Neighbor filed an animal abuse report on me

moxiewild

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Ugh. Where to start.

On November 1st/Sunday, when I went to one of our colony sites to pick up the bowls and the game camera I set by the bowls to keep an eye on the cats, someone had stolen all of it. (Bowls and camera are only left there for 30 minutes before I come to get them).

No one has messed with the bowls again the past two days, but today when I was picking them up, a man literally ran at me, screaming.

I had talked to two neighbors in this area previously. I told them what I was doing, and gave one of them the name of the local low cost spay/neuter clinic I was taking a trapped cat to that morning, since he seemed concerned.

This angry neighbor had clearly spoken to that one because he screamed that he checked and I “did not work there.”

I calmly explained that I never said I worked there, it was simply the clinic I was taking them to, as that is all they are - a vet clinic, not a rescue organization (in fact, that other guy had specifically asked if I worked there, and I explicitly clarified this, and explained I do this on my own time and dime...).

This man continued to yell quite aggressively at me and would not listen to anything I was trying to say.

He said he’s a former cop and he knows where I live and my name, and repeatedly shouted my address and name at me (although he had my name a bit wrong).

When I did manage to get a word in, he cut me off, shouted he didn’t believe me, demanded I tell him where some neighbor’s missing cat is, and accused me of hurting his two outdoor cats.

He told me that he’s “already opened up a case” on me, filed an animal abuse report on me, told me I’m already being investigated, submitted my camera for evidence, told me I wouldn’t get away with this, said I was disgusting, vile, creepy, etc

He then made a beeline for my car and stuck his head in the open window while screaming “Do you have any cats in here right now?!”

The entire time I was trying to deescalate, calmly empathize with his concerns, and explain what I was doing, but he just was not having it - he just kept cutting me off or shouting over me every time I attempted to speak.

After about five (frankly terrifying) minutes, I finally managed to calm him down enough to get a word in.

I told him I understood his concern, especially since he had two outdoor cats of his own that were frequently in the same area.

But I assured him of what we were doing and that I was not trapping his cats, briefly explained TNR, and encouraged him to Google it (the only reason I didn’t comprehensively explain it is because I was already having trouble getting words in as is).

He again stated his two cats have shown up in the past couple of months with injuries, so he knows what I said is not true.

I told him one of the reasons we neuter the males is to decrease aggression, and that his cats may have been injured by one of those we haven’t been able to neuter yet.

He said he didn’t believe that, because one of them had a paw injury that was “really suspicious.”

He seemed under the impression that I only started caring for this colony recently, but I have been doing so for about 6 months now (long before his cats were injured).

I explained I also hadn’t trapped there in a while (we target females first, and we’d already spayed all the females there, so now we’re working on the females in another nearby colony), and that I only use humane traps that do not harm the cats.

I finally persuaded him to take my contact information (he kept refusing this throughout the conversation prior, angrily stating he didn’t need it because he already knows where I live...), and gave him the name of the spay/neuter clinic, as well as my primary vet clinic (which is where we take kittens, friendly cats, and injured ferals - they are well aware of what we do, and fully support us).

Still angry, he shouted that he doesn’t like animals being hurt, and that he was going to check into things, and if everything was on the up and up, he would apologize (he managed to somehow say this in the least civil way possible).

After this conversation, I knew I had to contact my clinics to give them permission to confirm my status as a client and vouch for me.

But to add insult to injury -

I called the spay/neuter clinic, and explained the situation - guy doesn’t know what TNR is, doesn’t believe me, and is convinced I’m hurting cats, can you please verify to him that TNR is a legitimate practice and that I am a client of your clinic?

The woman said someone did, in fact, call yesterday to ask if I worked there - so they therefore were not going to be involved. She said this in an obviously accusatory manor.

When I tried to explain that I never said I worked there, that one of the neighbors was clearly confused, she became even more terse with me, and just started repeating “we are not going to get involved”.

I finally asked to speak to an upper level manager by name - a name I know because I work in rescue and have been going to, and donating to, this clinic for years.

At that point she (very begrudgingly) relented and asked what my name was and looked up my file. Then, in an exasperated tone, said she’ll leave a note to confirm that I’m a client if he calls.

Honestly, I just wanted to scream.

This clinic claims to advocate for community cats and their caretakers, but this employee was completely ready to just throw me under the bus without question.

Before talking to her, I had no doubt it would be an easy conversation - after all, it was with my regular practice vet, and pretty much the only time they ever deal with ferals is when I bring one in.

You would think a place that literally caters to community cats and promotes TNR would be more understanding. As individuals, caretakers cannot do what we do without these clinics and organizations having our backs.

