Holding my Girl

[happilyretired]

I hope someone has advice for me. I adopted my very sweet cat about 3 years ago. She was in a shelter--after having been thrown from a car and rescued by a cat-lover who saw it happen (but had 3 cats of her own and could not take another). She brought her to my vet, who had a small shelter in her office/home. At the time, the vet guessed her age at about 3, so she's just about 6-7 now. When Molly came to live with me, she hid for 2 weeks, but we're old friends now, and she's the most loving cat I've ever had--a true 'lap cat.'

The only problem is that she will NOT be held, which makes it difficult to confine her for vet visits (I have a mobile vet). I worry, too, if and when I have to confine her to get her to the vet in some emergency or for a procedure. I suspect her 'pre-rescue' past is the reason for her aversion to anyone holding her. Someone who would throw a cat out of a car may have abused her in other ways.

At her check up last week, my vet gave me gabapentin to try, and I've used it twice. Both times, she was very 'mellow,' but if I tried to hold her, the stress overcame the med, and she was her feisty self. Her reflexes were a little slower, so I think I might have been able to deal with her in a real emergency. But I'd like to see if I can get her to let me hold her without any meds.

Anyone have any experience/advice in how I can get her to like being held as much as she loves loafing on my lap?

 

[ArtNJ]

Get a big two cat sized carrier and leave it out. Throw treats in it. That will solve the going somewhere in an emmergency issue -- she'll voluntarily go into the carrier when you need it.

As far as the home vet, is there a coffee table, desk or somewhere that you can train her is appropriate to lie on? If she can get vigorously petted and maybe prodded a bit on a table, the vet should be able to provide care I would think. You can train her that when you shake the treat bag at the table and she comes up, she gets a treat, and then gets petted if she relaxes there. Maybe even put a basket on the table with a favorite blanket inside.

I don't know that it is actually possible to train a cat to like being picked up, so you need to finesse it in this manner. With some cats, just improving the bond will solve the issue, but some very well bonded cats just dont like to be picked up.

 

[happilyretired]

Thanks so much for your helpful advice. I would have explained more, but I was afraid that my post was too long.

A BIG cat carrier has been on my kitchen table for the past three years, and that's where I put her 'treats.' She will go in, but if I am nearby, she is very wary--despite the fact that she was getting her treats in there for months before I ever tried to close her in.

But last time the vet visited, she would not even go into the kitchen (where she almost always follows me). She seems to be tuned into my stress level and knows 'something's up.' So although I've always thought the carrier would be the best option, but, depending on the situation, she might not go near it.

I have to confine her when the vet comes because she will hide if ANYONE comes into the house. At the first visit, I had her in the carrier [lured with treats], but she got away from the vet tech when he tried to remove her. She's faster and stronger than most realize. The vets have been great and have examined her wherever they've caught her.

Yes, I had assumed that once we were well bonded, she'd let me pick her up. My first cat was a stray who adopted ME, and she was very skittish, but I could pick her up easily within a few months. Molly has been with me for 3 years now, and she's totally bonded and loves to 'cuddle' on my lap and sleep with me. In fact, she allows me to 'hold' her--i.e., have my hands/arms around her when she's on my lap--but any move to raise her from that position invokes her 'flight' response. As you mention, picking her up may not be possible, especially with a cat her age.

Thanks again for responding.

 

[rubysmama]

Anyone have any experience/advice in how I can get her to like being held as much as she loves loafing on my lap?

Reading about your Molly, could be me describing my Ruby. Except for the car incident. Though from what the shelter told me, Ruby was rescued off the street from some kids that were kicking her, so her experience is almost as bad.

As for picking her up, I've had her almost 7 years, and it's still a no go. She is a love bug. She'll come to me when I call her. She loves napping in my lap. She sleeps beside me at night. She head bumps me, and is a purring machine. But she HATES being restrained in ANY way. So picking her up is impossible. Even for a few seconds. She'll squirm and kick and eventually escape from my arms. Even just putting my arms around her when she's on the floor will cause her to wiggle away. I haven't actively tried to train her to like being held / picked up, but I really don't think it's something she will ever allow, or enjoy.

So I understand how vet appointments are difficult for you.

