Are carrageenans, gums, and fruits & vegetables that harmful in cat food?

felineempathy

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Carrageenan, Guar Gum, Xanthan Gum, fruits, and vegetables - these are common things found in canned cat food.  But are they really all harmful to our cats?  It appears that some of these ingredients have been given a bad reputation by bloggers and posters like us....then opinions spread rapidly.

First off all, Shanoah visited the veterinary for the first time yesterday and I asked her a variety of questions regarding the above pet food ingredients.  

She said that Guar Gums and Xanthan Gums shouldn't harm our pets, it's just a thickener.  Studies have shown that both gums are shown to have no affects on test animals (dogs and rats), even at high doses.  Both are also rated as perfectly safe food addictive.  Xanthan gum was shown to have occasional soft stools in the animal subjects but that's it.  I don't think there should be anything to worry about after hearing what a vet had to say and doing research.

Here are two interesting articles talking about Guar and Xanthan gums: http://chriskresser.com/harmful-or-harmless-guar-gum-locust-bean-gum-and-more

http://chriskresser.com/harmful-or-harmless-xanthan-gum   

I know the above articles are mainly for human use but the animal studies are what counts.

Now let's move onto carrageenan.  Quite possibly getting a bad reputation then it deserves.  A lot of tests have been done with poligeenan (people easily confuse this with carrageenan, but it technically isn't!) which is a highly processed version of carrageenan and is more fatal.  Poligeenan is shown to have harmful affects on animals such as cancer, ulceration, and inflammation in high concentrations.  However, food grade carrageenan is shown to not cause cancer.  That doesn't mean it's in the clear though - in some animal studies with rats it has caused intestinal damage, epithelial cell loss, increased intestinal permeability, and diarrhea.  Tests were administered on other animals such as pigs and guinea pigs, some showing fewer affects with others showing no affects.  This means that the affects of carrageenan are highly species dependent.  But take note that these tests are high doses and not the amount we would see in canned food.  My vet did say that carrageenan isn't harmful but this does make you think.   Here's the in depth article: http://chriskresser.com/harmful-or-harmless-carrageenan

Fruits and vegetables are okay once in a while and won't harm our cats but it's not something long term or something that your cat should be eating all the time because you have to stress that cats are carnivores and need protein to survive.  It's also known that fruits and veggies probably aren't on your cats menus while in the wild.  But still don't freak out if there's fruits and veggies mixed in your cat's food!

Although I haven't done a lot of research on potatoes, I remember reading that these are actually more digestible and should have some nutritional upside, probably for it's protein, but again probably not on the menu in the wild.

I did forget to ask my vet about montmorillonite clay and haven't done much research on it yet but I'll probably post about it soon.  This ingredient is most common in Nature's Variety canned foods.  From what I've read so far it appears to have toxin removing elements which is a big upside.

-Aaron
 
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lisahe

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Thanks for this report! I need to ask our vet what she thinks about carrageenan, too. I've been feeding very little of it and am phasing out their last food with it (the cats aren't so keen on pates these days anyway) but am curious about what she thinks... the stuff is almost ubiquitous! Some people on TCS report that their cats seem to get IBD from carrageenan. Our cats have enough stomach issues that I'd rather just avoid it to start with!

I still feed them a number of foods with gums, though: Weruva Cats in the Kitchen and Nutro Natural Choice. I just don't know what to think about the gums...

As for the fruits and vegetables, it's the starchy ones I avoid. One of our cats seems sensitive to potato, and it raises the carbs in foods, anyway. (When I told the vet Edwina is sensitive to potato, the vet said something like, "Potato doesn't belong in cat food, anyway!") And derivative ingredients like pea protein just don't seem right to me.

Feeding a cat is a strange balancing act that seems to involve a lot of weighing of ingredients and greater/lesser evils. I was resistant to feeding Primal raw foods for a long time because of ingredients like collard greens and celery and berries. But better those -- which, judging from the lack of chemicals on the Primal ingredient lists, must supply nutrients -- than some of the preservatives, colorants, and other things that make their way into cat food.

