6 year old Morty isn't doing so well

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🤦‍♂️

I think this morning's pop not withstanding, you've got this. Just keep doing what you're doing and avoid the carrageenan and agar agar.
 
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Morty Update:

*WARNING: VOMIT PICTURE BELOW*


So I'm really frustrated. We kept Morty on an all chicken diet for as long as we could, but he's decided that he's had enough of that protein. So much so that he's even started ignoring his temptations antibiotic mush. I started giving him cooked duck. I used the recipe from felinenutrition and used duck heart, liver and muscle. I cooked it up and put it into my food processor with the alnutrin and fish oil. Morty and Po really enjoyed it! I did notice though that the first time I gave it to Morty he appeared to...maybe be in pain? I might be jumping to conclusions but he stopped eating a little suddenly after inhaling the food and then went to the cat tree and layed there in a ball with his eyes open. He didn't throw up, and after about an hour he seemed normal again.

Because he hasn't thrown up since the carrageenan incident I decided to try again with turkey. I really wanted to wait until he was done with his antibiotic but he's had enough of chicken. He basically just sniffs it and lets it sit out until he's hungry enough to eat a small amount. He's been eating the turkey for the past two days and today I noticed a little bit of asthmatic symptoms. It's too soon for me to know whether or not this is circumstantial though.

Tonight I gave him cooked duck again. He loved it. Later when going back for more I noticed he got that look on his face again. He got a little stiff and seemed uncomfortable. A minute later he threw up. I have a few things to say about this vomit. 1) He already had his antibiotic so it may have contributed. 2) Just like the last time it was just one watery pile. This is not normal for him. Almost every time he vomits it is in three piles. 3) He had an appetite again in about 20 minutes and went back for some chicken I put out for him. He didn't throw up afterword.

I included a picture below of his puke just to show what it looked like. Normally it's less watery and in 3-4 different piles, each containing less food, with the last just being bile.

He's also been getting more diarrhea. I know it's from the antibiotic, so in his cooked duck I included some collagen and S. Boulardii that I added after cooking with the alnutrin.

So basically, I have no idea why he's throwing up...which is pretty much the same thing as before he went into the vet. It could be the antibiotic, the turkey, the duck (although I'm doubtful of this), or something completely different. I'm just frustrated. In the past couple days that he's been eating turkey I have noticed a bit more scratching and sneezing along with the asthmatic symptoms, so I'm going to take the turkey out of the equation and leave the duck. I wish we could just stick to chicken, but he won't let me do that. Anyway below is a picture of his most recent puke as well as him experiencing some asthmatic symptoms. It's hard to see, but his mouth is slightly open while he's breathing.

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Morty Update:

Another day and more vomit. Looks like last night he chose to do it on the window sill. Again, it was just one, watery pile. One of the main side effects of Orbax is vomiting so I'm going to blame that for now so I don't pull my hair out trying to find another reason. Since stopping the turkey again the asthmatic symptoms have drastically decreased. I can say for sure now that there is a correlation with turkey, which I guess shouldn't be surprising since it was a turkey treat that sent him to the vet to begin with. I'm going to eliminate all turkey from now on and not reintroduce it. I still don't know with the peas, but it's a lot easier to just avoid foods that have peas.
 

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Check with your vet, but my vet had me giving a cat of mine who was sick and on a lot of meds 1/2 of a regular Pepcid AC to fight nausea. Her explanation was that they get into a cycle of vomiting and if you can keep the nausea under control with the Pepcid you can stop the cycle. I used a pill splitter and it was small enough i could hide it in a small bite of cheese or something she liked.
 
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Check with your vet, but my vet had me giving a cat of mine who was sick and on a lot of meds 1/2 of a regular Pepcid AC to fight nausea. Her explanation was that they get into a cycle of vomiting and if you can keep the nausea under control with the Pepcid you can stop the cycle. I used a pill splitter and it was small enough i could hide it in a small bite of cheese or something she liked.
That's interesting. When Morty first developed food allergies my vet told me to give him pepcid to help with acid buildup but it didn't seem to do much for him. I still have the bottle though so we can see if it helps with his meds.
 

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Pepcid did little for Krista except to Pavlov her to the microwave beep. It had to be given 30 minutes before food. I would use the microwave timer. When it went off, Krista would come running to the kitchen knowing that I could finally feed her. Although she only took Pepcid for maybe a few weeks, she would come running to the kitchen if the microwave timer ran down for the rest of her life (another two, almost three years.) When I used the microwave myself, I would make sure I stopped it before it ran down to zero if I didn’t want Krista running in and begging for food.