One thing my vet and I discovered is that Ruby is more comfortable at the vet if she's allowed to stay in her carrier. So last time we took the top off the carrier, and the vet examined her that way. Only time they took her out of the carrier was to weigh her.

Course if the vet comes to your place, you might not need the carrier. Though, maybe if she got comfortable in her carrier, that might be an option for vet visits.

Good luck. Hopefully Molly won't need too many vet visits. And who knows, maybe in time she'll be less skittish about being picked up. If you are successful in that quest, do post again and tell us how you accomplished it.

 

[fionasmom]

Probably the last time that poor Molly was held was when she was thrown from the car window. This is a tough one and I have had cats who did not allow themselves to be treated in one way or another because of some experience that they more than likely had.

My story is Chelsea, who was trapped as a kitten and rescued, but would never allow her self to be picked up. She showed affection by coming over and rubbing against me, several years later moved to allowing me to pick her up with one arm only. If the other arm came up or the hand, she was ready to claw me. She now has intestinal lymphoma and as she has weakened she will allow me to pick her up and will miraculously take her meds. But I know that we got a late dx because of her temperament.

I would absolutely not give up on the carrier as you might need it someday and she might change like Chelsea finally did. Even with a home vet there could still be situations where you might need to get her into a carrier. You might even ask your vet if you can keep a couple gabapentin tablets on hand for an emergency.

 

[happilyretired]

Reading about your Molly, could be me describing my Ruby. Except for the car incident. Though from what the shelter told me, Ruby was rescued off the street from some kids that were kicking her, so her experience is almost as bad.

As for picking her up, I've had her almost 7 years, and it's still a no go. She is a love bug. She'll come to me when I call her. She loves napping in my lap. She sleeps beside me at night. She head bumps me, and is a purring machine. But she HATES being restrained in ANY way. So picking her up is impossible. Even for a few seconds. She'll squirm and kick and eventually escape from my arms. Even just putting my arms around her when she's on the floor will cause her to wiggle away. I haven't actively tried to train her to like being held / picked up, but I really don't think it's something she will ever allow, or enjoy.

So I understand how vet appointments are difficult for you.

One thing my vet and I discovered is that Ruby is more comfortable at the vet if she's allowed to stay in her carrier. So last time we took the top off the carrier, and the vet examined her that way. Only time they took her out of the carrier was to weigh her.

Course if the vet comes to your place, you might not need the carrier. Though, maybe if she got comfortable in her carrier, that might be an option for vet visits.

Good luck. Hopefully Molly won't need too many vet visits. And who knows, maybe in time she'll be less skittish about being picked up. If you are successful in that quest, do post again and tell us how you accomplished it.

Thanks for your info about Ruby! It's nice to know there are others like my Molly. But my question is HOW you get her in the carrier? Do you just surprise her, wrap her in a towel and force her in? That's my dilemma. Yes, I need her confined for vet home visits because that's the only way the vet can do the exam. A cat will 'disappear' if left unconfined.

 

[happilyretired]

Probably the last time that poor Molly was held was when she was thrown from the car window. This is a tough one and I have had cats who did not allow themselves to be treated in one way or another because of some experience that they more than likely had.

My story is Chelsea, who was trapped as a kitten and rescued, but would never allow her self to be picked up. She showed affection by coming over and rubbing against me, several years later moved to allowing me to pick her up with one arm only. If the other arm came up or the hand, she was ready to claw me. She now has intestinal lymphoma and as she has weakened she will allow me to pick her up and will miraculously take her meds. But I know that we got a late dx because of her temperament.

I would absolutely not give up on the carrier as you might need it someday and she might change like Chelsea finally did. Even with a home vet there could still be situations where you might need to get her into a carrier. You might even ask your vet if you can keep a couple gabapentin tablets on hand for an emergency.

Thanks for your response! I am so sorry your Chelsea is ill. I lost my last two cats to CRF, and it was sad that as they became increasingly ill, they almost welcomed being handled.

Yes, even for home visits, the cat has to be confined, preferably in the carrier. I have the gabapentin tablets from my vet, and I plan to call her now that I see how Molly responds to the dosage because she suggested it could be increased. If so, that might solve the 'vet visit' issue--i.e., if she was sufficiently sedated, I could more easily get her in the carrier. Fortunately, she seems to be a healthy girl, and we've only had annual check ups so far. The next scheduled 'event' is a rabies shot in May, so I have some time if there are no emergencies.

