Please Help

[fetzcatz]

Hello, i am new to the forum and im looking to get some answers to a couple problems im having with my cats.... any help is greatly appreciated....


We first got Raimei when she was 9 weeks old. We adopted her from a shelter and was already litter trained. She settled in at home with our dog just fine. was so loveable and relaxed.... then two weeks after we got her we had to make a cross country trip home (military) for my daughters funeral service. We asked a friend to watch the cat for us.... he has three cats of his own so i trusted him..... we were gone for a total of 2 weeks. He said the first week Raimei and his 3 cats got along just fine, everybody played and there was no fighting at all..... which was great!!!!
i called to check on her a few times that week and as all was going well i told him i wouldnt be calling the remainder of the time so that i could focus on my daughters memorial stuff. apparently during the second week, his cats turned on Raimei and started ambushing her every chance they got.... they are all declawed and never tried to kill her but they were just down right mean.....

before i knew of the change in attitude we were already on our way home.... we had found a 6 week old kitten abandoned at a rest stop on our drive back and i figured since raimei did so well with the other cats that we wouldnt have much trouble keeping the kitten... its only 7-8 weeks younger than her.... so we brought it home with us.

when i went to pick up Raimei she acted different..... very distant and not interested in me or my husband at all.... when we got home she went straight to her room and wouldnt come downstairs for about 24 hours.... and even then it was only for food.... when she met the new kitten there was a lot of hissing and batting on Raimei's end... the kitten just curls up in a ball and takes it..... i gave it a couple days and Raimei settled down a little.... they can at least be in the same room now.... and Raimei and Sushi have played with each other a couple times... But if it continues for too long Raimei starts to get really rough with Sushi almost like shes just being mean to her for the heck of it. i figured after a few more days Raimei will settle down...

Then last night i found cat feces at the top of the stairs.... Sushi has been using the litter box just fine.... and i knew Raimei was litter trained so i wasnt sure what had happened to make either of them go there....

After watching them for a while i noticed that when Raimei had to go, she would go into the litter box and dig the whole thing up, throwing litter everywhere and rolling around in it... jumping in and out of the box... my husband thought she was playing at first but then we noticed that every time she got back in the box she would pee and then do the tossing and rolling thing.... i dont think she likes the fact that the kitten used her litter box.... then this morning we caught her pooping next to the couch....

im getting her a litter box today to keep in her room (the office). Sushi isnt interested in going upstairs so im hoping if Raimei has her own space to go that she will quit going on the floor. other than that, is there anything i can do to stop the abusive behavior from Raimei and get her to stop using my carpet as her litter box????

Thanks in Advance everyone!!!

 

[ldg]

First of all, I'm so sorry about the loss of your daughter.

And thank you for rescuing Sushi.

Some questions, and some ideas.

Raimei is ... 16 weeks old? (Four months?) Have both kitties been fully vetted? Vaccinated? Dewormed? Deflead, etc.?

I find it interesting that everything went so well with your friend's cats and Raimei at first. Cats are very territorial, and it's unusual that they get along right away. It could be that Raimei was young enough that at first she wasn't perceived as a threat - but beating up on her is actually a pretty natural part of the process. This is why it's recommended that when introducing new cats to each other, it be done slowly. This way they can get used to the idea that they'll be sharing the space, it gives us time to get them associating each others' scent with "good things," and generally help make the introductions go more smoothly.

The main thing to remember when introducing cats to each other is that you must focus on the resident cat. They've got to think that the new kitty is basically a gift for them - and a new kitty means more love, more attention, more pets, more treats, more play for them (resident kitty). This helps them accept the new one with less trouble.

That said... as they're both young kitties, introductions usually go more quickly. And poor Raimei was traumatized while you were gone.

If I were you, I think I'd consider starting over. I know Sushi's young, but I'd put her in her own room at least for a few days. I'd spend time in there with her, but let Raimei settle down. If she wants love, I'd love on her. If she'd prefer play, I'd do a lot of it, especially with a laser toy or interactive wand toys - the more you get her moving, the more stress she'll work off.

I'd do some scent swapping. Rub Sushi all over with several clean rags or wash cloths. Put one under Raimei's food dish. When you're done with play sessions, put treats down on a "Sushi scented" cloth for Raimei. (Do the same thing with Raimei's scent for Sushi). This will help them associate each other's scent with things they like.