First thing she should have done is ask for my name so that she could see I’m a weekly freaking client there.

After the awful and terrifying encounter with the neighbor, I expected the clinic to have my back and support me. And I know it’s just a single employee, but man, it hurt.



So, here I am. Because I know you guys will listen to me, and will support me. And I know you all understand.
 

BellaGooch

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I am so sorry that you had to go through this! Are you okay? You are in my thoughts and prayers! :grouphug::heartshape:
 
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moxiewild

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Additional gripe -

I cannot tell you how upsetting it is to have this neighbor blame me for things that are inherent risks of having “outdoor cats.”

Your cats were injured, and the other neighbor’s cat disappeared, because you let them roam around outside freely.

And here I am, trying to reduce the outdoor and homeless cat population to reduce such suffering, and you have the nerve to blame me for your irresponsible decisions as a pet owner?

:fuming:
 
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moxiewild

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I am so sorry that you had to go through this! Are you okay? You are in my thoughts and prayers! :grouphug::heartshape:
Thank you!

I’m an still shaken, and obviously concerned, for multiple reasons.

I am normally so ecstatic when someone is apprehensive and so concerned about the wellbeing of the cats that they want to ensure I’m not doing them any harm by actually calling the clinic to verify my story.

When you have so many bad experiences with people who hate cats and don’t want them there, these people are always such a breath of fresh air that help to restore a little faith in humanity again.

But it’s always been civil before now. They’ve always just asked questions politely, and even the most skeptical are always civil.

This guy was just scary. I’m a young woman, in a semi-secluded area while it’s dark out and most people are still asleep (I go very, very early), and he is yelling at me and threatening me while making aggressive gestures at me and toward me, and he simply just did not let up for minutes of time, and even tried to block my path for my car at certain points.

It was awful. I was just trying to do everything in my power to be nice and agreeable and deescalate the situation.

To be honest, I really hope he was lying about having been a former police officer......

I’m also unsure of whether I should proactively contact the police department in case he really did file a report. This is just something that could do easily be verified and put to rest.

I’ve been advised that I shouldn’t say anything though :/
 

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I am really sorry that this happened to you and I would have been terrified. Why were you advised not to contact the police about a report being filed?

This man is unstable, clearly, to have approached you in the way he did. Even if he wanted the information there were others ways to have asked. Do you think that he is calmed down now? Since you are legit, he might never come at you again, or at least be more civil.

As for the clinic, that is also inexcusable. Maybe since you are very active with the cat community you should ask the clinic to keep a permanent note in your file that your information can be released to anyone who wants to verify what you are doing...up to whatever point you are comfortable doing that.

Four years ago my GSD and I were attacked by a lab mix who ran out of his front door because grandma could not stop him. Two men had to run out with baseball bats and break it up; fortunately Orlando was okay thanks to his huge ruff and identification collar but I was scratched. I asked for rabies identification and they gave me the name of a clinic who told me "they could not be involved." So it did not only happen to you. Since this is LA and everyone sues everyone else as much as possible I told her my attorney's name at which point she decided that she could check the file. I don't know what that is all about.
 

Whenallhellbreakslose

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Ugh. Where to start.

On November 1st/Sunday, when I went to one of our colony sites to pick up the bowls and the game camera I set by the bowls to keep an eye on the cats, someone had stolen all of it. (Bowls and camera are only left there for 30 minutes before I come to get them).

No one has messed with the bowls again the past two days, but today when I was picking them up, a man literally ran at me, screaming.

I had talked to two neighbors in this area previously. I told them what I was doing, and gave one of them the name of the local low cost spay/neuter clinic I was taking a trapped cat to that morning, since he seemed concerned.

This angry neighbor had clearly spoken to that one because he screamed that he checked and I “did not work there.”

I calmly explained that I never said I worked there, it was simply the clinic I was taking them to, as that is all they are - a vet clinic, not a rescue organization (in fact, that other guy had specifically asked if I worked there, and I explicitly clarified this, and explained I do this on my own time and dime...).

This man continued to yell quite aggressively at me and would not listen to anything I was trying to say.

He said he’s a former cop and he knows where I live and my name, and repeatedly shouted my address and name at me (although he had my name a bit wrong).

When I did manage to get a word in, he cut me off, shouted he didn’t believe me, demanded I tell him where some neighbor’s missing cat is, and accused me of hurting his two outdoor cats.

He told me that he’s “already opened up a case” on me, filed an animal abuse report on me, told me I’m already being investigated, submitted my camera for evidence, told me I wouldn’t get away with this, said I was disgusting, vile, creepy, etc

He then made a beeline for my car and stuck his head in the open window while screaming “Do you have any cats in here right now?!”