Did it help her? No. She was still vomiting weekly because of nonsense foods like Instinct with their clay and cranberries. And forbidden proteins including chicken and salmon—the two she was eating the most during the worst of it e.g. what her body learned as triggers like a learned allergy. 🤦🏼‍♂️😿

If he’s back to eating a more or less normal amount, I wouldn’t add another drug. If you suspect an acid control issue, feeding him smaller meals more often works better than reducing the acid in his stomach that’s essential for digestion. In my experience with Krista, her acid barfs (too much stomach acid) came before meals and were small, white, and foamy. I think Morty’s barfs are a reaction to what he ate vs what he hasn’t eaten yet (how and why Pepcid is usually prescribed.) But perhaps more likely a reaction to the antibiotic.

How much longer with the Orbax? You could ask your vet about going back on Cerenia for the remainder of the Orbax. Or at least try it out for a few days to make sure the Cerenia doesn’t kill his appetite. It’s such frustrating balancing act sometimes. 🤷🏼‍♂️🤦🏼‍♂️

And the fact that they can’t or won’t talk and tell us what’s wrong makes it that much harder! 😾
 

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How often is he getting the Orbax? You could try splitting his medicine meals. Give it with half the food. Let him get through that that and keep it down. When he no longer looks like this (or when he pesters you for more), you can feed the other half portion.
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Usually three to four hours. But he may get through it faster than Krista and be ready for round two in a couple hours. 🤦🏼‍♂️😹
 
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Pepcid did little for Krista except to Pavlov her to the microwave beep. It had to be given 30 minutes before food. I would use the microwave timer. When it went off, Krista would come running to the kitchen knowing that I could finally feed her. Although she only took Pepcid for maybe a few weeks, she would come running to the kitchen if the microwave timer ran down for the rest of her life (another two, almost three years.) When I used the microwave myself, I would make sure I stopped it before it ran down to zero if I didn’t want Krista running in and begging for food.

Did it help her? No. She was still vomiting weekly because of nonsense foods like Instinct with their clay and cranberries. And forbidden proteins including chicken and salmon—the two she was eating the most during the worst of it e.g. what her body learned as triggers like a learned allergy. 🤦🏼‍♂️😿

If he’s back to eating a more or less normal amount, I wouldn’t add another drug. If you suspect an acid control issue, feeding him smaller meals more often works better than reducing the acid in his stomach that’s essential for digestion. In my experience with Krista, her acid barfs (too much stomach acid) came before meals and were small, white, and foamy. I think Morty’s barfs are a reaction to what he ate vs what he hasn’t eaten yet (how and why Pepcid is usually prescribed.) But perhaps more likely a reaction to the antibiotic.

How much longer with the Orbax? You could ask your vet about going back on Cerenia for the remainder of the Orbax. Or at least try it out for a few days to make sure the Cerenia doesn’t kill his appetite. It’s such frustrating balancing act sometimes. 🤷🏼‍♂️🤦🏼‍♂️

And the fact that they can’t or won’t talk and tell us what’s wrong makes it that much harder! 😾
Hah! Don't forget the peas. I've read on their website their reasoning for adding the clay and they give this whole "it's beneficial for cats" nonsense.

When my old vet told me to give him the Pepcid, it was via crushing it up and mixing it in his food. He wasn't a fan. She mainly prescribed it because I mentioned sometimes he would throw up only bile/foam in the mornings. I haven't noticed that in a long time so I don't suspect it's an acid problem, plus it didn't seem to change anything to begin with. I just hate staring at the bottle (also by my microwave) and remembering how expensive it was. He is basically free fed all day at this point, so he gives himself as many small meals as he likes. It's not ideal for me, especially as Po is continually gaining weight, but if I take the food away now Morty won't eat very much. I wish there was a way to permanently give him the appetite stimulant without any major side effects. It worked so well, but the prescription said it can only be given for two weeks so I assume that's for a good reason.

The Orbax is supposed to be another couple of weeks. She said to "finish the bottle" and that there was enough. I don't think math is her best subject though because it's almost empty. It was a 20ml bottle with instructions of 1ml daily. He maybe has a few more days left. I've made my own decision not to give him more once the bottle is up. I can tell it's causing him pain and he's back to watery stools.

He's eating normally for him. This would mean give or take one 5.5 oz can a day, which I know isn't nearly enough for him, but he somehow always manages to maintain his weight. He has been enjoying the cooked duck meals I've made him so that's a great way to get in a lot of extra calories in a smaller quantity of food. I can't lie, I've come close to vomiting from the smell of cooking duck/liver/heart in my kitchen though. It's terrible.

