How did you start PMR?

[bluebo]

My cat is a fussy little turd (as many of you members know) but I am honestly beginning to believe that PMR raw is the best diet for Bo. I HAVE always believed it but I am scared of trying it because Bo is so fussy.
He will lick, he will throw the meat around, he will even chew a little bit but he always ends up walking away from it!
I am interested in doing a whole raw diet, but I was curious about how you mix supplements when you needs them? Taurine? Fish oils? Etc? Do you keep some pre-made so that you can mix supplements?
How long does it take a kibble addict (newly converted to canned) into a raw lover? Will my cat always be fussy or will he accept the raw diet eventually?
What if you can't get a plentiful assortment of meat cuts? Is pre-made a better diet in that situation?
I might have to begin with pre-made and mix his favorite canned in with it... I don't see any other way.
HELP! I feel so overwhelmed and upset! I thought that getting him onto canned was "the solution" to his problems but he ended up with blood in his feces again!
I'm so upset

 

[ldg]

Bluebo, what happened? Did he get constipated? Was there mucous with the blood? Our Sheldon used to have blood in his stools, though he wasn't constipated. The vet said he had colitis, and we simply had to try different foods that didn't cause the problem. I never identified specific ingredients, but on raw, it hasn't been an issue... when it happened with Bo, had you tried a new food? :dk:

Also - does Bo ever eat little bits of plastic? Our Ming Loy tries to eat any kind of rubber or plastic. If we aren't diligent enough, there will be a little blood and mucous when she passes something she got into - but it's not the diet per se, it's the stuff she shouldn't have eaten causing the problem.

As to your question about how people started PMR.... I had no intention of feeding PMR when I started feeding raw. On one of our vet's advice, we'd made the switch to timed meals, all wet food. We'd been feeding that for a little over a year. So I started with commercial raw - nature's variety, because it is what was available locally and it was cheap enough. I didn't have freezer space at the time. I just mixed a small amount into their wet food. None of mine complained about it until we were at 100% raw, and then I used toppers - freeze dried meat or liver, also at the beginning some Fortiflora (I think it made it smell like kibble :lol3: ) to get them to eat it. I "supplemented" the diet with some cut up chicken breast, and three of my boys decided they preferred chunks to ground. Since they weren't so good at chewing, I didn't bother with bones, but decided to supplement with eggshell powder. I just sprinkle it on when I make the meal, and that works great for my cats. :nod: I also know pretty much exactly what the calciumhosphorus ratio is, so I can adjust it for how each cat handles the calcium. Spooky tends to get constipated, so I give her a lower Ca ratio than the others.

Some of mine don't like the raw liver or kidney - so I use only freeze dried liver for them, rather than 5% raw liver and 5% raw kidney. I just make it 10% freeze dried liver (adjusted, obviously, for the lack of moisture in the freeze dried liver), because they all love that. They get their "liver treats" daily.

The other stuff I use - probiotics, an omega supplement, egg yolk lecithin to prevent hairballs and keep the poop moving through easily - all of these I would use no matter what diet I was feeding them. At this point these, for me, are unrelated to feeding raw. The only supplements I use because I feed raw are a little bit of taurine, and a little bit of Vitamin E, and raw egg yolks fed a couple of times a week (and about half of them don't finish their yolk, but they eat about half, and I'm fine with that). :nod:

In the end - he did gnaw on the chicken wing? So have you tried offering him a few bites of raw chicken breast or something? Cut up into small bites? :dk:

Is Carnivora sold at any stores near you?

 

[mrsgreenjeens]

I have tried and tried to get mine to eat PMR, and only one will have anything to do with it, and then only once in awhile

, but so seldom that I don't even need to worry yet about trying to balance out anything.  Addly enough, it was my oldest cet, who I lost earlier this year at the ripe old age of 16ish, who loved chunks of meat!  Go figure.  He had been on kibble his entire life until 2 weeks before he died. 

