Genetic Concerns in Russian Blues?

[moriah]

Okay, this is a story I know all of you have heard many, many times over, and if the question is "Is my cat a Russian Blue" the answer is 99% likely to be no. My concern over bloodline here is not about wanting my cat to be any more special than she already is to me, but to make sure I ensure she has a long, healthy, and happy life by getting her any kind of preventative care or testing she might need.

Essentially -- green eyes with a very tiny yellow ring around them -- but not as vivid of a green as I've seen in showcats. Mauve pawpads. Grey nose leather. Definite double-coat with tipping -- I have seen RBs up close and personally, and when we adopted her I went over to a friend's house to examine her RB's coat to see if they are the same. Tail has very subtle ring pattern that has lightened with age and is now barely noticible. She's only six months old butI don't have a recent picture. Lean but not skinny with definite muscle. Flaw: tiny white stripe on lower belly. I highly doubt she's purebred, but she's definitely a good lookalike.

She was found in a dumpster at 3 weeks old and taken in by a fostering group. We have no idea of the colors of her littermates. (No, she's not named Smokey -- Chloe is her name.)

I'm aware that Russian Blues are generally a very healthy breed, but I am curious if there are any recessives in the RB population that could have caused the white stripe, as well as if there are any diseases that RBs not on the Active Register could pass on should they be mated despite their non-breedable status. I do not believe that any responsible breeder would abandon a kitten because of a "flaw", but then again no responsible breeder would breed from a cat that was not on the Active Register and we've seen it happen before, although not often in RBs. My thought was that either someone was attempting to sell lookalikes and abandoned her since she was not a perfect lookalike, or it was an "oops!" litter, perhaps even from a female that strayed.

When dealing with medical care for my Chloe, I'd rather act as if a parent of hers might have been Russian Blue if there are any possible genetic concerns in the breed. She's been spayed already, and I wouldn't have bred her anyway. But if anyone knows of anything it might be wise to check out with her, please let me know as I adore my cat and want to be the most responsible pet owner I can be.

I'm aware that many shelters and individuals will call a cat part-Russian Blue to make it more attractive to potential adopters. Even though I know true RB breeders hate to hear "She might have some Russian in her", I'm pretty sure any cat-lover would be okay with whatever it took to help a stray or abandoned cat get a home as quickly as possible as long as they weren't charging for the kittens or advertising them as purebred.

Thanks,
Moriah

*Edit* Picture didn't work.

 

[moriah]

BTW: I'm not asking anyone to tell me if my cat had any Russian Blue parents or grandparents. I'm aware the chances are slim to none, and it's almost certain she is not purebred (because of the conditions she was found in and the white stripe).

However, on the off chance that she was produced in an "oops" litter or by an irresponsible "breeder" (these people don't deserve the name) who took a RB that was not on the Active Register and bred grey DSHs to it to try to sell lookalikes as "non-registered Russian Blues", it's unlikely that any Russian(s) bred from in her line are as healthy or as hearty as a breeding-quality cat on the Active Register. While any responsible breeder would immediately remove any cat with identified genetic predispositions to disease from their breeding program, the only way any of her ancestors could have been Russian Blues would have been because the person who mated the cat was not responsible.

If there are no genetic tendencies in "bad" lines that I would need to worry with, then I can forget about the question entirely and save some vet bills in testing or monitoring for any breed-specific problems. If there are tendencies, however, I would rather act as if she were Russian Blue insofar as to get her tested for anything and monitor her health, even on 100,000 to one odds. She's a wonderfully sweet moggy and I want to keep her healthy so she can own me for a very long time!

Moriah

 

[elizwithcat]

My book on purebred cats says Russian Blues are generally hardy cats.

 

[StefanZ]

Lucky you for finding such a lovely cat! She must be beautiful if so much look alike RB!

And who knows. Grandfather of our younger RB was castrated as 8 year, and he was allowed to get out and stray a little. So there are probably some cousins to Vagis roaming around as blue and black moggies... It may also happened in your country...

