Urgent vibes and prayers needed for feralvr's Perla!

[ldg]

Oh Lauren! to you, and :rub: :rub: :rub: to Perla! Poor baby!

If you're going to try to transition her to raw for the wet portion of her meals, given what just went on recently, I think you can avoid that by giving her the Fortiflora as directed (meaning, used as a probiotic, not just a flavor enhancer) - unless you have another probiotic you use for that. :nod: And for the benefit of others reading the thread, it's best to give the probiotic several hours after the antibiotic and several hours before the next dose... the antibiotic kills ALL of the gut bacteria, good and bad. So best to "time" giving the probiotic so it doesn't just get wiped out by giving an antibiotic with or after a meal if you've just given the probiotic. :nod:

There is a study (a review piece of the literature on the subject) that clearly indicates taking a probiotic during antibiotics really helps with digestion. :nod: The recommended dose for adults was 10 billion active colony-thingies, and 5 billion for kids. So for a cat, I'd think the 5 billion is a good target daily while on the probiotics.

for rincess: Perla!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[carolina]

Oh Lauren! to you, and :rub: :rub: :rub: to Perla! Poor baby!
If you're going to try to transition her to raw for the wet portion of her meals, given what just went on recently, I think you can avoid that by giving her the Fortiflora as directed (meaning, used as a probiotic, not just a flavor enhancer) - unless you have another probiotic you use for that. :nod: And for the benefit of others reading the thread, it's best to give the probiotic several hours after the antibiotic and several hours before the next dose... the antibiotic kills ALL of the gut bacteria, good and bad. So best to "time" giving the probiotic so it doesn't just get wiped out by giving an antibiotic with or after a meal if you've just given the probiotic. :nod:
There is a study (a review piece of the literature on the subject) that clearly indicates taking a probiotic during antibiotics really helps with digestion. :nod: The recommended dose for adults was 10 billion active colony-thingies, and 5 billion for kids. So for a cat, I'd think the 5 billion is a good target daily while on the probiotics.
for rincess: Perla!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

That's why proviable-DC is such a good one :nod: not only it is encapsulated, but is is very strong.... So you have a chance of some benefits from it :nod:.... and it has prebiotics too.....
The other ones are 100million CFU.... (Fortiflora for example) While Proviable-DC is 5 Billion

 

[auntie crazy]

Originally Posted by Carolina

Originally Posted by Auntie Crazy

It's a truly rare thing for a cat to be allergic to a protein source. It's far more likely that Perla is reacting to the form the protein is in, or to something else in the food.

Stella and Chewy's freeze-dried chicken caused Carolina's Bugsy to react poorly, too, where the Halo freeze-dried chicken did not. It's possible S&C sources their animals from a farm that feeds a corn-heavy diet, or something similar, that then affects the cats. Fascinating. But poor Perla!!!!

Time to try Rad Cat or Feline' Pride or maybe even whole fresh meats!

AC

...
Auntie, thanks for pointing out the corn fed meats....... but how do we find out who is fed that and who is not?

And that, my friend, is one of those million dollar questions.

You can try to find out via a manufacturer's website, or give them a call and hope they give you an honest answer. Mostly, however, you'll have to try your cats on the food and see how they do.

And don't forget..... many cats that are currently suffering from digestive issues, inflammation, etc., will be able to tolerate more foods that are less "pure" the longer they're on a raw diet (and their systems continue to heal). So foods that cause vomiting or diarrhea today may well be acceptable to them in a month or two.

AC

P.S. This is a good example that highlights the primary benefit of home-preparing my kitties' diets - if I need to source grass-fed beef instead of standard grocery-store fare, I can do so easily and without changing anything on their menu. I have ultimate control over the quality, source and amount of everything they're fed. For me, that control outweighs any benefit to be gained by feeding commercial raw.

 

[carolina]

And that, my friend, is one of those million dollar questions.

You can try to find out via a manufacturer's website, or give them a call and hope they give you an honest answer. Mostly, however, you'll have to try your cats on the food and see how they do.

And don't forget..... many cats that are currently suffering from digestive issues, inflammation, etc., will be able to tolerate more foods that are less "pure" the longer they're on a raw diet (and their systems continue to heal). So foods that cause vomiting or diarrhea today may well be acceptable to them in a month or two.

AC

P.S. This is a good example that highlights the primary benefit of home-preparing my kitties' diets - if I need to source grass-fed beef instead of standard grocery-store fare, I can do so easily and without changing anything on their menu. I have ultimate control over the quality, source and amount of everything they're fed. For me, that control outweighs any benefit to be gained by feeding commercial raw.

So - "Free-range, organic or Pasture-raised" that should be fine?