The entire time I was trying to deescalate, calmly empathize with his concerns, and explain what I was doing, but he just was not having it - he just kept cutting me off or shouting over me every time I attempted to speak.

After about five (frankly terrifying) minutes, I finally managed to calm him down enough to get a word in.

I told him I understood his concern, especially since he had two outdoor cats of his own that were frequently in the same area.

But I assured him of what we were doing and that I was not trapping his cats, briefly explained TNR, and encouraged him to Google it (the only reason I didn’t comprehensively explain it is because I was already having trouble getting words in as is).

He again stated his two cats have shown up in the past couple of months with injuries, so he knows what I said is not true.

I told him one of the reasons we neuter the males is to decrease aggression, and that his cats may have been injured by one of those we haven’t been able to neuter yet.

He said he didn’t believe that, because one of them had a paw injury that was “really suspicious.”

He seemed under the impression that I only started caring for this colony recently, but I have been doing so for about 6 months now (long before his cats were injured).

I explained I also hadn’t trapped there in a while (we target females first, and we’d already spayed all the females there, so now we’re working on the females in another nearby colony), and that I only use humane traps that do not harm the cats.

I finally persuaded him to take my contact information (he kept refusing this throughout the conversation prior, angrily stating he didn’t need it because he already knows where I live...), and gave him the name of the spay/neuter clinic, as well as my primary vet clinic (which is where we take kittens, friendly cats, and injured ferals - they are well aware of what we do, and fully support us).

Still angry, he shouted that he doesn’t like animals being hurt, and that he was going to check into things, and if everything was on the up and up, he would apologize (he managed to somehow say this in the least civil way possible).

After this conversation, I knew I had to contact my clinics to give them permission to confirm my status as a client and vouch for me.

But to add insult to injury -

I called the spay/neuter clinic, and explained the situation - guy doesn’t know what TNR is, doesn’t believe me, and is convinced I’m hurting cats, can you please verify to him that TNR is a legitimate practice and that I am a client of your clinic?

The woman said someone did, in fact, call yesterday to ask if I worked there - so they therefore were not going to be involved. She said this in an obviously accusatory manor.

When I tried to explain that I never said I worked there, that one of the neighbors was clearly confused, she became even more terse with me, and just started repeating “we are not going to get involved”.

I finally asked to speak to an upper level manager by name - a name I know because I work in rescue and have been going to, and donating to, this clinic for years.

At that point she (very begrudgingly) relented and asked what my name was and looked up my file. Then, in an exasperated tone, said she’ll leave a note to confirm that I’m a client if he calls.

Honestly, I just wanted to scream.

This clinic claims to advocate for community cats and their caretakers, but this employee was completely ready to just throw me under the bus without question.

Before talking to her, I had no doubt it would be an easy conversation - after all, it was with my regular practice vet, and pretty much the only time they ever deal with ferals is when I bring one in.

You would think a place that literally caters to community cats and promotes TNR would be more understanding. As individuals, caretakers cannot do what we do without these clinics and organizations having our backs.

First thing she should have done is ask for my name so that she could see I’m a weekly freaking client there.

After the awful and terrifying encounter with the neighbor, I expected the clinic to have my back and support me. And I know it’s just a single employee, but man, it hurt.



So, here I am. Because I know you guys will listen to me, and will support me. And I know you all understand.
Why does us cat caretakers go through such BS? There was my situation not to long ago with a neighbor/feeder who went berserk on me for trying to get cats off the street (at her husband's request) and turned a tnr group against me. Then I heard all sorts of craziness lately with other caretakers getting harassed, attacked and even have the cops called on them. What is this? Open season on caretakers and tnr people?😧

I am so sorry you are going through this. That man sounds like a bit of a psycho. And to add insult to injury was not so much the confusion of the neighbor, but the employee at the vet's office with her couldn't care less attitude. You figure someone there would vouch for you and say that you take kitties there weekly to be tnred and that you are doing a community service by HELPING (tnr) the cats, not hurting them.😬 Does this man have any clue how vicious tom cat fights are? I have seen cats injured from these fights, one cat in particular was always getting into fights and had a wound that turned into an abcess. This cat was a complete mess. Thankfully, he was taken to a clinic where he got wound treatment and was tnred.

