Traditional Persians

mx4878

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Hello, is there any specifications on what a traditional Persian should look like? I have found specifications on the "standard" Persian cats but cant seem to find any on traditional Persians.
Is there maybe an ethical breeder that breeds well-bred traditional Persians?
I'm interested in seeing how the Persians that are very common in the middle east look like opposing the breed's specifications.
 

Maurey

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Do you mean Traditional/Original Longhairs? They’re their own breed, and only accepted by WCF and SACC in specific colours that are more moderate within the Persian breed itself, like Chinchilla golden/silver.

Here’s the WCF standard https://wcf.de/pdf-en/breed/TLH_en_2011-01-01.pdf
And here’s a breeder with good examples of the breed in South Africa.
 
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mx4878

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Do you mean Traditional/Original Longhairs? They’re their own breed, and only accepted by WCF and SACC in specific colours that are more moderate within the Persian breed itself, like Chinchilla golden/silver.

Here’s the WCF standard https://wcf.de/pdf-en/breed/TLH_en_2011-01-01.pdf
And here’s a breeder with good examples of the breed in South Africa.
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Thank you! They actually do look very similar to the "Persian" cats here, though the well-bred cats do have more fuller coats. And while most cats commonly found in the middle east are domestic longhair/shorthair many do seem to have Persian heritage.
 

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As far as I know there is no breed standard for what you call traditional Persians. They are pet quality cats (nothing wrong with that either!), but most reputable breeders focus on breeding to the breed standard rather than bring more pets into the world.
 
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mx4878

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As far as I know there is no breed standard for what you call traditional Persians. They are pet quality cats (nothing wrong with that either!), but most reputable breeders focus on breeding to the breed standard rather than bring more pets into the world.
I see, I wonder why traditional Persians arent breed standard? They are healthier, even if the breeder does check for any possible medical issues before breeding. "Peke-faced" Persians are just a result of a genetic disease, they were exploited and bred un-ethically there's no avoiding that. Do breeding organizations consider breeding them ethical?
 

posiepurrs

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The breed standards are written by breeders. The traditional cats do not meet the standard. Pet quality (traditional) Persians are no healthier than those bred to the breed standard. Peke faced Persians were a mutation and were only found in red Persians. They died out some time ago. The breed standard Persians have NO relation to Peke faced Persians.
 
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mx4878

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The breed standards are written by breeders. The traditional cats do not meet the standard. Pet quality (traditional) Persians are no healthier than those bred to the breed standard. Peke faced Persians were a mutation and were only found in red Persians. They died out some time ago. The breed standard Persians have NO relation to Peke faced Persians.
Traditional Persians are healthier than the extremely brachycephalic Persians. Peke-faced is used to describe the Persians that meet show standards regarding the vertical alignment and short muzzle. Peke-faced isn't a breed, they have not "died out". I am not stating that traditional Persians are healthy, they aren't. They will still face issues with irregular skull formation, narrow airways, increased eye discharge that can lead to a higher risk of irritation and infection etc. The health issues are more serious the more "extreme" the flat face is. I have noticed the difference between "doll-faced" Persians (well-bred "pet standard"), "peke-face" Persians (well-bred, with papers "show-standard"), and mixed "Doll-face" Persians with other breeds (also, well-bred). I have rescued many cats, the flatter the face, the more vet bills there were. I have traditional "pet quality" Persians, all were pretty much normal however the ones with "moderate" brachycephaly had more issues (My Amber cannot breathe properly when carried on her back, Koala has irregular skull formation, excess eye discharge as well as jaw issues that affect her ability to groom and even eat.) Breeding "show-quality" Persians, exotic shorthair, and the Scottish fold isn't ethical breeding. I am not a fan of "pet-quality" breeding, there are already many pets available. I didn't get my "pet-quality" cats, they were family cats.
 

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I am afraid we will have to agree to disagree. I have 30+ years experience with the Persian breed, both pet and show quality. The only ones I have seen with breathing problems come from back yard breeders who are not reputable and use cats with small nares. I have worked with some of the top breeders in CFA and have had no issues. The term Peke face to describe a show quality cat is a misnomer. It is mistakenly used to describe show quality Persians, but the true Peke face Persians head had a different structure. I do agree there are people who breed who do not have the best interest of the cats (and dogs) of ALL breeds at heart. Peke face WAS a type of Persian that was only found in red or red tabby. In the late 1990s there were less than 100 registered with CFA and there are NO known breeders working with them. No it isn’t a separate breed, but was a classification.
 
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mx4878

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I am afraid we will have to agree to disagree. I have 30+ years experience with the Persian breed, both pet and show quality. The only ones I have seen with breathing problems come from back yard breeders who are not reputable and use cats with small nares. I have worked with some of the top breeders in CFA and have had no issues. The term Peke face to describe a show quality cat is a misnomer. It is mistakenly used to describe show quality Persians, but the true Peke face Persians head had a different structure. I do agree there are people who breed who do not have the best interest of the cats (and dogs) of ALL breeds at heart. Peke face WAS a type of Persian that was only found in red or red tabby. In the late 1990s there were less than 100 registered with CFA and there are NO known breeders working with them. No it isn’t a separate breed, but was a classification.
So show quality Persians dont have narrow airways, irregular skull formation, irregular eye discharge, skull fluid issues and jaw issues? Youre telling me youve never even heard the sound of their breathing issues? Persian cats are loud breathers, I wonder why. They dont even look normal. Breeding to the point where the cat is harmed, or can no longer function normally isn't ethical. Hell, if the breeding even causes the cat a "slight" discomfort such as "harmless" eye-discharge, it should not be under the term "ethical".
 
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