White hairs. Yes, they happen in RB. Not frequently but they do happen.
1. Single, occasional - the cat can be used to breeding if real excellent in other features.
2. More - being a spot - the cat cant be used in breeding.
Those usually on the breast as a little medal.

The race is healthy. Hardly typical genetical sickedness.
I know some russian blue had kidney failures yes. But kidney failures is the single most common serious sickedness otherwise healthy cats do die from. In all breeds and in moggies.


Last. I think it is OK for a shelter or someone who took care of a homeless stray bluegrey cat to call it for russian-blue alike or something such. As long as they dont demand a price as for att pedigree russian - but the price as for a moggie. As long as the blue-grey moggie get a good home I dont mind she/he is called for a Russian Blue!
Everyone knows it is a moggie, so nobody gets deceived.

A colonel-leutenant is usually called for colonel amongst his friends. It is quite OK for our ex homeless bluegrey moggie to be called almost pure Russian blue if it makes everyone happy.

Warm greetings
from long cousins
Vagis and Muskis!

 

[moriah]

Originally Posted by StefanZ

Lucky you for finding such a lovely cat! She must be beautiful if so much look alike RB!

Yes, I am very lucky to have found her. I've never owned a purebred cat and really don't see me ever doing so, despite how lovely some of the breeds are. I'm fairly sure the only way my conscience could allow me to do so would be to donate twice the amount the kitten cost to a local shelter or fostering group. All of my babies have been rescues, shelter kitties, or "We really don't know what to do with Miss Kitty's babies, if we don't get rid of them I guess they'll have to go to the pound..." situations (and everytime I've taken one of those I gave them enough money to get their cat spayed or offered to take them to get it done myself).

She's not only beautiful but very sweet, although she is fairly shy of strangers. She's bonded to me more closely than my boyfriend, but that is because I am home more often. Still, I often come into the living room to find her asleep on his lap, and she always sleeps with us. She really won't settle down until one of us lays down in bed and lets her knead our chest or belly awhile (thank goodness for SoftPaws!) She's also very smart, and while she loves to chase toys we've thrown for her (mylar balls and hard-shelled mice with beads in them to make them rattle slightly are her favorites), the fishing pole toys have to be used quite craftily to keep her interested. I've had cats who will chase the same thing for hours in a circle, but after a few misses she runs back behind something (usually my legs!) to hide and pounce.

And who knows. Grandfather of our younger RB was castrated as 8 year, and he was allowed to get out and stray a little. So there are probably some cousins to Vagis roaming around as blue and black moggies... It may also happened in your country...

I'm sure quite a few moggies have some purebred ancestor way back in their genetic history -- I've seen barncats that are pointed, several with facial structures similar to Persians although not nearly as pronounced as some, etc. But I also know those traits had to be in the cat population to begin with for the breeds to ever have developed. A friend of the family adopted what appeared to be an almost pure-white kitten with a slight peach tone on the tail and ears that grew up to be a very gorgeous cat that showed peach pointing and has gotten darker with the years -- and the trait has bred true, to the person's slight dismay as she didn't really mean for her to breed but couldn't afford the spay operation quickly enough and she got outside. A gorgeous line of cats, but I'd never call them any kind of Siamese.

White hairs. Yes, they happen in RB. Not frequently but they do happen.
1. Single, occasional - the cat can be used to breeding if real excellent in other features.
2. More - being a spot - the cat cant be used in breeding.
Those usually on the breast as a little medal.

While the stripe is rather small, it's bigger than what I would refer to as a "button" or a "locket". I've had several black cats that exhibited some stray white hairs in the same region, but hers is quite defined. Oddly enough, I really hope she was a simple random-bred daughter of a stray instead of the product of some of the people who attempt to sell "paperless pedigree cats" or breed a "not for breeding" pet cat deliberately. "Oops!" litters occur, and the stray and feral populations are so large already that while it's sad accidents occur, deliberately breeding a cat and then abandoning it is something I cannot comprehend.

