Pet food energetics - cats with allergies

[lisamarie12]

Has anyone had experience with pet food energetics, i.e., hot and cold meats based on Chinese medicine yin / yang?  Meats that are hot (and shouldn't be fed to pets with allergies would be chicken, lamb, venison); cool meats include rabbit and duck. There are neutral meats as well.

Most fish is considered cooling, however, I won't feed my cats fish for the obvious reasons that have been discussed via TCS.

I do a mostly commercial raw with my cats, about 75% and 25% canned (turkey / rabbit) hoping to transition to 100% soon).  I remember when I was feeding Ziwi Peak canned, which is mostly meat based, both venison and lamb, the cats were terribly itchy, as itchy as they were eating chicken (which the vet diagnosed as an allergy).  Maybe it was the green mussels in the food - I don't know if they are allergic to fish.

I found several links (for dogs but useful for cats as well) and I'm just wondering if anyone else has experimented with hot / cold meats with their allergic cats.

http://www.animaldoctormuskego.com/...wledge-of-food-energetics-could-help-your-pet

http://www.dogsnaturallymagazine.com/allergies-food-energetics/

http://pets-1st.com/files/2013/04/Food-Energetics-Brochure-All.pdf

Thanks!

 

[geely]

I have not heard of this before. Thank you for the information. I do have a cat that some time ago was having GI issues and his body  was very warm at that time.  I took him in to the vet and he was put on an elimination diet. We started with rabbit and after a short period of time his body was no longer warm. I had thought of it as a fever but it could have very well been the food as these articles suggest. 

He can now eat chicken and pork though without any issues.

 

[abbyntim]

I ran across this idea about a year ago when Tim was so sick. I am not sure if he has food allergies, but he had a lot of problems that I believe were caused by diet. I eliminated chicken (along with carrageenan and gums) and he rapidly improved. During this time, we tried feeding lamb, but he had a strong reaction to that. At the time, I thought it might be the high fat content, but maybe it was the energetics.

We recently tried feeding Tim chicken and he reacted to it, so I'm not sure if it's the chicken or the fact that it is a warming food. He eats primarily rabbit and turkey, with occasional pork, beef, and salmon, but in very small amounts and never mixed. Tim's stomach is sensitive, so we add things slowly. I intend to add more proteins to his main diet and closely watch his reactions. It will be interesting to see how he does with cooling versus warming foods!

 

[lisamarie12]

 
I have not heard of this before. Thank you for the information. I do have a cat that some time ago was having GI issues and his body  was very warm at that time.  I took him in to the vet and he was put on an elimination diet. We started with rabbit and after a short period of time his body was no longer warm. I had thought of it as a fever but it could have very well been the food as these articles suggest. 

He can now eat chicken and pork though without any issues.

Interesting Geely, that kitty would feel "warm" to the touch.  It could be as a last resort maybe, for pets with allergies, when all else fails.  Thanks for sharing your story.

 

[lisamarie12]

 
I ran across this idea about a year ago when Tim was so sick. I am not sure if he has food allergies, but he had a lot of problems that I believe were caused by diet. I eliminated chicken (along with carrageenan and gums) and he rapidly improved. During this time, we tried feeding lamb, but he had a strong reaction to that. At the time, I thought it might be the high fat content, but maybe it was the energetics.

We recently tried feeding Tim chicken and he reacted to it, so I'm not sure if it's the chicken or the fact that it is a warming food. He eats primarily rabbit and turkey, with occasional pork, beef, and salmon, but in very small amounts and never mixed. Tim's stomach is sensitive, so we add things slowly. I intend to add more proteins to his main diet and closely watch his reactions. It will be interesting to see how he does with cooling versus warming foods!

What kind of  "reaction" to the lamb did Tim have - was it GI related or itchy skin / other? It's fascinating info, food energetics. I've been doing mostly turkey and rabbit for the cats. Turkey is a warming meat though, not a cool meat. I guess it doesn't have to be all or nothing. I thought it was interesting also that the holistic vet site (Muskego), gave the example of the Pomeranian dog with "gooey eyes" advice to avoid duck -- although duck is a cool meat, it is also a damp meat. 

It does require that one really seek out alternate and different proteins so the cats get a variety of proteins, just trying to gauge which would be on the cooler side (if one is to try more novel meats e.g., from Hare Today).  Thanks again for sharing your experience.

