Good variety at butcher!...thoughts please

thecatlady3

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I went to my butcher today to buy some chicken because I ordered TC Feline to try. They had whole local rabbit. Of course chicken beef pork and venison. They also had beef and chicken liver. They also had frozen mixed giblets. They also grind chicken carcasses, without organ. I asked about them and they remove the breast, thighs, wings etc and grind the remaining carcass.

I did want to do a ground type of diet but have been struggling with wanting to ensure I have all the necessary ingredients. I want to avoid adding various supplements, hence the TC feline.

Do you think I could make a sufficient diet with these ingredients? I know the meat and organs available are sufficient but what about the ground carcass? How much of that should I use for enough bone?

I don't have a grinder but want to feed a ground diet. I want to be able to spend an hour or so per month to prepare food and freeze it.

Any help is appreciated!!
 

vball91

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The chicken carcass grind is going to be very high in bone. I am not sure how you're going to figure out how much of it to feed unless the butcher can give you a really good guesstimate of the bone percentage.
 

peaches08

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Which TC Feline did you get?  TC Feline has calcium in it so all you need to add is meat, water, and liver (unless is has freeze dried liver in it). 
 
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thecatlady3

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Which TC Feline did you get?  TC Feline has calcium in it so all you need to add is meat, water, and liver (unless is has freeze dried liver in it). 
I got the one with liver, but now that I found chicken liver I will try the one without
 

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Which TC Feline did you get?  TC Feline has calcium in it so all you need to add is meat, water, and liver (unless is has freeze dried liver in it). 
I got the one with liver, but now that I found chicken liver I will try the one without
Did you get that you should not use the ground carcass with TCFeline? It already includes calcium. Bone is only needed as a source of calcium.
 
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thecatlady3

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The chicken carcass grind is going to be very high in bone. I am not sure how you're going to figure out how much of it to feed unless the butcher can give you a really good guesstimate of the bone percentage.
Ok thank you.
 

peaches08

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I got the one with liver, but now that I found chicken liver I will try the one without
OK, for the TC Feline that has liver in it, all you will need to add is meat and water.  The TC Feline without liver in it, all you will need is meat, water, and liver.  The packages should have instructions on them about how much to add.

The whole carcass grinds should NOT be used with these premixes.  That much bone/calcium is very unhealthy for your kitty.
 
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thecatlady3

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OK, for the TC Feline that has liver in it, all you will need to add is meat and water.  The TC Feline without liver in it, all you will need is meat, water, and liver.  The packages should have instructions on them about how much to add.

The whole carcass grinds should NOT be used with these premixes.  That much bone/calcium is very unhealthy for your kitty.
Hi thank you! Sorry if my post wasn't clear. I went to the butcher just to buy meat, but then found all of the other meats and organs.
I'm ok to use the TC feline but ultimately would like to make my own using whole ingredients, without added supplements.
I was wanting to know if it was feasible to make a diet with the items I listed in my post.

I know only to add meat to the TC feline and not extra bones, etc.
thanks for clarifying
 

peaches08

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Hi thank you! Sorry if my post wasn't clear. I went to the butcher just to buy meat, but then found all of the other meats and organs.
I'm ok to use the TC feline but ultimately would like to make my own using whole ingredients, without added supplements.
I was wanting to know if it was feasible to make a diet with the items I listed in my post.

I know only to add meat to the TC feline and not extra bones, etc.
thanks for clarifying
Oh OK! As far as supplements, if you use ground meat and bone then you will be adding supplements due to oxidation. To avoid supplements you would need to feed prey model raw, but you have to make sure each cat eats their own share. I don't have time to police bowls, so I do the grind and supplement.
 
