Tumour near windpipe - terminal

[iPappy]

iPappy I honestly can not tell you how invaluable your information and advice has been over this past week.

I think I did the same thing I did when my boy was diagnosed, I literally look/looked at them thinking they are going to keel over any second. I have learned a lot going through it with him but the respiratory aspect kind of put me back to the uncertainty of when he had his diagnoses.
But then I guess that’s it, each animal is unique, as are their issues and as much as you might think you are prepared for what to look for in a terminal diagnoses to make certain decisions, it’s always different.

as well as monitoring her respiratory rate I’m going to take regular pictures of the lump, as much as I can from the same angle. I think it might give me a more clear picture of the growth rate rather than going by eye. The vet felt changes but I’ll never physically examine it because I don’t know if it hurts her. So pictures are all I have.
I’ll leave the thread here for now, but I’ll update with changes and despite the fact that I value the input from everyone I sincerely hope I don’t have to update any time soon. I do however hope to stay active on this site, I’ve come to feel quite at home here

You are so welcome, I'm so happy I have been able to help.
Regular pictures would be a wonderful idea. I did this (very often) and it really helped us see another piece of the big picture. One of mine developed a tiny lump on his gums (smaller than a pea), and the vet actually took a photo so she could compare it to his next appointment (it grew a tiny bit then stopped and never caused any issues!)
When my Tag was diagnosed almost a year ago with a malignant cancer, every single day was this feeling like I was going to find him in major distress. I remember once I had to run an errand that usually takes me 30 minutes and I got stuck behind the worlds slowest train on the worlds most deserted road. I sat there thinking I was going to have a panic attack because Tag was home and I was not. Then, the stupid train stopped!!! There were huge, deep ditches on either side of this tiny back road so I had to back my car onto a main road. I was so freaked out by the time I got home. And he had slept the entire time and was ready for a snack and some love when I got home.
Some good advice I got was pretend like they don't have (whatever disease they're fighting) and go by how they act. Had I not taken Tag to the vet, I wouldn't have suspected he was so sick because even though he looked a little rough, he was still so happy and still did everything he used to do. It's very hard advice to follow religiously (trust me, I know!), but on days you find yourself worrying excessively maybe this will help you out.
Please update whenever you can. I joined this site shortly after realizing my Tag was terminally ill and I got so much support even though Tag was a dog. I hung out on the Cat Lounge (The Cat Lounge) as a distraction and to just chat with people and have a laugh. That really helped take my mind off of the bad.

 

[Furrywurrypurry]

It was two weeks yesterday since precious started her steroids. She hasn’t deteriorated in any way that I am able to tell. Her appetite has definitely increased, not that it needed to but I see no reason to stop her from eating as much as she likes at this stage. She’s drinking much more but the I recall that that is a side effect of the steroids. The vet was happy to keep her on the 5mg dose rather than reduce when I contacted her after 7 days.

Her resting heart rate is around 28 breaths per minute and has been that way consistently, although I have noticed two occasions where she has inhaled deeply and then kind of flinched and licked her lips, it could be nothing but it’s something I’ve noted. Also her breath really smells, when I’m lay in bed I know when she’s nearby because I can smell her breath.

In terms of the lump itself, I can’t see any reduction in size, if anything I think I can see growth. It’s hard to judge without examining her. But it definitely hasn’t gotten any smaller which is what the vet was hoping.
I’ll attach an image taken today and then the one I took 12 days ago.
Top image is today.

Overall there has been little change from what I am able to see anyway, it’s not stopping me from feeling the guilt every single day wondering whether or not she’s hurting. I look at that lump and wonder how there is any possible way that it can’t be. I always come back to the fact of that cats are masters of hiding pain. Am I right in thinking that when they hide that that is when pain is pretty intolerable?

 

[Furrywurrypurry]

On the image today her chin is raised on the earlier image her head is in a neutral position and so the skin is a little stretched on the new image

 

[Furballsmom]

I don't know, this might help?

