Thinking of dabbling into the raw territory.

[kattiekitty]

Well as the title states, I'm thinking about going raw. I'm still in the research phase and wondering if this will work for my two. I have a 3 yo very healthy male cat with no health issues. He is a kibble junky and prefers his kibbles to canned, though he will eat the Wellness grain free chunks in gravy style. He doesn't like pate style though. I'm starting to reduce the amount of dry he gets and he is more open to eating the canned lately. the kibble that they get is a mix of Orijen grain free, and Wellness or Natures variety Prairie with grain. I get paranoid about UTI even though none of my cats have ever had one.

My female kitty is more of an issue. She is 8 yo with chronic constipation issues that are under control with Miralax. The big thing lately is her allergies are out of control. Even steroid injections don't really work and I don't like giving them to her. her blood work done on Friday was perfect except for an elevation in eosinophils due to the allergies I'm assuming. I have switched foods and done my own elimination trials with no real success. Since the allergies come and go with the seasons, I believe it is more an atopic or inhales allergy. The reason Im considering raw though is that it is more natural and healthy and maybe it will heal her from the inside out so that her system won't be so hyper sensitive to her environment. At least that was my hope, that an healthier cats over all.

Now I research everything heavily before diving in. I would first have to get them to accept it which would be challenge one. Also I was thinking of starting off with a commercial raw before doing my own. It is expensive though. I live in an apartment and don't have a huge freezer so that may be a problem too. Freeze dried raw was tempting because of this. The brands I have easy access to are Nature's Variety and Stella and Chewys. I think I found a store that carries Radcat as well, though it is downtown. I won't be able to put all this research into action till I get back from vacation cause I'm sure my parents won't be thrilled to feed raw and I don't want to start something and  be gone. I was thinking of getting the freeze dried  toppers though to see their reaction. Any thoughts or opinions?  Again I am going to look through all the threads here to get an idea . I am just really nervous in making everything balanced as we don't want deficiencies  or more problems.

 

[Willowy]

When you get down to it, feeding commercial raw is no different than feeding canned, except you have to thaw it instead of opening a can :lol3:. You don't even have to switch 100% right away. . .just add some raw to your wet food rotation. If your cats like it right away (probably the best chances of that are with RadCat), super! Otherwise you'll have to resort to persuasion techniques like toppers.

Are they on scheduled meals or do they free-feed?

 

[carolina]

If you go commercial, you have none of those worries.... I love rad Cat .. imho, it is the best... The meats from haretoday are awesome too, you just add the alnutrin supplements they sell, and rebag into Ziploc bags.... Awesome and cheap! I bought a small freezer that fits right in my office- from Craig's list paid $75 and works like a charm!
Today I feed chucks of meat, but I started with natures variety and quickly moved to rad Cat, then to frankerprey, but boneless. There is a lot of information in here:
http://www.thecatsite.com/t/240809/raw-feeding-resource-thread
Good luck, and welcome to the amazing world of raw!

 

[Willowy]

Oh, some of your other concerns--if you can buy the food locally, lack of freezer space shouldn't be a problem. Let the store provide the freezer space! And, if you're feeding high-quality foods, commercial raw isn't much more expensive (and is cheaper than most of the higher-end canned foods). Remember they need a lot less of it. . .maybe 3-4 ounces a day for an average cat.

 

[kattiekitty]

Awesome! They are on timed feedings twice a day, sort of. The canned food is placed down and eaten or not for 30 minutes. Then their limited amount of kibble is left out but usually gone within the hour or so. I only give each cat a 1/4 cup at each meal. My male is 15 pounds and the female is 11. The balance of their meals is wet. My boy will scarf the dry fast and be super hungry and more willing to try canned at the next meal so hopefully raw will go over well. I have a pet pros store literally minutes away that carries natures variety and Stella and chewies. The rad cat one is at the specialty store downtown. I've never been there, but looked it up in the store locator. I know that pet pros has a trial size of the medallions that wasn't too expensive. I haven't really added up costs of the cats food specifically cause I buy food and supplies for a dog, 2 cats, 1 rabbit and 3 birds. I average about 200 once a month when all is said and done. I think depending on the kibble I spend about 30 for about 10 pounds combined of dry. I rotate brands and use a grain free and grain in. For example, I'll use wellness chicken and rice, and orijen 6 fish or poultry. Currently it is poultry cause I'm eliminating fish from Katties diet. For cans, I'll buy 20 or so cans each month and rotate my stock. All are the high quality stuff like wellness, blue buffalo, tots, merricks, natures variety weruva ect.
I think the commercial raw would be a good stepping stone for us to try, who knows I might even get my dog on it. He's 12 and a half and healthy. He's on acana Pacifica and canned.

