Turkish Van?

[Mark Piastrino]

Hi!
We’ve had Bella for 3 years now and she is so different to any cat I’ve ever owned.
When we first picked up Bella she was the only kitten that was white and gray and all the other kits were tortoiseshell tabbies! The vets explained that Bella most likely had a different father and that female cats uteruses have two compartments and that all the other kittens would have been in one side and Bella would have been in the other isde on her own. Anyway….I’d never heard of Turkish Van cats until I met a lady who was a cat fanatic who owned around 8 cats. It wasn’t until I was sitting on the spa with the kids one day and Bella circled the top of the spa and we put her in that we went wait, what? Cats hate water!! Not Bella.
She loves it! She loves baths and a shower and we even take her to the beach for a swim when it’s hot! She shares all the traits of the genuine Turkish Vans that I’ve looked online. She is really intelligent, so loyal like a dog, loves attention, is really affectionate, so active, loves playing and can fight, climbs anything, loves being in high positions, loves traveling in the van….we can basically take her anywhere!!
We’ve had a few other cat lovers swear that she is a Turkish Van. Regardless even if she isn’t, will love her all the same. Thought I’d post some photos and see what you guys think.
Any thoughts on her appearance would be greatly appreciated. She’s a poser!!

 

[di and bob]

Cats are usually no certain breed, and unless you have papers, the breed is a moot point. Purebred cats are NOT turned out onto the streets, or bred indiscriminately. It's hard to say what is in their background. she will be known as a DLH or domestic long hair, white and black. Whatever she is, she is beautiful!

 

[Mark Piastrino]

Thanks for your comments Di & Bob. She’s actually White and Grey, not black.
She ticks all the boxes of a Turkish Van, characteristics, physical traits and appearance. But I definitely know for sure that her mother is a moggy and the rest of the kittens also. It’s awesome anyway. The way I look at it she’s a customized special edition! She’s special.
I’ll attach a photo of when she was tiny and we picked her up. I didn’t see all the other kittens at first, so it was quite surprising when we went and got her that Bella was the odd one out.
By the way, the original owner of mother cat said she remembers seeing the mother one day with a big white cat on top of her!!!

 

[goingpostal]

Turkish Vans like most breeds exist because that pattern exists in domestic cats, you'll find lost of cats with the van pattern, it doesn't mean they are part purebred or descended from one, just that it's a pattern cats come in.

 

[Mark Piastrino]

Thanks for your input. Did you read the original post? The fact that she loves water and swims?
Most cats will rip your face off if you put them remotely close to water. And I agree there are a lot of cats that share the same cost pattern but Bella has the markings of a Turkish van to a T. I’ll repeat I know she’s definitely not a purebred T.V but she uncannily has all the traits of one from what I’ve read into.

 

[Zara12345]

Hi!
We’ve had Bella for 3 years now and she is so different to any cat I’ve ever owned.
When we first picked up Bella she was the only kitten that was white and gray and all the other kits were tortoiseshell tabbies! The vets explained that Bella most likely had a different father and that female cats uteruses have two compartments and that all the other kittens would have been in one side and Bella would have been in the other isde on her own. Anyway….I’d never heard of Turkish Van cats until I met a lady who was a cat fanatic who owned around 8 cats. It wasn’t until I was sitting on the spa with the kids one day and Bella circled the top of the spa and we put her in that we went wait, what? Cats hate water!! Not Bella.
She loves it! She loves baths and a shower and we even take her to the beach for a swim when it’s hot! She shares all the traits of the genuine Turkish Vans that I’ve looked online. She is really intelligent, so loyal like a dog, loves attention, is really affectionate, so active, loves playing and can fight, climbs anything, loves being in high positions, loves traveling in the van….we can basically take her anywhere!!
We’ve had a few other cat lovers swear that she is a Turkish Van. Regardless even if she isn’t, will love her all the same. Thought I’d post some photos and see what you guys think.
Any thoughts on her appearance would be greatly appreciated. She’s a poser!!View attachment 447418View attachment 447419View attachment 447421View attachment 447422View attachment 447423View attachment 447425View attachment 447426View attachment 447427

She's gorgeous! I wish my cats loved water as much as yours does

 

[Mark Piastrino]

Thank you Zara! She is a little Spunk.
Hence the name Bella!!

 

[Mark Piastrino]

BTW-Fleas get a free swim too!

 

[Peaches&Mango]

I would say she’s more harlequin patterning than van patterning as she’s got too much colour on her back. She’s gorgeous though!