 

[rubysmama]

But my question is HOW you get her in the carrier? Do you just surprise her, wrap her in a towel and force her in?

Yes, more or less. I follow another recommendation of my vet, which has made the ordeal so much easier on both me and Ruby. This is what my vet suggested, to quickly get a cat in a side opening carrier.

Without the cat seeing you (if possible) put the carrier up on a high surface, like a counter or table. Point it so that the door opening is right on the edge. Then quickly pick up cat (no towel) and while trying to avoid getting scratched, hold cat toward carrier opening. Since there is no where else for them to go, but in the carrier, they should go in. As soon as they go in, and walk to the back to turn around, close the door.

I suggest wearing long sleeves, and maybe (sun) glasses, to protect yourself from scratches. (cats do seem to gain a few extra legs during this process. LOL) And if there's a chance they'll run and hide under the bed, close doors to all rooms before attempting to put cat in carrier. It sounds simple, but if you catch them by surprise, it really does work.

 

[happilyretired]

Yes, more or less. I follow another recommendation of my vet, which has made the ordeal so much easier on both me and Ruby. This is what my vet suggested, to quickly get a cat in a side opening carrier.

Without the cat seeing you (if possible) put the carrier up on a high surface, like a counter or table. Point it so that the door opening is right on the edge. Then quickly pick up cat (no towel) and while trying to avoid getting scratched, hold cat toward carrier opening. Since there is no where else for them to go, but in the carrier, they should go in. As soon as they go in, and walk to the back to turn around, close the door.

I suggest wearing long sleeves, and maybe (sun) glasses, to protect yourself from scratches. (cats do seem to gain a few extra legs during this process. LOL) And if there's a chance they'll run and hide under the bed, close doors to all rooms before attempting to put cat in carrier. It sounds simple, but if you catch them by surprise, it really does work.

Thanks so much for responding. It actually helps me that I know most of this stuff! What's bad is that my Molly is too damn smart. The carrier is always open on the kitchen table, and I give her treats in it daily--which I assumed would make it a 'friendly' place for her. Alas, she also knows I can close her in it, so she won't willingly go in if I am close by.

ALSO I may have to close most doors for a few days before I plan to confine her because last time, as soon as she noticed I was closing the bedroom doors, she was on alert.

However, I've thought of doing what your vet suggests, and I actually bought 'vet gloves' on Amazon that go above my elbows and should provide protection and enable me to push her into the carrier. It's the 'taking her by surprise' that's tough because she seems to pick up on my stress and always know 'something's up.'

 

[fionasmom]

I believe that some cats are hyper sensitive to even the slightest human body language which makes everything more complicated. Fiona herself could seemingly read my mind and would disappear if I ever even started to make a move to do anything like pill her or put her in a carrier.

I do use the method which rubysmama suggested and it does work about 90% of the time. The vet gloves are also a good idea, and I have put on coat and glasses with some cats.

 

[happilyretired]

Yes, I think my Molly is much like your Fiona--she reads me well! I think it's because of her awful past--she is always reading her humans for self protection. By the way, her 'full name' is Molly Brown, after the 'unsinkable' because she's survived so much in a short life.

Fortunately, she loves all things Greenies, so she is easily pilled with their pill pockets. The vet initially gave me liquid gabapentin to mix with her food, but it must have some slight odor because she wouldn't go near it. But she just gobbles those pill pockets--the only thing that's been easy with her:-)

 

[rubysmama]

That does make it tough when they're so aware of everything going on, including their human's stress.
You are lucky that pill pockets work for giving meds. They don't for Ruby.

 

[happilyretired]

That does make it tough when they're so aware of everything going on, including their human's stress.
You are lucky that pill pockets work for giving meds. They don't for Ruby.

Yes, I'm really grateful that she loves Greenies so much that the pill pockets work. People have reported that when their cats crunch down on the pills, they spit them out and refuse the pill pockets. But she seems to gobble them up so that she probably swallows them whole.

My sister's dog hates all things Greenies, so it's amazing how different animals can be in their preferences.

