Cat's play always end with hissing/growling

[bathsmama]

I have a 2 year old Baxter (neutered male) we rescued when he was 6 months..... and a 4 month old Bartholo"mew" (neutered male) that we recently adopted.

So far, Baxter doesn't seem to mind sharing toys, hiding spaces, sleeping spaces, etc... and even doesn't mind too much when the kitten tries to steal his food. They seem to be going in each other's litter boxes, so I figure they can sort that one out over time on their own...although I don't know if this could be a cause of concern to allow the kitten to use Baxter's box.

Since Bartholomew is a new addition, we've been keeping him seperated in the bathroom during the night when we can't supervise them.

First thing in the morning, they touch noses and then are very anxious for breakfast They eat find right next to each other and there is a lot of purring going on.

After that, they pretty much use the litterbox right away, and the kitten seems to go directly for Baxter's box instead of his own and I can't really tell if Baxter is annoyed by it or not. He tries to use the kitten's box which is in the bathroom, and I don't shoo either away and just let them do their business.

After that, the play begins. Usually lots of trilling going on with Baxter. They take mutual turns chasing each other across the room....but within a few minutes, it usually ends up with Baxter pinning the kitten down...and the kitten hisses...and then Baxter runs away. Then the kitten is back at instigating chase.

Once I hear hissing, I usually try to intervene and distract with toys and give each a reassurring pat on the head. When they don't feel like playing, they seem fine sleeping near each other (although not on the same sofa) without incident.

It's only been a week so my expectations might be off....but I'm concerned with the play that leads to hissing. Also this morning it got REALLY rough, and I couldn't tell which one was hissing and growling while Baxter had the kitten pinned down. I don't want to keep the kitten locked away in the bathroom for his whole life and naturally I want them to get along.

What sort of timeline am I looking at, where the cats will warm up to each other? I don't need them to be best friends or anything, but I don't want play time to always turn into fighting. I'm find with hissing, because I feel it's natural for the little one to be scared or intimidated when a larger cat has him pinned down. I would think the fear would eventually wear off as he's more comfortable in his new home. But the growling concerns me.

How long until your new additions could play without intervention or supervision?

 

[calicosrspecial]

Hi,

Typically we like to go through the formal introduction process methodically.  http://www.thecatsite.com/a/the-ultimate-yet-simplified-guide-to-introducing-cats

One week is very fast for them to have this kind of contact. But with that said I think they are doing unbelievably well.

Hissing is communication, like saying "uncle" to let the other one know the play is a bit much.

Has anyone been hurt? Is there any different behavior after this rough play? Hiding, slinking around, etc?

GREAT that you distract with play (or food) if it gets too intense.

There are a lot of great signs in what you wrote. You really accelerated the process so we have to be very diligent. Keep getting them to eat together (associate the other one with good things like food). Try to have every interaction as a positive. Do scent swapping.

I get a sense the cats already have warmed up to each other. But we need to be very diligent because this process was very accelerated. We want to make sure they have positive encounters. Also keep working on building Baxter's confidence by playing with him then after play feed. Have them eat together. Get Baxter up on his cat trees. And if possible give them love and attention (getting them to purr if possible) AS LONG as you are not at risk of being scratched or bitten or hurt in any way. We always try to associate the other cat with good things and food is the best as is play and love and height.

It is always hard to tell how long the process will take but I am happy to help you along the way. Let's take is slow and try to make every encounter positive to build their trust and confidence. A confident cat is less likely to attack or be attacked and a secure cat is also. If a cat does not view the other cat as a threat then they will accept.

So far I see a lot of good signs but this is early and the process has been done quickly. But I have good feelings that they will be fine. But I do want to understand better how Baxter pins Mew on the ground and his reaction after. If Mew is fine after then Baxter is just teaching him. But we don't want Baxter to hurt him. But it sounds like they like each other and that Baxter is a good cat. But it has only been a week.

I am happy to help as long as needed so please feel free to share anything any time and ask anything.

 

[bathsmama]

Wow, thank you so much for your thorough/thoughtful reply!