 

[auntie crazy]

Originally Posted by Carolina

.......
So - "Free-range, organic or Pasture-raised" that should be fine?

I think free-range and pasture-raised would be indicative of a naturally-fed animal, but I'm not sure about organic.

Anyone want to look up the USDA's definitions of these words to give us a definitive answer?

AC

 

[momto4kitties]

Oh I'm  so sorry Perla is reacting to the food, as you know I'm going through that and it is so awful!   I just hope the Fortiflora helps her go back to her more healthy diet and she can get better, I will keep her in my prayers.

 

[carolina]

I think free-range and pasture-raised would be indicative of a naturally-fed animal, but I'm not sure about organic.

Anyone want to look up the USDA's definitions of these words to give us a definitive answer?

AC

I am asking because that's what Rad Cat Claims.... I am guessing if they are free-range or pasture-raised there wouldn't be a reason to be corn-fed?
All of our meats are:
•USDA Inspected and US Sourced
•Antibiotic and hormone-free
•Free-range or pasture-raised
Organic
then.......
•No preservatives
•No by-products
•No grains
•No fruits or vegetables

 

[feralvr]

It's a truly rare thing for a cat to be allergic to a protein source. It's far more likely that Perla is reacting to the form the protein is in, or to something else in the food.

Stella and Chewy's freeze-dried chicken caused Carolina's Bugsy to react poorly, too, where the Halo freeze-dried chicken did not. It's possible S&C sources their animals from a farm that feeds a corn-heavy diet, or something similar, that then affects the cats. Fascinating. But poor Perla!!!!

Time to try Rad Cat or Feline' Pride or maybe even whole fresh meats!

AC

And S&C beef treats mad hope throw up immediately..... but then so did NV Bison... and S&C Beef raw (for dogs). So I do think she has an intolerance to beef - In any case, I am just not willing to clean up raw puke from my rugs anymore :lol3:
Auntie has a point though - kitties have done FANTASTIC on Rad Cat - even though I was so scared of feeding Bugsy anything outside of the 100% pathogen free guaranteed meets.... such as NV and S&C..... That is some fresh/quality meat right there!
For what Auntie says, and the reviews too, Feline's Pride is the same way.... I will be ordering their rabbit too :bigthumb:
Auntie, thanks for pointing out the corn fed meats....... but how do we find out who is fed that and who is not? :dk:

THANK YOU!!!! WE had progress tonight too. NO MORE FANCY FEAST The fortiflora came in and at least for tonight (I don't want to jinx it ) Perla ate 1/2 raw Nature's Logic rabbit and 1/2 EVO wet mixed together with Fortiflora on top..... . She ate very, very well. I have not been able to get her to eat EVO lately :dk: In fact, are you ready ................................................. PIPSQUEAK ate some raw :shocker: mixed in with the EVO and Fortiflora sprinkled on top. IN fact, everyone had some raw meat with dinner tonight. OMG Presley LOVES raw. He get's a bit wild over the stuff :lol3:

No more S&C for Perla either. I had to trade the opened bag of beef for the chicken. BUT I can feed that to the other's or to Wilbur. I will not purchase S&C anymore after tonight only because I am liking what I am learning about the commercially made raw meats more than the freeze-dried. The freeze-dried I always served soaked and wet anyway.

P.S. Carolina, I just cringed when I read about your brazilian rug getting puked on........ Don't want that. I don't think the bison would be good either for Perla.

 

[feralvr]

Oh Lauren! to you, and :rub: :rub: :rub: to Perla! Poor baby!
If you're going to try to transition her to raw for the wet portion of her meals, given what just went on recently, I think you can avoid that by giving her the Fortiflora as directed (meaning, used as a probiotic, not just a flavor enhancer) - unless you have another probiotic you use for that. :nod: And for the benefit of others reading the thread, it's best to give the probiotic several hours after the antibiotic and several hours before the next dose... the antibiotic kills ALL of the gut bacteria, good and bad. So best to "time" giving the probiotic so it doesn't just get wiped out by giving an antibiotic with or after a meal if you've just given the probiotic. :nod:
There is a study (a review piece of the literature on the subject) that clearly indicates taking a probiotic during antibiotics really helps with digestion. :nod: The recommended dose for adults was 10 billion active colony-thingies, and 5 billion for kids. So for a cat, I'd think the 5 billion is a good target daily while on the probiotics.
for rincess: Perla!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I do now give her Probiotic in between the antibiotic's. POOR PERLA - she was on Clavamox, then Orbax and now Baytril. This has got to be killing her gut flora :shame: I will give the Fortiflora packet spread into two meal's and then 1/2 capsule (5 billion) probiotic at lunchtime. I hope that will help her. BUT I think the addtion of the raw meat will be very beneficial to her gut flora anyway...