 

[happilyretired]

Update--The gabapentin dose made Molly 'mellow' with slower reflexes, but when I tried (gently) to hold her, her 'flight' response kicked in, and she bolted. With her slower reflexes, it's possible I could have controlled her, but there was no way to take her by surprise because even with the gabapentin, she was alert to what was going on.

I spoke to my vet about her response, and since she's a big girl (12.5 lbs), the vet suggested increasing the dosage to another half pill to see how that affects her. Since cats easily develop a tolerance for gabapentin, I won't try the higher dosage for a few weeks, probably the end of this month.

 

[Anoxia]

Hello! I have a skittish girl who also hates to be held/confined, and I don't think it will be possible for me to hold her. What I do with her now is that I incorporate the carrier as part of her breakfast routine, and although I'm not able to carry her, it gives me peace of mind to know that she will let me put her inside.

She gets timed meals and her carrier is kept near her meal mat; she has a large plastic carrier (big enough for 2 cats) with both a top and front entrance. When I started out, I would run both hands along her side while we were near/next to the carrier, give her a treat, then put down her breakfast and leave her alone. When she grew comfortable with that, I moved onto petting her belly before treating/putting down breakfast, then onto placing my hands under her chest and pelvis (no lifting), then very small lifting (e.g. immediately pick up and then put down), then lifting while moving her a small distance. I increased how high I could lift her, and how far I could lift her (always keeping them very short! A few seconds at most), until I was able to move her to be next to the carrier. Eventually I moved onto putting her inside the carrier from the top (with her head facing away from the front entrance, although you can start out with her facing the front), with both entrances fully opened, and never stopped her from escaping. (Early on after I put her in, I would immediately step away to the other side of the room where she could clearly see me approaching. This was so that if I put treats inside or near the carrier, she would feel safe enough to eat them.) When she got comfortable enough that she didn't immediately run out, I started closing the top entrance after I put her inside, but left the front entrance open for her to leave from. Eventually I closed the front before putting her inside, but I left the top open and immediately opened the front door after she was in. Finally I closed the front before putting her inside, closed the top after putting her inside, and immediately opened the front door so she could leave.

This is definitely a longer-term project and not something that will help immediately (she was a kitten when I started, and it took about 5 months), but for us, we were able to get to the point where I'm now able to put her inside every morning, and I maintain the routine so I don't have to worry about her growing fearful again during times we don't need the kennel. If I have free time, I'll randomly put her in kennel too, just so she doesn't start to get suspicious if I do need to take her somewhere and I need to kennel her later than breakfast time.

We started this because I was also unable to take her to the vet so I know how stressful it can be. I hope everything with your baby will go okay!

 

[daftcat75]

I suspect cats don't like to be picked up because, after kittenhood, in the wild, getting picked up is usually a prelude to being eaten. Some cats will consent to being picked up and some will even crave it according to my Instagram feed. But I suspect that is a product of socialization and trust. My Krista who loved and trusted me to the moon and back would tolerate being picked up, but I knew she preferred not to be.

Have you thought about this instead of a carrier?
Cat-in-the-bag E-Z-Zip Cat Carrier Bag, Cobalt, Small - Chewy.com

It's not that hard to get onto a cat. You just have to make certain the neck is pulled snug enough so they can't get a paw up into the neck. Once you have it secured around her neck, it's pretty easy to zip it up.

I would suggest clicker training as well. It will help you desensitize her to things like the carrier or the cat bag and it will teach her that if she performs the routines you teach her, she will be rewarded. It turns it into a game of cooperation rather than domination. That alone should dial the stress down for the both of you. You won't be stressed about having to confine her and she won't pick up on that and get stressed as well. You'll both be happy to play your roles in the carrier or bag routines.

Have a look at this and the part two video for an example of how you would build up desensitization training. Adapt it for your carrier or cat bag routine.

I also recommend giving CBD/hemp oil a try. I recommend a big dog product. It's all the same oil. But the big dog oil will be more concentrated than the oil for cats. That means you can give far less of it. Start with one drop and see how she does. Cats don't build up a tolerance to CBD. You can practice with CBD as often as you want. My only caution with CBD is mixing it with other medications. CBD, on its own, is very safe. But it can interact with other medications. So if Molly is taking other meds, then don't give CBD. Don't mix gabapentin and CBD.

