Touching face/ head with paw during play

[asterix000]

I have a 11 week old Female F5 Savannah kitten. She is very gentle but has expressed some behavior that may be a concern. During play, or prolonged eye contact, my kitten will sometimes make a sudden dash for the head and attempt to touch her paw to my head or face. The claws are never extended, and she is gentle with contact, but being part serval (even distantly) I’m a little worried that guests may take this behavior as a form of aggression. Again, she has never so much as scratched me during play and always retracts her paws when playing around me, I’m simply concerned how other people may interpret this and curious as to why. Anyone see this before in a cat or have any explanation as to why she may be doing this?

Thank you.

 

[sfbridges1]

Baby cats tend to 'attack' during play because it's part of the wild instinct. All cats from young to old stalk prey and want to kill it. Inside cats stalk toys and attack them. It's normal behivor of a cat.

Now, you wrote she's attacking your head. Good that there isnt any claws but eventually there might be. You have to work to get the kitten to get the toy and not get you. Also talk to the cat often so it can learn to understand what you say, probably won't listen to you if you call its name, but it will learn to understand. Thats my personal opinion about talking to the cat.

Good luck to you. :-)

 

[asterix000]

Thank you for your reply. 

I would agree but it does not seem like she is trying to attack my head, not in the same way she would say attack a toy, or say my hand or toes should they move too much.. its more like a soft tag and then she backs away and watches me. If I were to anthropomorphize her, I would say she is just trying to prove she can tag me. 

She will also touch my head when I pick her up, but I don't see that as an issue as without the sudden dash preceding it, it doesn't have the same appearance of aggression. I read many posts on this being an act of affection, however they always describe it during sleep or relax periods, never with a running lead or in the middle of play. 

That being said, how would I discourage this behavior in a manner that wouldn't make the claws come out, or discourage play. 

 

[sfbridges1]

You wouldn't be upsetting the cat to make its claws come out, it's part of the cat growing up.

 

[callista]

Hmm, perhaps this is not play-aggression; perhaps it is more like curiosity?

Some cats like to investigate things with their paws. They will touch their paws to a new toy, push it around. Or they'll paw at a new thing in their environment. Some cats learn to open doors by pawing at them. My cat Tiny likes to run his paws over surfaces that make interesting noises, like the plastic cover on a library book or the fake wood side of my desk. He's not scratching; doesn't have his claws out. He just likes to hear the noise he can make.

I wonder if perhaps she is investigating you in that way. Does she tend to just put her paw on you, perhaps tapping your face as though she's curious? Does she usually investigate things with her paws? Like, is she the kind of cat who paws things off tabletops, retrieves things from openings, pushes things around with her nose or paws?

Not all cat play is hunting simulation. Some is more investigation and experimentation. If she is investigating you like she investigates anyone else, she may just be a curious kitten.

 

[asterix000]

Yes, she is very curious, and will frequently paw at what have you. It's not uncommon for her to meow at something out of reach until I lift her to it so she can touch it with her nose or paw before being content to move on with her life. She also has a mild obsession with reaching her paw under the crack under doors, even open doors, to paw at what I assume to be shadows. 

The behavior its self is actually quite enduring due to the gentle nature of the contact its self, sort of like a game of tag where she becomes determined to touch my head then is satisfied once she does. I'm just worried it would be taken the wrong way with the running dash that it sometimes is lead by. I'm honestly not too worried about her actually hurting anyone given how she is when I play with her, I really am actually surprised she has not scratched me the way I too commonly dangle toys between us, or let her climb over me in pursuit of a toy- I absolutely should be more careful. I'm just worried she would give someone a fright, and being a hybrid cat, that could be reacted to a little more harshly then if she was a domestic short hair. 

Then again maybe sfbridges is right and my head just resembles a giant mouse and any week now I'll have to start a thread titled 'my cat ate my face'. 

 I don't actually know 

 

[miskinsincap]

I had such kitty when I was a teenager. She loved touching my face, but only mine. She used to touch my mouth while I was talking with her, wake me up by touching my nose and eyes, tag my face while we were playing, and she even used to slap me if I was out of line. She never did that to anyone else, and she never used her claws.

