Older Cat With Bad Teeth

[colbey]

My elderly aunt has a cat that has had bad teeth for years. She couldn't pay the $600+ to have some of them removed a few years ago; the vet would just periodically prescribe antibiotics. I know that's awful, and I tried to find a place that would do extractions for less, but wasn't able to find anything.
So last week I was visiting her and the cat, Matilda, is SO freaking skinny. Now, she's always been thin, but I mean...I could feel all her bones. My aunt said she'd just been to the vet for her yearly check-up and the vet only gave her 1 shot, because...The vet said she's now too old to be able to handle the anesthetic, so......
But Matilda is still happy. She loved having me pet her, and jumped up on the table (which she's always done). She used to go out and roam the yard for a bit (the days when she could sneak out), but my aunt says she hasn't been out for awhile. She made a couple attempts to get out while I was there, but I wonder if she isn't just feeling tired because she's simply not getting enough nutrition.
My aunt says Matilda is 16. She came to live with my aunt when her owner had to move into 'specialized housing.' I doubt there's anything to be done about her teeth now. What I'm hoping to do is to find a way to get more half-way decent calories into her so her remaining time isn't spent suffering.
Right now she only gets ~2 small cans of food a day. It gets very watered down because someone told me aunt she needed to add a lot of water to it. Some, yes, but I haven't got my aunt to stop adding quite so much. It's so runny, and then it dries in the bowl. If I scrap the food up into a pile, Matilda will usually eat some more.
I have a tube of Cat-Cal that I'm going to take to her. If she likes it, that would at least be some more calories. Right now she's only eating fish-flavored food, so I bought some canned salmon (the tuna all seems to have vegetable broth in it now). The salmon has salt, but...choices. Extra calories, or no salt...
What I want to do is pick up a dry food so that Matilda at least has that as an option at all times. I broke in half about 10 of the semi-soft cat treats ("Irresistables" I think they're called). Matilda gobbled them down. She'd try to "chew" them once, then swallow. My aunt says she's never thrown up her food or her treats.
So I'm thinking that a hard or semi-soft food that's small in size. That way she can swallow them whole, but hopefully be able to digest them okay. Something high in calories. But not a prescription, as I don't know that I could get the vet to give her one, since he hasn't already.
My aunt is also fairly sick, so I can't come up with something that involves a lot of work. I live an hour away so can't go very often. CNAs and a "helper" are in every day; I'm sure the helper will do some cat feeding, and the CNAs might too, but likely nothing like cooking homemade cat food.
Does anyone have any suggestions?
I can go to a local pet store here and ask them, but it can be hit-or-miss on who's working at the time. Oh, Matilda's canned food is...either Friskies or Fancy Feast. Has been for years. But the fact that she ate so many broken-in-half treats before stopping made me wonder why not give her some hard/hard-ish food?
I do want to mention that as far as I know, Matilda hasn't ever been diagnosed with any cat diseases. She doesn't take any medication other than the occasional antibiotic.
Sorry this is so long. I'm not sure what would be useful to know.
Thank you so much for any suggestions!

 

[mrsgreenjeens]

When was the last time Matilda had bloodwork done? You said she got a shot recently, but I wonder if they actually checked her for all the senior diseases like kidney, thyroid, diabetes?

Anyway, back to your question. If your Aunt could add an egg yolk to her wet food a several times a week, that would be wonderful protein and calories and should help fatten her up and be much better than dry food. The yolk can be blended right into the food. Most cats enjoy the taste. It can be raw or cooked. Or even an entire egg, as long as it's cooked. Or a higher calorie wet food. With older cats, dry food can cause constipation, especially since she's used to eating watered down wet food. I supposed adding in dry food is not a bad idea, as long as she continues to eat her other food as well.

 

[Lalka]

What about the gravy type of canned food/pouches with small pieces of meat in it?

