Bad Behaviour Becoming Too Much To Handle - Is It Normal?

AMBRIER

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Hi there,

I am posting with regards to my cats behaviour that, despite several efforts and methods used to try and better it, simply will not change.

She is almost 4-5 months old and a really beautiful cat, and the fact we do really love her, as well as the amount of money we have spent on her, are a few factors that are making us keep her at the moment. She is so badly behaved, constantly, that it is making my partner (mostly) regret getting her to the point where she is having to take time away from the cat because she stresses her out too much.

Bad behaviour includes:
-Biting and attacking of hands, wrists, feet, toes, hair.
-Runs up to us and attacks us out of nowhere
-Scratches everything and is ruining our apartment.
-When she lays behind us she'll suddenly attack our heads from out of nowhere.
-She'll just suddenly launch herself at pieces of furniture and attack them.
-Scratches at and breaks doors when we shut her in another room.
-When we let her in the bedroom she runs around on the bed like a maniac and attacks anything that moves, and then runs onto the pillows and attacks our hair, and sometimes her claws find our eyes. (We have tried not moving at all, and she just attacks us because she can feel us under the covers.)
-She'll randomly go into aggressive mode where she'll run at everything as though she's burning off energy, and her playing becomes far rougher than usual (which is saying something).

None of this is done out of anger, but being playful, we can tell that much. We have tried so many methods to try and correct her behaviour but nothing works.
-We play with her to encourage her not to attack us. She still does.
-We try and reward her for playing with toys that aren't our body parts. She still thinks its acceptable to attack us.
-We ignored her when she attacked us for a while, but it seems without receiving some form of warning or punishment she just continues until she hurts us too much where we have to throw her off of us.
-We tried pushing toward her when she attacks to try and confuse her as we'd heard that isn't what a predator would expect. She just takes that movement as encouragement.
-We have probably spent about $400 between us on 'environmental stimulation' such as trees, towers, tunnels, scratching posts to try and stop her being bored and attacking us, and although she uses them a lot, she gets herself all worked up and then attacks us.
-We have tried taking her toys away at night to encourage her to settle down. It doesn't work.
-We have tried putting her in 'time out' in a different room, but she soon ends up scratching the bottom of the door to shreds in a rented apartment (not ideal!). When we go to bed we have to shut her out because all she does is attack us; mostly our hair. She starts scratching and pulling apart the bottom of the door, also waking us up, so we put her in another room, and she does the same to that door and the only other place she can go is in her cat carrier (which we don't want to do because she can't access her litter box etc.)
-We have tried water spray bottles. They worked at first, but now she just sits there and takes it, runs off for a second and then comes back.
-Yelling at her works temporarily, and then she'll try again at what she was doing.
-When she is well behaved, it's only until we leave the room and she starts doing what she knows she shouldn't. (scratching stuff and jumping onto/burrowing into stuff that could be dangerous to her).
-'Licks' (tasty, edible relaxers) have little to no effect on her.
-We've tried encouraging good behaviour such as sitting with us or sitting on her tree with treats. Doesn't stop her behaving badly at all.
-We have tried making hissing noises when she does something bad to us or near us. She flinches, and then continues.
-We have tried crying out in pain when she hurts us. She just continues doing what she's doing as though it actually encourages her.
-We have tried blowing in her face to stop her being bad. She flinches and continues.
-We've tried 'baby talking' to make her calmer and not encourage her to act out with harsh noises. Has no effect.
-Orange peels are the only repellent that seem to deter her, but I'd hardly call it practical to have orange peels all over the apartment and all over us.

-We don't want to 'just get another cat', as one is more than we can handle at the moment, not to mention all the extra vet fees etc. Our apartment isn't big enough for two cats to be running around.

We feed her raw meat, so we're not sure if that triggers a more predatory reaction. She tries to cover her food like she would do to her poop in a litter box as though she's covering it for later in the wild. We've heard that feeding a cat raw meat can bring out a more wild nature, but we don't want to feed her anything else. We want her to be healthy and eat what she's supposed to.

It just seems that she's responding to nothing and just wants to attack everything that moves and/or makes a noise and it's starting to drive us insane because we just want her to sit with us and not hurt us. It is making us regret getting her and we just want to make it work because we do love her with all our hearts, but she's making it extremely difficult. We don't want to regret getting her. We're both busy people and constantly have to keep an eye on where she is in case she's doing something she shouldn't, which is 90% of the time. It's stressing us both out and we're literally losing sleep because of her behaviour.

I've looked on multiple pages listing behavioural correction methods. Watched plenty of youtube videos of the same. None of the suggested methods work.

Is this normal? Should a cat be responding to these kinds of deterrents?

I'd appreciate any suggestions, because we are running out of ideas.

Thanks.
 

talkingpeanut

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Where did you get your kitten, and how old was she when you got her?

Is she spayed?

She does sound bored. How much, how often, and how do you play with her?
 
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AMBRIER

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Where did you get your kitten, and how old was she when you got her?

Is she spayed?

She does sound bored. How much, how often, and how do you play with her?
We got her from my partner's friend. Her cat was an indoor cat who got out just once and got pregnant. We got the kitten when she was about 8 weeks old. She's had her first couple of vaccinations but hasn't been spayed yet. We've heard this might help, but obviously it's not recommended until they're a certain age.

We play with her at various times throughout the day. If we have the time we'll try and play with her for about 15-20 mins straight to tire her out, which seems to only work temporarily. We're always throwing toys for her to go and play with and she responds to that. We have stick toys and toys on strings that she likes to play with and we play with those a fair bit with her.

When it's just me at home she's usually not too bad, but when she first sees me in the morning, or when my partner comes home from work, it's like her excitement really cranks up her maniacal behaviour. It's as though her excitement just makes her go nuts and attack everything.
 

war&wisdom

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She can be spayed now, and it might help. Kittens can be spayed starting around 8 weeks or when they're over 2 pounds. Mine were spayed and neutered around the same age as yours.
 

war&wisdom

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Also, mine LOVE the laser pointer. It always tires them out after 10-15 minutes, at which time I give them some healthy treats so that they feel like they've accomplished something. They are kittens, of course, so they can get riled up again quickly, but it depends on the day.
 
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AMBRIER

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The vet said they'd call us to book a spaying appointment nearer the time they suggested so I guess we're waiting until then. We have a laser pointer, but we heard it can make the cat frustrated because it's not actually something they can catch. Maybe I'll try it and give them treats so, like you say, she actually feels she has accomplished something. If it depends on the day, it must be every day for her :p
 

war&wisdom

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The vet said they'd call us to book a spaying appointment nearer the time they suggested so I guess we're waiting until then. We have a laser pointer, but we heard it can make the cat frustrated because it's not actually something they can catch. Maybe I'll try it and give them treats so, like you say, she actually feels she has accomplished something. If it depends on the day, it must be every day for her :p
I mean, if we've been gone for a long time on a given day, it's harder to calm them down even after the laser session. Also, my kitties get so excited for the laser game that they even knock around the pointer because they want us to make it do the dot thing. They will get frustrated if they get no treats for their efforts, so just make sure you provide a reward every time.

Some vets are under the impression that it's unsafe to fix cats before 6 months. This is not true, as many decades of research have shown. This site recently hosted a veterinarian and a colleague on an "expert forum" who represent the widely-accepted movement to fix all kittens by 5 months. (They can go into heat as young as 4 months, and this can increase the chance of a number of health problems -- and behavioral problems.) You can check out the forum yourself under the Expert Forum subsection of the forums page.
 

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Also, kittens are better socialized when they stay with mom until 12-14 weeks. You are having to take over the role of mom and siblings here. This will require more patience. She needs more play, too.
 
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AMBRIER

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I guess we could try playing with her more, it's just a time issue. We'll have to discuss the spaying too. It's just getting out of hand. Not to mention we're moving apartments soon so that's going to unsettle her even more. We try and balance play and setting boundaries with her but it just doesn't seem to get into her little head what we're trying to teach her.
 