Your cat is still so young though. I don't think that you need to be alarmed unless she begins to use you as a huge toy mouse. If she begins to treat you as some kind of toy, that might cause real trouble as she grows up, even if she doesn't direct her paws to your face (I can assure you that being ambushed by a 5 kg cat in the dark hallway is no fun at all and one of you can get hurt easily). But I don't think you'll need to go into some serious "training program" to achieve that. She's young and while playing, she'll probably pick up doing what pleases you more, and she'll give up doing things that makes you "not happy" simply because there's no fun anymore when you refuse to participate in it. Just try to be her play mate, but refuse to be her toy. 

 

[callista]

Quite so. When a cat plays with littermates, they teach her that playing too rough just means her littermate will yelp and run away, and the game will end. If she ever is rough with you, it is usually enough just to yell "Ouch!" and withdraw, end the game, so she knows she has to be gentle with fragile human skin.

 

[nbrazil]

Hi, I just joined and will do a formal introduction... but this thread caught my eye because this is a problem behavior that is developing and I don't know what to do.

Briefly... Artie is just coming up on his 6th month, he is a Ragdoll, fixed at 4 months... but extremely active (guess I have to wait for the adult for that mellow goodness I got him for). He's a big boy, about 10 lbs and growing.

Anyway - he is also a single animal and I work (I NEVER HEARD OF SINGLE CAT SYNDROME, AND WAS UNAWARE OF IT WHEN I GOT HIM). He plays very aggressively. I NEVER taught him hands are toys, but it seems unless I'm not on the other end of the toy (wand) he will ignore it. In other words, self play is rare. Shared play is rough, he gets all hyperventilated and rips into the wand toys, biting and kicking. This happens even when I slow it down.

I spend two 30 minutes play sessions a day with him, very actively... but that isn't enough. Even if I spend 2 hours, that isn't enough, it just winds him up for more. What happens is that he will come over (when he wants more) and bite me (play aggression) or... come running across the room to pat me (trying for my head, sometimes succeeding) on my head, bite, and then scoot away and hide, hoping I will chase him.

I've been advised to ignore this. But when I do he gets even MORE aggressive, and now I've gotten a little claw and nearly breaking of the skin (in play). I know punishment doesn't work and timeouts don't work, now ignoring doesn't work. I appreciate that he is bonded to me, but I'm not a cat, and I cannot have a 20 lb adult doing this. 

Locking him in another room works, but he is alone so long I don't think that is the best solution. Running out of ideas other than waiting it out and HOPING he doesn't retain this as an adult habit. Thing is he used to sleep with me, but now the unruly teenager won't settle down, as soon as I lay next to him he rolls over to grab, bite and bunny kick. I KNOW it is all play, but those charges when he meets eye contact and now starting to be common (instead of rarely).

Anything besides the (what I think is emotionally cruel to a Ragdoll) pick him up and put him in another room? (Besides, he just comes back 15 minutes later). Wait it out (he will grow out of it)? What is the collective wisdom on this?

 

[callista]

It is not cruel to put a cat in "time out". Usually it is just necessary until the cat calms down... five minutes is enough in most cases. I put my cat Tiny in the bathroom sometimes when he gets too rough with Christy. A few minutes alone and he calms down, then I let him out.

I don't think it's quite a punishment. It's more like, the cat has gotten too hyper, and I want him to get a grip. Being in a "boring" room without other cats or people for a little while tends to calm him down.

I wonder if he needs a companion. He's still young and introductions shouldn't be too bad, though you'll have to do it slowly since he is old enough to object to another cat in his territory. There are so many unwanted cats in shelters. Try a no-kill shelter; the workers there often know their cats' personalities. You want a cat-friendly cat who likes rough play, but has a calm personality, and probably one that is young, less than two years old, so it can keep up with your cat. Two cats really is easier than one, even when they're not too good a match... my two cats aren't a very good match--Tiny likes rough play and Christy doesn't, so she has to hiss at him and put him in his place when he tries to wrestle with her. But all the same, they seem to entertain each other somewhat and Christy is more annoyed than scared by Tiny's rambunctious antics. If you can get a better match than that, maybe your cat will learn how to play nice... But you'll have to get a very even-tempered cat who can be trusted to hiss or swat without the claws, instead of attacking, when it gets annoyed.

 

[asterix000]

Hi NBrazil!

Thanks for joining the conversation. Your issue is different from mine, I’m fortunate enough that my little savannah plays gentle, although she does have a powerful need for interaction. Like your cat, she does not care much to play alone, and I don’t really feel getting another cat is a viable option.