Good luck with your own cat food choices!
 
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felineempathy

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Thanks for this report! I need to ask our vet what she thinks about carrageenan, too. I've been feeding very little of it and am phasing out their last food with it (the cats aren't so keen on pates these days anyway) but am curious about what she thinks... the stuff is almost ubiquitous! Some people on TCS report that their cats seem to get IBD from carrageenan. Our cats have enough stomach issues that I'd rather just avoid it to start with!

I still feed them a number of foods with gums, though: Weruva Cats in the Kitchen and Nutro Natural Choice. I just don't know what to think about the gums...

As for the fruits and vegetables, it's the starchy ones I avoid. One of our cats seems sensitive to potato, and it raises the carbs in foods, anyway. (When I told the vet Edwina is sensitive to potato, the vet said something like, "Potato doesn't belong in cat food, anyway!") And derivative ingredients like pea protein just don't seem right to me.

Feeding a cat is a strange balancing act that seems to involve a lot of weighing of ingredients and greater/lesser evils. I was resistant to feeding Primal raw foods for a long time because of ingredients like collard greens and celery and berries. But better those -- which, judging from the lack of chemicals on the Primal ingredient lists, must supply nutrients -- than some of the preservatives, colorants, and other things that make their way into cat food.

Good luck with your own cat food choices!
I'm still going to avoid carrageenan as well.  Even though I asked my vet about it, I could tell she did seem a little unsure about it.  I do think that there isn't a lot known about it with additional tests needing to be done.  Since tests show that it is species dependent, it's possible that dogs and cats are the few that show little to no effects from it compared to other animals.  I'm still going to take caution and avoid it.

Please ask your vet and tell us what she has to say about it! I'm curious about other professional opinions.  Mine is part of an animal hospital so she probably has more experiences of what is bad for cats and dogs - meaning the amount of cases and questions that come in.

We can avoid carrageenan but there's other things that can't really be avoided like gums.  I still don't think it's a big deal but xanthan gum should probably be avoided with animals that have sensitive stomachs, which probably explains the occasional soft stools.  It probably doesn't really matter in Nutro though because I think it's one of the last ingredients listed (meaning there's very little).  I don't think there's anything wrong with guar gum, it does come from a natural plant and has shown no effects in testing.

My vet did talk about raw and said that it does have a higher chance of things like salmonella and other risks that raw meats bring.

Everyone does have their own freewill and choices though.  I'm just reporting my findings.
 
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mrsgreenjeens

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If you look hard enough, you will find reports saying pretty much anything you want to hear
.  Carrageenan is ok...carrageenan is horrible.  Guar gum is ok...guar gum is horrible.  You get my drift. 

There ARE some cats who cannot tolerate certain ingredients, just like there are some people who cannot tolerate certain foods.  Those ingredients might be carrageenan or Guar gum or even chicken for that matter. 

As far as fruits and vegies that are in cat food, they probably are in there more for US than for the cats
.  They aren't "harmful", but they don't really serve much purpose, IMHO. 
 
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felineempathy

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If you look hard enough, you will find reports saying pretty much anything you want to hear
.  Carrageenan is ok...carrageenan is horrible.  Guar gum is ok...guar gum is horrible.  You get my drift. 

There ARE some cats who cannot tolerate certain ingredients, just like there are some people who cannot tolerate certain foods.  Those ingredients might be carrageenan or Guar gum or even chicken for that matter. 

As far as fruits and vegies that are in cat food, they probably are in there more for US than for the cats
.  They aren't "harmful", but they don't really serve much purpose, IMHO. 
All true!  Everything just gets more confusing and stressful when your cat depends on you to keep him/her healthy.

My cat definitely doesn't have a sensitive stomach and tolerates guar gum and xanthan gum from what I can tell.  I've already given her some carrageanan foods in Blue Buffalo and Wellness and it doesn't bother her.  Like you said, it's definitely cat dependent.