I'd also invest in some Feliway. I'd buy Bach's Rescue Remedy (Flower Essences): put a few drops in their water dishes every day when you clean them and put in fresh water. I'd buy cat attract (or kitten attract) litter. It's expensive - but for a few weeks, it should help.

You also need to clean up any place she's pooped with an enzyme cleaner. This is the only way to get the scent up in such a way that kitty can no longer smell it. The pooping outside of the box - if not a medical problem (which is sometimes is) - is usually a territory-marking issue. Removing the scent with all of the other steps taken should help curb the behavior.

Focus on reassuring Raimei... and then slowly start reintroducing them. When doing this, do not focus on them meeting so much as them just being in the same room. Fuss over Raimei to no end. Get out the wand toys or the red dot - whatever she really enjoys. See if you can get her focused on play. Let Sushi watch. If she wants to play, have DH play with her (or you play with Sushi while DH plays with Raimei. But you get the idea). Put treats out for them both.

Limit the time at first. Then maybe feed them a meal together - some kind of yummy wet food.

Poor Raimei's had a rough time of it, through no fault of yours.

Explain to her that Sushi had no home and would have died without you, and she doesn't need to like her, she just needs to share some of her space with her.

I'm sure they'll end up being friends. It just needs a little time for Raimei to feel confident that she's not being threatened - and doesn't need to threaten.

Definitely do not scold her for dominating Sushi though. Cats have a hierarchy, and our interfering with it just reinforces that she needs to keep at it. The more attention you give her, the less need she'll have to beat up on Sushi. Sushi curls up in a ball and takes it because she's not trying to challenge Raimei. In the long run this will make it easier, but it is hard to watch. We adopted a very submissive kitty, and we kept wanting him to stick up for himself. It took some time, but it did all work out.

The other thing to consider is that Raimei's around the age she's probably teething. She'll be bitey and need things to chew on. Bendy straws are great - scatter them everywhere. She may be in some pain, which could also be making her cranky. And you may want to consider getting her spayed sooner rather than later if she's not already. If she wasn't already spayed, those hormones may be starting in her, and that would definitely account for the territory marking behavior. In fact - they're both old enough to be spayed. And being at the vet together and recovering together may help them bond a bit.

Just a thought.

Many for you and your babies. And feel free to ask more questions - and I'm sure others will chime in with more ideas.

 

[ldg]

Oh sorry! Another quick thought here. Do you have much vertical space for them? Cats are very 3D, and sometimes just adding vertical space for them (shelves just for them, cat condos, cat trees - even rubbermaid boxes stacked in a pyramid on a wall with holes cut in them so they can go through and up, etc.) can help diffuse territory issues. Scared cat can flee up - alpha cat can BE up.

 

[yosemite]

I admit I just "scanned" Laurie's post but I didn't see her mentioning having more than one litter box. The general rule is one box per cat plus an extra but I've gotten away with 2 boxes for 2 cats.

 

[fetzcatz]

Originally Posted by LDG

First of all, I'm so sorry about the loss of your daughter.

And thank you for rescuing Sushi.

Some questions, and some ideas.

Raimei is ... 16 weeks old? (Four months?) Have both kitties been fully vetted? Vaccinated? Dewormed? Deflead, etc.?

I find it interesting that everything went so well with your friend's cats and Raimei at first. Cats are very territorial, and it's unusual that they get along right away. It could be that Raimei was young enough that at first she wasn't perceived as a threat - but beating up on her is actually a pretty natural part of the process. This is why it's recommended that when introducing new cats to each other, it be done slowly. This way they can get used to the idea that they'll be sharing the space, it gives us time to get them associating each others' scent with "good things," and generally help make the introductions go more smoothly.

The main thing to remember when introducing cats to each other is that you must focus on the resident cat. They've got to think that the new kitty is basically a gift for them - and a new kitty means more love, more attention, more pets, more treats, more play for them (resident kitty). This helps them accept the new one with less trouble.

That said... as they're both young kitties, introductions usually go more quickly. And poor Raimei was traumatized while you were gone.