 

[LunarFlower]

Love of water can occur in randomly bred cats. My big orange male loves water; he readily plays in his water bowl and one of his favorite places to be is in the shower when it’s still steamy and wet. I don’t know if he would go for a swim like yours if given the opportunity, but he might.

He has a lot of traits like a Maine Coon (very large size, thick mane around his neck and a plumed tail, loves water, talkative, confident, outgoing, friendly, etc), but he’s not a Maine Coon. Maybe one of his ancestors was from that same area or from the breeding population that Maine Coons originally came from, but I would never say he’s a Maine Coon. He lacks other defining features of the breed; his muzzle isn’t blocky enough, he’s not quite big enough, and he doesn’t have lynx tips on his ears.

It’s uncommon to get a water loving cat, but it can happen. That’s part of the fun of rescues and Moggies; they have the potential to have any of the traits found in purebred cats, and some traits that aren’t from any particular breed.

A good general rule is that if you don’t have papers from a reputable breeder or your cat doesn’t have a distinct and defining breed related trait that doesn’t occur normally in the general population (such as hairlessness, fold ears, TRUE rosette markings, etc.), you probably don’t have any particular breed of cat. You have a domestic longhair or domestic shorthair. That doesn’t mean they’re any less wonderful or special, it just means they are one of a kind.

 

[Mark Piastrino]

Agree with one of a kind!! We love Bella….she’s all
you could want in a pet.
Your cat looks so cute and playful. Gotta watch the red heads though, they can be firey!!
Thanks for your comments.

 

[Mark Piastrino]

I would say she’s more harlequin patterning than van patterning as she’s got too much colour on her back. She’s gorgeous though!

The general rule when determining a T.V from their coat marking is 15% color and the majority white. (Minus the head and tail) I’d say Bella still passes that criteria. Regardless her Dad was something else and she looks nothing like her mother and siblings. Probably being bias but she is a gorgeous feline…she’s really loyal and affectionate…to me more than anyone else.
Thanks for your comments.

 

[Meowmee]

Hi!
We’ve had Bella for 3 years now and she is so different to any cat I’ve ever owned.
When we first picked up Bella she was the only kitten that was white and gray and all the other kits were tortoiseshell tabbies! The vets explained that Bella most likely had a different father and that female cats uteruses have two compartments and that all the other kittens would have been in one side and Bella would have been in the other isde on her own. Anyway….I’d never heard of Turkish Van cats until I met a lady who was a cat fanatic who owned around 8 cats. It wasn’t until I was sitting on the spa with the kids one day and Bella circled the top of the spa and we put her in that we went wait, what? Cats hate water!! Not Bella.
She loves it! She loves baths and a shower and we even take her to the beach for a swim when it’s hot! She shares all the traits of the genuine Turkish Vans that I’ve looked online. She is really intelligent, so loyal like a dog, loves attention, is really affectionate, so active, loves playing and can fight, climbs anything, loves being in high positions, loves traveling in the van….we can basically take her anywhere!!
We’ve had a few other cat lovers swear that she is a Turkish Van. Regardless even if she isn’t, will love her all the same. Thought I’d post some photos and see what you guys think.
Any thoughts on her appearance would be greatly appreciated. She’s a poser!!View attachment 447418View attachment 447419View attachment 447421View attachment 447422View attachment 447423View attachment 447426View attachment 447427

Officially she would be a dlh bicolor with vannish pattern. She does have some TV features for me, those gorgeous yellow eyes, the tail, fur and pattern etc. When I looked at TV pics online many have more than a touch of color on the head/eyes etc., so maybe it varies. Some have what is called the touch of god, a spot on the back. I think they are a bit broader maybe in the face from what I remember looking at in the past. I wrote a post about here for someone else and there cat with comparitive pics.I wish my cats liked water, none of them every have. I have only one pb cat my Quinn siamese. Many breeds came from people breeding cats naturally in the area so cats can often have pb features.

