He is drinking water now and is going back into his tent. I am getting ready to pass out since I have not slept since yesterday evening.

My mother surprisingly helped me pay half the bill, which the total was 90+ dollars (The paper is downstairs, I will post it on Boo's weebly site later tonight if I wake up, or in the morning)

He ate his wet food well when he got home and then again. I think I need to start offering him fresh wet every 4-6 hours. I had not thought of it.

She said his eyes look great, his blood vessels in his eyes are not enlarged, his ears look excellent and his bad breath is because of the toxins in his blood. She said he could have had this kidney issue since birth and it just slowly got worse, and then having him but under for procedures may have made it worse. Or it could have just gotten worse. I told her I was told by my vet when he was diagnosed with struvite crystals and put on C/D dry and wet (And told to keep the wet food to a minimum *rolls eyes*) that he could go the completely opposite way and develop STONES because the PH in his pee could go wonky. I never thought that happened, but as observant as I've been in the past, who freaking knows.

Anyway, right now he is doing well. He tolerated the ride well. He has not been vomiting. I am going to try to switch out pans and bring one up here so he will not go avoiding it. He was OK'd for as much cat nip as he wants, the Pet Tinic was OK'd for once a day and uummmm I forget what else. I'm sorry guys, my brain is sooo fried.

Thank you all. So very much.

 

[mews2much]

She sounds like a good vet to me.
The Epogen/Procrit is what I was suggesting to you.
That is what Stripe had for her anemia.
My Yoshi had stones in his kidneys and they killed him.
He had so many surgery was not a option and I even talked to U.C. Davis.I do not allow my cats to have Metacam it is known to cause kidney problems.
My cats get buprenex for pain.
My vet uses Iso also and I make sure before they have surgery.
Like your cat Coco had bladder infections and stones before she got CRF.
She also had a metacam shot not even a year before the CRF.

 

[otto]

Thank you so much for the detailed report! I'm SO GLAD you have found a new vet.

You and Boo rest and rest, you both deserve some rest and respite.

How's Chickster doing?

What about this tom? You mean he is an intact male that has been dumped? Do you feed him?

 

[snickerdoodle]

intact, that is the word I was looking for a couple days ago. Yes, this a new tom to go along with the other tom we have, who is also intact. This new one doesn't go around batting at the two ladies (Which I believe are spayed due to the matching crescents popped into their ears, which I think is a trap and spay/neuter program in a town nearby) and he knows the word "No". He is also very loving and likes to walk right in front of you, try to trip you, and rub on your legs. He stares and stares and stares at me, it freaks me out a bit, and he likes to leave his mouth open after a meow, and stands there looking exactly like this smilie:

Sometimes it is kind of spooky! I posted a link of him a few posts back, because my friend in the city nearby has a cat who looks nearly exactly like him, save that he has a HUGE head like a brick and great big thick jowls. This one MAY have been neutered and still has his little puffies back there, and compared to Rocku, his puffies aren't as big, but they are not small. But neither male has a hole in his ear. And this one is really groomed well. He seems like a house cat, unlike Rocky, who while he likes petting does not like being picked up or cuddled or messed with for long. HE just wants food. This one seems to be begging for love

I do feed him, just like the other 3 outside. Difference being between them and the new one, he was skinny. And he was hiding under a small plastic table mewing like crazy the second he saw me.

Like I said before, I can't stand to let anything starve. But he did not come up on the porch and he was "interested" in Boo, but Boo ignored him for the most part and the new one laid down away from the porch and rolled around trying to look cute.



I got him some wet food but he wanted a bit of tub water, now he is back in his tent and resting.