The race is healthy. Hardly typical genetical sickedness.

Very good to hear, and that does ease my mind a bit. I've known several people who have taken in strays that possibly had Persian ancestors and lost their cats to cardiomyopathy (sp?). They beat themselves up for a long time for not considering the possibility and failing to carefully monitor them for the condition.

I know some russian blue had kidney failures yes. But kidney failures is the single most common serious sickedness otherwise healthy cats do die from. In all breeds and in moggies.

True. So far she's been eating Iams Kitten dry food, but I bought her a water fountain when I got the Littermaid (while some people say I spoil her, the Littermaid at least was purchased to spoil me). I hope this will encourage her to stay well-hydrated, and as she gets older if the vets see any signs of problems I will do whatever is neccessary as far as any special diets to prevent/treat those issues. The website www.felinecrf.com lists Russian Blues as possibly being more prone to chronic renal insufficiency, but does say it can and does happen in any cat. With the interesting concerns regarding the 4-in-one kitten vaccines grown in kidney tissues and later kidney disease, hopefully any preventable predispositions will be resolved for all cats. If that is a possibility for the cause of kidney disease, perhaps it seems to be more prevalent in Russian Blues and other purebred cats because purebred cats are more likely to have all of their shots kept up with than your average barncat.

Last. I think it is OK for a shelter or someone who took care of a homeless stray bluegrey cat to call it for russian-blue alike or something such. As long as they dont demand a price as for att pedigree russian - but the price as for a moggie. As long as the blue-grey moggie get a good home I dont mind she/he is called for a Russian Blue! Everyone knows it is a moggie, so nobody gets deceived.

*grin* I agree, and shelters are often in a position where many cats simply aren't adopted. I can understand them doing whatever they can to get ones that resemble pedigreed cats adopted -- because then at least that cat will be saved. Of course, that does leave out the wonderfully sweet kitties that aren't lucky enough to look unusual. I'd never recommend anyone adopt a cat for its looks, but at least they are getting homes.

Anyway, I'm very lucky to have Chloe and I know it, despite who her great-grandma or grandpa might be. I do feel better that the chances of any preventable/treatable causes for disease for her would be no more than the usual for most cats -- but she's still going to get excellent vet care regardless. We have an excellent vet that only works with cats, and she's quite reasonably priced for her level of expertise.

Thanks,
Moriah

 

[StefanZ]

Thanks Moriah for your beatiful letter and your wise thoughts.

Interesting too about the theory of vaccine grown on kidney tissues and kidney diseases...

Btw. Many - NOT most - RB are more or less shy of strangers.


PS: What is Littermaid and what is SoftPaws you do mention?
Im not sure we have them here in Sweden, - if we have them so in different commercial names...

 

[elizwithcat]

Sometimes shelter do declare their cat a persian mix or a main coon mix, or simply persian or main coon. Many times, though, the cat doesn't even resemble whatever mix or breed he is supposed to be.

I do think it's deceptive, though, unless shelter actually knows who the parents were, because I am sure many a time the cat isn't going to have any of the breed in him he/she is supposed to be.
When I was in petsmart, they had a cat for adoption who they declared a persian mix, but he was short hair. Still very cute, though.

 

[StefanZ]

Originally Posted by elizwithcat

When I was in petsmart, they had a cat for adoption who they declared a persian mix, but he was short hair.

a) how is it with genetic? I believe longhair genes are recessive. If so, it means a perser x shorthair cat will usually be shorthair...
So if they knew or though they knew a parent was persian - it was correct to call him a persian mix.

b) there ARE shorthaired persians. the Exotic.

But in the main I do agree with you, many times it is as you tell us.