35 Signs That Your Cat May Be In Pain - TheCatSite

 

[Furrywurrypurry]

Furballsmom thank you this is a really comprehensive list. It’s really helpful.

thankfully she isn’t exhibiting hardly any of these things, she has for the first time in her life urinated on the rug this week, she has never gone outside the litter box before. It was just the once and hopefully a one off. But massively out of character, I had taken note of that, I thought perhaps the steroids making her pee more but I guess it could also be a sign of distress. Her facial expressions bother me a little but it’s hard to know if I’m projecting on to her.
I generally feel like she’s doing ok, it’s just the constant worry of if I’m wrong. I didn’t think I’d do this to myself a second time, the torture over knowing what to do when, granted it’s not quite an all day every day thing like the first time round but there’s just those moments in the day where the thought knocks the wind from my chest. The location of this tumour fills me with so much dread.
The thoughts of me losing her are bad but they pale in comparison to the thoughts of her suffering.

 

[Furballsmom]

I so understand, and I'm so sorry. She might be responding to your stress to a degree with the litterbox miss, I'm not sure.

I am keeping the both of you in my thoughts and prayers

 

[Jem]

Hi. I hope you're doing well.
I'll admit that I did not read thru this entire thread, so I may be missing some information/updates, but after reading your first post I wanted to let you know that what you describe is similar to what happened to my boy.
One day, we noticed that his breathing seemed compromised but it continued to progress and worsen. After a few trips to the vet, over the span of about 4-5 weeks, with nothing showing other than higher than normal calcium levels and a bit of inflammation of his upper airways, they were stumped, until the day after our last visit with them, we woke up in the morning and poor Chewy was gasping for air. So off we go to the vet again. At this point, it was just pure luck that he happened to gasp and look back at the right angle that the vet could just see the edge of a mass in his throat. His tumor was slowly suffocating him as it was growing inwards, into his larynx. You could not feel it with palpation on the outside of the neck. It was too far down to see by mouth but sitting just too high that the x-rays did not catch it as we were looking at his bronchi and lungs...not his throat. Our only option was exploratory surgery to try and remove the tumor. Unfortunately, the tumor was too vascular to remove. He would not have survived the surgery so we had to put him down.
My vet had never seen anything like this before in her 30 plus years as a vet so she ask our permission to perform an autopsy. It turns out he has a relatively rare form of extremely aggressive cancer. She assured us that even if we had caught it early, he still would not have survived very long.
He had "active" symptoms for maybe 5 weeks before he was gone. But looking back, he did start drooling more for a few weeks leading up to the breathing issues and did not always finish his meals...however, this was not unusual for him so I didn't think much of it. I assume that was when the tumor appeared. So were talking maybe 10-12 weeks total.
I can't remember the name exactly, but a quick Google search and I am going to assume it was Condrosarcoma as it best matches what my boy went thru.
I hope your kitty does not have what Chewy did, but perhaps because his tumor is growing out rather than in, if it is the same cancer, he would have a better chance.
I wish you the best...

 

[iPappy]

Furballsmom thank you this is a really comprehensive list. It’s really helpful.

thankfully she isn’t exhibiting hardly any of these things, she has for the first time in her life urinated on the rug this week, she has never gone outside the litter box before. It was just the once and hopefully a one off. But massively out of character, I had taken note of that, I thought perhaps the steroids making her pee more but I guess it could also be a sign of distress. Her facial expressions bother me a little but it’s hard to know if I’m projecting on to her.
I generally feel like she’s doing ok, it’s just the constant worry of if I’m wrong. I didn’t think I’d do this to myself a second time, the torture over knowing what to do when, granted it’s not quite an all day every day thing like the first time round but there’s just those moments in the day where the thought knocks the wind from my chest. The location of this tumour fills me with so much dread.
The thoughts of me losing her are bad but they pale in comparison to the thoughts of her suffering.