I’m sure getting a companion pet will be a popular suggestion, I’ll probably be unpopular for the comments I’m about to make, but please keep in mind that there is no guarantee that the cats will get along and I heard some pretty awful horror stories of cat owners with disinterested pairs that ignore each other but to compete and fight. Cats are solitary animals by nature, and only form colonies in the presence of an essential resource (food, water, shelter).  It’s not a natural state for them to need constant company (with the possible exception of a bonded pair), but it is natural for them to need stimulation, it just happens stimulation is easy to provide by tossing another cat in the mix . We tend to attribute human values to cats, but in general cats socialize very rarely. However (and this is a big however) it is also not natural for a cat to be confined to a room/house/ property.  They normally have large territories to patrol, pray to chaise, and threats to avoid to keep them busy so lacking that they can become bored. Cats have a notable brain size to body size ratio, so all that extra brain power needs to be stimulated.

My cat actually gave me the answer herself. She has a need to be up high to survey the area. When she is nervous she moves to the highest point in the room (often my shoulder) for security, and when bored she’ll often try to climb furniture, curtains, and sometimes even try to climb the walls themselves to get up high. I made her a 5 foot tall cat tree from wooden posts covered in hemp in front of a window, so while toys may not keep her occupied, running up and down that post does. If nothing else she seems compelled to stay up there to survey the area.  

This probably won’t help your ragdoll much; I understand that breed prefers to spend time closer to the ground.  If it were me, I’d try laying out some hiding spots, boxes with holes in them, tunnels, things that will enrich the environment for your cat. Try dangling jingle balls or other toy from strings that may make some noise as he pasts them by.  A coworker of mine with a ragdoll recently got a bird feeder outside a window he has easy access to, and he tells me that is working quite well to keep his ragdoll busy. The important thing is to keep him stimulated, what we call bad behavior is often a cry for stimulation.

As for the rough play, all the advice people are telling me is probably the best thing you can do. If he bites you, make a yelp and disengage. Attention is a driving motivator, and if he gets attention in the form of scorning/struggling/or even making you decided to play with a toy to distract him, your encouraging a behaviour brought on by boredome.

TLDR; Ragdolls like hiding and running through tunnels, give it a places to hide and maybe it won’t be so bored.

G'luck!

 

[jcat]

I had such kitty when I was a teenager. She loved touching my face, but only mine. She used to touch my mouth while I was talking with her, wake me up by touching my nose and eyes, tag my face while we were playing, and she even used to slap me if I was out of line. She never did that to anyone else, and she never used her claws.

Your cat is still so young though. I don't think that you need to be alarmed unless she begins to use you as a huge toy mouse. If she begins to treat you as some kind of toy, that might cause real trouble as she grows up, even if she doesn't direct her paws to your face (I can assure you that being ambushed by a 5 kg cat in the dark hallway is no fun at all and one of you can get hurt easily). But I don't think you'll need to go into some serious "training program" to achieve that. She's young and while playing, she'll probably pick up doing what pleases you more, and she'll give up doing things that makes you "not happy" simply because there's no fun anymore when you refuse to participate in it. Just try to be her play mate, but refuse to be her toy. 

Our last cat (DSH) gently patted my face for nearly 14 years, always with his claws sheathed. It usually meant he was seeking interaction (snuggling or play), but sometimes just seemed to be his way of expressing affection. He also touched my lips when he wanted me to talk to him. He never did that to anybody else, and we figured it was because he considered me his "mommy" and main playmate. He didn't slap me in the face, like miskinsincap's kitty, but would occasionally do it to my arm or leg when he was annoyed about something.

 

[miskinsincap]

Hi  NBrazil!

Well, first of all, patience my friend, you're gonna need lots of it. 

My current cat Peanut was about 2 years old when she took that kind of attitude. It took me about 8 months to regain the peace in the house again. Even after that, I had to deal with short termed relapses from time to time. But Peanut is a very agressive, very dominant, even stubborn cat. I don't think you'll have such a hard time with Artie. 

In the long run, you'll have to dominate him somehow. So you'll have to be consistent and patient. This means you can't back off once you demand something from him. Even if he tends to get aggressive (my Peanut often did that when I refused to participate in her game), you can't let him have his own way. He has to understand that if you're not having fun, then he's not getting any by using you as a toy. 

