New to raw, seeking advise

[TortieCat]

Hi all, I’ve been reading a lot about raw feeding for cats, I wanted to say thank you to all the people here who have put together a lot of helpful links and resources. I do, however still have questions and hoping to get some help or pointed in the right direction.

I have two cats (3 yo and 6 yo, both are rescues and I want to give them the best diet I can afford). Currently, they eat canned food (weruva, fancy feast, I and love and you, tiki cat, and sometimes other brands for more variety). I also use Ziwi air dried food sometimes. I’ve started adding some freeze dried raw foods into their meals (got some samples from my local pet store) as a way to introduce them to raw foods. So far they’re both doing well, one cat likes it a lot more than the other though . The prices for commercial raw food are quite high, so I want to make my own cat food but I'm scared of doing it wrong and hurting my fur babies.

What would be the safest way to provide benefits of raw food to my cats while making sure they get all the vitamins/minerals etc in the amounts they need? Can I give them both canned and raw food, either in the same feeding or separate feedings? I'd like to keep using canned foods as a backup in case I can't give them raw for some reason.

For raw food, is it safe to buy commercially made frozen or freeze dried, such as Northwest Naturals, or a subscription like Viva, or what would be a good brand?
If I try making the food myself, would it be easier to buy meat/organs and use a premix? What is a good premix to use? I'm also quite confused about the whole bone issue, should I use raw bones or just use a supplement that has calcium and phosphorus in it? What if I want to occasionally give them a chicken wing tip or a foot for dental health, would that add too much bone to the diet?

I've read that many people use Dr Pearson's recipe, but I can't find if anyone has been using it long term and had good success. Is it a good recipe to use? Can it be used with other meats besides chicken?

Thanks everyone in advance!

 

[Tobermory]

Okay. Let’s see what I can do here!

What would be the safest way to provide benefits of raw food to my cats while making sure they get all the vitamins/minerals etc in the amounts they need?

The safest way for you and your cats would be commercial raw, either freeze-dried or frozen.

Can I give them both canned and raw food, either in the same feeding or separate feedings?

If they’ll eat it, sure! Mine get canned in the morning and freeze-dried raw in the evening. They’d also eat it if I mixed it, but mine aren’t particularly picky.

For raw food, is it safe to buy commercially made frozen or freeze dried, such as Northwest Naturals, or a subscription like Viva, or what would be a good brand?

The cats’ evening meal is Northwest Naturals freeze-dried raw. They love it. I’ve tried Stella & Chewy freeze-dried, which they also liked, and Primal frozen which they tolerated. They don’t really care for the frozen. I’ve stayed with NW Naturals because the bone content is 7% versus S&C’s 10%. Both mine are prone to constipation and the lower bone content works better for them.

If I try making the food myself, would it be easier to buy meat/organs and use a premix? What is a good premix to use?

Absolutely! Much easier! I’ve used both EZ Complete and Alnutrin with Eggshell Calcium. Many people make food—I used Dr. Pierson’s recipe for five years. Be aware that it is extremely labor intensive and you’ll need a grinder. And it must be done exactly right or you put your cats and yourself (handling raw meat) at risk. No shortcuts on supplements and meat handling.

I'm also quite confused about the whole bone issue, should I use raw bones or just use a supplement that has calcium and phosphorus in it?

I started out grinding bone-in meat, but my grinder would handle only chicken bones, nothing heavier. And I got lazy about grinding bones. I switched to making and using eggshell calcium.

I've read that many people use Dr Pearson's recipe, but I can't find if anyone has been using it long term and had good success. Is it a good recipe to use? Can it be used with other meats besides chicken?

As I said, I used Dr. P’s recipe for five years and my cats thrived on it. I used chicken, turkey, and pork. I tried rabbit but my cats were kind of indifferent to it and since it’s extremely expensive, I stopped using it. If they weren’t gonna be enthusiastic about it, I decided they could do without rabbit meat that cost $16 a pound!

I stopped making their food because it just got to be too much work for me.

I hope I didn’t forget anything you asked!

 

[TortieCat]

Tobermory thank you so much! I feel better and more confident now. Can I ask couple more questions please. Why would one choose Alnutrin with Calcium or Alnutrin with Eggshell Calcium? Is it just a flavor difference that some cats prefer one over another?