I tried to sneak just teeny tiny pieces of duck heart into their ground up commercial raw one day, and "the boys" chewed and chewed and then looked at me as if I had poisoned them, and left the room.  Callie kind of likes them, but I always have to Flortify (use Floriflora) them to get her to finish them up.  So I just give her many one heart finely chopped along with commercial raw.  I have tried them on chicken thighs, chicken breasts, turkey tenderloins, pork tenderloins, and the duck hearts.  As I said, "the boys" won't have anything to do with any of them.  Not even Darko, my little piggy.  He RUNS from them

.  Tinky just tried to cover them up

.  Callie might give it the ole college try, but usually just licks it to death and that's it. 

That being said, I have some chicken breast strips that I cut up pretty small and vacuum packed in tiny packages that are thawing in the fridge right now.  I'm going to give it another shot today.  I figure with enough topping, maybe I can convert them yet.

  wish me luck

  If I can just the 2 younger ones to try it, I think they'll like it.

 

[bluebo]

Bluebo, what happened? Did he get constipated? Was there mucous with the blood? Our Sheldon used to have blood in his stools, though he wasn't constipated. The vet said he had colitis, and we simply had to try different foods that didn't cause the problem. I never identified specific ingredients, but on raw, it hasn't been an issue... when it happened with Bo, had you tried a new food? :dk:

i tried adding Fancy Feast into the rotation again. Also, I gave him some Greenies- here are the ingredients-- http://www.greenies.com/faq/cats/dental-treats.aspx

Also - does Bo ever eat little bits of plastic? Our Ming Loy tries to eat any kind of rubber or plastic. If we aren't diligent enough, there will be a little blood and mucous when she passes something she got into - but it's not the diet per se, it's the stuff she shouldn't have eaten causing the problem.

I have never seen him eat any plastic. He's pretty safe although he does love to lick paper (books, newspaper etc). He has never eaten paper only licked it.

As to your question about how people started PMR.... I had no intention of feeding PMR when I started feeding raw. On one of our vet's advice, we'd made the switch to timed meals, all wet food. We'd been feeding that for a little over a year. So I started with commercial raw - nature's variety, because it is what was available locally and it was cheap enough. I didn't have freezer space at the time. I just mixed a small amount into their wet food. None of mine complained about it until we were at 100% raw, and then I used toppers - freeze dried meat or liver, also at the beginning some Fortiflora (I think it made it smell like kibble :lol3: ) to get them to eat it. I "supplemented" the diet with some cut up chicken breast, and three of my boys decided they preferred chunks to ground. Since they weren't so good at chewing, I didn't bother with bones, but decided to supplement with eggshell powder. I just sprinkle it on when I make the meal, and that works great for my cats. :nod: I also know pretty much exactly what the calciumhosphorus ratio is, so I can adjust it for how each cat handles the calcium. Spooky tends to get constipated, so I give her a lower Ca ratio than the others.
Some of mine don't like the raw liver or kidney - so I use only freeze dried liver for them, rather than 5% raw liver and 5% raw kidney. I just make it 10% freeze dried liver (adjusted, obviously, for the lack of moisture in the freeze dried liver), because they all love that. They get their "liver treats" daily.
The other stuff I use - probiotics, an omega supplement, egg yolk lecithin to prevent hairballs and keep the poop moving through easily - all of these I would use no matter what diet I was feeding them. At this point these, for me, are unrelated to feeding raw. The only supplements I use because I feed raw are a little bit of taurine, and a little bit of Vitamin E, and raw egg yolks fed a couple of times a week (and about half of them don't finish their yolk, but they eat about half, and I'm fine with that). :nod:
In the end - he did gnaw on the chicken wing? So have you tried offering him a few bites of raw chicken breast or something? Cut up into small bites? :dk:
Is Carnivora sold at any stores near you

He did gnaw on the chicken wing a little bit but I am thinking ground might be better for him. I'm going to get some Carnivora soon and try him on that! His issues with bleeding were fine until I introduced fancy feast and the greenies?