 

[ldg]

I third what Willowy and Carolina said. :lol3: It's SO much easier to start with commercial raw. :nod: You don't have to think about it, and the store provides the freezer space. You can go at your kitties' pace, and it's much easier to introduce the raw and different proteins. It really helps just to get comfortable with the process, work with their reaction to it, and you can research other options along the way.

I do think it will help your Kattie's allergies. Chum had allergy issues - his may have been partially seasonal, but he probably also had food allergies and just a lot of environmental allergies (not seasonal). On raw, he stopped eating the pills the holistic vet had prescribed - and he's not had any of those things (that totally controlled his allergies) for... five months now? And he's not the least bit itchy! (And before the pills, he had bare spots on his legs and his abdomen was bare). I do use an omega 3 supplement, and that might have helped too.

Hope you enjoy your vacation!

 

[kattiekitty]

Well I went out today and went to the high end petstore that is actually not downtown but closer and easier to get to. They have radcat, natures variety, raw advantage and some others that I forgot. Anyways, they were super helpful and even gave me a few free samples of the rad cat. I also bought an 8 oz tub of rad cat turkey and a trial size of the Natures variety chicken. Well I took the samples this evening which were about 1 oz I believe and gave one to each cat. One was the turkey, one was the chicken variety. Oh my gosh, I've never seen Kattie so enthusiastic about eating! She scarfed the chicken sample down. Oscar on the other hand sniffed and looked at me funny lol. I even tried to hand feed it to him (washed my hands afterwards) but he just gave it a lick. He will be the issue if i decide to completely switch them both. Kattie looks to be easy though. I think I will still go slowly though as I use up my stock of cans and dry. Oscar I ended up giving a can of Wellness Chicken in gravy, so maybe I will mix the raw in the canned. It is grain free canned so hopefully the digestion times won't be an issue. I ended up giving Kattie Oscar's sample which she scarfed too.

Now is it ok to give a meal of dried or canned and then a separate meal of raw at a different time, till i get them completely converted? Also since Kattie has had issues with constipation in the past should I be worried on raw? I've read too much bonemeal can cause issues. She gets her miralax once a day to keep her regular. Also the Nature's Variety has other stuff besides just meat, but rad cat looks like mostly meat are they both ok to feed as a regular diet? I have a feeling i will have better luck with Rad Cat texturewise, The only other concern I have with it is that it comes in small tubs, 8 oz and one larger one I believe. It says to feed 3-4 oz twice a day for every 8 pounds of cat. that seems like a lot. Each 8 oz tray is 4 something so that could get pricey unless it comes larger. Also do you defrost a tray then split it into serving sizes to refreeze? Otherwise it is rock hard and not dividable like the natures variety medallions.Well anyways, I'm excited that Kattie is liking it, as she is the one I want to convert the most, I will work on Oscar as it would be nice to purchase one kind of food, not to mention cheaper I think in the long run. Otherwise I will be buying cans, kibble and raw. Cans would be a good back up though when I have someone watch them, don't know if my parents would be willing to feed raw.
 

 

[carolina]

Well I went out today and went to the high end petstore that is actually not downtown but closer and easier to get to. They have radcat, natures variety, raw advantage and some others that I forgot. Anyways, they were super helpful and even gave me a few free samples of the rad cat. I also bought an 8 oz tub of rad cat turkey and a trial size of the Natures variety chicken. Well I took the samples this evening which were about 1 oz I believe and gave one to each cat. One was the turkey, one was the chicken variety. Oh my gosh, I've never seen Kattie so enthusiastic about eating! She scarfed the chicken sample down. Oscar on the other hand sniffed and looked at me funny lol. I even tried to hand feed it to him (washed my hands afterwards) but he just gave it a lick. He will be the issue if i decide to completely switch them both. Kattie looks to be easy though. I think I will still go slowly though as I use up my stock of cans and dry. Oscar I ended up giving a can of Wellness Chicken in gravy, so maybe I will mix the raw in the canned. It is grain free canned so hopefully the digestion times won't be an issue. I ended up giving Kattie Oscar's sample which she scarfed too.

GREAT Start! Yep, definitely some kitties are easier than others..... sometimes WAAAAAAAY easier than others :lol3::lol3::lol3: Hopefully both of yours will be easy :cross:

Now is it ok to give a meal of dried or canned and then a separate meal of raw at a different time, till i get them completely converted?