I am not surprised the man did not know what TNR is. If he let's his cats out and they are fighting and breeding-- than he is an ignoramus. He shouldn't be attacking someone like a bulldog, not giving them a chance to explain/defend themselves.😡 Is there someone above that snotty employee to vouch for you, perhaps have some fellow tnr/caretakers who can get involved. In my neck of the woods, I take cats to the ASPCA to get tnred for free. Their program has been very helpful. Since this guy will probably call the ASPCA on you, you may want to contact them and explain that your are a local tnr/caretaker and tell them about your encounter with this guy and that he doesn't understand tnr and was very hostile towards you. Have your proof, receipts from clinic, pics of cats, statement from fellow caretakers, etc. This guy will look like a fool if he keeps presenting you as an animal abuser. My goodness of all things to accuse you of!!! The tnr group that got turned against me where blaming me for the fight with neighbor, even though she wrote a nasty email and I wrote one back calling her out her bs and here is the kicker when i mentioned that i am getting mobbed by her cats--the tnr group told me to shoo the cats back (which doesn't work btw) and to STOP taking things out of the cats. WTH! . After, I was the one who was telling them how concerned I was for their welfare and listing the reasons why. Oh dear, It really sucks when people see you in a bad light when you are busting your butt to try to help the cats. SMH in utter dusgust. This guy will never apologize when he finds out you are a decent person helping the cats. So don't expect it. I hope this mess gets cleared up. Please take people with you when you go back there. Do not neglect your safety. This guy sounds very hostile and who knows what he will stoop to.

Hang touch. You are in my thoughts and prayers 🙂
 

Jcatbird

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If he comes at you again, get it on your phone! Video of some sort will be proof you need. Another witness may help too but video is better. Taking another person is advised. For your sake. Perhaps this guy will calm down. Hoping. Do you keep records on each spay and neuter? If not, get a copy from the clinic you use NOW! Keep records. Keep a copy in your car until this is settled.
Who advised you not to report this? Clinic? Family? An officer? I can see that you have no prof so, your word against his right now but an incident report might be important later. Perhaps consult a lawyer? Most lawyers will adobes beforetelling you if you need their services. A lawyer is handy to have “on call.” Just in case. If there is one around who loves animals, that’s a huge plus.
The vets are NOT allowed to give out medical info in the way a doctor can’t. Without permission from you, the employee should not have spoken at all. However, they do need to avoid being dragged into things when they don’t know all the details. If that guy said you claimed to work their she may have just been trying to clear that up but remember that what you got from that guy , she probably got too! People are just so on edge right now that every thing makes them hypersensitive. I’m sure that guy was scary and even more so since he claims to be someone who worked in a highly volatile job. The officers I know tend to be a bit skeptical of most people as a result of working with so many bad things. Not excusing him by any means! No excuse for being hostile without the facts. He’s a bit of a criminal himself if he stole the camera. Was it on private land? Maybe he had permission to take it. Future cameras are things you need to document too. Do you have the make and model number, receipt for the camera? In this case, maybe he will see that you are strictly doing great work to car for the cats. It might be a big plus.
Try to calm your nerves. I know it’s hard. If there is a leash law for cats there, he may not know he should not let his cats roam. Poor cats! Try to work with this guy if you can. Educating him may work. Perhaps you will find he can be recruited to help. Ask! If you put that question to him, he may be surprised or he may just vanish. ;) Turn the tables.
 
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moxiewild

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I am really sorry that this happened to you and I would have been terrified. Why were you advised not to contact the police about a report being filed?

This man is unstable, clearly, to have approached you in the way he did. Even if he wanted the information there were others ways to have asked. Do you think that he is calmed down now? Since you are legit, he might never come at you again, or at least be more civil.

As for the clinic, that is also inexcusable. Maybe since you are very active with the cat community you should ask the clinic to keep a permanent note in your file that your information can be released to anyone who wants to verify what you are doing...up to whatever point you are comfortable doing that.

Four years ago my GSD and I were attacked by a lab mix who ran out of his front door because grandma could not stop him. Two men had to run out with baseball bats and break it up; fortunately Orlando was okay thanks to his huge ruff and identification collar but I was scratched. I asked for rabies identification and they gave me the name of a clinic who told me "they could not be involved." So it did not only happen to you. Since this is LA and everyone sues everyone else as much as possible I told her my attorney's name at which point she decided that she could check the file. I don't know what that is all about.
It wasn’t explained, but I had the impression they thought he could be lying (so don’t bring attention to yourself and the cats), or even if he was telling the truth, the police would decide not to pursue it.

And I definitely think the latter is a good possibility.

The only evidence this guy has is that I feed them and keep a game camera on them (and the camera only has footage of cats eating and maybe a shot or two up my nose from carrying the camera before turning it off 😆). I know for a fact some of the footage on there shows ear tips close up.

And because of the other neighbor who saw me trap, they know where I have them neutered already. So I imagine they’ll just call the clinic and verify I’m a client.

If they search Nextdoor, they’ll find explicit comments from me over the past month about TNRing, as I was helping in several lost cat searches on there.

Same thing for Facebook. Virtually no friends on there, but I’m part hundreds of rescue pages and groups (it’s all I use it for).

Others have now suggested contacting them, though.

And on one hand, I’m leaning toward it. I am violating the city limit with my indoor cats, so I’d rather act preemptively to prevent them from showing up at the house or... finding out otherwise.

So I will probably contact them tomorrow, I suppose.

His reaction really was bizarre, but not in an actually mentally unstable or unhinged sort of way. It’s hard to explain, he just seemed really pissed, and I can understand some freaking out if he truly thought his own cats might be in danger.

But yeah, most people simply ask me questions and talk to me or just leave a note for stuff like this....

I really hope he calms down! He didn’t contact me today, so I don’t know if he called or not. He said it was his day off today, so I would think he would have.

To be honest, I’m holding out hope that he will do a complete 180 and very sincerely apologize, because (ironically) I think he could be a potential ally. He obviously cares about the cats (including the ferals) and has a good relationship with the neighbors.

He even wants to adopt one of my males I haven’t neutered yet.

And yes, I agree, it’s strange for clinics to not want to be “involved” in both our situations when all we’re even asking for is very simple and basic!
 
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moxiewild

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Why does us cat caretakers go through such BS? There was my situation not to long ago with a neighbor/feeder who went berserk on me for trying to get cats off the street (at her husband's request) and turned a tnr group against me. Then I heard all sorts of craziness lately with other caretakers getting harassed, attacked and even have the cops called on them. What is this? Open season on caretakers and tnr people?😧

I am so sorry you are going through this. That man sounds like a bit of a psycho. And to add insult to injury was not so much the confusion of the neighbor, but the employee at the vet's office with her couldn't care less attitude. You figure someone there would vouch for you and say that you take kitties there weekly to be tnred and that you are doing a community service by HELPING (tnr) the cats, not hurting them.😬 Does this man have any clue how vicious tom cat fights are? I have seen cats injured from these fights, one cat in particular was always getting into fights and had a wound that turned into an abcess. This cat was a complete mess. Thankfully, he was taken to a clinic where he got wound treatment and was tnred.

I am not surprised the man did not know what TNR is. If he let's his cats out and they are fighting and breeding-- than he is an ignoramus. He shouldn't be attacking someone like a bulldog, not giving them a chance to explain/defend themselves.😡 Is there someone above that snotty employee to vouch for you, perhaps have some fellow tnr/caretakers who can get involved. In my neck of the woods, I take cats to the ASPCA to get tnred for free. Their program has been very helpful. Since this guy will probably call the ASPCA on you, you may want to contact them and explain that your are a local tnr/caretaker and tell them about your encounter with this guy and that he doesn't understand tnr and was very hostile towards you. Have your proof, receipts from clinic, pics of cats, statement from fellow caretakers, etc. This guy will look like a fool if he keeps presenting you as an animal abuser. My goodness of all things to accuse you of!!! The tnr group that got turned against me where blaming me for the fight with neighbor, even though she wrote a nasty email and I wrote one back calling her out her bs and here is the kicker when i mentioned that i am getting mobbed by her cats--the tnr group told me to shoo the cats back (which doesn't work btw) and to STOP taking things out of the cats. WTH! . After, I was the one who was telling them how concerned I was for their welfare and listing the reasons why. Oh dear, It really sucks when people see you in a bad light when you are busting your butt to try to help the cats. SMH in utter dusgust. This guy will never apologize when he finds out you are a decent person helping the cats. So don't expect it. I hope this mess gets cleared up. Please take people with you when you go back there. Do not neglect your safety. This guy sounds very hostile and who knows what he will stoop to.

Hang touch. You are in my thoughts and prayers 🙂
Yes, I remember your situation!

I am normally prepared to fight against those who don’t like the cats or want them there, but it’s very strange fighting against people who also care about the cats.

His cats actually are neutered, but I haven’t neutered all of the males in this colony yet. I’ve only seen his cats coexisting peacefully with the ferals, but who knows how they ended up hurt.

He also keeps collars on his cats, which is another good sign. It sounds like his cats “came with the house” when he moved there and he took them in. It also sounded like he has found homes for some kittens before. And he wants to adopt one of my ferals - so obviously there is some good in this man, he just may have no idea TNR is a thing and can’t even conceive of it?

We’ve been very active with TNRing lately, so we are preemptively organizing our feral binder and records sheet since I’m a bit behind.

Hopefully I can get my boyfriend to wake up out of his coma st 5 in the morning tomorrow to feed the cats, but I won’t hold my breath! 😂

I carry pepper gel and a personal alarm on me, so at least I have those.
 