My responses in bold

 

[bluebo]

I have tried and tried to get mine to eat PMR, and only one will have anything to do with it, and then only once in awhile , but so seldom that I don't even need to worry yet about trying to balance out anything.  Addly enough, it was my oldest cet, who I lost earlier this year at the ripe old age of 16ish, who loved chunks of meat!  Go figure.  He had been on kibble his entire life until 2 weeks before he died. 

I tried to sneak just teeny tiny pieces of duck heart into their ground up commercial raw one day, and "the boys" chewed and chewed and then looked at me as if I had poisoned them, and left the room.  Callie kind of likes them, but I always have to Flortify (use Floriflora) them to get her to finish them up.  So I just give her many one heart finely chopped along with commercial raw.  I have tried them on chicken thighs, chicken breasts, turkey tenderloins, pork tenderloins, and the duck hearts.  As I said, "the boys" won't have anything to do with any of them.  Not even Darko, my little piggy.  He RUNS from them :lol3: .  Tinky just tried to cover them up .  Callie might give it the ole college try, but usually just licks it to death and that's it. 

That being said, I have some chicken breast strips that I cut up pretty small and vacuum packed in tiny packages that are thawing in the fridge right now.  I'm going to give it another shot today.  I figure with enough topping, maybe I can convert them yet. :high5:   wish me luck :cross:   If I can just the 2 younger ones to try it, I think they'll like it.

Yeah chunks might not work for Bo....I will be trying Carnivora next Friday (we live a ways out of the nearest city and we only go in once or twice weekly).
I'm still going to try chicken gizzards and even if he won't eat them raw I'm almost certain he'll eat them half seared (for his teeth).
This is all so frustrating. *argggg*

 

[ldg]

FYI, only a couple of my cats eat anything resembling a chunk. I cut up their meat into strips (for some) and bites for others. And for Spooky, I still basically mince her meat. PMR doesn't have to be "chunks."

I've only got three cats eating whole hearts or gizzards. I cut the hearts in at least half for the others, and the gizzards I cut into strips too.

 

[bluebo]

This is such a pain. Honestly. My dog just hoovers everything up like its filet mignon but I could offer my cat filet mignon and he would turn up his nose, it is starting to irritate me.

 

[mrsgreenjeens]

FYI, only a couple of my cats eat anything resembling a chunk. I cut up their meat into strips (for some) and bites for others. And for Spooky, I still basically mince her meat. PMR doesn't have to be "chunks."

I've only got three cats eating whole hearts or gizzards. I cut the hearts in at least half for the others, and the gizzards I cut into strips too.

Well, yeah, I don't mean chunks like 1 x 1 inch or anything like that.   I actually do either very thin strips (about  1/2 in by 1 in) OR finely diced like a shallot!  Neither works.  Today I gave Callie the small strips of chicken breast and I think she licked one, so then I got out my trusty scissors and cut all the strips up into teeny pieces, covered the heck out of them with Fortiflora and it was still a no go.  So then I rinsed them all off and covered them in Pure Bites powdered FD chicken and at least she nibbled at them, but only half heartedly. 

 

[Willowy]

I bet it was the Greenies that caused Bo's bloody stools, if kibble set him off before. Dry treats are enough like kibble that a sensitive cat might have trouble. Argh! Some cats! Don't give any Greenies for a while and see what happens.

 

[bluebo]

I bet it was the Greenies that caused Bo's bloody stools, if kibble set him off before. Dry treats are enough like kibble that a sensitive cat might have trouble. Argh! Some cats! Don't give any Greenies for a while and see what happens.

I haven't been giving him any for the past 2 days. I don't think I'll bother after looking at the ingredients again. There is honestly nothing in them to make them good for a cats teeth... have you read the ingredient list? I'll stick with Merricks canned food without any dry treats and hopefully I'll find him some other wet foods that he will tolerate. I'll also be looking into Carnivora raw.
Bo is the bane of my existance :lol3: