Younger Cat Bullies Older Cat

[whattheduck07]

I'm not even sure how to approach asking this question so I'll just jump into the background. This revolves around my 5 year old calico Kimi. Kimi has a huge personality, and has a bit of an attitude. I'd say it's probably because of the calico personality, but perhaps she's just being a moody kitty.

Anyways, she's been acting out for about two years now, and it really started after my husband and I moved in to our new apartment. I have a second cat, Syra, who is a black and white domestic short hair and is a year older than Kimi. Unfortunately for Syra, Kimi has grown quite randomly aggressive towards her and it's a really sad sight. Syra could just be walking to the other side of the room, minding her own business when Kimi will lunge at her, hiss, spit and swat at her. About 70% of the time, Kimi and Syra can peacefully co-exist, but we've found random scratches on Syra's nose which we can only assume comes from Kimi.

We've noticed it's gets VERY bad after we separate them for any period of time, which usually means we've taken one cat to the vet and the other stayed home. For example, this morning we took Syra to the vet because we noticed she had a bald spot on her leg and was biting and licking there more than normal. They determined it wasn't ring worm and was either bacterial or stress related. When we brought her home, Syra went straight to the bedroom, where she was greeted immediately by hisses from Kimi.

This continued throughout the day, with Kimi sometimes randomly attacking Syra and not letting her walk to the other side of the apartment. My husband and I figured that perhaps Kimi can smell the vet scent on Syra, and it makes her upset. Kimi hates the vet, always gets very scared and aggressive... to the point where sometimes they can't even sedate her to do treatment and they just leave her in her carrier, scared and upset for the entire visit.

This situation is really, really sad because we see that Syra wants to be friendly with Kimi. She tries to groom her, tries to share her toys and favorite sunspots, but Kimi just won't return the kindness. Sometimes, Kimi will let Syra begin to groom her, and then she lashes out and Syra scrunches back, ears flat and runs off. Any advice you have on how to make one not so nice kitty like a the most sweet and adorable kitty ever would be appreciated.

 

[p3 and the king]

OK well this is a long term problem so I am not sure anything can really help.  Has Kimi been to a behavior specialist and ruled out anxiety or chemical imbalances? It could be that she is an alpha personality.  Syra from what I read, hasn't made herself prey but if she does run, cower, or submit to Kimi, this is exactly what she is.  You can try a reintroduction.  For information on how to do this, look up Jackson Galaxy and watch his videos on cat reintroductions.   First of all, do not expect too much or a complete personality change that won't happen.  Like I said, being a long term problem, it may not help at all or only help them tolerate eachother by ignoring one another which is better than Syra being attacked.  Good luck!

 

[whattheduck07]

She has not but we have discussed the possibility. She also pee's outside the litter box (I recently posted about that as well), so we hope to take her to a vet that also has a behaviorist to not only figure out if her grumpiness is because of her being sick, but afterwards what we can do to keep her from being mean to our other cat.

I think our biggest concern is that we hope to move to a new home soon (by soon I mean by next summer), and we just don't want the stress of that move to make things work for Kimi or Syra. Both cats seem extremely stressed out right now, and we aren't sure why. It's definitely tough to see our furbabies so bent out of shape, especially knowing that one of them is the cause of the stress.

After we take Kimi to the vet to rule out any medical problems, we plan on trying to implement more play time and possibly trying to get her to walk on a leash. We've been watching My Cat From Hell to try and find bits of info that might help us tame the beast that is Kimi and we've noticed he really enforces the walking outside. The only thing is we don't feel Kimi's behavior is nearly as bad as those on his show, we just are scared going in to a move sometime soon that it'll make the problem worse (both the aggression and the peeing outside the litter box).

 

[p3 and the king]

 
She has not but we have discussed the possibility. She also pee's outside the litter box (I recently posted about that as well), so we hope to take her to a vet that also has a behaviorist to not only figure out if her grumpiness is because of her being sick, but afterwards what we can do to keep her from being mean to our other cat.

I think our biggest concern is that we hope to move to a new home soon (by soon I mean by next summer), and we just don't want the stress of that move to make things work for Kimi or Syra. Both cats seem extremely stressed out right now, and we aren't sure why. It's definitely tough to see our furbabies so bent out of shape, especially knowing that one of them is the cause of the stress.

After we take Kimi to the vet to rule out any medical problems, we plan on trying to implement more play time and possibly trying to get her to walk on a leash. We've been watching My Cat From Hell to try and find bits of info that might help us tame the beast that is Kimi and we've noticed he really enforces the walking outside. The only thing is we don't feel Kimi's behavior is nearly as bad as those on his show, we just are scared going in to a move sometime soon that it'll make the problem worse (both the aggression and the peeing outside the litter box).