Maybe I should stop thinking about it so hard....starting to give myself a headache 
.  I'm satisfied with my findings and how my cat reacts to these ingredients.
 

denice

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Montmorillonite clay isn't like play doh.  It's considered a healing clay and has been used by people going back to ancient times and is still used in holistic medicine.  It's believed to absorb and remove toxins from the digestive system  http://draxe.com/10-bentonite-clay-benefits-uses/

I don't know if the hype from the holistic community is true but I do know that it does not have the possible negative effects that what we think of as clay would have.
 

fluffybeard

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I went through about 7 months of chronic soft stools and diarrhea with my kitten (now big monster cat!) before I found Nature's Variety Instinct canned food which cured the poop problems within a few days. The lack of gums and the presence of montmorillonite clay were the only things unique to that food that I could possibly pin it to. I had tried just about everything else. Since then I have tried the few flavors of Tiki Cat that also do not have gums and he does just fine with those too. I have challenged him a couple times after a long period of normal poop with high quality food similar to Tiki Cat and Nature's Varitey Instinct, but with gums as thickeners, and sure enough, he had loose stools again.

It's hard to say for sure if the gums were causing the loose stools because there is no definitive test the vet can do for that kind of thing. But I'll keep shelling out the big bucks for gum free food because I'm just happy the loose stools stopped and he feels good!
 

lisamarie12

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Fluffybeard:

Me too - although my cats eat about 75% commercial raw, the remaining 25% has been NV canned for the past year.  I recently sampled, over a period of about a week, Mauri's cat food, grain-free, mostly meat, carrageenan-free, but with three gums, those gums being also on the second line of the ingredient list.  Both my cats stools went from being  "normal"  to soft and stinky. I do have an IBD cat who does fine on his normal diet. While I can't prove it was the gums in the food, I'm not willing to take the risk. And I introduced  the food very gradually b/c I do know that making an abrupt switch with foods can cause digestive problems. I haven't found NV to be any more expensive than e.g., Weruva, Mauri, ZiwiPeak, etc.
 
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felineempathy

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I went through about 7 months of chronic soft stools and diarrhea with my kitten (now big monster cat!) before I found Nature's Variety Instinct canned food which cured the poop problems within a few days. The lack of gums and the presence of montmorillonite clay were the only things unique to that food that I could possibly pin it to. I had tried just about everything else. Since then I have tried the few flavors of Tiki Cat that also do not have gums and he does just fine with those too. I have challenged him a couple times after a long period of normal poop with high quality food similar to Tiki Cat and Nature's Varitey Instinct, but with gums as thickeners, and sure enough, he had loose stools again.

It's hard to say for sure if the gums were causing the loose stools because there is no definitive test the vet can do for that kind of thing. But I'll keep shelling out the big bucks for gum free food because I'm just happy the loose stools stopped and he feels good!
 
Fluffybeard:

Me too - although my cats eat about 75% commercial raw, the remaining 25% has been NV canned for the past year.  I recently sampled, over a period of about a week, Mauri's cat food, grain-free, mostly meat, carrageenan-free, but with three gums, those gums being also on the second line of the ingredient list.  Both my cats stools went from being  "normal"  to soft and stinky. I do have an IBD cat who does fine on his normal diet. While I can't prove it was the gums in the food, I'm not willing to take the risk. And I introduced  the food very gradually b/c I do know that making an abrupt switch with foods can cause digestive problems. I haven't found NV to be any more expensive than e.g., Weruva, Mauri, ZiwiPeak, etc.
Yeah it just seems like it depends on the cat.  I'm still avoiding carrageanan and feeding food that does have gums (really hard to avoid anyway) and I can tell from the litter box that my cat doesn't have any issues with gums.  My report for xanthan gum up there did say that some dogs had occasional soft stools (it doesn't look like guar gum has been causing that from the animal studies) and it's recommended to avoid gums with pets that have sensitive stomachs.
 

lisamarie12

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Yeah it just seems like it depends on the cat. I can tell from the litter box that my cat doesn't have any issues with gums.  
I'm glad your cat isn't having any issues with the gums. ;)
 
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