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moxiewild

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If he comes at you again, get it on your phone! Video of some sort will be proof you need. Another witness may help too but video is better. Taking another person is advised. For your sake. Perhaps this guy will calm down. Hoping. Do you keep records on each spay and neuter? If not, get a copy from the clinic you use NOW! Keep records. Keep a copy in your car until this is settled.
Who advised you not to report this? Clinic? Family? An officer? I can see that you have no prof so, your word against his right now but an incident report might be important later. Perhaps consult a lawyer? Most lawyers will adobes beforetelling you if you need their services. A lawyer is handy to have “on call.” Just in case. If there is one around who loves animals, that’s a huge plus.
The vets are NOT allowed to give out medical info in the way a doctor can’t. Without permission from you, the employee should not have spoken at all. However, they do need to avoid being dragged into things when they don’t know all the details. If that guy said you claimed to work their she may have just been trying to clear that up but remember that what you got from that guy , she probably got too! People are just so on edge right now that every thing makes them hypersensitive. I’m sure that guy was scary and even more so since he claims to be someone who worked in a highly volatile job. The officers I know tend to be a bit skeptical of most people as a result of working with so many bad things. Not excusing him by any means! No excuse for being hostile without the facts. He’s a bit of a criminal himself if he stole the camera. Was it on private land? Maybe he had permission to take it. Future cameras are things you need to document too. Do you have the make and model number, receipt for the camera? In this case, maybe he will see that you are strictly doing great work to car for the cats. It might be a big plus.
Try to calm your nerves. I know it’s hard. If there is a leash law for cats there, he may not know he should not let his cats roam. Poor cats! Try to work with this guy if you can. Educating him may work. Perhaps you will find he can be recruited to help. Ask! If you put that question to him, he may be surprised or he may just vanish. ;) Turn the tables.
Touched on a lot of this in that last response, but -

I will try to remember to record, but I honestly hate confrontation, and if he were to come at me again like that, I am fairly certain I’d be too scared to record in fear of escalating the situation. :/

Yes, I am a meticulous record keeper (my boyfriend says some of what I keep is trash, but I keep it JUST IN CASE 😂). However, not the best organizer, so we are working on that tonight. Keeping it in the car is a great idea!

I did actually know a lawyer who worked in animal advocacy. It was years ago now, but I’ll try and see if I can track down our old emails and get in touch.

Should I consider consulting a lawyer before contacting police to help clear things up? I really don’t know how this sort of thing should work.

I completely understand how the woman at the clinic would be wary considering he said I said I worked there. But I mean, I was also like “Yeah, I never said that, I said I was taking them there and these people don’t know anything about TNR so someone must have gotten confused.” Which isn’t a stretch or anything. Most (“uninitiated”) folks are going to assume if you’re doing things like this that you’re either working for or volunteering with a rescue.

She should have just asked my name after that. In reality, I should have just gone up there in person so that the employees I know there would immediately vouch for me. Lesson learned.

The camera was on public property. I always assume it’s technically up for grabs because of that and just hope for the best 😆 Some people have said it could still be considered theft, but I’m honestly not looking to escalate things here.

I have my Amazon receipt for the camera, so i’ll go ahead and add that info to the binder!

Our city doesn’t have a leash law for cats, it only requires free-roaming cats to be neutered and up to date. His are definitely neutered. (However, our HOA does not allow free roaming cats, but they don’t enforce it either).

Despite everything, I do actually see potential for him. It was obvious he cares about the cats. He may just need to work on his people skills a bit ;)
 

Jcatbird

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I vote for trying to recruit him! Lol He could be a loud advocate!
As for the records, probably best to just keep a copy of the most recent in your car. Put everything where it is safe. I keep binders handy for quick info. I could roof my house with old rabies tags at this point! Lol I also save everything!
I would not push anything unless he continues the issue but I would contact that lawyer for advice as soon as possible. The lawyer can better advise you.
As for video, don’t make it obvious. You can turn it on as you approach the feeding site and keep it in your pocket or tuck it in your waistband. No point in letting him know. He might grab the phone or become angrier. I had to use my video once. At first the guy did not realize I had it on. ( it just appeared that I had my phone and was carrying it. The screen was facing the ground at first) Once he did, he changed tactics and made excuses before high tailing it away. I don’t know exactly what his intentions were but he scared me enough that I sent the video to friends and family immediately. He never bothered me again but I still see his truck go by sometimes. I would try to approach the topic , if he reappears, immediately of ,” would you be interested in helping with the cats? They could use another caring human and I can tell you have the needed passion.” A little honey instead of the vinegar he made us all feel.
 

fionasmom

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I agree with what Jcatbird Jcatbird is suggesting. This guy might have a good heart and just be weird and might be helpful since he seems to like and take responsibility for cats. If he would do some legwork for you, he could keep his lousy people skills because no one would have to deal with him.