CBD For Dogs - Hemp Oil, Edibites, Canna Care Topical

 

[Lisannez]

Have you tried coming from behind and picking her up at the part of her neck like the mother cat would with her mouth with your two fingers? I understand it’s not super easy if she’s a larger cat, I struggle to it but my fiance (a big guy) has no problem doing that with our cats. We rarely have to but every once in awhile if they get really freaked out like by a fire drill when we lived in a condo or a garbage bag (one cat really is) or they don’t want to get into a carrier when he does that it truly instantly calms them down and he is able to get them into the carrier. It takes confidence though when you do it and you cannot not be afraid. He’s had them since they were kittens he’s really good with it. I found a lot of what our cats react to is our own calmness and fear. So if your cat thinks you are nervous about picking her up or getting her into the carrier they get scared too. Our Ragdoll can be skittish she was found not the side of the road in a plastic bag and we think a man with a long black coat in boots dropped her off because she is petrified of most men, long black coats and boots. Sometimes she acts up at the vet but the vet will usually give her an anti anxiety medication often a shot if she does. They always call and ask if that’s okay and we say yes. Have you had a vet do that, maybe a shot? It also helps now that we go to the same vet and have for four years she is more comfortable. Our tuxie is pretty Low key but she hates car rides. We tried Gabapentin but even at the max does it did not work she would cry and yeowl and pant the entire car ride. So I think for some cats it just does not work. She also does not react to cat nip. We tried Benadryl no such luck. The only thing that works with her (and this is weird) is that we have to distract her if she does not want to get in the carrier. I let her watch YouTube videos of fish, I swear to you on my phone. Then I get her from behind and I shove her in she does not know what hits hit.. ha ha. Or my fiance does the neck pinch thing. In a true emergency such as a fire if you really need to move the cat out grab a pillow case and throw the cat in there. It will not be pleasant but the cat will live. That’s what our vet told us. We only had to do it once, it was only a drill but it worked.

 

[happilyretired]

Hello! I have a skittish girl who also hates to be held/confined, and I don't think it will be possible for me to hold her. What I do with her now is that I incorporate the carrier as part of her breakfast routine, and although I'm not able to carry her, it gives me peace of mind to know that she will let me put her inside.

She gets timed meals and her carrier is kept near her meal mat; she has a large plastic carrier (big enough for 2 cats) with both a top and front entrance. When I started out, I would run both hands along her side while we were near/next to the carrier, give her a treat, then put down her breakfast and leave her alone. When she grew comfortable with that, I moved onto petting her belly before treating/putting down breakfast, then onto placing my hands under her chest and pelvis (no lifting), then very small lifting (e.g. immediately pick up and then put down), then lifting while moving her a small distance. I increased how high I could lift her, and how far I could lift her (always keeping them very short! A few seconds at most), until I was able to move her to be next to the carrier. Eventually I moved onto putting her inside the carrier from the top (with her head facing away from the front entrance, although you can start out with her facing the front), with both entrances fully opened, and never stopped her from escaping. (Early on after I put her in, I would immediately step away to the other side of the room where she could clearly see me approaching. This was so that if I put treats inside or near the carrier, she would feel safe enough to eat them.) When she got comfortable enough that she didn't immediately run out, I started closing the top entrance after I put her inside, but left the front entrance open for her to leave from. Eventually I closed the front before putting her inside, but I left the top open and immediately opened the front door after she was in. Finally I closed the front before putting her inside, closed the top after putting her inside, and immediately opened the front door so she could leave.

This is definitely a longer-term project and not something that will help immediately (she was a kitten when I started, and it took about 5 months), but for us, we were able to get to the point where I'm now able to put her inside every morning, and I maintain the routine so I don't have to worry about her growing fearful again during times we don't need the kennel. If I have free time, I'll randomly put her in kennel too, just so she doesn't start to get suspicious if I do need to take her somewhere and I need to kennel her later than breakfast time.

We started this because I was also unable to take her to the vet so I know how stressful it can be. I hope everything with your baby will go okay!