I will try breaking up his remaining doses to twice daily and see if it helps. The fact that each time it's only been one watery/food pile is so unusual for him, it really makes me think this has to be it.
 
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How often is he getting the Orbax? You could try splitting his medicine meals. Give it with half the food. Let him get through that that and keep it down. When he no longer looks like this (or when he pesters you for more), you can feed the other half portion.
View attachment 370872
Usually three to four hours. But he may get through it faster than Krista and be ready for round two in a couple hours. 🤦🏼‍♂️😹
That is exactly how he looks!!!
 

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Hah! Don't forget the peas. I've read on their website their reasoning for adding the clay and they give this whole "it's beneficial for cats" nonsense.

When my old vet told me to give him the Pepcid, it was via crushing it up and mixing it in his food. He wasn't a fan. She mainly prescribed it because I mentioned sometimes he would throw up only bile/foam in the mornings. I haven't noticed that in a long time so I don't suspect it's an acid problem, plus it didn't seem to change anything to begin with. I just hate staring at the bottle (also by my microwave) and remembering how expensive it was. He is basically free fed all day at this point, so he gives himself as many small meals as he likes. It's not ideal for me, especially as Po is continually gaining weight, but if I take the food away now Morty won't eat very much. I wish there was a way to permanently give him the appetite stimulant without any major side effects. It worked so well, but the prescription said it can only be given for two weeks so I assume that's for a good reason.

The Orbax is supposed to be another couple of weeks. She said to "finish the bottle" and that there was enough. I don't think math is her best subject though because it's almost empty. It was a 20ml bottle with instructions of 1ml daily. He maybe has a few more days left. I've made my own decision not to give him more once the bottle is up. I can tell it's causing him pain and he's back to watery stools.

He's eating normally for him. This would mean give or take one 5.5 oz can a day, which I know isn't nearly enough for him, but he somehow always manages to maintain his weight. He has been enjoying the cooked duck meals I've made him so that's a great way to get in a lot of extra calories in a smaller quantity of food. I can't lie, I've come close to vomiting from the smell of cooking duck/liver/heart in my kitchen though. It's terrible.

I will try breaking up his remaining doses to twice daily and see if it helps. The fact that each time it's only been one watery/food pile is so unusual for him, it really makes me think this has to be it.
I don‘t know that I would break up his dose to twice daily. Then he has to go through that twice a day. Instead, if he gets half a can for breakfast with the orbax, give the orbax with 1/4 can, let him scrunch it out for a few hours and then give him the other quarter can.
 

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I tried to read through everything here but may have missed something. Have you tried a food sensitivities test? It helped us pinpoint gastro problems. If he’s having trouble with duck and turkey is it possible he would do better on a diet not involving poultry at all? Cats like humans have such strange gastro issues, we need a feline Dr House.

I’m thinking something like the hound and gatos beef or rabbit, they use agar agar not sure if you are ok with that. But it’s a good food overall.
 

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You can give Mirtaz longer than two weeks. Ask your regular vet about this. I have heard of kidney cats or IBD cats being on Mirtaz for years. But it’s also an antidepressant with appetite stimulation as a side effect. For that reason, I wonder what it really does to cats and whether there is a dependency or lasting reliance on it. So, for now at least, I’d rather he didn’t need to rely on appetite stimulants. Hopefully the Orbax runs out sooner than later and everything will go back to “normal” again.

You can get a SureFeed microchip feeder to keep Po out of Morty’s food bowl. They’re not cheap. But then neither is vet care if Po gets too fat.
 
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I don‘t know that I would break up his dose to twice daily. Then he has to go through that twice a day. Instead, if he gets half a can for breakfast with the orbax, give the orbax with 1/4 can, let him scrunch it out for a few hours and then give him the other quarter can.
Okay I think I understand. I'm not sure that would work. He only eats it with the Temptations treats and will not touch it with his food. He also needs to have a good amount of food in his stomach to begin with or it gets super painful, like when he stuck out his tongue. Theoretically I could try adding the Temptation Treat mixture on top of the food, but I fear he might only pick out the treat mixture and not have enough food in his belly to handle it.
 
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You can give Mirtaz longer than two weeks. Ask your regular vet about this. I have heard of kidney cats or IBD cats being on Mirtaz for years. But it’s also an antidepressant with appetite stimulation as a side effect. For that reason, I wonder what it really does to cats and whether there is a dependency or lasting reliance on it. So, for now at least, I’d rather he didn’t need to rely on appetite stimulants. Hopefully the Orbax runs out sooner than later and everything will go back to “normal” again.