To answer your questions, no one has been hurt (at least that I can tell). Each cat's behavior seems the same after play, and Baxter doesn't hide or slink away...but sometimes the kitten will for a brief moment. That being said, the kitten hid and was very scared when we first met him and even when be brought him home. It took 2 days before he stopped always running into his crate or under something to hide. For the most part, he will still run into the bathroom, but not into his crate..and he usually comes right back out.

We notice that every day he's getting more adventurous and not trying to hide as much anymore. He does sometimes try to hide when Baxter chases him, but I think that is just part of whatever game they are playing because Baxter won't pursue the chase into whatever space Mew is hiding in, and if he starts to walk away, Mew jumps out and initiates the play again. Neither cat slinks off to hide permanently after the rough play. At most when I break up anything before it escalates, they'll go off and come back in mere seconds.

So far, we keep them separated at night and when things start to seem too intense. From what I can see, Baxter REALLY wants to play but I think he's also a bit unsure still and doesn't understand he might be too rough for a little guy. And I think Mew might still be uneasy at Baxter's intentions...although he doesn't have a problem going after Baxter's uneaten food or stalking him or jumping out and trying to chase.

Mew is super purry and relaxed and cuddly when it's just me and him. He does seem fearful of my husband (that is another thread entirely Lol; I think my husband is larger and louder which startles the kitten) but with Baxter around, he's busy watching what he does and is either trying to mimic Baxter or be an annoying little brother. He definitely won't cuddle next to me with my husband close by or Baxter within view, but he will relax and sleep on his own in the same room as all of us. Not sure why he's comfortable on his own vs cuddling with me, but I hope that's just a sign he's gaining his kitty confidence. 

I'm just a nervous mama because the whole reason we got Bartholomew was to be a companion to Baxter and I don't understand what is causing the growling this morning so I can help prevent it and only have them associate one another with positive things. I've never had 2 cats before, so I don't know how long it takes for them to accept one another. They don't have to be BFF's, I just don't want them to kill each other LOL

 

[calicosrspecial]

You are very welcome.

I  love to read messages like yours. Pretty easy to reply to.  

I am so glad that no one is hurt and that they behavior is normal after playing. The behavior tells us a lot. So always watch how they act. It sounds like there are not any problems in how they interact and how they behave after the interactions.

It is very normal for a cat to be a bit skittish/scared when first brought home. Cats are territorial so changing their territory leads to caution. Just as if we were dropped in a foreign land not knowing the language or having any money it would be pretty scary. But if the people are nice and give us love and food then we would be ok.

I think it is very good to keep them separated at night for now. Just keep monitoring how they interact and how they behave/act, keep associating the other cat with good things, build their confidence, and slowly extend the time they are out. It is more art than science and I am happy to help.

Right now what I am reading are all great signs. We just have to maintain the positive momentum. Keep trying to keep their interactions as positive as possible.

It is great that Mew can sleep on his own with everyone around. That tells me he feels safe and secure and is confident. Wonderful!!

I don't think you have to be that nervous, I think you found a wonderful match, you have two great cats. That doesn't mean we should be diligent and watch but I think you all are in a very good place. Usually introduction take from a month or so up to a year. Yours is REALLY fast. Given that it is so fast we have to make sure their interactions remain positive and we watch the interactions but so far there is a lot of good news. So we still have work to do to ensure that the positive interactions stay that way. 

Cats can take on our emotions so please stay calm and confident around them.

Judging by what I have red Baxter seems like a really great cat. We usually see the resident struggle with the new addition but he seems to be accepting Mew really well so far. Just keep associating each other with good things and try to keep the interactions positive. 

I am more than happy to help for as long as needed. I think you are doing a great job. And please feel free to ask anything anytime.

 

[pearl99]

I'm not an expert, just adding my experience. Mew is still a young kitten. As advised time and patience and slow introduction are a key. We want them to get along much faster than may be possible.

My experience is with my semi-feral adult "Waffles" being acclimated to my daughter's kitten, Beans.

It took 3 months- and I noticed as Beans got older he gained more confidence to stand up to Waffles with a bat of the paws, a pounce on Waffles out of nowhere (very funny to watch), a chase head on to Waffles. Now they play chase, pawsies, etc. with no problem and like being with other.

So, keep working and sounds like they will get there! My two still won't use each others' litter boxes, yours sound like they are doing great!