For the gaming time, I profited a lot by changing our gaming style to a "hide and seek" format. At first she tried to go after my feet of course, but some orange essence on my slippers quickly fixed that problem. But if you intend to use parfume for that kind of purpose, you should choose something without alcohol, and you should use so very little of it (half a drop maybe); you don't want to repell him completely, you just want to protect your feet. I usually use dried orange peels or dry lavender to give a mild scent, Also, a ping pong ball, or better, a surprise egg shell thrown in a plastic laundary basket helped me so much to drain her energy by herself. But the main thing is, you should definitely end the fun if he begins harsh tricks on you. Show your discontent, end the game, leave the room if necessary (unless he's trying to attack you). If he's trying to chase you as a toy, shut the door behind you, or shut yourself in another room till he calms down. But if he's attacking you, you can't run away from him, you should retaliate and make him understand he's not allowed to dominate you. Be warned though, if he's serious about dominance, you might end up with several scratches. Long sleeved sweaters are recomended for such tense situations, and water spray is effective if you need some serious defense. Avoid contacting him though, that might initiate a fight, you just need to show that he can't scare you.

For the bed time, first of all, orange scented pillow cases helped me to protect my face from surprise paw attacks while I was asleep. If she wasn't at the peak of her hyperactivivty, I used a baby blanket to cover her, she usually fell asleep under it while bunny kicking the blanket. If that didn't work, I exiled her from the bed (several times a night). But after a while she turned the whole thing into a game. At that phase, I used different things to end the game, sometimes, ignoring her by hiding under the blanket worked, sometimes I had to abandon her in the bedroom and leave the room, sometimes I forbid her to enter the bedroom for the night, whichever suited the situation and ended her fun.

But as I said, Peanut is a difficult cat, it took several months for her to accept that there's no fun it any more, and there won't ever be. Artie is young. He'll probably get over it much more quckly, and find new ways to have fun. One more thing though; some cats tend to be active at night time. If Artie is one of them, you might perhaps consider giving him access to a balcony at night time, so he can chase moths and dust balls there and come back to your bed as a tired happy cat afterwards. 

 

[nbrazil]

Good and well thought out responses all, so far.

Addressing some of the points raised...

Being the active teenager he is, there are no boring rooms, he is in that "bored means trouble" phase. So in the bathroom, instead of calming down, he claws the door (it now needs to be replaced because it is stripped) or the shower curtain, or chews on the edge of his litter box instead of calming down when he really wants to play. Sigh. So what I meant by locking him in another room works, I mean it keeps him off of me for the time.

He starts off slowly, rolling onto his back and meowing, which means "lets play." If it is his playtime, I bring out something like da bird and go at it. Then I usually feed him. But then he comes back more energized.

This phase is the crazy one. If I look at him or talk to him, more times than not he will get that crazy look, and start panting in anticipation of more play. This is the problem part... this is when he will puff up, crab walks and play attack. Ten pounds of Ragdoll muscle hitting you is really something!

I have to just do my best to walk away... at which point he either gets the zooms or realizes I'm not gonna play and "settles down." I put quotes because he is like a spring. He looks calm, but 50% of the time if I touch him, he reaches around to bite me.

Opps, not addressing, but describing. I've actually thought of having blood work done because of his, what I think is, excitement response. In human terms, anticipatory panting. Just plain weird.

So... Callista, I have definitely considered a companion cat since he wants to play with me as a cat. I am dealing with a medical condition that leaves me easily fatigued (hence a ragdoll) and this has not been easy. The good news is that I have a godparent (rehome) if needed (i.e. health worsens substantially - prognosis is good long term, but it is not a straight line). Don't know if I could manage to line up two potential rehomes. Yes, I believe in forever home, still one should prepare when one has a health issue.

Why did I do this knowing the health issue? Again, health practitioners suggested it to get my mind off of my physical issues. But that is water under the dam, kittens are kittens. If I knew then what I know now, I would have gone to a no kill shelter and gotten an adult.

Okay, back to responses. Artie does like to jump up high to get as close to my face as possible, however, asterix has a point. Recently on a lark I got a cat tunnel and HE LOVES IT. I've also put his carrier down on the floor and got some other "caves" and he goes from one to the other. He just discovered blankets and the fun in getting under them. So you have a point. Maybe a couple MORE tunnels scattered about?