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Sticking with one form of 'discipline' (either hissing or a firm 'No') and applying it consistently is the key to make her understand what you don't want her doing. And, if need be, walking away from her and ignoring should follow as needed. You need to be relentless on what ever you chose and religiously practice each and every time she behaves in a manner you want to stop. If it is not done every time, you are sending her mixed messages and she won't be able to figure out what the heck you want. And, as mentioned above, on those occasions where she actually minds you and stops, be prepared to give her a treat right then and there. You can't wait to go get up and get a treat and come back, because too much time will have transpired between her good behavior and the treat for her to know they are connected.

A routine is also probably necessary - that is feedings at the same time each day, play time at the same time each day, etc. - as much as is possible. Kittens and cats do much better if there is a routine that they can learn to follow.

Using toys that don't directly involve your hands being close to her would be helpful as well - toys on long sticks, and especially things like the laser pointer help to promote play that doesn't entail having your hands near her face.

Also, pay attention closely and learn to read the signs from her that tell you she is about to 'go over the edge' and stop whatever you are doing with her before she actually goes over the edge. For example, if 5 minutes of petting provokes her into a frenzy, stop petting her after a couple of minutes.

Keeping her nails clipped, if you don't already do it, is another way to minimize damage that may be done on those occasions when she just can't stop herself.

It is doable! And, once she does get spayed it will help a good deal toward getting her to calm down with your commands.
 

talkingpeanut

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She just needs to play, and she needs an outlet for her energy. If you don’t have the time to help her, you might want to consider rehoming to a home with another cat.
 

war&wisdom

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She just needs to play, and she needs an outlet for her energy. If you don’t have the time to help her, you might want to consider rehoming to a home with another cat.
Rehoming seems a bit extreme. The OP stated that they do play with the kitten multiple times throughout the day, sometimes for about 15 minutes straight. I like FeebysOwner FeebysOwner 's suggestion of more regimented routines and nail clipping.

I will say that I've been so grateful that I have two kittens at once -- they often wear each other out and tend to wrestle with each other instead of with us, and they teach each other kitty manners. We spend a lot of time playing with and loving on them too, but it's so much easier because they have each other.
 

Kieka

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If she's better with you, it sounds like it's a consistency issue. As mentioned above, cats do well with routines and need to get the same message every single time.

As an example, my boy is a trouble child. Give an inch and he takes a mile. We have a timed cat door that unlocks at dawn (I set the time to dawn) and he can go outside at that time. My Dad has given into letting him out before the door unlocks. So my boy will yell in my Dad's ear to be let out. My Dad has complained about this for a good solid year. I keep telling him don't let him out and he will stop.

About a month ago, my Dad said he had enough and would just lock the cats out of their bedroom. The next morning he came smiling into the kitchen asking how I liked my night being woken up by my cat. It was fine because my cat didn't wake me up. Link knows I won't let him out before the door unlocks so he just settled down in my bed and slept until it unlocked. Somehow that made it click and my Dad realized that he had inadvertently trained Link to yell in his ear to be let out (or Link trained him). He spent the next two weeks ignoring Links attempts and Link stopped.

The point of my story is, there is something that you are doing that is response enough to elicit the behavior. If she goes after you there shouldn't be redirection to a toy, it should be a loud hiss or no and totally ignore her. Leave the room if needed. Redirection with a toy is for up until the moment she attacks. Time out doesn't work because cats don't contact things in that manner. But ignoring her will work if it is done consistently every single time by every member of the household. She attacks, she doesn't exist for the next ten seconds. No yelling at her after, no tossing a toy or using a wand, absolutely nothing. Ignore, walk away, calmly detach her and turn away. She has to know her behavior means she gets nothing. Even the slightest touch of a claw or tooth should get the same reaction.

It does sound like you are already taking a lot of the steps needed. Getting a set schedule and ignoring her every time with solid consistency might be that final piece that is missing.
 
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AMBRIER

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Thanks for all your suggestions. I guess making a proper routine is something we haven't tried, mostly because our lives are a bit all over the place. My partner rotates between day shifts and night shifts and I do freelance stuff at present which means that our days are a bit weird between us. I shall continue to encourage her with treats when shes sitting still.