You can get a SureFeed microchip feeder to keep Po out of Morty’s food bowl. They’re not cheap. But then neither is vet care if Po gets too fat.
That's good to know!

I've looked into those feeders and I know Morty will be afraid of them. Anything that moves will probably scare him. It would work the other way around to keep Morty out of Po's food...but that wouldn't be helping anyone hah. I'm just going to try and keep them separated for longer periods of time. Eventually when we can go back to raw we can get back to a feeding schedule and this won't be so much of an issue because they finish their portions pretty quickly.
 

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That's good to know!

I've looked into those feeders and I know Morty will be afraid of them. Anything that moves will probably scare him. It would work the other way around to keep Morty out of Po's food...but that wouldn't be helping anyone hah. I'm just going to try and keep them separated for longer periods of time. Eventually when we can go back to raw we can get back to a feeding schedule and this won't be so much of an issue because they finish their portions pretty quickly.
I have three of those feeders and in order to keep the other cats out I had to buy the additional back shields (not included!) but they do work and it was easy for the cats to get used to them.

I will say the company does not recommend them if you feed raw or freeze dried raw because it’s a pain to clean around the non bowl area well and bacteria may be missed. So if I fed raw or freeze dried I would not use these
 
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I tried to read through everything here but may have missed something. Have you tried a food sensitivities test? It helped us pinpoint gastro problems. If he’s having trouble with duck and turkey is it possible he would do better on a diet not involving poultry at all? Cats like humans have such strange gastro issues, we need a feline Dr House.

I’m thinking something like the hound and gatos beef or rabbit, they use agar agar not sure if you are ok with that. But it’s a good food overall.
The only reason I haven't done that test is because I've read they're not very effective. TBH if I knew they were I'd go and get it done tomorrow.

You are right that poultry allergies can come in pairs/multiples with some cats, however he doesn't have a chicken allergy. It's possible that he may be reacting to duck but it's really too soon to tell. I will definitely keep an eye on it though and see if his scratching/sneezing starts up again. Both times have seemed to come from the turkey, and the vomiting isn't his usual allergy vomit so I think it's the medication.

Hound and Gatos use fish/salmon oil pretty high up on their ingredient list. I have no way of knowing if its pharmaceutical grade so I've avoided them for that reason.
 

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The only reason I haven't done that test is because I've read they're not very effective. TBH if I knew they were I'd go and get it done tomorrow.

You are right that poultry allergies can come in pairs/multiples with some cats, however he doesn't have a chicken allergy. It's possible that he may be reacting to duck but it's really too soon to tell. I will definitely keep an eye on it though and see if his scratching/sneezing starts up again. Both times have seemed to come from the turkey, and the vomiting isn't his usual allergy vomit so I think it's the medication.

Hound and Gatos use fish/salmon oil pretty high up on their ingredient list. I have no way of knowing if its pharmaceutical grade so I've avoided them for that reason.
Yeah they do have the fish oil, some people are put off by that. I know they are responsive so you could write them and try.

honestly I did my own research for months charting everything before doing the sensitivities test and all the info matched up so for me it was worth it and I found the report helpful

I used to feed my old cat hound and gatos with no issues when she couldn’t handle anything else. I know how hard it is chasing down what makes them sick.

Also since allergies and sensitivities are different he could have a sensitivities to the turkey but not an allergic reaction etc
 
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Yeah they do have the fish oil, some people are put off by that. I know they are responsive so you could write them and try.

honestly I did my own research for months charting everything before doing the sensitivities test and all the info matched up so for me it was worth it and I found the report helpful

I used to feed my old cat hound and gatos with no issues when she couldn’t handle anything else. I know how hard it is chasing down what makes them sick.

Also since allergies and sensitivities are different he could have a sensitivities to the turkey but not an allergic reaction etc
That's a good idea. I've been looking at their pork pate because Morty loves pork and it's 98% pork, but it has agar agar as well. I don't know if he has a reaction to agar agar (yet) but I feel like it's best to avoid it just in case. I'm doing the same with peas right now. I feel like it's easier to just avoid some things than doing all these food trials, especially when it can take up to 3 months for symptoms to subside.

Yeah he could have an allergy or a sensitivity, or maybe he has no problems with turkey and it's all in my head. At this point it's pretty early to tell. The only thing I know for sure is that fish will make him vomit every time. This allergy grew from mild scratching etc, to occasional vomiting, to vomiting every time. I get the feeling if there is a turkey issue, it's in an earlier stage. It was also a turkey treat that sent him to the emergency vet, so I'm also keeping that in mind as well.
 
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