 

[moriah]

SoftPaws are a type of vinyl (or some other plastic) cap that is glued onto the cat's claws after trimming their nails. It's an alternative to declawing. I'm glad they've introduced them here in the States because so many people seem to think they have to declaw their cats if they want to keep their furniture or have children. Not only do I think declawing is incredibly cruel, our contract with the fostering group includes an agreement not to declaw as there are so many declawed cats in shelters because they developed behavioral problems. We don't use them as much for our furniture's sake as because I have a non-classic-hemophillia blood clotting disorder and cats often make me bleed just by accident.

I've given the brochures for the product to every landlord I've had who tried to enforce a declaw policy on their tenants -- and only once was I rejected from renting an apartment or house because I refused to declaw.

LitterMaid is one of the makers of automatic litterboxes -- while they don't scoop everything (the rakes don't get all the way down to the bottom of the box) it does help with odor control and reduces the time for litterbox maintenance. It also means that if I need to go out of town for a day or two she won't have a horribly stinky litterbox and our catsitter doesn't have to scoop it. (One of my boyfriend's longtime friends has a housecleaning service, and she gives us a very reasonable price to have her come in to clean every other week. She also has offered to catsit for us anytime we need it.)

As far as my spoiled kitties, I bought my first automatic litterbox as a Christmas present for myself. We did find a bargain cat tree (six feet tall) for her, but I'm just glad she's a small and lightweight kitty -- if she gets bigger we may have to use the plans and build another one that's more sturdy. She has a ton of toys, mainly because she's good at losing them under the couch and that way we can bring them out one at a time and hunt them all down at once when she runs low.

----

Eliz:

"I do think it's deceptive, though, unless shelter actually knows who the parents were, because I am sure many a time the cat isn't going to have any of the breed in him he/she is supposed to be."

It is deceptive to a degree, but many people may come to a shelter just to see the cats and not really to adopt one. If they're stuck on wanting a specific type of cat, it does get the homeless kitty a home. I think the reason we Americans want to have a cat with a supposed purebred ancestry is related to how we discuss our own genetic roots -- if someone mentions their family is mostly Scottish, for example, everyone in the room will start detailing where their family came from and what they're a "mix" of. Since an American with Scottish blood on one side might call themselves Scottish, it's no wonder that we will call a pointed cat Siamese without proof of ancestry.

Thanks to all of you for being willing to respond to my question!

Moriah

Edit -- I finally think I have a good link to photos of my Chloe.

http://photos.yahoo.com/rhiannonbrightstar

The photos were all taken at her foster-mom's place about two weeks before I adopted her. You can see that the lighting is very different in all photos -- one she looks a very dark blue with almost pointed tail and feet, and only in one head shot was the lighting good enough to see the green eyes at such a young age. The eye progression was rather odd -- at that age they were almost jade-green, then became more yellowish, and now at six months the inside is a darker green with a very small yellow ring around the outside. Still, they are not the vivid emerald green I see in showcat's pictures.

Anyway, I love showing her off -- she's so cute! As soon as we get a digicam, I plan on getting some better pictures of her in different lightings to show some of my coworkers who hear me talk about her but have never really gotten to see her except as the grey streak running back towards the bedroom when company comes, or shyly peeking her head out. She's my sweet baby girl and I'd love her even if she was the ugliest cat on the planet -- but I think she's beautiful as well as sweet.

 

[KitEKats4Eva!]

I have a purebred Russian Blue and she has about ten or fifteen pure white hairs on her chest. It annoys me but they are also really cute at the same time.

Very hardy breed - there is nothing ever wrong with her.

Russians as a whole will be timid with strangers and tend to latch onto one person in the house, whom they will generally adopt and then follow around like shadows wherever you go. It's VERY sweet.

My other cats are shelter kitties but I got Sashka because I loved the look of the breed and everything I'd read about their personalities. As she is an indoor-only cat I was happy to spend the money on her, a lot of it to see what it is like to have a purebred cat. She is everything I hoped for and more, I just adore her and would never hesitate to get another Russian.