 

[colbey]

thank you both! sorry for the delay. getting online is sometimes problematic for me.
the egg idea is very helpful. i'd read that cats should/could be given eggs, but that site recommended the whites only, and then only if cooked. i can't remember why it said "no" to the yolks. i don't think it was just something about calories, because that wouldn't have made me think i shouldn't give them to her. but, again, it's not likely that whatever the 'issue' was would be horrendous for Matilda right now. (famous last words, right.) i was going to cook up 2 egg whites and a yolk tomorrow to take to her. if there's no white, (or as little as possible) then the egg yolk can be stirred into her food raw? (if she'll eat it.)
anyway, it sounds like a good idea to get more food/calories into her.

after posting, i remembered those pouches of food they used to sell. my cats rarely got them as a treat. they were small, pellet-like chunks that were...moist. so kinda between wet and dry food. i'm going to see if they still sell that and pick some up. maybe that would be easily digestible, yet could still sit out most of the time.
i also remembered about baby food, and am going to pick up some Gerber 1st meats jars. they probably don't have fish flavor (i don't remember fish flavor from last time i had to buy it). but that could be some more calories.
and i found a can of Royal Canin Recovery RS here from when Blue wasn't eating well. it's still good (and unopened, lol), so hopefully Matilda will like it. if i'm remembering correctly, it's supposed to be very high calorie. if she likes it, i'll get some more. somehow. probably HAVE to talk to her vet then.

honestly, i don't know much about Matilda's history/health history. i don't know when she had blood checked for those other 'typical' diseases. i guess i was just assuming she didn't have any health problems because 1) my aunt has never mentioned any medicines and/or special foods she should be eating, and 2) my aunt, i think, thinks of me as "the cat person." she knows i've had cats for years, and has often asked my opinion on different issues.
i suppose i could try and talk to her vet. i think i've been to that clinic many years ago.

Lalka - that's what she's been eating for years. the cans of food. sometimes she gets the stuff with chunks and gravy, but usually she gets the pates. she does really like the cans with the cheese in them, so thanks for reminding me and i'll pick her up some of those tomorrow.

i just built her a little "feeding stand" so i'm going to take that over there tomorrow/today with some food, and see how they're doing.

thank you!!

 

[xcourtney3]

I would try a kitten dry food

 

[colbey]

Thank you! I didn't find the 'pouch' food i remembered. (i think it's kinda been 'replaced' by the newer freeze-dried food?)
But Fancy Feast has a dry food that has pretty small pieces, so i bought that. Matilda was ready for supper when I got there. She wouldn't eat the Cat-Cal stuff, but it was on my finger and a lot of cats won't eat off or out of fingers. I wiped it on the edge of her food bowl then but she still wouldn't eat it.
She did dig into the RS food when i put it down. Of course, when i put some 'cheesy' FF in there, too, she switched over to that, lol. She also ate some of the FF kibble. I told my aunt that the goal was just to get more calories in her. Without making her sick.
I left 4 jars of 1st meats baby food, a bunch of the cheesy food, 3 cans of salmon (no veggie broth), and the Cat-Cal (which ended up mixed in the RS food so i'm betting it got eaten later). And I did grab a few cans of FF kitten food, thinking it might have even more calories. I didn't see any kitten hard food, but I was just at the grocery store. I can see that it might have more calories, be smaller pieces, and be easier to digest? I can check the local pet store, which stocks a lot of types of food.

I did ask my aunt if Matilda has ever been diagnosed with anything, and she said no. Just the bad teeth.
It was good to see her eat the 3 types of food I put down. I still feel bad that her teeth must hurt all the time.

 

[NewYork1303]

It sounds like she might have kidney problems. My great aunt just lost her 17 year old cat to the same thing. The cat just kept losing weight and it wasn't interested in eating extra calories. The only thing she would eat in the end was Temptations cat treats.

Has the amount she has been eating changed? Out of the two cans of food how much does she eat?