Thanks for your really nice response. I've had the carrier out for years now, and I feed her treats in it (open). But you had the advantage of working with a kitten, whereas my girl was about 4 when she arrived and had experienced significant trauma (she hid for 2 weeks when she came here). She's more relaxed around the carrier, but also extremely wary. I know that to confine her, I may have to use force--if the increased gabapentin dosage doesn't work to sedate her enough.

Thanks again for sharing the incredible patience you've had with your cat.

 

[happilyretired]

Have you tried coming from behind and picking her up at the part of her neck like the mother cat would with her mouth with your two fingers? I understand it’s not super easy if she’s a larger cat, I struggle to it but my fiance (a big guy) has no problem doing that with our cats. We rarely have to but every once in awhile if they get really freaked out like by a fire drill when we lived in a condo or a garbage bag (one cat really is) or they don’t want to get into a carrier when he does that it truly instantly calms them down and he is able to get them into the carrier. It takes confidence though when you do it and you cannot not be afraid. He’s had them since they were kittens he’s really good with it. I found a lot of what our cats react to is our own calmness and fear. So if your cat thinks you are nervous about picking her up or getting her into the carrier they get scared too. Our Ragdoll can be skittish she was found not the side of the road in a plastic bag and we think a man with a long black coat in boots dropped her off because she is petrified of most men, long black coats and boots. Sometimes she acts up at the vet but the vet will usually give her an anti anxiety medication often a shot if she does. They always call and ask if that’s okay and we say yes. Have you had a vet do that, maybe a shot? It also helps now that we go to the same vet and have for four years she is more comfortable. Our tuxie is pretty Low key but she hates car rides. We tried Gabapentin but even at the max does it did not work she would cry and yeowl and pant the entire car ride. So I think for some cats it just does not work. She also does not react to cat nip. We tried Benadryl no such luck. The only thing that works with her (and this is weird) is that we have to distract her if she does not want to get in the carrier. I let her watch YouTube videos of fish, I swear to you on my phone. Then I get her from behind and I shove her in she does not know what hits hit.. ha ha. Or my fiance does the neck pinch thing. In a true emergency such as a fire if you really need to move the cat out grab a pillow case and throw the cat in there. It will not be pleasant but the cat will live. That’s what our vet told us. We only had to do it once, it was only a drill but it worked.

Thanks for your response. No, I have never done the 'two-finger thing,' and I doubt I'd be able to. Not only is she big (12.5 lbs), but I am 79 and live alone (i.e., no one to help with her). She seems to respond OK to the gabapentin, but getting her confined requires a lot of planning. Not only does she pick up on my own nervousness, it's important to close the bedroom doors before trying to minimize the places she can escape to and hide. Once I start closing doors, she's on 'alert,' so as I mentioned to someone else, I'm going to try to close those doors every once in a while so that it will be more routine and not signal trouble to her.

 

[35 year catdad]

I've had Martin, a huge shelter cat adoptee returned for being a talker, and hes never once been in my lap. And I can't pick him up after 10 yrs trying. ok...no prob
But...when I lay down to nap hes there by my side purring and rubbing his cheek pheromones on me. soooo he gives me love on his terms. He is a special one and also signs in tune to songs -usually the blues. I have recordings to share its too funny!

I have some gabapentin for martin I will use next time we visit a vet. Careful with that stuff as i used the presc. amount in my sick old Tortie and she jumped up on my chair and b4 I could grab her...fell off on her side. Yikes she doesn't appear to be in pain and no need for heavy drugs. She does breathe fast and shallow (like in pain)with my huge sub Q fluid needle in her neck but its over in 5 minutes.
My two girts can read my thoughts from afar and dog gone it I havent kept a journal. My boycat doesn't do this.
Hes not the brightest bulb on the tree....female felines are far superior to males intelligence wise, in my experience..
Last time for the old Tortie was 5 days ago 3 am when I thought she had died in her hiding spot, sooooo I went online laying in bed silently (shes deaf anyway) to see how much it costs for that last Cat-Vorkian shot..and before i could call the 24hr emerg vet for a price to put her down.... here she is on my stomach purring ..and telling me NOT YET DAD!!!.. ok ok honey so I put the tablet down and that was that! They have ultra sensitive senses and can pick up our thoughts I am 100% convinced.
.
Take care