And if using premixes, can I mix meats in the same recipe, for example, chicken meat and Turkey meat, or Turkey meat with chicken lever, and add a few chicken hearts?

 

[Tobermory]

Why would one choose Alnutrin with Calcium or Alnutrin with Eggshell Calcium?

Alnutrin with calcium is only eggshell. Their other version is for those who want to include their own bone. (Well, not their bone, but you know what I mean. )

can I mix meats in the same recipe

I’ve mixed different proteins before, particularly when I didn’t have enough to make a whole recipe. My cats never complained. And I always used chicken livers, regardless of which protein I was preparing.

You might be interested in a site that used to exist on its own (feline-nutrition.org) but is now archived on the Hare Today site. Lots of useful info.
Feline Nutrition - Feline Nutrition Home Page | Hare Today

 

[TortieCat]

I see! Thanks so much for taking the time to explain it all! It seems like one of my cats prefers the freeze dried raw food while the other likes frozen raw food as well (she’s not very picky, which makes it easier for me). I’ll order Alnutrin and see how they like it, fingers crossed

 

[Tobermory]

You’ll still have to get involved with grinding meat with Alnutrin, unless you buy proteins from Hare Today or another provider of grinds for pets. When I started making food, I used my food processor until I was sure my cats would eat it and I wanted to make the commitment. After that, I bought a grinder.

 

[TortieCat]

Yes I have a grinder attachment for my kitchen aid mixer, so I’m planning to use that at first and see if they like the food. And if they like it, I’ll get a grinder as their Christmas present

I’m also planning to add some chopped meat to the ground mix later so they can chomp on it and clean their teeth

 

[oyster]

I would like to chime in and inform you that it is a huge time commitment. Make sure you really want to do it.
Also, make sure the supplements are given in the correct amounts or you could be doing a lot more harm.
I chose to chop meat to help with teeth as my last two cats had huge dental issues. I also give my cats, raw meaty bones. One eats it with no issues and the other one, eats it occasionally.
I did a lot of research and read all the nutrition information on various web sites, yet still decided to hire a nutritionist specifically for cat nutrition to help fine tune my own recipes.

 

[TortieCat]

oyster thank you! Yes I understand and that’s why I’m not planning to go 100% raw, at least not at this time. I’m planning to do a combination of canned food, commercially made raw (freeze dried) and homemade raw which I’ll make using Alnutrin premix with eggshell calcium. I think that’ll be safe while still giving them the benefits of raw food.
How did you find and hire a cat nutritionist? I tried looking for one and seems like there’s not many available around here and they all need a referral from the vet

 

[oyster]

Gotcha! I have read that you shouldn't feed raw and canned food together in one sitting. I am sure you know that, already.
I found one through a blog. She is European who speaks fluent English and she makes recipes for cats only. She also has a youtube channel-- The Little Carnivore. (Use the CC settings in English). Or you can read her very detailed blog and figure it out yourself. She has (free) handy calculators on it which should help with most of the nutrients needed for your cats.
I also tried the recipe maker from Mariah@ Paws of Prey which was very user friendly. I just chose to use Coline --The Little Carnivore because she does individualized recipes and offers 3 months of follow up with any personal questions. I was really happy with her service.
I went through all this trouble and money because I had two elderly cats who suffered greatly due to dental issues even though they ate grain free canned food all their lives. One of them died of a tumor and the other one, of medical negligence but he had had bad teeth and CKD. He had hyperthyroidism, as well but he was treated for that with iodine radiotherapy. Overall, all these treatments cost us well over $10K so I learned my lesson and am trying to avoid those mistakes with the younger generation of cats.

 

[TortieCat]

I'm sorry about your cats' health issues. I hope the younger generation of cats are doing much better though. I'm also trying to give my cats the best food that I can reasonably make/afford so they can be healthy and hopefully avoid future problems especially as they get older. And I want to improve their dental health as well, as one of my cats needed a dental cleaning last year. I'm trying to brush their teeth but it doesn't always go well. But I'll keep trying and yes I plan on feeding them canned food for breakfast, raw food for dinner, but lunch would depend on how much time I have - could be one or the other, depends on the day.

I did read The Little Carnivore website too! I didn't know she was offering nutritional consultations, there's no mention of it on the website. I'll email her and ask if she still does it. Thank you!