Vet's Best Hairball Relief - Interesting observation

[monkeymom]

Huh, I've tried giving VB on an empty stomach before, and Sophie did not look very comfortable afterwards and didn't want to eat later. Maybe it was too hard on her stomach? Same thing if I increase the dosage too much.She does fine with 1/2-3/4 tab mixed into her food daily. If Tux starts with the hairball hack, I immediately crush an extra half tablet and make it into a paste mixed with a freeze dried treat. Same thing if I see a hairball, which is rare. VB + egg yolk has virtually eliminated the problem though, thank goodness! I also use a spoon the crush the tablets.

 

[peaches08]

 
Huh, I've tried giving VB on an empty stomach before, and Sophie did not look very comfortable afterwards and didn't want to eat later. Maybe it was too hard on her stomach? Same thing if I increase the dosage too much.She does fine with 1/2-3/4 tab mixed into her food daily. If Tux starts with the hairball hack, I immediately crush an extra half tablet and make it into a paste mixed with a freeze dried treat. Same thing if I see a hairball, which is rare. VB + egg yolk has virtually eliminated the problem though, thank goodness! I also use a spoon the crush the tablets.

My first thought is to try increasing water in her food.  I say that because psyllium can cause an obstruction in some people if not taken with enough water, so it would stand to reason that it might in cats as well.  It would be better if kitty would drink water with her pill, but I know how far you'd get if you pointed your finger at the water fountain or water bowl and said "drink" to the cat. 

I'm giving the tabs 30 min to an hour before feeding, which gives is a chance to work but the extra water I add to the food may help prevent discomfort that psyllium can cause.  I just started the different schedule yesterday, so we'll see how it goes!

 

[abbyntim]

I have similar thoughts as peaches08 regarding psyllium and water. I've been giving my cat a bit of psyllium for the past couple of months and I always mix it with a lot of water, then mix with a little food. I am not paying real close attention to timing before or after meals, but I do stretch the cats' morning and evening feedings over a period of 60-120 minutes, and I give the psyllium with either the first plate or last plate of food. Now that I am giving my male cat a blend that mimics the active ingredients of Vet's Best, I still mix with a lot of water. (This may be TMI, but I had a very uncomfortable couple of days once after consuming a very high fiber smoothie without drinking enough water within 30 minutes as the instructions indicated and I don't want to cause similar discomfort in my cats).

 

[ldg]

It's Monday morning. We had no hairballs Saturday and Sunday I changed the schedule to give the VB on an empty tummy. We're on day 3 of no hairballs, no puke, no bile. Knock wood.

As hairballs are now thought to be the result of impaired motility, and inflammation may have a role in that, I put all of them (other than Spooky) on standardized curcumin with peperine. If there are no more hairballs, I know we won't know if it was the VB or the anti-inflammation. But I just wanted the vomiting to stop, poor babies. :heart2:

Shel has his annual scheduled Thursday to coincide with Spooky's ultrasound. I'll bring Lazlo along, and both boys will get their bellies shaved if it can be done without anesthetic. That would leave only Tuxie.

...but letting them nibble grass does seem to have stopped the pica issues. :cross:

 

[myrnafaye]

Tell us about curcurmin with peperine?

 

[monkeymom]

@peaches08  I suspect it was the fiber as well. I now add additional water into their food to help offset VB, and when I give extra tablets I crush, add water and make a paste with freeze dried treats. BMs seem normal for both cats at the current dose, and I never see them straining.

I'm also curious about the curcumin and peperine. I've heard of curcumin having anti inflammatory and possible radioprotective effects, but have never seen it used in cats.

 

[ldg]

I learned about it (curcumin with something included to make it more bioavailable) because of my FIV+ boy, Chumley. The discussion is as it relates to FIV, but... http://www.fivtherapy.com/curcumin.htm

I have another kitty with arthritis in her hips, but she also has high blood pressure and a grade 2/3 heart murmur. So I researched arthritis treatments that aren't contraindicated for her BP and heart issues. I settled on an omega 3 supplement, Krill oil. HUGE, huge benefit. Clearly works very well as an anti-inflammatory. In that research, I came across turmeric - curcumin a number of times. There's actually some research done on it in people, for asthma and rheumatoid arthritis, maybe osteoarthritis as well. As the krill was working so well, I just "filed" the information.

Well, Flowerbelle had strange symptoms (a "weird" purr :lol3: ). It took a year of vet visits and diagnostics that walked us up all the way to an MRI. And in the end, we wound back up right where we started: she has asthma. So I asked my vet to look up the dose for cats. Her information basically concurred with the information on the FIVtherapy site. And I started Flowerbelle on 90mg of a standardized curcumin supplement. This one:
I used mini measuring spoons, the smallest scoop, to measure how much powder is in one capsule (answer: 16 of the 1/64 teaspoon. :lol3: ). Each capsule is 500mg, so each 1/64th teaspoon is ~31mg. So I started adding 1/64th teaspoon to each meal (she eats three meals a day).

And within two "doses," her weird purr - her asthma attacks - stopped. And the way we knew it was asthma was that it got worse over the year of diagnostics and vet visits. So even though the asthma pattern couldn't be seen on x-ray, by the end, she was *clearly* having trouble breathing. Whenever she'd get excited - like before a meal - she'd have an asthma attack, and have to go lie down and relax for about 10 minutes before she could eat. That completely, 100% stopped.

So now I dig into curcumin research. And it has a lot of indications: pancreatitis (though supposedly contra-indicated when there's a known bile obstruction - IDK. I get salivary gland blockages (PAINFUL!), and the way to manage those is eat/drink/suck sour stuff that stimulates production to help push through the blockage. Anyway... ), IBD, asthma, arthritis, cancer..... And I know, for sure, from Flowerbelle's experience that it is, indeed, a powerful anti-inflammatory.

My four cats with hairball issues are older. Who knows what they've been exposed to or are exposed to that could cause inflammation. I don't feed grass-fed / pastured meats, so they're still getting who-knows-what from the diet, even though it is homemade raw. I'm not starting Spooky on the curcumin because we may need to do a biopsy on her intestines (we'll find out Thursday), and reducing inflammation can interfere with results. So I've held off on giving it to her.

So there's the background, my experience, and the theory.

 

[ldg]

I put up a thread in the health forum with information and links: http://www.thecatsite.com/t/282828/curcumin-in-treatment-of-ibd

 

[harrylime]

does anyone use this just for constipation and not necessarily for hairballs?

 

[abbyntim]

When my cat was first put on cisapride for constipation and I was transitioning him from kibble to canned, the pet supply store where I shop told me about this product and said many of their customers use it for constipation.

 

[tdonline]

I'm giving up on VBH.  They retch after ingesting it.  The point is stop the retching of hairballs.  If VBH is making them vomit...I'm just adding another way to making them violently upchuck.

 

[ldg]

Yes, of course. If the ingredients don't agree with them, don't use it!

 

[blueyedgirl5946]

I took my bottle of this to the vet visit for Mattie yesterday. He is not familiar with the slippery elm ingredient. But he told me if I am not seeing hairballs, don't give her anything. She sheds to much, I was concerned about the possibility and was trying to use this as a preventive. So I want to ask does anyone else treat their cat with meds if they don't see hairballs.

 

[ldg]

I treat preventatively for hairballs.

If a cat is on medicine, the Vet's Best, like any fiber, will slow down digestion and affect medicine metabolism, so it should be given at least 2 hours apart from meds.

Here is information on slippery elm bark powder. I personally would not expect most traditional vets to be familiar with any herbal ingredients.

http://www.littlebigcat.com/health/slippery-elm/

 

[ldg]

peaches08 how are things going?

In the end, only Shel and Spooky got their bellies shaved. I've done so many things, I have no idea what's working - but other than BILLY - who tossed a hairball two days in a row - I can't actually remember the last time I cleaned up a hairball or bile! KNOCK WOOD!

So Billy has been added to the list of cats getting Vet's Best and SEB syrup.

And because I like its anti-inflammatory AND anti-oxidant properties, I've just put everyone on the curcumin supplement. Except Spook - not sure if it interferes with the leukeran. Until I find out for sure, she won't be on it. I know it would have interfered with Lazlo's.

 

[peaches08]

I'm still having to use the Temptations Hairball treats 1-2 times a week.  Ticks me off to have to do so, but it beats the alternative.  Mine groom each other a lot, so I really don't think a tummy shave would work for mine.  I almost never see them grooming tummies.  It's paws, legs, and each other.

Darn hairballs.

 

[ldg]

KNOCK WOOD I think it is just generally calming down over here. Lazlo is only getting the yolks and lecithin - didn't have his tummy shaved - and isn't have an issue.... :cross:

And yes, the hairball treats are better than the alternative. What a nightmare this year. hno:

 

[peaches08]

Mine haven't vomited since we've moved here (8-2-14), so maybe stuff is calming down.

 

[ldg]

Well, the knocking wood didn't help. :lol3: BILLY tossed a hairball again! What the heck is the matter with HIS gut? This is so discouraging.

 

[abby2932]

Just a thought that I had today about the hairballs....Could it be the FUR?

LDG, I read that you started buying Hare Today Whole Ground Rabbit, Fur and All. (And I thought a few other people are trying that one as well but maybe not) I also just started using that one instead of the regular fur-less rabbit that I was ordering. My cats also eat the cavies which have a ton of fur and I am notice a massive increase in hairballs since they have started eating this food.

Malibu always had weekly hairballs when he was on kibble until I switched him over to canned and reduced the hairball frequency to about 3 a year. Kali was never on dry food, only canned for her 3 years of life and she had NEVER had a hairball in her life.

Now that they have started eating raw (and I don't think I'm blaming the raw, I really believe it is the fur from the rabbit and cavies) we are back to a hairball a week for BOTH cats! It is unbelievable.

I'm not sure if this is the reason why your cats are having hairballs but I truly think that this is why mine are. Just wanted to share/throw out my thoughts!