 

[colbey]

one of my cats died from kidney disease. it was a long, slow death (she basically starved to death). her brother died from fatty liver disease (the surgery to put in an abdominal feeding tube killed him--blood clot likely hit his lung in the morning when he started moving). so i know i'm just really jumpy about cats that seem too thin.
but...Matilda has always been skinny. since i don't live there, and don't even get over there often, it's hard for me to know anything for sure. i think she gets 2 3-oz cans of food a day, and i think she eats most of that. my aunt seemed a bit concerned because she wasn't finishing her food lately. (that's why i think she usually finished it.)

however...she has this large dual-bowl feeding thing. the bowl is too deep for a small cat, and the food gets pressed down into and then she can't get it out. i'm going to take 2 smaller bowls and just get rid of that damn thing. the bowls i have are much less deep, and smaller overall, so it should be easier for Matilda to get the food. i built a stand so that my aunt won't have to bend over quite so far so maybe she can scrape/loosen the food up a bit more.
i added the hard food just so can eat whenever she wants--without having to hope it's loose enough to get at.

as i mentioned, she's still quite happy--purrs a lot when petted. she goes out on the screened-in porch and gets up in her chair. and she can jump from the floor onto the kitchen table, so she hasn't lost the energy for that. (which both of my 2 cats wouldn't have been able to do that, especially when they were as thin as Matilda is now.)

i know that..."finicky" eating for kidney disease. my girl would seem really interested when i'd put something down, but then not actually eat more than a few licks. Matilda didn't do that, which really encouraged me.

she goes to the same vet that the previous owner took her to. i've not heard bad things about this vet clinic, so i can't imagine they wouldn't check for obvious things like kidney disease or fatty liver disease on a cat that's obviously thin. i know the vet recommended having multiple teeth removed a bit over a year ago, but...as i wrote...money. and now he says she's too old.

maybe i'll call the clinic and see if they'll talk to me about Matilda at all. since i'm not the owner, i don't know if they will.

 

[cheesycats]

Idk if you have a Petco near you, or a grocery store that has pet products but the brand freshpet has bagged soft kibbles. You just put in the fridge. And pour them out into a bowl at feeding time. I belive they’re a bit high calorie and smelly and also have egg in the recipe of some of them. Just a thought for some extra calories. Hopefully she doesn’t end up with the kidney issues.

 

[stiv]

I know how it is to be unable to afford veterinary procedures, you said your aunt's pretty ill, and it's hard to scrap up money when you're disabled in any way. Still, I hope Matilda had some bloodwork done at the vet - dental disease can lead to heart and kidney disease and it's very important to be on the lookout for that, especially if she's 16, and since she's so skinny I also hope her thyroid levels were checked. You said you hadn't heard a bad thing about this particular vet and that they were already familiar with her before your aunt took her in, so I imagine they did do all that, but it's good to double-check. But if your aunt can't answer that for you, vets are bound to similar confidentiality laws as human doctors, so it may be a bit hard for you to find out.
Cats with bad teeth are very often still able to eat dry food, as most cats don't really chew their food. However it's better for all cats and especially older ones to get more water into them - just maybe not as much as your aunt is adding but dry food does tend to be high in calories so I don't think it could hurt to offer it to her.
You said she only eats fish flavored food - Kong makes a treat paste that's salmon-flavored. It's designed for use with a kitty kong toy, but you could see if she'll eat it off your finger or a plate. You could try that if she doesn't like the cat-cal. Maybe not as nutritious, but it's calories.
Baby food is a good idea - that was the only way we could get my mom's aby to eat when his kidneys unfortunately failed. Kitten food might be worth a shot too - higher calories. The freshpet mentioned by cheesycats is also a great idea, and is one of the more high quality foods you could offer. It's basically meat pellets. They also make treats that are similar. I don't know too much about petco's store layout but petsmart tends to have all the cat food on one side of the store and the freshpet can be found in a little refrigerated section.
Also, using a plate or saucer is probably better than using a bowl! Cats can get whisker fatigue from pulling their whiskers back eating from a bowl. Since her bowl is so deep, I imagine that may contribute a small bit to her lack of appetite. It's not so pleasant for them to have to pull their whiskers back!
I can't say for sure that Matilda doesn't have kidney disease but she sounds a lot less finicky than what I've experienced with cats with renal failure. Some cats just tend to lose their appetite and thus lose weight as they age, and if she was always skinny it can look a bit alarming. Once had a cat who got alarmingly skinny around age 11-12, but had nothing wrong with her and lived another 3-4 years like that.

 

[colbey]

Thank you both!! There's both a Petco and a Petsmart around here. (our local pet store chain is called Mounds.) Thanks for telling me the Freshpet is in the refrigerated section. I'll definitely look for it and check it out. (and i have another thread here about maybe switching my own cat to a different dry food, so maybe it would be good for her.)
Matilda has very long hair (which is, sadly, usually somewhat matted). So you can't tell how skinny she is until you start petting her. I just had the idea that maybe I'd ask my sister to go there with me, and we might be able to cut or shave much of her hair off. Wrong time of year, I know, but I'd think she'd feel so much better. My sister shaves her own cats, so she's got the tool and the experience. Does that sound really dumb??

I know about the whisker thing, so I try to buy "bowls" that are pretty shallow and wide. So I think if I take over the 2 other bowls and set them up, that it might help. I actually put her canned food, this last time, in a smaller, shallower 'tupperware' container, then set a small 'tupperware' container under it in the large bowl to bring it up higher.

The dry food I set out is not to replace the wet food, just to supplement it. So Matilda can eat whenever she wants a few bites, even if the canned food is smushed down and kinda dried. I also took 4 new bags of the treats she likes, so she'll get some of those.

I know I looked at some of the freeze-dried foods a year ago (for my Blue), but if I remember right, you need to soak/rehydrate them. And that seemed too much for my aunt right now. So the Freshpet might be great.
I wish I'd known about baby food when my sick girl got so bad. It is so hard to watch them starve to death. To know that they're hungry, but nothing you offer them can 'win' over the nausea and inappetence.

And I'll try stopping in at the clinic. Matilda just went in for her yearly (where the vet only gave her 1 shot), and an 'aide' took her in. So they know my aunt is struggling. Maybe face-to-face they'll talk to me a bit. They could even call my aunt while I'm there. Worth a shot, I guess.
Then I can find out if they've checked all the things people have mentioned.

Again, thank you SO MUCH!

 

[stiv]

Honestly, if her fur is matted, I think being shaved would bring Matilda a lot of relief, even if she might not be so happy with the process itself. It doesn't sound dumb at all. I personally own a pair of low-decibel pet clippers to do my Autumn's sanitary shave because she's overweight and needs it done so regularly that it was more cost-effective to buy $20 clippers than pay $20 a month just to shave her butt.
You're so welcome! The freshpet is good stuff, I haven't personally bought it (yet) but I work in the petshotel and it's becoming an increasingly popular choice for people to feed to both cats and dogs. here's a list of ingredients (not including the added vitamins) of one formulation:
Chicken, Chicken Liver, Ocean Whitefish, Natural Flavors, Carrots, Eggs, Spinach, Pea Protein, Pea Fiber, Vinegar, Salt, Potassium Chloride, Beta-Carotene, Taurine, Celery Powder.
All of the first ingredients are MEAT, no corn gluten or carrageenan. I'm having trouble coming up with a consistent price online for ANY of the freshpet foods (everything says "In-Store Only" with no price) but I could check for sure when I go back to work on Monday. One website says about $11/3.5 lb for one of their dog foods, which is a little pricey but not terribly so. I'd imagine the cat food is a similar price.
I've had to prepare the freezedried food before, you just throw water on it, but you know your aunt and her abilities better than I do.
It's terribly tragic and very hard to watch a cat starve due to underlying illness. My mom's poor aby hadn't eaten in days when we gave him the baby food, and we had only thought to give it to him because he was very spoiled and had eaten it his whole life as a special treat. Not the first thing you think of if you don't feed your cat baby food to begin with.
I would say having them call your aunt or having your aunt call them while you're there is your best bet. If she went for a yearly well-cat visit it's extremely likely she's had a blood panel done, but it's always good to make sure. Autumn's only 12 and they do a blood panel every visit regardless of why we're there due to her age.

 

[colbey]

well, just to wrap this up. fyi, this post doesn't have a happy ending.

i did stop by the vet clinic the other day. they had just closed, but i caught one of the vet techs in the parking lot. as we thought, she couldn't discuss Matilda directly unless my aunt called and gave permission. but we talked for a few minutes, and she had some very good ideas that i wanted to share here because i'd never heard them before.
she 'knew' Matilda, and when i said i didn't necessarily need to know particulars about her test results, etc., but was more simply concerned over whether i might offer her food that would, somehow, be bad for her, the tech said i could just feed her whatever she would eat. which i took to mean 1) she had no underlying issues, like diabetes/whatever, that would require a special diet, and 2) whatever she wanted to eat could only help her to not suffer too much at this point.

she did say that if a cat has a tendency to bring up hard food, it's probably because 1) they eat it too fast, and/or 2) they eat too much of it. because Matilda had actually walked away from a couple treats, she seemed to know when to stop.
the tech said that for some cats, if they eat hard food too fast (or too much), because it's dry and small it gets in their stomach and absorbs moisture and "blows up" so that their stomach is then over-full and they bring it up.
that was interesting, and i'd never heard that as an explanation before.

the tech recommended, for those cats (or any) to slightly wet any dry kibble. she said for Matilda i could try sprinkling some CatSip on the dry food i was putting out. but she said water would be good too.
(which brought up a question i've had before--is CatSip the same as lactaid-free milk? or whatever that milk is for lactose-intolerant people?)

as for shaving her--she said i definitely should NOT. because of her age, she thought Matilda's skin would be too thin/fragile. when i mentioned cutting out the mats, she warned me about the dangers of using scissors (the animal moves suddenly and you accidentally cut them), which i was aware of. and she said we wouldn't be able to get the mats out without going very close to the skin because that's where they start.
she said we could try taking some of the longer hair off with scissors if we were very careful. and then she said a "greyhound comb" and a slicker brush would work best. she said to turn the greyhound comb so that you would be pulling it "sideways" through a knotted area, rather than trying to use it as a comb. and to do that until much of each knotted area was out/loose, then gently use the slicker brush.
so that was also new--and very good-to-know--information.

but i hadn't made it over there with Fresh Pet kibble for Matilda to try. and it turns out my aunt didn't have my correct phone number, so she couldn't have called if Matilda was throwing up a lot or something.
because, sadly, my aunt did try to call me--she had to have Matilda...'put to sleep' a couple days ago. she finally called my mom and my mom just called and told me. apparently Matilda hadn't eaten anything or pooped for a couple days. my aunt had one of the nurse's aides take her in to the vet, and he said it "was time."

so...i don't know if i helped or hurt Matilda. i don't know if the extra food i put down (especially the dry food) caused a problem that led to this.
i certainly didn't mean to cause any harm. but my experiences have taught me that doesn't seem to matter. we, or at least i, cause harm even when we don't mean to. but that's mostly my sorrow speaking, i guess.

thank you all very much for all the help.

 

[Cataria]

Oh no! *hugs* I'm so, so sorry. Honestly, I can't think of a reason why you putting down the extra food would have caused a problem; I think she just had other issues that were never diagnosed. She was going downhill even before you tried to help and remember even the vet tech said you could offer her whatever she would eat, so I don't think anything you did caused more problems.

 

[mrsgreenjeens]

Oh no! *hugs* I'm so, so sorry. Honestly, I can't think of a reason why you putting down the extra food would have caused a problem; I think she just had other issues that were never diagnosed. She was going downhill even before you tried to help and remember even the vet tech said you could offer her whatever she would eat, so I don't think anything you did caused more problems.

I agree. Please don't blame yourself .

Run free at the bridge, Matilda

 

[colbey]

thank you so much, Cataria and Mrs.Greenjeens.
i know when i was there a month ago and noticed HOW thin she was, i left my aunt's house that day thinking they were both so very close to the end. (my aunt was recently put on, what i believe, is absolutely the wrong medication, and it was having some major negative effects that day.)
mostly i worry because i was told that Matilda stopped pooping and eating, but i don't know in what order, and i worry that the hard food may have constipated her so much that she stopped eating altogether. but, when i couldn't find the "pouch" food in the store that i remembered, i bought the Fancy Feast hard food. partly because it was a smaller bag (to try), but mostly because Fancy Feast is what she ate canned every day.

so i mostly think it wasn't the food, and maybe she just got a week or so of having some food that tasted pretty damn good (i don't know if she got fed the baby food, or more of the cheesy canned food she loved), and maybe she didn't feel quite so hungry until the last 2 or 3 days.
but it really helps to hear it from others. thank you.