He has a very rich environment in regards to cat tree, a perch by the window and tons 'o toys. But he isn't very interested in them. I suspect he now regards ME as part of HIS territory - so, like I said, if I'm not on the end of the toy, he rarely plays (laser wand is good, but after awhile he stops going after the light, instead he goes after my hand moving the light!). I finally found evidence of it this morning. An organic toy that I wouldn't mind him ripping apart, I found in two pieces. Hooray!

As for the OP - wow, a Savannah! I only just last week even heard of that breed. That'll make my guy look small! LOL

It was your initial post that got my attention. Eye contact with my guy equals a sudden dash for my head, paws out, and pat/pat, run away. No claws. What got me concerned is last night when I decided, what the heck, see what he does if I do nothing, he came back, this time with claws!

But it sounds to me that you are a knowledgeable guardian, looking out for the kitten and guests alike. So I guess it isn't the same problem. So instead of responding here, I will consider starting another thread instead of hijacking this conversation.

Thanks all. And best to you asterix.

 

[nbrazil]

Hi  NBrazil!

Well, first of all, patience my friend, you're gonna need lots of it. 

My current cat Peanut was about 2 years old when she took that kind of attitude. It took me about 8 months to regain the peace in the house again. Even after that, I had to deal with short termed relapses from time to time. But Peanut is a very agressive, very dominant, even stubborn cat. I don't think you'll have such a hard time with Artie. 

In the long run, you'll have to dominate him somehow. So you'll have to be consistent and patient. This means you can't back off once you demand something from him. Even if he tends to get aggressive (my Peanut often did that when I refused to participate in her game), you can't let him have his own way. He has to understand that if you're not having fun, then he's not getting any by using you as a toy. 

For the gaming time, I profited a lot by changing our gaming style to a "hide and seek" format. At first she tried to go after my feet of course, but some orange essence on my slippers quickly fixed that problem. But if you intend to use parfume for that kind of purpose, you should choose something without alcohol, and you should use so very little of it (half a drop maybe); you don't want to repell him completely, you just want to protect your feet. I usually use dried orange peels or dry lavender to give a mild scent, Also, a ping pong ball, or better, a surprise egg shell thrown in a plastic laundary basket helped me so much to drain her energy by herself. But the main thing is, you should definitely end the fun if he begins harsh tricks on you. Show your discontent, end the game, leave the room if necessary (unless he's trying to attack you). If he's trying to chase you as a toy, shut the door behind you, or shut yourself in another room till he calms down. But if he's attacking you, you can't run away from him, you should retaliate and make him understand he's not allowed to dominate you. Be warned though, if he's serious about dominance, you might end up with several scratches. Long sleeved sweaters are recomended for such tense situations, and water spray is effective if you need some serious defense. Avoid contacting him though, that might initiate a fight, you just need to show that he can't scare you.

For the bed time, first of all, orange scented pillow cases helped me to protect my face from surprise paw attacks while I was asleep. If she wasn't at the peak of her hyperactivivty, I used a baby blanket to cover her, she usually fell asleep under it while bunny kicking the blanket. If that didn't work, I exiled her from the bed (several times a night). But after a while she turned the whole thing into a game. At that phase, I used different things to end the game, sometimes, ignoring her by hiding under the blanket worked, sometimes I had to abandon her in the bedroom and leave the room, sometimes I forbid her to enter the bedroom for the night, whichever suited the situation and ended her fun.

But as I said, Peanut is a difficult cat, it took several months for her to accept that there's no fun it any more, and there won't ever be. Artie is young. He'll probably get over it much more quckly, and find new ways to have fun. One more thing though; some cats tend to be active at night time. If Artie is one of them, you might perhaps consider giving him access to a balcony at night time, so he can chase moths and dust balls there and come back to your bed as a tired happy cat afterwards. 

Okay, so I'm back. There is a lot here that I like (except for water spray, doesn't work on him, and besides, that's punishment).

I couple of times I've experimented with puffing myself up, holding my hands up (like his paws), staring (I know that it can be interpreted as aggression, but is another way to dominate), and making an ugly sound. He backs off, looks pitiful (almost as if he were, in human terms, say... but why????) and once even made an ugly sound back (sounded like frustration) before backing off.

If I knew this were dominance behavior on his part I would continue to dominate back... I just don't know. The way he did back off that day WAS interesting, though. After his little scream at me, he walked out of the room and did not return for a long time (unusual for him). I felt so bad being mean papa.

Still, some interesting and DIFFERENT things here.

