FIP and other cats

[iarecrystal]

About a week ago one of my 5 month old kittens (Julian) was pretty much diagnosed with the "wet" form of FIP. He is not acting sick but does have the potbelly and is losing alot of weight. We've got steroids from the vet to keep him comfortable but I have a question about one of my other kittens.

Daisy is Julians sister and just today she started acting sluggish. She did not want to eat, play, eat a treat, or any of the things she usually loves. She's got watery eyes and I've cleaned up two places where one of them has vomited. I'm not sure who did it but I'm thinking it was her since all my other cats seem just fine and normal.

Can the wet form of FIP spread? I asked my vet and she said all my other cats are just fine and won't catch what Julian has.
I was wondering if anyone else has lost more than one cat to FIP and if the second one showed any sick symptoms like Daisy is. I am pondering isolating Julian but I don't know if I should.
Any advice or thoughts on what's going on with Daisy? Her and Julian are going to the vet saturday anyway but till then I need to find this all out before I worry myself sick.

thanks

 

[emb_78]

Originally Posted by iarecrystal

About a week ago one of my 5 month old kittens (Julian) was pretty much diagnosed with the "wet" form of FIP. He is not acting sick but does have the potbelly and is losing alot of weight. We've got steroids from the vet to keep him comfortable but I have a question about one of my other kittens.

Daisy is Julians sister and just today she started acting sluggish. She did not want to eat, play, eat a treat, or any of the things she usually loves. She's got watery eyes and I've cleaned up two places where one of them has vomited. I'm not sure who did it but I'm thinking it was her since all my other cats seem just fine and normal.

Can the wet form of FIP spread? I asked my vet and she said all my other cats are just fine and won't catch what Julian has.
I was wondering if anyone else has lost more than one cat to FIP and if the second one showed any sick symptoms like Daisy is. I am pondering isolating Julian but I don't know if I should.
Any advice or thoughts on what's going on with Daisy? Her and Julian are going to the vet saturday anyway but till then I need to find this all out before I worry myself sick.

thanks

I don't know why you were told that???? Your other cats can get the FIP from her!

 

[kluchetta]

Originally Posted by emb_78

I don't know why you were told that???? Your other cats can get the FIP from her!

I agree!!! My kitten was just diagnosed with dry FIP. My vet isn't extremely worried about my other cats, because they are adults, but kittens seem to quite susceptible to it. I understand it's passed in stool and saliva. In addition, in a thread where I talked about it, Hissy told me to throw away his toys, bedding and litter box!

I'm so sorry about your kitty. FIP is just horrible!

 

[iarecrystal]

So I should definetly isolate Julian?

 

[kluchetta]

Is Daisy Julian's only sibling there? It is my opinion that if she's not well, isolating him might be too late. I would really question the vet, and get a vetrinarian's opinion. The feeling I got in the vet's office was that they were only too willing to rush me out of there - it's contagious!

 

[iarecrystal]

Julian has two siblings (Daisy and Louie.) and my other kitten is not related to any of them, but is the same age, maybe a few weeks older. I also have four adult cats and everyone is acting fine except Daisy. Even Julian is acting normally, besides his pot belly and thin frame.

 

[iarecrystal]

I have been doing alot of research as much as I could lately and I found this page: http://www.sniksnak.com/cathealth/fip.html

(Where it states the stages of FIP) I think he is in stage 3 because our vet told us he has about two months to live. It says there that the cat is not contagious during this stage. I am thinking that is the conclusion my vet has came to, but I don't know how to explain Daisy starting to get sick. She was playing and jumping this morning but around 4:30 is when I noticed her acting not-so-well. Could it be a coincidence?

 

[kluchetta]

Well, since I just learned about FIP yesterday, I'm hardly anyone's expert. Some understanding I get is that there is an initial infection. In my cat's case, at about 11 weeks several of the kittens got what seemed like a cold, and was probably the coronavirus. Some who get it get FIP, some just had the sneezes once. The virus mutates into a deadly form which is a time bomb inside the kitty. One of my sources said that when they are sick they don't actively shed the virus - but to me that doesn't sound right - I'd be careful with that.