 

[Maurey]

TV's distinct traits are less about their markings (which any cat can have) and more about their unique head and ear shape (which fewer cats share). While unusual, some cats, regardless of breed, are known to love water; it's in no way indicative of breed. The vast majority of cats have absolutely no significant breed ancestry -- they're not like dogs. It doesn't make them any less special.

source: Halima Turkish Van Cattery - Home Erica was elected TICA Turkish Van Breed Chair This painting was done by one of our talented kitten owners of her three wonderful sisters she got from Halima cattery: Cleo, Ariel, and Cassie. copyright Joanne Danford-Cordingley 2015 Pictured below is CFA Best OF Beed Turkish Van in the world for 2014-2015 show season Gumibar was also 23 best Allbreed Cat in CFA he is now a Regional Winner in both TICA and CFA. Halima is a CFA and TICA registered cattery located in Michigan specializing in Turkish Van kittens for show, breeder, and pets. We have been Showing Turkish Vans for 18 years and breeding quality kittens for 17 years and have imported cats from around the world to ensure low inbreeding and healthy stock. We are striving to produce great examples of the Turkish Van to preseve this rare natural cat. Our kittens are raised underfoot in our home and handled from birth to ensure they are strongly bonded with humans. Once you experience a Van from Halima Turkish Vans you will realize what it was your home was lacking. We have a limited number of litters per year allowing us to hand raise each and every kitten. We have bred shown and sold many award winning cats and started breeders selling only the top stock available allowing them to start breeding award winning cats right from the start. Why not start with the best.Turkish Vans come from the Lake Van area of Turkey and are a very old breed one could argue the oldest natural breed of cat. They have a medium length coat that is very silky and are medium in build but very muscualr.They are chalk white with colored markings on the head and tail. New to the United States is the all white Turkish Vans or Vankedisi prized in the Lake Van Region of Turkey.They are an energetic cat and bond strongly with their family. They are very smart and are easily taught tricks. This statue of the Van Kedi is located in Van Turkey. Halima Temple Anubis Halima cattery's 2011-2012 Show alter finishes his TICA show season as a Supreme Grand Champion Alter and Regional Winner. Anubis became a CFA Grand Premier at the Taylor Michigan cat show.

 

[Caspers Human]

If she was born to a tabby mother she can't be a Van. That doesn't mean she doesn't have a little bit of Van in her blood.
Cats can mate with multiple males and produce kittens, technically, sired by each. Who knows what could have happened in the Great Outdoors?

Here's a picture of a former cat of mine, "Spike." He was known to be a Van.

(Black and white photo with sepia tone. The cat was actually white and brown.)

We adopted him from somebody who couldn't manage him. He was very headstrong!

Yes, he liked water! He would jump in the shower with you if you didn't watch out!

You could probably call your cat a Van if you want to but don't consider her a purebred.

She's a good looking cat regardless of what her bloodlines actually are!

 

[goingpostal]

Thanks for your input. Did you read the original post? The fact that she loves water and swims?
Most cats will rip your face off if you put them remotely close to water. And I agree there are a lot of cats that share the same cost pattern but Bella has the markings of a Turkish van to a T. I’ll repeat I know she’s definitely not a purebred T.V but she uncannily has all the traits of one from what I’ve read into.

Love of water isn't a trait that is concentrated to a breed or particular to TVs, there's plenty of Vans that hate water and there's plenty of domestics that love it. This has nothing to do with breed. By that logic my Bengal isn't really a Bengal because she doesn't play in the water and the breed is known to be water lovers. There are lots and lots of random bred cats that look and act like a purebred counterpart because most breeds were developed from the domestic population, all these colors and behaviors exist in cats all over the world. Only very recently have we created breeds and cats are only considered to be those breeds if they have a verifiable pedigree.

 

[Mark Piastrino]

Officially she would be a dlh bicolor with vannish pattern. She does have some TV features for me, those gorgeous yellow eyes, the tail, fur and pattern etc. When I looked at TV pics online many have more than a touch of color on the head/eyes etc., so maybe it varies. Some have what is called the touch of god, a spot on the back. I think they are a bit broader maybe in the face from what I remember looking at in the past. I wrote a post about here for someone else and there cat with comparitive pics.I wish my cats liked water, none of them every have. I have only one pb cat my Quinn siamese. Many breeds came from people breeding cats naturally in the area so cats can often have pb features.

Thanks so much for your positive input.
Best of luck your way!

 

[Mark Piastrino]

TV's distinct traits are less about their markings (which any cat can have) and more about their unique head and ear shape (which fewer cats share). While unusual, some cats, regardless of breed, are known to love water; it's in no way indicative of breed. The vast majority of cats have absolutely no significant breed ancestry -- they're not like dogs. It doesn't make them any less special.