 

[tulosai]

It is not cruel to put a cat in "time out". Usually it is just necessary until the cat calms down... five minutes is enough in most cases. I put my cat Tiny in the bathroom sometimes when he gets too rough with Christy. A few minutes alone and he calms down, then I let him out.

I don't think it's quite a punishment. It's more like, the cat has gotten too hyper, and I want him to get a grip. Being in a "boring" room without other cats or people for a little while tends to calm him down.

I wonder if he needs a companion. He's still young and introductions shouldn't be too bad, though you'll have to do it slowly since he is old enough to object to another cat in his territory. There are so many unwanted cats in shelters. Try a no-kill shelter; the workers there often know their cats' personalities. You want a cat-friendly cat who likes rough play, but has a calm personality, and probably one that is young, less than two years old, so it can keep up with your cat. Two cats really is easier than one, even when they're not too good a match... my two cats aren't a very good match--Tiny likes rough play and Christy doesn't, so she has to hiss at him and put him in his place when he tries to wrestle with her. But all the same, they seem to entertain each other somewhat and Christy is more annoyed than scared by Tiny's rambunctious antics. If you can get a better match than that, maybe your cat will learn how to play nice... But you'll have to get a very even-tempered cat who can be trusted to hiss or swat without the claws, instead of attacking, when it gets annoyed.

This.  I think time outs of up to 10-15 minutes are okay and definitely a better solution than many other techniques often employed.  They give kitty a chance to get over the excess stimulation. Longer than that and my opinion is different.

 

[miskinsincap]

NBrazil, I know how you feel about water spray. In fact, I prefer scratches on my arms to water spray, but Peanut is once in a lifetime trouble, and I had to use it on her twice, because I absolutely had to break the fight, and I have no regrets. 

You might be right about the dominanace, maybe Artie is just an energetic teenager trying to find ways to direct his energy. But you should keep in mind that dominance behavior doesn't always show up with agression, he can try to dominate you in a very cute fashion. In fact agression is usually the last stage: 1) kitty asks, you refuse, 2) kitty insists, still doesn't get what he/she wants, 3) kitty demands, still gets a no, 4) kitty begins to get angry, after all what kind of a serf are you if you don't do as you're told? You can actually check this out easily over a favourite spot, or by just observing how insistent he is about his demands generally (I mean, apart from the bedroom and play-time attitude). I certainly hope you don't have such a problem. But if you do, and if you ever need help, I have a few more tricks. Btw, I also hate to play the role of a strict mom, but believe me, living under the command of a crazy cat is far too difficult for any humanly strength.

 

[mservant]

Hi Asterix000. Firstly I think it's worth asking if anyone who has commented has a hybrid cat? I do not but have read with interest a number of posts on hybrid cat behaviour and training since starting to use this site. I suspect it is considerably more important for you to assert control and clarify for you cat what acceptable behaviours are very early on other wise there is a greater risk of injury for you (and others) as your Savannah grows - and this is probably going to be faster than with a domestic cat.  It seems that early bonding and training is quite different for them, and is really important. Probably useful for you to search for this, and hopefully get some others with similar cats to advise you here.

I have a bouncy Russian Blue 2 1/2 year old who is very gentle in nature but also very playful. He was not socialized with any cats other than his mother and enjoys direct physical play with humans as well as through toys. I adopted at about 15 weeks and when I was playing kneeling down at floor level, or when sitting on a chair, he quickly started to show interest in my head. Sometimes it was curious patting and investigating, but sometimes he would run right up to me or 'set up' in front of me and get that 'I'm going to pounce' look in his eye, crouched down and ears back and hips rocking. He would launch up and land right on my head in play attack - furry belly over my face. No claws, no teeth, just a big furry bundle of cat belly and muscle in the face but it was still pretty unsettling esp. as I thought about what it would be like if he did it to anyone other than me - or continued until he was fully grown! 

  There was definitely a mix of behaviours and reasons behind what he was doing, part curiosity, part play, but also in him learning about boundaries and dominance with me now that he was away from him mum (she did a very good job of pasting him on to the floor, on his back, pinning him down and play biting at his neck to show him she wasn't to be messed with 

).   He was not being aggressive but he was certainly testing things out.  I went for the saying firm 'NO' as first line if he adopted the play attack posture. If he ignored this and looked like he was going to launch I would rise up to standing so he could reach my body or shoulder but not head if he did launch, looked him in the eye with a stern face, held my hands forward a little and flat with palms down, and again say 'NO'. If he was so over excited that he still pounced I would gently lift him off and back down to the floor (if he hadn't fallen off as he's never held on with claws) and then repeat no firmly and move away slightly. He never pushed it beyond this point. The behaviour stopped when he was about 1 year old. I was SO relieved - it was quite cute and funny as a kitten but I knew it had to stop! (Your cat would be far too big and quite dangerous if still doing this by that age I suspect).