As for the stones, or possible cancer, I am not sure I want to treat him for this. (Maybe 60% I can't afford it and 40% it wouldn't be fair to Boo, I want to try everything, but I don't want to be unfair to boo) She offered buprenex at a low dose (Adjustable of course, so he is not out of it or anything) if he does seem to start having pain issues or problems jumping because I brought up the arthritis. She said the kidney may be making him slightly uncomfortable but she doubts he is in any real pain right now. He liked her I think. The Epogen, she made it sound afforadable and doable. My old vet made it sound like it was just a bad idea all around, and was reluctant to try it. He mentioned "blood transfusions" ... I don't know. Oh well, we have this new vet now! And she talked to me for nearly an hour and 45 minutes I think! It was pretty amazing!
Chickster is doing ok. She ran from him when we got home and hissed, which he is used to now, but I heard a noise when I woke up a few minutes ago to use the bathroom and it was this rattling sound. I looked down the steps and saw Chickster's tail, and I went down there to see Boo in the kitchen eating his Royal Canin Mature/Senior 27 dry

So Chickster was watching after him, she is laying outside of my bedroom door being a hallway monitor I think. She won't even come in and lay on my bed, she wants to keep an eye on him. I'd put their tents beside each other but I know she wouldn't lay in hers.

I brought a fresh pan up here and put a sheet of plastic under it. Hasn't been TOUCHED. I am not sure this is going to work :T

Anyway... you guys have a good night (Or morning, depending) I have had my 10 minutes awake and am going to pass back out. I will grab my paper to make sure I haven't missed anything in the morning. <3 <# <3

 

[mrsgreenjeens]

What did the new Vet say about Boo's episode in the carrier when he collapsed after peeing? Did she think it was because of his anemia?

Also, as far as the possible kidney stones go, I know nothing about them in cats, but in people, the way to get rid of them is with lots of fluids (along with pain killers while they are passing!) I'm guessing with cats it's different, since he's already on sub-qs, and was ppossibly getting too much fluids for awhile? It sounded like the options are all surgical? I probably wouldn't go that route either, not in his existing condition, anyway. But what did she advise, money not withstanding? Remember, don't be too proud to ask for assistance!

On a completely other subject...I have no idea how to tell if a male in intact! I have 3 neutered males currently, and one has a set of cajones that are unbelievable!! One is too furry to really see, even when he's got his back legs splayed open for belly rubs

, and the other is quite protective of his entire back end in total! Just wondering how you can tell right off. I know our Vet could tell instantly when "the boys" adopted us at age 6 months that they were already neutered, but I didn't ask him how he could tell, I was just thankful!!!!!

 

[snickerdoodle]

I guess, thinking about it harder, I can't tell if they are neutered! I know Boo has none whatsoever, along with his twinkie winkie, it's gone because of the P/U Surgery. Rocky has huge cajones and this new one has little fuzzballs of cajones, and (Forgive me, I was curious and this may sound reaaaaaaaaally weird) while Abra wasn't looking I poked one of them and there was something in there. So I don't think he is neutered. I used to think the size mattered, since they take the inside of the testes out, but I guess I was wrong! I can tell a girl from a boy, though, if they stand still! LOL

Or maybe I can't!

His anemia is what caused his collapse, but it wasn't from peeing, which of course upset him because he may have thought I would be mad at him and/or he was upset because he doesn't like to be near his or anyone else's waste like that. What brought on the collapse was his feverish scratching of the inside of the carrier. It wore him out. The vet said it was his anemia.

She didn't really advise me one way or the other, she just presented me with options. When I told her I did not think I wanted to put him through any sort of surgery or chemo or biopsy, she copied my face (Wrinkled nose, squinting, shaking my head) and she nodded and kind of understood. Money not withstanding, I still do not think I would do it. I hope that doesn't sound cruel. He's already not really acting like he used to. He's not acting miserable, but he's just not like his old self, you know? And to put him through all of that other stress, surgeries, whatever, I just think is too much. He's had a helluva rough life...

The kidney stones... Like I said, I was told by the other vet that putting him on C/D Dry would cease the struvite crystals. IT would also make him more thirsty, so he would pee more and keep the crystals from forming. But was also told it could go the other way and he could get stones. Why, I'm not sure. But he hasn't been on C/D for a few weeks now, just his Hi-Tor and the snacking of the purina. SO when I caught him in Chickster's bowl of Purina One I covered it with a layer of C/D. He has his own bowl of Royal Canin, but he only sometimes goes over there.