You're doing an excellent job with her!! The urinating on the rug could be a lot of things. My Tag was on steroids and he occasionally peed in the house, and for him it seemed to be a matter of instant urgency. He would be laying down, stand up, then immediately "go" and have a horrified look on his face because he couldn't control it. He lived with me his entire life and before he got sick, he never had accidents. The vet slightly lowered his dose, which seemed to help and kept his symptoms at bay, so if it happens again, I'd definitely call the vet and see what they say. Tags vet started him on a maximum dose and slowly lowered it based on his symptoms/side effects. Is she still eating and drinking well? Acting like herself?

You said..."the torture over knowing what to do when, granted it’s not quite an all day every day thing like the first time round but there’s just those moments in the day where the thought knocks the wind from my chest." Does that ever resonate with me! I sometimes felt like there were times that my heart was working way too hard despite just sitting around. Every beat was this dull, extremely heavy thump, and it was almost like a prelude to a minor panic attack. It comes on so suddenly and really does knock the wind out of your chest. That feeling is so horrible. It's like you're being terrorized by your own thoughts and it can make you feel like you're totally alone, but you're not.

 

[Furrywurrypurry]

Jem Thank you for your reply. and so sorry about the loss of your boy.
After many an hour spent googling, though know I shouldn’t, chondrosarcoma is high on the list of probabilities, myself I believe it’s either that or a chemodectoma. They were two of the things suggested by the vet, both are very rare and unusual.
I am incredibly thankful that so far, precious breathing is perfectly normal, the tumour definitely protrudes outwards however it must be doing something internally for her to have been experiencing pain.
If it’s not too personal or too painful to talk about do you mind me asking what your cats breathing issues first looked like? Was it loud breathing? Heavy breathing? fast breathing? I’m sure I will notice with her, but honestly it would be such a help to know what to watch out for.
thank you again

 

[Furrywurrypurry]

Furballsmom Thank you for being so supportive, I do try to keep myself together around her and not cry in her presence etc, but you’re right in that she is probably picking up on my stress whether it’s the reason for the toilet issues or not. It’s something I’ll try to be more mindful of.

 

[Furrywurrypurry]

iPappy I will definitely consult with the vet if she has any more accidents. It was 3 days ago now and nothing since. But the steroids did cross my mind as a potential cause. She seems completely herself in every other aspect really and she’s eating like a fiend. She had an elevated appetite for a short while before diagnoses but she’s never had an issue with her weight and so I didn’t really think much of it. She devours everything out in front of her and I’m hoping that’s a good sign rather than a tumour driven increase in appetite, I don’t even know if that’s a thing but you worry about every little possibility.

You understand completely how I feel, it’s so physical, I have to actually brace myself when it happens. I was just barely holding together the hole in my chest from losing my boy when I discovered precious’ lump. It’s been a rough 6 months. I’m not by any means slipping into the abyss of despair and I fully realise people are dealing with much greater trauma. Precious and Gollum fill my days with smiles and I value that so much, but I’m finding myself to be forgetful and struggling to keep a thought in my head. There are times recently when I’ve questioned if im actually losing my mind because my brain just feels too full.

It’s such a blessing to have found this site, im sure we all know those people who think ‘it’s just a cat’ who make you feel pathetic for not just taking it in your stride, and so to find other people that get it, it definitely does make you feel less alone

 

[Jem]

Was it loud breathing? Heavy breathing? fast breathing? I’m sure I will notice with her, but honestly it would be such a help to know what to watch out for.

Initially we thought he had a little URI flair up. It simply sounded like his airways were congested...but he wasn't sneezing so it was weird. So I guess loud breathing? That progressed into labored breathing...which makes sense if his airway was shrinking. But as mentioned, I think I missed a couple symptoms...The first which was the increased drooling. He often drooled when happy and purring, but looking back there was definitely more drool. As it was growing into his throat, swallowing I assume was either difficult or painful...or both.
His purring was more noisy...gurgley and rumbly...it's hard to explain...I guess it sounded wet? and the vibration was at a lower frequency....Like if you were to compare a muscle car to a regular car....they rumble...lower and slower....I'm sorry, It's hard to explain...I hope you get what I'm trying to say.
His voice cracked while meowing. But he was always a quiet meower, you know when sometimes they'll meow and no noise comes out or it's just a little squeak? He already did that but again, looking back, it was more often than not that his meow was silent.
In the last couple weeks his eating decreased dramatically.