View attachment 447674
source: Halima Turkish Van Cattery - Home Erica was elected TICA Turkish Van Breed Chair This painting was done by one of our talented kitten owners of her three wonderful sisters she got from Halima cattery: Cleo, Ariel, and Cassie. copyright Joanne Danford-Cordingley 2015 Pictured below is CFA Best OF Beed Turkish Van in the world for 2014-2015 show season Gumibar was also 23 best Allbreed Cat in CFA he is now a Regional Winner in both TICA and CFA. Halima is a CFA and TICA registered cattery located in Michigan specializing in Turkish Van kittens for show, breeder, and pets. We have been Showing Turkish Vans for 18 years and breeding quality kittens for 17 years and have imported cats from around the world to ensure low inbreeding and healthy stock. We are striving to produce great examples of the Turkish Van to preseve this rare natural cat. Our kittens are raised underfoot in our home and handled from birth to ensure they are strongly bonded with humans. Once you experience a Van from Halima Turkish Vans you will realize what it was your home was lacking. We have a limited number of litters per year allowing us to hand raise each and every kitten. We have bred shown and sold many award winning cats and started breeders selling only the top stock available allowing them to start breeding award winning cats right from the start. Why not start with the best.Turkish Vans come from the Lake Van area of Turkey and are a very old breed one could argue the oldest natural breed of cat. They have a medium length coat that is very silky and are medium in build but very muscualr.They are chalk white with colored markings on the head and tail. New to the United States is the all white Turkish Vans or Vankedisi prized in the Lake Van Region of Turkey.They are an energetic cat and bond strongly with their family. They are very smart and are easily taught tricks. This statue of the Van Kedi is located in Van Turkey. Halima Temple Anubis Halima cattery's 2011-2012 Show alter finishes his TICA show season as a Supreme Grand Champion Alter and Regional Winner. Anubis became a CFA Grand Premier at the Taylor Michigan cat show.

Thanks Maury,
OMG! That photo you have posted of that gray and white TV. Mate that looks like it could be Bella’s sister or brother. Come on. Is it just my eyes?
The eye colour and shape, face and ears looks almost exactly the same! Even the grey color.
It’s coat, it’s tail, the undercoat…down to a T.
If Bella doesn’t have any Turkish van descent then she’s doing a marvelous job of looking like one.

 

[Mark Piastrino]

If she was born to a tabby mother she can't be a Van. That doesn't mean she doesn't have a little bit of Van in her blood.
Cats can mate with multiple males and produce kittens, technically, sired by each. Who knows what could have happened in the Great Outdoors?

Here's a picture of a former cat of mine, "Spike." He was known to be a Van.

(Black and white photo with sepia tone. The cat was actually white and brown.)

We adopted him from somebody who couldn't manage him. He was very headstrong!

Yes, he liked water! He would jump in the shower with you if you didn't watch out!

You could probably call your cat a Van if you want to but don't consider her a purebred.

She's a good looking cat regardless of what her bloodlines actually are!

Hey Caspers,
Thanks for your response.
I never stated that Bella is a full bed Van.
I know she isn’t but I like to think that maybe her father was. The original owner saw Bella’s Dad ‘in the making’ and described him as a big white cat.
If you look at the photos of Bella she definitely appears to have the same marking s and features of a Van and Ashe refinery sheets all of the traits of one. Regards to your old cat Spike, sorry but besides the coat he didn’t look anything like a van. It appears he had too much colour other than white to pass the criteria.
I’m really not to concerned if she doesn’t have TV in her bloodline. My original post was to just get peoples opinions on her appearance as to what particular breed she looks like she may have in her. She’s not a good looking cat. She’s a freaking supermodel!!

 

[Mark Piastrino]

Love of water isn't a trait that is concentrated to a breed or particular to TVs, there's plenty of Vans that hate water and there's plenty of domestics that love it. This has nothing to do with breed. By that logic my Bengal isn't really a Bengal because she doesn't play in the water and the breed is known to be water lovers. There are lots and lots of random bred cats that look and act like a purebred counterpart because most breeds were developed from the domestic population, all these colors and behaviors exist in cats all over the world. Only very recently have we created breeds and cats are only considered to be those breeds if they have a verifiable pedigree.

You might be correct. But the affinity with water is only one of the major comparable traits my cat shares with Turkish Vans. There is no denying that her facial features, body length, shape, coat and markings resemble that of purebred grey and white TV. I’ve owned domestic cats all my life, seen many cats and it’s not a common pattern on domestic cats, especially her tail.
Please look at the photo of a purebred Turkish Van one of the posters has posted on this thread.
Any resemblance?
If and only if Bella’s father is a Turkish Van, which could be a possibility then I’d say that TV gene is stronger and has taken over. Unfortunately, her mother didn’t even get a look in.
Thanks.