I'll also try and stick with one form of punishment. I suppose we'll have to figure out which works best.

We don't want to re-home her. We do have time for her, but not always time to play for like 15-20 mins straight. We play with her for a few minutes, then we do something that needs doing, then play with her for a few more, but finding the time to play with her so much in a single go that she tires herself out can be tricky at times, not to mention exhausting for us too after a long day.

Will try and figure out which way to go with this.

Thanks for the suggestions, and of course, if you have any others, I'd be happy to hear them. :)
 

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When we got our first cat, Duncan, he was the only survivor of his litter and had zero manners. We did everything we could to stop the biting and it helped, but didn't solve the problem. We ended up getting a second young cat and that slowly did the trick although it added a second set of problems.

Consistency is huge with cats. We ended up setting bedtimes for ourselves, and regimented our morning routine a little more and it really paid off. We also made sure to never play with him in the bedroom.

Commands are also a big deal. Use the same words to get the desired response - not "Duncan do you think you should be doing that" or "Duncan you know better" but "Duncan No"
 

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Just please don't use forms of punishment - like spraying her with water, bopping her nose/face, tossing/brushing/throwing her off your lap, etc. You can read up on it - most articles discourage this kind of response to bad behavior because it can actually re-enforce it. The key is to think of it as teaching discipline to your kitten, not punishing them.
 

FelisCatus

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Definitely needs to be spayed.

If that does not help, talk to your vet about behaviour modifiyng drugs. She might just not be wired up like most cats, not her fault.

Thank you for putting so much effort into her and even asking for help here :).
 

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I shall continue to encourage her with treats when shes sitting still.

I'll also try and stick with one form of punishment. I suppose we'll have to figure out which works best.
It seems to me that you want to punish her for being a kitten. Kittens have extreme energy that they simply need to use. Her sitting still is simply against her nature at this time. She needs to run like crazy, she needs to stalk, she needs to playfully attack, that way she learns how to be a cat. They hate being alone. I agree that she should not bite you, but please remember, this behavior was caused by your choice to take her home too early and her mother did not have a chance to teach her the boundaries, so please have some empathy towards her.
What breed is she? Some breeds are more energetic than the others. Maybe you should be looking into taking a cat that is of a quiet nature, possibly older, with established personality, they don't require so much time and energy as kittens do. And they rarely destroy the apartment like kitten do :-) Energetic kittens are not for everyone.
I also believe that she should have a company of another young cat/well socialized kitten that would play with her and teach her the boundaries that she didn't have a chance to learn. Ironically, another cat could free you from responsibility of taking care of her so much. So if you end up to rehome her, make sure she'd go to the place with the young cat, it would help her a lot.
 

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She's still very much a baby but a baby on massive caffeine. If a kitten is awake it's in hunt/play mode.

I'm not sure what age cats teeth but they make chew toys for cat now. There is also something called Kickeroo that is made for wrestling. Try direction her to these before she bites.

Incorporate play into all of your activities and plan at least 5 min each hour your home. Some cats learn to fetch and it can burn off some of that energy.

Hissing or a high pitched ow and then ignoring them works to teach some cats not to bite hard. Adults cats will also hold a kitten still to get the point across. If you try this just remember how much bigger and stronger than her you are.

When your partner gets home kit is so happy she can't contain herself. Maybe your partner could start a routine for when she gets home. Play session, treat, hugs and kisses. Just something good for both of them.
 

ItsMaryann

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Rehoming seems a bit extreme. The OP stated that they do play with the kitten multiple times throughout the day, sometimes for about 15 minutes straight. I like FeebysOwner FeebysOwner 's suggestion of more regimented routines and nail clipping.

I will say that I've been so grateful that I have two kittens at once -- they often wear each other out and tend to wrestle with each other instead of with us, and they teach each other kitty manners. We spend a lot of time playing with and loving on them too, but it's so much easier because they have each other.
I have to agree. We have two siblings, six months old now, for several months. They play together and sleep together most of the time.
 
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