On occasions like making beds where my cat gets very over excited, if I'm worried one of us could be injured accidentally I stop what I'm doing, wait until he is paused and not bouncing about so I can pick him up and remove him from the room. I briefly shut the door so he is removed from the situation, then let him back in. I do not wait as long as 5 minutes - maybe just 30 seconds to 1 minute. I think 5 minutes is too long for him to still associate the behaviour and learn from the experience when he comes back in calmed down. 

Good luck - I think the Savannah cats look stunning and wish you well with your developing relationship.

 

[asterix000]

Thank you Mservant.

It may be worth mentioning that I've had no luck correcting behavior by simply moving her from where she is not suppose to be.. She actually seems to really enjoy me picking her up and placing her somewhere else, I get a lot of purring and immediate repetition of the behavior, sometimes 12-20 times before she becomes interested in something else. Guess she just loves to be up high. 

Yes, it is very important I curve behavior before she grows up, even if she doesn't cause any scratches and it just turn out to be a quirk, knowing shes a hybrid could cause people to react harshly. I'm just no sure how to discourage this specifically. If she does it after making eye contact, how can I show her that it isn't the right reaction vs teaching her that eye contact means punishment is coming. During play its easy enough to disengage, perhaps she'll get the idea through that.  

I just been lucky so far with her temperament, the only other issue I've encounter is her love to be on counters and some minor issues finding the litter box when shes not already in the room adjacent to it. The counter trouble seems to be effectively controlled using tape, and the litter box issue seems to be improving as she ages. 

 

[callista]

Cats don't really have a strong drive to dominate anybody. I mean, they don't really have a pack like dogs do; there's no alpha in a group of cats. There are cats who are better at getting their own way; there are cats that are more demanding. But dominance? Not really, not in solitary hunters. With a cat, you have to either negotiate and form a compromise, or simply prove to the cat that you are the more stubborn and in that particular matter are going to have your way. Cats aren't dogs. They can be pretty willful and stubborn, and you can get them to do what you want, but you're only going to get them to do that one particular thing. They're not going to acknowledge you as dominant because they don't understand "dominant". It's not part of the way they live. If both cats want the choice window spot, they may share it, or one cat may bully the other cat out of it, but that's not going to settle who gets the first treat or who gets to perch on top of the refrigerator.

Staring at a cat is aggressive and overstimulating. A more polite way is to look briefly, then look away or blink slowly. That says, "I am here. I know you are here. I seek peaceful coexistence." It is a cat's version of a smile, to glance and then look away.

I guess it's a bit of a fine distinction. There are cats who rule the roost in their household, getting their own way most of the time. But these cats aren't true dominant cats, not like a dog would be. They are just more confident or persistent or sneaky. Other cats don't recognize their dominance. They don't think, "This is the top cat in the house." They just think, "I have to give in when this cat wants the window spot."

When you train a cat, your best bet is more like communication or negotiation than, as you would with dogs, establishing yourself as a trustworthy leader. Convince the cat, "It is in your best interest to do this when I want you to do it," or, "I am stubborn enough that you won't get away with doing that," and the cat will listen. Just remember that a cat will not obey what you want when you are out of sight. When you are not there, as far as your cat is concerned, what you want doesn't matter, because you are not there to get upset about it. And by the time you get back, the cat has no way of knowing what you are angry about. When you don't like what a cat is doing to you, though, you don't have to worry about that, since obviously there's no opportunity to do it when you're gone.

With the possible exception of kitten-and-mother, a cat is incapable of seeing anyone else as anything other than an equal. If you want something from a cat, you have to convince the cat to do it. You can't demand things just because you're the human and the cat is a cat. Humans are social animals, in the sense that we psychologically need and naturally form social structures. Cats are not social in the same way. For a human, social interaction is the center of life. For a cat, social interaction is an interesting diversion. When they socialize, it's because they want to, not because they need to.

I think I've been rambling on a bit. Oh well... serves me right, staying up 'til 2 a.m. I should get some sleep.