Any cat genetic experts? a question about golden chinchilla

[cindy321]

I have a few questions regarding golden chinchilla colour gene

picture 1 and 2 are from kitten 1, which I understand as a nomal golden chinchilla, typically the colour become lighter when kittens mature, which become total golden colour.

picure 3 and 4 are from kitten 2. as you can see the colour is much lighter, I think it might be called blue golden? but I am not sure

Is the 2nd colour a dilute version of the 1st one? genetic wise how this colour was created and how will the kitten look like when they reach adulthood?

 

[posiepurrs]

I am NOT a genetics expert, but have been a breeder of silver and golden Persians for around 13 years. The first kitten does not look like a chinchilla to me, more like a shaded golden. The kittens seem to become lighter because the barring evens out to make the tipping in the coat. I was taught to look at the coat between the ears and eyes as being indicative of the adult coat color (not the tipping). The second may be a blue golden - I can't tell from the photo. Do both parents carry dilute? The dilute must come from both parents in order to have a blue golden. Here are the color descriptions from the Persian breed standards in CFA. Note the different color paw pads of the shaded golden and blue golden.

CHINCHILLA GOLDEN: undercoat pale honey to bright apricot Coat on back, flanks, head, and tail sufficiently tipped with black to enhance a golden appearance. Legs and end of tail may be shaded with tipping. Chin, ear tufts, stomach, and chest, consistent dilute  color, much lighter in tone than the undercoat color. The general effect is lighter than a shaded golden due to less tipping. Rims of eyes, lips, and nose outlined with black. Nose leather: rose. Paw pads: black. Eye color: green or blue-green. Disqualify for incorrect eye color, incorrect eye color being copper, yellow, gold, amber, or any color other than green or blue-green. SHADED GOLDEN: undercoat pale honey to bright apricot with a mantle of black tipping shading down from the sides, face, head and tail. Legs to be the same tone as the face. Ear tufts, chin, chest, stomach and underside of the tail, consistent dilute color, much lighter in tone than the undercoat. The general effect is darker than a chinchilla golden due to more tipping. Rims of eyes, lips, and nose outlined with black. Nose leather: rose. Paw pads: black. Eye color: green or blue-green. Disqualify for incorrect eye color, incorrect eye color being copper, yellow, gold, amber, or any color other than green or blue-green. BLUE CHINCHILLA GOLDEN: undercoat ivory to pale honey. Coat on back, flanks, head, and tail sufficiently tipped with blue to enhance a golden appearance. Legs and end of tail may be shaded with tipping. Chin, ear tufts, stomach, chest and underside of tail, consistent ivory to pale honey color. The general effect is lighter than a blue shaded golden due to less tipping. Rims of eyes, lips, and nose outlined with blue. Nose leather: rose. Paw pads: blue or rose. Eye color: green or blue-green. Disqualify for incorrect eye color, incorrect eye color being copper, yellow, gold, amber, or any color other than green or blue-green. BLUE SHADED GOLDEN: undercoat ivory to pale honey with a mantle of blue tipping shading down from the sides, face, head and tail. Legs to be the same tone as the face. Chin, ear tufts, chest, stomach, and underside of tail, consistent ivory to pale honey color. The general effect is darker than a blue chinchilla golden due to more tipping. Rims of eyes, lips, and nose outlined with blue. Nose leather: rose. Paw pads: blue or rose. Eye color: green or blue-green. Disqualify for incorrect eye color, incorrect eye color being copper, yellow, gold, amber, or any color other than green or blue-green.
Here is another site to check out for some basic genetic info on color (just scroll down to see the part about silver and goldens). Basic Persian and Exotic Color Genetics

 

[cindy321]

Thank you so much for explanation, posiepurrs. Really appreicate it, although I am still bit confused about the colours.
I have no idea what their parents carry, these are the two kittens from the breeder we visited last week, both are boys but the darker one is slightly older, I was told the darker one is a golden chinchilla, but the younger boy colour are much lighter, if we want a golden chinchilla boy, which one should we choose, here are some more pics..

 

[lutece]

Are you looking for a kitten as a pet, or for a stud male for a breeding program?

 

[cindy321]

this one will be pet as our girls all been spayed now, plus I do not think this breeder willing to sell her kittens as active.

 

[lutece]

Which kitten appeals to you the most as a pet, then?

I agree with posiepurrs that the first kitten looks more shaded than chinchilla. The other one looks more like a blue golden to me.

 

[cindy321]

I am not sure to be honest, my daught like the dark one because he is playful, I thought he will become totally golden colour when he mature, but if he is shade, maybe we should take the lighter one? I do not know what blue golden will look like when they are older neither

 

[posiepurrs]

Just so you have a point of reference the photo I have included is a shaded golden. As a kitten he was darker. To see an adult Bluegolden, check out Castlegate Persians website- the male page. The first blue golden grand champion in CFA is on that page.

 

[cindy321]

Just so you have a point of reference the photo I have included is a shaded golden. As a kitten he was darker. To see an adult Bluegolden, check out Castlegate Persians website- the male page. The first blue golden grand champion in CFA is on that page.View attachment 344223

This is stunning colour, I hope the kitten will change to this colour later.

 

[cindy321]

I assume this is a blue golden ? however I think the 2nd kitten actually look much paler than this one, or maybe blue golden kitten will become darker when the mature?

 

[cindy321]

genetic wise, I guess black dilute become blue? and gold dilute to some kind of pale gold?

 

[lutece]

genetic wise, I guess black dilute become blue? and gold dilute to some kind of pale gold?

Most golden cats are black-based tabbies (what we would normally call brown tabbies) with wide banding. Blue goldens are blue tabbies with wide banding. Like other blue tabbies, blue goldens have a cream or beige ground color, but the tone of the ground color can vary (warmer or cooler in tone).

 

[cindy321]

I think the 2nd kitten should be same colour as ones on the following pic, thus he is a blue golden