 

[abbyntim]

This is interesting. I am glad you started this thread, as the topic is on my mind as I broaden Tim's food choices.

Tim's reactions are always GI. When he was at his sickest, he had many other signs of inflammation (excess heat). Stopping chicken and switching to turkey and rabbit helped a lot. I am confused about turkey, though, as I have seen it characterized as all three (cooling, neutral, and warming), depending on the source. Right now, Tim is doing well on turkey and he loves Rad Cat raw turkey, so I just observe and hope I don't have to stop that protein.

 

[lisamarie12]

AbbyNTim:

It is interesting info and you're right as far as conflicting opinions re: turkey being either cool or warm. I'll search and see what else I can find.  The sites I found, however, all seem to agree that venison, lamb and chicken are on the "hot" side. Interestingly though, many pets with allergies, from what I've read, do well on an elimination diet of venison or lamb. There are all kinds of variables though and food energetics isn't scientific, just based on ancient Chinese principles of yin / yang. To what extent do e.g., denatured proteins affect allergies -- that some pets are allergic to any kind of cooked chicken, but do fine on raw chicken is also an issue.

As it applies to humans, it also makes sense. In the summer, we wouldn't want to eat foods that will make us feel even hotter and conversely in the winter, we want to eat foods that warm us up.

If a pet has skin allergies then, eating "hot meats" will exacerbate skin inflammation, as the info seems to suggest. And also, the more processed the food, e.g., kibble, the "hotter" the reaction of any meat, regardless of whether it's a cool meat or not.

It's also interesting how food energetics is applied to "personalities" in pets as well, e.g., that a shy dog could benefit from warm / hot meats, an overly excited pet from cooler meats.

My little guy likes Rad Cat turkey also, I have a hard time getting it locally, but when I feed it he's been okay with it. He also used to have very bad stools, digestive upset, vomiting, etc. and raw has cured those symptoms almost entirely. To make things a bit more complicated, he's also FHV, although he hasn't been tested for herpes, it's what his ophthalmologist suspected. My issue with  him is that he is still having to wear a little custom made cape, to keep him from scratching at lesions on his neck which scab (and itch) and he reopens when I remove the cape to wash.  We hope to get him allergy tested at some point, even though results are only 80% effective, but I'll take the 80% over this long-term guessing game.

Keep me posted on how this goes and I will also, if I find new info, I'll post it to this thread.

Have a great day.

 

[geely]

I wonder too that maybe if a cool meat and a hot meat are feed together or  at different meals, but not too far apart, if that would neutralize it. I was thinking maybe that is why my cat didn't have a problem with chicken. I added it slowly in his diet and was still feeding rabbit as I was adding this protein.  Then I did chicken and pork. I was actually looking to do a new protein here soon and was considering lamb, but now I think I will try the duck instead.

Yes,very interesting stuff.

 

[lisamarie12]

I wanted to pass along a couple of other links I found re: hot, cold and neutral meats. Turkey appears as both cool and neutral (from Evergreen Animal Hospital), while turkey appears as "warm" from the Honest Kitchen's link re: pet food energetics; rabbit is listed as neutral. Egg yolks appear as "hot" from the Evergreen - yikes, Rad Cat)!

http://evergreenpethospital.com/about-us/services/food-energetics.html

The info is re: dogs and feeding raw, however, scroll down to mid page for the list of meats:

http://www.thehonestkitchen.com/thk-blog/feeding-your-dog-a-raw-food-diet/

And this site lists turkey as warm:

http://hawthornevet.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/Food-Therapy-for-Pets.pdf

One last link, short article from a holistic vet discussing food energetics for pets:

http://hawcmonroe.com/2011/07/22/food-and-your-pet-food-energetics/

Have a great evening everyone.

 

[lisamarie12]

 
I wonder too that maybe if a cool meat and a hot meat are feed together or  at different meals, but not too far apart, if that would neutralize it. I was thinking maybe that is why my cat didn't have a problem with chicken. I added it slowly in his diet and was still feeding rabbit as I was adding this protein.  Then I did chicken and pork. I was actually looking to do a new protein here soon and was considering lamb, but now I think I will try the duck instead.

Yes,very interesting stuff.

Interesting Geely, I guess it depends how severe the allergy / protein intolerance is.