I just want her to be better and happy again. :cross:

 

[feralvr]

I think free-range and pasture-raised would be indicative of a naturally-fed animal, but I'm not sure about organic.

Anyone want to look up the USDA's definitions of these words to give us a definitive answer?

AC

These last few day's have been such an eye-opening experience for me in how I am feeding my cat's and my sweet old dog's. I really think that free-range AND pasture-raised are one in the same - Will TRY :lol3: to do some research on the the above and see how USDA's describes them.

 

[carolina]

These last few day's have been such an eye-opening experience for me in how I am feeding my cat's and my sweet old dog's. I really think that free-range AND pasture-raised are one in the same - Will TRY :lol3: to do some research on the the above and see how USDA's describes them.

I think free-range might go to poultry and pasture-raised to cattle? :dk:

I am SO happy with your posts!!!!! Yey for everyone eating raw tonight and little Perla eating well......... good food too!!

 

[ldg]

Free range is definitely not pasture-raised. I don't have a link for it - I'll find one at some point if you don't get to it Carolina. But "free range" for chickens, at least, means that they are not in cages. It can still be some huge giant warehouse kind of thing with a door (so they technically have access to the outside, even if they aren't allowed out).

And grass-fed beef does not necessarily mean they're grazing.

So "pasture fed" is definitely something different than free-range, though I don't know technical/regulatory definitions.

 

[feralvr]

This is quite interesting, the differences between Free-range, pasture, grass-fed and organic. Organic means hormone, antibiotic and pesticide free.

Free-range is for cattle - no fences, no barriers and they just eat off of the land. Here is one link I found that describes a little bit - http://curezone.com/forums/am.asp?i=414103

 

[feralvr]

Free range is definitely not pasture-raised. I don't have a link for it - I'll find one at some point if you don't get to it Carolina. But "free range" for chickens, at least, means that they are not in cages. It can still be some huge giant warehouse kind of thing with a door (so they technically have access to the outside, even if they aren't allowed out).
And grass-fed beef does not necessarily mean they're grazing.
So "pasture fed" is definitely something different than free-range, though I don't know technical/regulatory definitions.

I did find that "cage-free" means they are kept in a huge building with a small door that leads out to the pasture. BUT most chicken's don't venture out away from their food source and still spend most of their lives inside this building - cage-free though. AND true about grass-fed - there are many other plant's and foliage that the cattle eat other than grass. :confuse2:

 

[carolina]

so......
Basically saying "Free-range or pasture-raised" says nothing about what they eat...... right? Because there's where I want to get - do they eat corn? :lol3:

 

[ldg]

Pretty much, Carolina. What you look for in poultry is vegetarian diet - meaning they're not fed rendered products or bone meal. Most "quality" chickens WILL be fed on at least some corn. For red meats, you need to look for "grass fed." Of course - "free range" or "pasture raised" is better than the alternatives - it does speak (at least a little) to the quality of the feed animals' lives.

I'll go post in the Questions about Commercial Raw thread, as many commercial raw products are using (mostly) grass fed red meats.

 

[ldg]

OK, took care of that post. :lol3:

Now - how is Perla doing today? :cross:

 

[mrsgreenjeens]

Ok, now that my head is finished spinning, I want to know how Perla is doing to

 

[libby74]

Well, I just came to the Health Forum to see if there was anything I'd missed concerning Pipsqueak ( I obviously don't check this forum very often ).  Lo and behold, the drama of Perla unfolded before my eyes.  That poor baby girl!   I really have no advice to offer, Lauren, because I've never had a problem like this before.  Just wanted to let you know that you and your fur-babies are in my prayers, and I'm sending you loads of "get-well-quick"

 for sweet Perla.

 

[feralvr]

so......
Basically saying "Free-range or pasture-raised" says nothing about what they eat...... right? Because there's where I want to get - do they eat corn? :lol3:

I think free-range cattle eat off the land and I guess that would mean they could be munching on the corn fields :dk: - This is a great topic to start in Nutrition :nod:

Pretty much, Carolina. What you look for in poultry is vegetarian diet - meaning they're not fed rendered products or bone meal. Most "quality" chickens WILL be fed on at least some corn. For red meats, you need to look for "grass fed." Of course - "free range" or "pasture raised" is better than the alternatives - it does speak (at least a little) to the quality of the feed animals' lives.
I'll go post in the Questions about Commercial Raw thread, as many commercial raw products are using (mostly) grass fed red meats.

:lol3: I was going to suggest we start a new thread in raw about the differences. Thank you Laurie - will go and check out that thread. I am very, very curious about the EXACT differences.