I am glad you brought up the neutering thing though. I guess I never really thought about it before. On the E-How site it says you can tell by feeling. If it feels hard like a marble, they are not neutered, and if it just feels like an empty fuzzy sack, they are neutered.

Um, that was the first time i've felt a cat's cajones, so I would say Abra is NOT neutered, course I only barely poked him and only for a split second (Didn't want to lose a hand, just in case)

Anyway.. I gotta go, stripping wallpaper off a bathroom, and Boo is resting. Pretty decent day so far. If it wasn't 88 degrees I'd let him sit in the sunroom in his window, but our A/C doesn't get out there.

When she calls me back I will be talking to her about the possible UTI and I will bring up the stones/biopsy and see if she'll give me her professional advice. She probably will not want to push me either way. I don't know. I will have to really think about it.

<3 Thank you all.

 

[mrsgreenjeens]

This new Vet sounds like a winner. I think if you just tell her you want Boo to have best qualify of life for whatever length of time that is, then ask her for the best options for that, she will tell you. (hope that sentence makes sense!!)

I compare it to if I were old and sick already, and then got cancer, I probably would NOT opt to have chemo, and be sick from that, just to prolong my life for a short while. I'd rather live less time, and not be sick from chemo. I'm speaking as MYSELF. (I'm also rattling on, I'm sure

)

 

[snickerdoodle]

No, I totally u nderstnd what you are saying. I am work now but on the way there was a wrong way driver, thankfully I was in the right lane and not the left, because I didn't even see him until he was nearly past me. I am having a rough night LOL All nerve wracked and everything

Just updating real quick that Boo was very active today. He left his "tent" (We call it) and came downstairs several times today, and was vocal. his itching seems to be lessening and I caught him sleeping deeply several times.

Anyway... gotta focus on work. I tell ya, headlights coming (nearly) at you will clarify things in your life right quick won't it!

 

[snickerdoodle]

Just wanted to let you guys know that Dr. Pierce called me. She said so far it doesn't look like he's got a UTI, she does that culture that takes a week. She said nothing has come up yet.

She really wants me to use th Epogen and I said I will totally do it, and she alsomentioned another med that is 150/month and I just cannot afford that. So we will do the epogen. His PCV will have to monitred for a coupl weeks afterwards but she said that will only be 18 dollars for the test and no exam charge (Thankfully!)

The big kicker? She looked up the Kanamyacin that was given to Boo in the Amforol liquid suspension..... she said she didn't want to say anything one way or another, but said I MUST get his med records from the old vet ASAP and she wants to see them. She said if I have ANY TROUBLE getting them to let her know and she will take care of it O.O I was like wow, what? I know in the state of NC, by law, the vet has to give me the copies of the med records. I am going to look through my receipts and see if I even have it on a receipt, so hopefully it will be on the records and not "disappeared".

In any case... I am very interested to hear what she has to say about the records and this kanamyacin.

She is a great vet I am loving her more everytime we talk!!!

Boo was insisted to go outside this morning but it felt like nearly 100 degrees in the heat this morning so we only stayed out for awhile. I had a really rough night and was struggling to stay away, but he got a good 15 mnutes, and IMHO I think that was enough, it was too hot and not enough shade. He sat in his window, I made a pallet beside of him, and he started banging on the door with his paw going MEW MEW MEW!!! I said Boo, too hot, we're not going outside right now. He went upstairs. I passed out on the floor. I woke up 30 minutes ago or so, dazed and confused. He's doing well today. Still more active than usual.


<3 Thanks guys

 

[mews2much]

I am glad you have a good vet now.
Can you find out what med is $150 a month.
I may know a place that has it cheaper online.
Sounds like that vet may have made Boo sick.
I have friends in N.C. and the vet has to give you his records.

 

[otto]

Thanks for keeping us updated. I'm so happy for you that you have found this vet. The vet does have to provide you with a copy of Booboo's records, but they can legally charge you a processing or copy fee, I think.

Many vets are all computerized now, is that the case at the old vet? In that case you will probably get a dvd disc.

to you Booboo and Chickster from me Tolly Mazy and Jennie