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thecatlady3

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Oh OK! As far as supplements, if you use ground meat and bone then you will be adding supplements due to oxidation. To avoid supplements you would need to feed prey model raw, but you have to make sure each cat eats their own share. I don't have time to police bowls, so I do the grind and supplement.
Ok thank you! I too don't want to police bowls, but I will have to initially as I have one that won't eat raw at all. He will be time consuming and require patience.
I am thinking TC feline will be the way to go for me until I get the hang of raw feeding. Thank you for your input!
 
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thecatlady3

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Oh OK! As far as supplements, if you use ground meat and bone then you will be adding supplements due to oxidation. To avoid supplements you would need to feed prey model raw, but you have to make sure each cat eats their own share. I don't have time to police bowls, so I do the grind and supplement.
If I were to make my own ground food I would have to add supplements, however, why don't commercial made frozen raw products add supplements? I was looking at Red Dog a Blue Kat products and they don't add any supplements yet they say their meals are complete. So confused...
 

peaches08

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If I were to make my own ground food I would have to add supplements, however, why don't commercial made frozen raw products add supplements? I was looking at Red Dog a Blue Kat products and they don't add any supplements yet they say their meals are complete. So confused...
I saw in their ingredients list that they are adding supplements (wild salmon oil, eggs, veggies), so I'm not sure why they claim to not add supplements.  Maybe the definition of "supplement" varies from person to person. 
 
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thecatlady3

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I saw in their ingredients list that they are adding supplements (wild salmon oil, eggs, veggies), so I'm not sure why they claim to not add supplements.  Maybe the definition of "supplement" varies from person to person. 
Maybe. What about taurine? I would think that would degrade with freezing?
 

peaches08

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Maybe. What about taurine? I would think that would degrade with freezing?
There are different schools of thought on this.  I've read where people have questioned taurine degradation when freezing and I adopted their philosophy:  I don't know if it degrades or not, the toxicity level is hard to reach, so I add more taurine than required when making food and maybe my cats simply have expensive urine (from excess taurine excretion).  But the vet and vet techs always comment about how great their eyes and coat look so I don't worry about the high levels of taurine that I give them.

The taurine in Red Dog Blue Cat is supplied by heart meat.  I don't have access to heart meat other than beef, and my cats literally fled the room when I tried to serve it.  I don't have time for that noise so I feed ground and have the supplements already in the food.  I do have chunks in the food for dental health, though.  Lately I've taken to cutting up Cornish hens and storing snack-size amounts and letting them have that for bone-in snacks.  But as far as balancing the meat:bone, liver, heart, and etc for prey model?  I can't keep Julie from swiping everyone's liver, Gadget will haul off with everyone's meat chunks...it's just easier for me to use a recipe that makes it easier when "musical bowls" starts.  My method isn't perfect but it's what works for me and my cats eat balanced meals 90% of the time or better (the other 10% or less being unbalanced snacks).
 
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thecatlady3

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There are different schools of thought on this.  I've read where people have questioned taurine degradation when freezing and I adopted their philosophy:  I don't know if it degrades or not, the toxicity level is hard to reach, so I add more taurine than required when making food and maybe my cats simply have expensive urine (from excess taurine excretion).  But the vet and vet techs always comment about how great their eyes and coat look so I don't worry about the high levels of taurine that I give them.

The taurine in Red Dog Blue Cat is supplied by heart meat.  I don't have access to heart meat other than beef, and my cats literally fled the room when I tried to serve it.  I don't have time for that noise so I feed ground and have the supplements already in the food.  I do have chunks in the food for dental health, though.  Lately I've taken to cutting up Cornish hens and storing snack-size amounts and letting them have that for bone-in snacks.  But as far as balancing the meat:bone, liver, heart, and etc for prey model?  I can't keep Julie from swiping everyone's liver, Gadget will haul off with everyone's meat chunks...it's just easier for me to use a recipe that makes it easier when "musical bowls" starts.  My method isn't perfect but it's what works for me and my cats eat balanced meals 90% of the time or better (the other 10% or less being unbalanced snacks).
Would you mind sharing your recipe?
 
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