So...hopefully someone more knowledgeable will show up. But I would get a second opinion. Practically, I know it's hard to isolate a cat, especially if they all sleep in the same place, etc. because you want your sick cat to be comfortable and happy, and that happiness may come from those other cats themselves.

I hope this is a little bit helpful - I'm a bit overwhelmed myself right now, and I don't have any other kittens.

 

[kluchetta]

Originally Posted by iarecrystal

I have been doing alot of research as much as I could lately and I found this page: http://www.sniksnak.com/cathealth/fip.html

(Where it states the stages of FIP) I think he is in stage 3 because our vet told us he has about two months to live. It says there that the cat is not contagious during this stage. I am thinking that is the conclusion my vet has came to, but I don't know how to explain Daisy starting to get sick. She was playing and jumping this morning but around 4:30 is when I noticed her acting not-so-well. Could it be a coincidence?

I hope so, but it's hard to dismiss. My cat has the dry, and it started right after he got neutered. He just sat hunched up for a day, and his third eyelid started showing. Then his eye started swelling, and he had a fever, and well, he's just really sick. I'd take her in anyway. You should get a temp at least.

 

[iarecrystal]

Come to think of it, around the end of July and beginning of August, when all of the kittens were around 3 months, all four kittens and the mother of the three siblings all caught a URI. It was like a small epidemic. Everyone was sick for around two weeks but antibiotics helped. Do you think this could've been the initial infection of the cornoavirus? I'm not sure if it has anything to do with it,though.

We're going to speak with the vet on the phone tomorrow and probably take Daisy and Julian to the vet saturday.
Me and my mother are truely overwhelmed, as I have just lost my dad and it seems everything is going badly.

 

[kluchetta]

Originally Posted by iarecrystal

Come to think of it, around the end of July and beginning of August, when all of the kittens were around 3 months, all four kittens and the mother of the three siblings all caught a URI. It was like a small epidemic. Everyone was sick for around two weeks but antibiotics helped. Do you think this could've been the initial infection of the cornoavirus? I'm not sure if it has anything to do with it,though.

Yeah, I really do. And I think that the mother will probably be ok, and some of the kittens. It's EXACTLY what happened here. I'm so worried. There are 7 other kittens out there that may have it as well.

Sheesh. This stinks!

 

[iarecrystal]

Julian went to the vet today and he is not getting any better. Daisy didn't go to the vet because the next day she was fine and has been fine since. She's playing like usual and being the silyl hyper kitty she's always been, we don't know what was wrong with her.
I asked again if his FIP was contagious and she said no. But I was wondering since Daisy is related so closely to Julian, does that mean she is more likley to mutate the coronavirus because her genes are close to being the same? Or is it just a random mutation that happens in a random cat that's been exposed to coronavirus?

All this is very confusing.

 

[kluchetta]

I was under the impression it was a random mutation. But I still think it odd that the vet doesn't think it was contagious. The vet I went to all but followed us to the door with bleach.

 

[booktigger]

When I had a cat with FIP, I was told to isolate her from my other cat (and his blood tests show he is perfectly healthy for his age, 2.5 years later), although I have read articles recently that state that as it is a mutation, it can happen to indoor only, single cat households. If they are related though, maybe there is a chance it could affect both. I really would talk to another vet though. This is something a friend sent to me off the net a few months ago:

Recent research has shown that mutant FECVs arise within an individual cat. Thus, we now know that the vast majority of cats do not "catch" FIP, but they develop it themselves from their own mutant FECV. Transmission of FIP from cat to cat is considered to be rare. This fact has caused leading FIP researchers to state that cats who are ill with FIP are unlikely to be a risk to other cats and thus do not need to be isolated.