If I were you, I think I'd consider starting over. I know Sushi's young, but I'd put her in her own room at least for a few days. I'd spend time in there with her, but let Raimei settle down. If she wants love, I'd love on her. If she'd prefer play, I'd do a lot of it, especially with a laser toy or interactive wand toys - the more you get her moving, the more stress she'll work off.

I'd do some scent swapping. Rub Sushi all over with several clean rags or wash cloths. Put one under Raimei's food dish. When you're done with play sessions, put treats down on a "Sushi scented" cloth for Raimei. (Do the same thing with Raimei's scent for Sushi). This will help them associate each other's scent with things they like.

I'd also invest in some Feliway. I'd buy Bach's Rescue Remedy (Flower Essences): put a few drops in their water dishes every day when you clean them and put in fresh water. I'd buy cat attract (or kitten attract) litter. It's expensive - but for a few weeks, it should help.

You also need to clean up any place she's pooped with an enzyme cleaner. This is the only way to get the scent up in such a way that kitty can no longer smell it. The pooping outside of the box - if not a medical problem (which is sometimes is) - is usually a territory-marking issue. Removing the scent with all of the other steps taken should help curb the behavior.

Focus on reassuring Raimei... and then slowly start reintroducing them. When doing this, do not focus on them meeting so much as them just being in the same room. Fuss over Raimei to no end. Get out the wand toys or the red dot - whatever she really enjoys. See if you can get her focused on play. Let Sushi watch. If she wants to play, have DH play with her (or you play with Sushi while DH plays with Raimei. But you get the idea). Put treats out for them both.

Limit the time at first. Then maybe feed them a meal together - some kind of yummy wet food.

Poor Raimei's had a rough time of it, through no fault of yours.

Explain to her that Sushi had no home and would have died without you, and she doesn't need to like her, she just needs to share some of her space with her.

I'm sure they'll end up being friends. It just needs a little time for Raimei to feel confident that she's not being threatened - and doesn't need to threaten.

Definitely do not scold her for dominating Sushi though. Cats have a hierarchy, and our interfering with it just reinforces that she needs to keep at it. The more attention you give her, the less need she'll have to beat up on Sushi. Sushi curls up in a ball and takes it because she's not trying to challenge Raimei. In the long run this will make it easier, but it is hard to watch. We adopted a very submissive kitty, and we kept wanting him to stick up for himself. It took some time, but it did all work out.

The other thing to consider is that Raimei's around the age she's probably teething. She'll be bitey and need things to chew on. Bendy straws are great - scatter them everywhere. She may be in some pain, which could also be making her cranky. And you may want to consider getting her spayed sooner rather than later if she's not already. If she wasn't already spayed, those hormones may be starting in her, and that would definitely account for the territory marking behavior. In fact - they're both old enough to be spayed. And being at the vet together and recovering together may help them bond a bit.

Just a thought.

Many for you and your babies. And feel free to ask more questions - and I'm sure others will chime in with more ideas.

thank you for the advice! and Raimei is fully vaccinated and Dewormed. Sushi has an appointment with the vet for all of that on thursday..... they have not been fixed yet...... Raimei's adoption agency will provide that for free when she reaches 18 weeks old, which i do plan on doing..... Sushi's vet wants to wait until she is at least 16 weeks....

Raimei's attacks on Sushi have been a lot worse this morning. Ill hear Sushi cry out like she's hurt and i can't help but go running to her!

When i get close, Raimei lays her ears back, will then hiss at me and run away to hide. I dont know what else to do so i locked them both in seperate rooms and we will try the introduction thing again. And despite having her own litter box, Raimei continues to use the carpet as her bathroom...... if this continues i may have to find a new home for Sushi. We rent a house and destroying the carpet is not going to fly.

 

[ldg]

Since they have been interacting and sharing litter boxes, it'd be best to deworm Raimei again. Unfortunately, rescue kitties almost always have round worm. To treat round worm, you can use a topical, either Revolution or Advantage Plus. But ANY deworming treatment only kills the adult round worm, so the treatment must be applied three weeks apart for at least two cycles. Just so you don't have problems down the road, I'd treat them both for at least two cycles, each three weeks apart. Because Raimei was already treated at least once, that should suffice. But Sushi I'd treat at least three times.

 

[ldg]

If you haven't seen this thread, you may want to read it: http://www.thecatsite.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=234179