You see, the timing of him getting sick wasn't great. We were also dealing with our other two cats who were sick as well. Hank developed congested heart failure and despite months of treatment he unfortunately threw a clot so we had to put him down. He was only 10 so it was really hard. It was at this time that Chewy started with what seemed like URI symptoms...we initially though it was a herpes flair up due to stress from losing his friend.
Then Toby, who was at the end stages of CKD, needed to be put down because...well...it was just his time, his body had had enough after years of treatment...he was 20. That was about 5/6 weeks after loosing Hank.
Then just under 2 weeks or so after loosing Toby, was the final vet appointment for Chewy where we tried the surgery but were unsuccessful, he was 18.
We were at the vet almost once a week for one of the cats...I don't even want to know how much I spent in those 3 months...

So for our boy, because the tumor was growing inwards, I assume that is why he deteriorated very quickly. It wasn't so much the cancer that killed him, it was due to the location...he was slowly suffocating.

And no worries about asking me any questions....feel free to ask me anything, I'll try my best to answer.

 

[Furrywurrypurry]

I’m so sorry for all your losses. It must’ve been such a hard time.

Honestly that is so incredibly helpful. It’s honestly what I posted this thread for initially is someone to tell me what to look for. There isn’t any saving or treatment for her and so the second she begins to struggle I would like to do right by her and let her go. The biggest question in mind is what does that struggle look like and all the things you have described give me pointers of what to look for, stopping eating is a key thing in any condition but drooling, the change in purr and meow are not really things I would’ve readily thought of. I’ll be mindful of those things now.

I understand where you are coming from, I kick myself every day because I feel like maybe I missed precious lump because my boy had been diagnosed with a terminal intestinal tumour last October. We lost him in Feb of this year and I feel like I was focused so much on him and my own grief that I missed things. I still can’t recall any symptoms that I’ve missed but I missed the lump. I don’t know if her prognosis would’ve been different if it was found sooner, given the location, the logical part of my brain tells me it wouldn’t, but I’ll always wonder.

Thank you honestly, you really don’t understand how valuable what you have shared with me is, not just to me but to precious and her

 

[Jem]

I don’t know if her prognosis would’ve been different if it was found sooner, given the location, the logical part of my brain tells me it wouldn’t, but I’ll always wonder.

Rest your mind. As my vet told me, even if we had found the cancer earlier it would NOT have changed his prognosis. Perhaps we could have gotten an extra couple of months out of him if the tumor could have been removed when it was a bit smaller, but this cancer is terminal...my vet said that she's never seen or heard of a case where they survived...She assured me with complete and utter certainty that we did all we could have...NOTHING would have changed the ultimate outcome.

 

[Jem]

I’m so sorry for all your losses. It must’ve been such a hard time.

Thank you. And yes, it was the worst. I'm still trying to overcome the stress, anxiety and physical manifestations from the mental crap I developed from that time. But it's going to get better...one day at a time.

 

[Jem]

One thing I just thought of that you may want to consider...

Before bringing my boy into surgery, our vet gave him some steroids in hopes that it would reduce the inflammation of all the surrounding tissues to make the surgery easier. And it did help.
I wonder, as you enter the palliative care stage with your girl, if your vet would think it appropriate to prescribe steroids to help ease any pain or discomfort of the surrounding tissues to keep her more comfortable.