The peak ages for losses to FIP are from 6 months to 2 years old (with the highest incidence at 10 months of age). Age-associated immunity to FIP appears to be possible. Transmission of FIP from a queen to her unborn kittens has not been shown to occur.

 

[kluchetta]

I did read, also on the 'net, that the initial infection with Coronavirus tended to be contagious, but when the disease is full blown, they don't tend to shed the virus. One of my other cats is his mom, who grooms him all the time. I doubt separating them would help, as it would just stress both of them. My other cat is a 15 year old queen of the world, who wouldn't deign to be near the other two. She also is extremely healthy, and the vet thought she was only 10.

 

[semiferal]

First, I am very sorry to hear about Julian.

Isolating him will do no good at this point since everyone has already been exposed to him. However, your vet is right - the risk to your other cats is minimal. FIP is caused by specific mutations of feline coronavirus. Feline coronavirus is highly contagious but the mutations themselves are not. No one knows exactly why some cats develop the mutation and others do not. Overall, up to 90% of cats have positive coronavirus titres. However, only about 5% of cats ever develop FIP. Direct exposure to cats with FIP does not seem to increase the risk for healthy cats. Clusters of cases do occur, though only rarely. In these cases, normally the cats actually seem to have different mutations originating from the same "parent" virus. The evidence is still that the specific pathogenic mutations are not contagious. So for the rest of your cats, this is very good news.

It would be wise, however, to avoid bringing in any new cats for the remainder of Julian's life. At the very least, this will keep Julian's stress level lower and help to keep him in relatively good health for as long as possible.

FIP is a rotten disease. My thoughts are with you.

 

[semiferal]

Originally Posted by iarecrystal

I asked again if his FIP was contagious and she said no. But I was wondering since Daisy is related so closely to Julian, does that mean she is more likley to mutate the coronavirus because her genes are close to being the same? Or is it just a random mutation that happens in a random cat that's been exposed to coronavirus?

All this is very confusing.

It sounds like you have a fantastic vet.

Everything I have read and experienced indicates that Daisy is no more likely to get FIP than any other cat. Even siblings - who can share even more genetic material than parents and offspring - do not seem to be more at risk if one gets FIP. I don't think there is any reason that her odds of getting FIP are any higher than the 5% odds that any other cat has. She could develop it, of course, but it would be a pretty random coincidence. She still has a 95% chance that she will never get FIP.

 

[kluchetta]

Thanks, that makes me feel better, too!

 

[beckiboo]

I am so sorry about Julian! And condolences on the loss of your Dad. What a difficult time your family has had!

I lost a kitten (Mattie) last summer to FIP. I did isolate her from her littermate (Festus) and our other boy (Garfield). I had read that FIP is not really contagious, but sometimes more than one cat in the household will get FIP. I wish I was the member of a site like this at the time, to help give more information! I was fearful at the time, and took away Mattie's support system in her last days.

Mattie would lay in a laundry basket in our kitchen when she was first sick with wet FIP. I knew she was less active than the other kittens, but just thought she was mellow...I didn't know the round belly could be something serious. After I quarantined her, she began to look a lot worse, because Festus used to get in the laundry basket with her and bathe her. So Mattie's fur looked oily, and she kept getting thinner and thinner. We finally put her to sleep when it seemed she had lost all quality of living.

Festus and Garfield are still doing fine. They were never developed FIP, and neither did the other 2 kittens from our litter, who were adopted before Mattie got sick. I pray that your other kittens will be fine as well.

 

[iarecrystal]

Thanks everyone for your advice and thoughts. I feel really releived about the lessened chance of Daisy getting FIP. I have decided to not isolate Julian, based on all the information that I have gained from you all and from my vet.

They don't know how long it will be for Julian, but he is not showing any sign on discomfort, or anything he's being the sweetest kitten alive. But I know isolating him is making him less comfortable. He's the kind of kitten who just loves to be in your lap, and I've been missing that in the last few days.