I keep all records of ferals who are outside so that I can prove what a community service I am providing if I were ever confronted.

Lawyer before the police as you can speak more openly to the attorney who is on your side. I do get your concern about your house being brought into the picture if you have more animals than allowed.
 

tobby

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He told me that he’s “already opened up a case” on me, filed an animal abuse report on me, told me I’m already being investigated, submitted my camera for evidence, told me I wouldn’t get away with this, said I was disgusting, vile, creepy, etc.

Filing a false police report is considered a crime in many jurisdictions. Filing most any type of false report with the intention of harming another person’s reputation will open the other party up for a civil suit. Of course actually collecting damages from such a suit is another matter.

Do you have the camera’s serial number? Does it have distinctive marks, such as wear blemishes, or accessories such as a case? You might try searching on eBay for present and completed listings. Completed listings only remain visible for 90 days so take make backups. I have found that the Opera GX browser works well for saving entire eBay pages as pdfs of eBay pages. Also try Facebook Marketplace. Someone could be reselling it for a quick buck. If the item was shipped via USPS from eBay sales it may also fall under the jurisdiction of the United States Postal Inspection Service.

He said he’s a former cop...

Reminds me of the cop who said he was a friend of the family of a 21 year women who ran into my car head-on at 45pm trying to enter a college parking lot where there was no entrance. She got off with some little $15 fine even she was the guilty of the crimes of not having any insurance or a driver’s license. She was also not tested for drugs or alcohol.

My car was totaled whereas her giant 1970s car was dented and drivable. I and my sister had whiplash and sore necks for a time. I borrowed a car from my parents the next day to again pick my sister up from the college, as she hadn’t bought a car yet, and we both witnessed the unlicensed and uninsured driver still driving her car. The country attorney and his secretary literally laughed in my face behind the service counter when I brought it to their attention. The town’s mayor did nothing. Sheriff did nothing.

I had to use my video once. At first the guy did not realize I had it on. ( it just appeared that I had my phone and was carrying it.

We had a abusive family of dog owners living in a former rental house across the street who got their kicks from letting their dogs run loose in the neighborhood. The entire family got the idea in their head that people who make complaints about dogs are afraid of them thus they only increased their activity. This is strange because we used to own a dog before moving to town. Even after one of this guy’s dogs got obviously got hit my a car they continued to let their dogs run loose in order to harass neighbors.

I was able to use my Canon Rebel to take HD video of a threatening tirade of one of the owners that began while documenting him walking a dog off the leash and letting it run onto our property where it confronted and threatened three adults by snarking and bearing its teeth. This cost him 45 days in jail and a 90 day no contact order. After I posted some stills of the video online the landlord eventually evicted the family and sold the home.

Of course such a camera would not be ideal for most situations - it worked this time as the guy was drunk out his mind - even caring a stovepipe beer can during the tirade. A phone can also be awkward and can be seen. Have you investigated the use of a body cam that you could obscure within your clothing? Even if you can’t hide it you could simply leave it running while you visiting the site thus leaving your hands free.

One might also might consider adopting a procedure for immediately calling 911 just in case. Doing this on a phone might be too slow thus you might consider buying a dedicated 911 alert device which is activated with a simply push of a button. These are often marketed to seniors, but there is not reason anyone else could use them also.

Also consider self defense classes. A couple years prior another house across the street was rented out to another “nut job” who got his kicks from harassing, threatening neighbors and committing various acts of vandalism. He had a long history of this and had previously lived on another part of the town, but was protected by his well to do parents. After making several complaints against him, he walked across the street one day trying to coax me out on the public area grass between the sidewalk and street under the guise of shaking hands and to apologize.

When I didn’t respond he rushed onto my property and pushed me in the chest in an attempt to knock me down. My high school wrestling practice from 20+ years ago immediately kicked in, without thinking, and I used a headlock to fireman's carry to place him on the ground where I proceeded to sit on him until Sheriff deputies could arrive. A deputy later told me he kicked out the rear window of the cop car and needed to be put in restraints. He later set fire to his girlfriend’s car and assaulted another person that resulted in a broken jaw whereas he was finally sent to state prison. The landlord who was friends with this habitual troublemaker lost his house to the bank. The mother of this individual, who caused much of his behavior due to her alcoholism and resulting fetal alcohol syndrome, later hanged herself from a tree in a uninhabited housing development about 10 miles away.
 