OK, well a behavior specialist is a good idea, especially if she has other issues.  However, I am going into this field and I would like to say upfront that it is not a quick fix.  It's not an exact science.  And it is very abstract so it can take awhile for you to start seeing progress with anything the behaviorist suggest.

Another thing is, cats as a general rule DO NOT LIKE CHANGE.  It stresses them out big time.  This could be why she is peeing outside the box.  I'm not saying its the cause for certain.  But if you've been packing or getting ready to move, she knows something is up.   Not only that, cats are very sensitive and intuitive about us and our stress and she could be picking up on that.  You need to rule out medical causes first but then, see a behavior specialist.  And I would do the reintroduction after the move.  Why?  It's neutral territory and a good time to start over.  This would increase chances of success.  Besides, you'll just have to do it all over again after the move.  Jackson Galaxy has very good ideas.  And like he always stresses, it's work.  And you have to stay on it and be consistent if you want to see improvements.  Again, just do not expect miracles or unrealistic goals.  Any improvement is better than none.

 

[whattheduck07]

Exactly. We know it's not going to be an overnight thing, we just hate seeing Syra try so hard and Kimi just shut her down. We know whenever Kimi gets stressed, like when we take her to the vet, she pees. I've actually stopped taking her in my car because I don' want her peeing in it. It's brand new and I just don't want to risk her peeing on the way to the vet. So we have a sneaking feeling that she's stressed by our other cat (who was there first, mind you), because they were never properly introduced and thus is peeing every where and being aggressive.

Once we move we can try the reintroduction, but I guess we'll just have to tough out her aggressive moments towards Syra until then. We are motivated to try just about anything with the cats, we just need to know where to start.

 

[p3 and the king]

Get medical issues ruled out first and then look for a behavior specialist.  In the meantime, to help with stress of moving and everything, try Comfort Zone diffusers through the house.

 

[shadowsrescue]

Vet visits are often big stressers not only for the cat who went to the vet, but for the cat who stayed home and then smells the cat when it returns from the vet.  The cat who went to the vet comes home smelling awful.  This drives some cats crazy.  They smell other animals as well as chemicals from shots or medication.  I have read that before you leave for the vet rub down each cat with a separate small towel.  Before you let the cat out of the carrier from the vet, rub him/her down with the towel that has the scent from the other cat.  You can also try taking a cotton ball and putting some vanilla extract on it.  Place a small dab between each of their shoulder blades.  This will help them to smell similar. 

You definitely want to get Kimi to the vet for a check up on the urinary issues. Syra could be picking up on an illness and that stresses her out. 

Feliway or Comfort Zone diffusers can also help.  I also really like Composure.  It comes in treat formula or liquid.  I prefer the liquid as not all cats like the treats.  You can put it directly into the wet food.  It helps to calm the cats and make them less aggitated.  You can find it on amazon.  I like the Liquid Composure Max.  Here is a link telling of the product http://www.vetriscience.com/index.php?l=product_detail&p=900860008

 

[southern belle]

In my experience, some cats are just more accepting of domestication than others.  Dogs seem to play just for fun but cats play to practice their hunting skills.  They are all still feral hunters at heart and only tolerate our need to domesticate them.  So I wonder if Kimi is pouncing on Syra simply because she looks like 'moving prey'?  Could Kimi just need more mental and physical stimulation than Syra?

I have a younger indoor cat (Java, a former feral) that wouldn't leave a little older indoor/outdoor, neighborhood cat (Tom) alone when he came inside.  I just assumed that Java was a hyperactive cat (slept little; always on the hunt) and Tom was just a laid back couch potato.  However, we started taking Java outside each evening on his leash and harness this spring.  He runs, climbs trees, eats grass, and hunts and pounces on frogs and bugs. Then, we setup an outdoors to indoor tent and tunnel so he can sit outside whenever he wants and a bird feeder just outside a big window.  He spends hours each day in his tent just sitting outside watching, listening and smelling or you'll find him in the window chattering at the birds or squirrels. 

Wow, what a change!  Tom is now primarily the one who initiates their chasing and wrestling matches.  Most times, Java just walks away or flops down showing that he's not interested.  Before all the outdoors stimulation, my three or more 30 minutes+ daily play sessions were never enough.  Now, it's a challenge to even get Java out of his bed.  And if I play with Tom with a string-type toy, Java just watches and doesn't join in.

So after the vet check and stress reducers, you might want to start the leash training and also give Kimi more intense play sessions.  She might just be more of a hunter who needs a lot more mental and physical stimulation than Syra.