Also, another thing we did...although this was with Toby (the CKD kitty). We did not want him to suffer from the moment of his immediate decline to when we would be able to get him in to be put down. This may sound selfish but we just could not stand the thought of having to bring him to an ER vet, surrounded by extra stresses and possibly a rushed euthanasia if the time came when our vet was not open. So we asked her if there was anything we could do to keep him comfortable for his last moments. She gave us a 3/4 day prescription of buprenorphine...just in case we needed it. And as luck would have it, our boy started to decline on the same weekend as my brother's wedding, we couldn't just not go to the wedding and I don't think I could gone to the wedding mere hours after saying goodbye...so we kept him comfortable, he just slept most of the time, until first thing Monday morning when we could get him to our vet. Perhaps this would be something to consider as well. Just have some decent pain/sedative meds at the ready...

 

[Furrywurrypurry]

Rest your mind. As my vet told me, even if we had found the cancer earlier it would NOT have changed his prognosis. Perhaps we could have gotten an extra couple of months out of him if the tumor could have been removed when it was a bit smaller, but this cancer is terminal...my vet said that she's never seen or heard of a case where they survived...She assured me with complete and utter certainty that we did all we could have...NOTHING would have changed the ultimate outcome.

Thank you I know this to be true in my heart of hearts, but sometimes I think hearing it from someone else helps to stop us beating ourselves with that stick.

 

[Furrywurrypurry]

Thank you. And yes, it was the worst. I'm still trying to overcome the stress, anxiety and physical manifestations from the mental crap I developed from that time. But it's going to get better...one day at a time.

That’s what keeps me going. Knowing that it will get better.
Caring for one terminally sick animal was hard, losing him broke me, doing it a second time so soon after, not sure I have the words to describe it. For you to lose 3 so quickly I can’t imagine. I hope that you are able to recover from the trauma.
People ask me or offer the the thought that it’s better to have time to say goodbye and it’s a yes and no answer for me, parts of me are so grateful for having ‘more’ time, for telling them all of the things, for letting them eat all of the foods, for giving all of the cuddles. The other part hates watching them ever so slowly fade away into shadow. And it culminates in you deciding when they die. It’s awful anyway which way it happens.

 

[Furballsmom]

It’s awful anyway which way it happens.

Yeah, pretty much it is.

 

[Furrywurrypurry]

One thing I just thought of that you may want to consider...

Before bringing my boy into surgery, our vet gave him some steroids in hopes that it would reduce the inflammation of all the surrounding tissues to make the surgery easier. And it did help.
I wonder, as you enter the palliative care stage with your girl, if your vet would think it appropriate to prescribe steroids to help ease any pain or discomfort of the surrounding tissues to keep her more comfortable.

Also, another thing we did...although this was with Toby (the CKD kitty). We did not want him to suffer from the moment of his immediate decline to when we would be able to get him in to be put down. This may sound selfish but we just could not stand the thought of having to bring him to an ER vet, surrounded by extra stresses and possibly a rushed euthanasia if the time came when our vet was not open. So we asked her if there was anything we could do to keep him comfortable for his last moments. She gave us a 3/4 day prescription of buprenorphine...just in case we needed it. And as luck would have it, our boy started to decline on the same weekend as my brother's wedding, we couldn't just not go to the wedding and I don't think I could gone to the wedding mere hours after saying goodbye...so we kept him comfortable, he just slept most of the time, until first thing Monday morning when we could get him to our vet. Perhaps this would be something to consider as well. Just have some decent pain/sedative meds at the ready...

She is on steroids and will be on them indefinitely unless she has and serious issues. Seems to be standard protocol here for palliative cat cancer. I believe without them she would be in pain as she was prior to receiving pain meds. She hid in pain for a full weekend whilst we awaited test results.
When our boy reached his time we got a vet to come to the house, a few hours after we realised he was no longer really enjoying life. But I agree that it would be good to have something on hand for precious, we have already been told that it’s likely to become a medial emergency so having something on hand would give me a lot of peace of mind.
Thanks again for sharing and for all the useful advice xxxxx