Jcatbird

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T tobby Yikes! Those are all terrible incidents and I sympathize. I had my battles here too but let’s hope that since this guy has cats, he isn’t all bad. The body cam is a great idea. Fortunately, as you pointed out, time brings about changes and people move or get caught. Let’s hope the problem with this guy was a one time thing.
 

Whenallhellbreakslose

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Moxiewild, I hope the dust is starting to settle and maybe this guy is calming down and won't try to get you in trouble for animal abuse. SMH, seriously animal abuse???!!! I detest situations when you are being accused of something that couldn't be further from the truth. Like in my case, where the tnr group thought I was "taking things out on the cats" when I was extremly concerned for their welfare and I made that very clear in my communications. Just mindboggling. 😯🤯

This man may be a strong advocate for the cats and may become an ally, but he needs to calm down and be more rational. Maybe he overreacted or he is a hostile attitude towards others. I have ran into a number of misantrope- types who treats animals very well, but have either very little people skills or just outright hates people. These types want as little interaction with people as possible, see people in the worse light, and are quick to turn on people. I tried to get on the"good side " of these kind of people, but it was only a matter of time before they turn on you. These people are always getting into fights with others and develop a reputation of being antisocial.

Well, I wish you the best. Let us know how things turn out. You are not alone in this situation. You have our support. Also, thanks to you and the other wonderful members of TCS, I got through those stressful situations i was going through in the last while. I am happy I found this website. I think I would be far worse off without it. Hang tough and I hope things improve for you.🙂
 
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moxiewild

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Belated update and new problem! Breaking it up into two separate comments.

Update

Okay, so the day I posted this thread I had actually intended to make a different post.

One of my cats at this colony - among the most reliable to show up of all my colonies - had not shown up since after the morning the bowls were taken.

Until this man raged at me, I feared that whoever stole my stuff had hurt her, scared her, taken her, something.

Ironically, my encounter with him actually made me feel pretty confident that he would never hurt any of the cats. But I just had no idea where she was. She was missing for about 4 or 5 days.

Then on Friday morning she showed up!

But she had severe eye drainage, nose drainage, one of her eyes looked ulcerated, and she was certainly hungry, but too congested to eat. She just had her FVRCP about a month ago when she was TNR’d, so I was a bit surprised to see her sick like this.

Luckily, she is one of my ONLY semi-ferals, so I was able to just push her into a carrier to get her to the vet right away. (She is dutifully still holding a grudge over that 😂)

While I was doing this, I was 99% sure the scary neighbor dude was watching behind the fence at my back.

I go pretty early, and it’s always dead silent, but there was a whole lot of obvious rustling that was coming from specifically behind his fence. I just pretended to be oblivious and kept talking to the cats, lol.

So now... at this point, I’m feeling pretty cocky :lol:

Not only am I taking in a cat that I’ve already responsibly TNR’d, but now my regular vet will confirm she’s spayed, chipped, and feral. I’m also demonstrating that I am both able and willing to provide necessary veterinary care promptly, AND the guy witnessed me doing it which confirms that it is definitively a cat from that specific location.

All of my vets would have vouched for me on all of this already, but this situation lined up so perfectly that I felt pretty bullet proof after that (Kitty is doing better, but not happy! Still trying to figure out how the heck to get medicine in her eye 🙄)

Anyway, over the weekend we became distracted by election stuff and shifting rooms around since now we’re recovering two injured or ill ferals.

Then on Monday morning the guy catches me picking up bowls. Luckily my boyfriend was with me this time.

His demeanor completely changed. He was cordial, he apologized (though it was kind of as an aside, and I honestly wish he would have emphasized that more given how he acted toward me and what he accused me of...), and said he checked me out and that everything looked to be “on the up and up.”

I think he was just extremely worried about his own cats in particular, which I understand. I would be too if I had no idea TNR was a thing.

He asked that I only text him on nights I’m going to trap so that he can lock his boys up. He understands now the traps wouldn’t hurt them, but he didn’t want his cats to be alone and scared and vulnerable sitting in a trap for hours (I never leave traps unattended, however, I am always having to shoo his kitties away when I’m trapping there, so I just agreed since it would actually help a lot lol).

I can really appreciate that concern too, and it further demonstrated that he really does care about his kitties quite a lot. (He also stressed that they are family, which is always a good sign!).

He then gave us back our bowls and gave us the name of the officer we need to contact to get our camera back (haven’t done it yet because we’ve been lazy).
 

fionasmom

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I am so sorry about the sick kitty and hope she recovers. I take it that she did not appear to have been injured on purpose in any way? And now you have a sort of friend in the area! Okay, no social skills and even though he loves his cats he was not well versed in general cat management but you can overlook that since he was reasonable. With time, he might even become a helper if things work out.
 
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