The best way to do this, is to put them on scheduled meals.... Do you free feed dry? I would recommend stopping that, if you want to transition to raw.... Raw+canned is fine.... Raw+dry on the same meal, not so much. I did it, while transitioning Lucky, however, she was eating very little raw, and the kibbles was EVO, not only grain free, but very low in carbs - only 7% (carbs slows down the digestion of meat, and can lead to digestive problems)

Also since Kattie has had issues with constipation in the past should I be worried on raw? I've read too much bonemeal can cause issues. She gets her miralax once a day to keep her regular.

I would not worry about that- see how it goes...... it she gets constipated, you can add a little meat to it, a little pumpkin... or your Miralax - but thefact that some cats got constipation doesn't mean your will too.....

Also the Nature's Variety has other stuff besides just meat, but rad cat looks like mostly meat are they both ok to feed as a regular diet? I have a feeling i will have better luck with Rad Cat texturewise,

Both are ok, balanced and complete, and perfectly fine to feed as regular diet. IMHO Rad Cat is the best Commercial food there is. You should try the lamb - kitties LOVE it.

The only other concern I have with it is that it comes in small tubs, 8 oz and one larger one I believe. It says to feed 3-4 oz twice a day for every 8 pounds of cat. that seems like a lot. Each 8 oz tray is 4 something so that could get pricey unless it comes larger. Also do you defrost a tray then split it into serving sizes to refreeze? Otherwise it is rock hard and not dividable like the natures variety medallions.Well anyways, I'm excited that Kattie is liking it, as she is the one I want to convert the most, I will work on Oscar as it would be nice to purchase one kind of food, not to mention cheaper I think in the long run. Otherwise I will be buying cans, kibble and raw. Cans would be a good back up though when I have someone watch them, don't know if my parents would be willing to feed raw.

I believe it comes in 8, 16 and 24oz.
What I did, was I filled a tub with cold water, and soaked the container for a while (inside a large ziplock bag. That would defrost it just enough for me to separate into small portions. Repacked into smaller ziplock bags with enough for all the cats (per meal), and re-froze them. The tubs took about one hour (the 16oz or 24oz) to defrost in cold water.

Hope this helps!
As far as quantities..... My cats ate it like they eat their raw food now - 1.6oz per meal..... 3 meals a day (one is 11lbs, one is 13, one is 18 on a diet :lol3 same same :nod:

 
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[kattiekitty]

Thanks Carolina! I do think it was the 24 oz that they had in the RadCat that was the largest tub. I believe it was 10 or so dollars  depending on the meat. I think 1.6 oz three times daily is much more realistic for my kitties. that would come out to 4.8oz a day. the label said 4 oz per meal which would use up the tub super fast, especially for 2 cats. Both of my cats are fairly lazy, with Kattie more so. Oscar has some kitten spunk still and will dart around the house for no reason, or rough house with the dog. He is still about a pound or so too chunky I think at 15 pounds. He has a slight belly even though he is a naturally big cat. Kattie is 11 pounds and is a good weight so no need to change there. We will play around with amounts and eventually get there. First I have to get Oscar convinced it's food lol. I thought it was going to be reversed personally, Oscar is my potential hunter and I have to watch him around my pet birds. Kattie, is a lazy prissy girl that I never thought would take to raw so easily. As to the dry food, I limit it to 1/4 cup twice a day and we are gradually going less dry and more canned. the dry is usually eaten pretty quickly and I leave it, but it is gone within the hour or so til next meal. Wet is down for 30-45 minutes then picked up. So they are pretty much fed only twice a day.

 

[carolina]

Thanks Carolina! I do think it was the 24 oz that they had in the RadCat that was the largest tub. I believe it was 10 or so dollars  depending on the meat. I think 1.6 oz three times daily is much more realistic for my kitties. that would come out to 4.8oz a day. the label said 4 oz per meal which would use up the tub super fast, especially for 2 cats. Both of my cats are fairly lazy, with Kattie more so. Oscar has some kitten spunk still and will dart around the house for no reason, or rough house with the dog. He is still about a pound or so too chunky I think at 15 pounds. He has a slight belly even though he is a naturally big cat. Kattie is 11 pounds and is a good weight so no need to change there. We will play around with amounts and eventually get there. First I have to get Oscar convinced it's food lol. I thought it was going to be reversed personally, Oscar is my potential hunter and I have to watch him around my pet birds. Kattie, is a lazy prissy girl that I never thought would take to raw so easily. As to the dry food, I limit it to 1/4 cup twice a day and we are gradually going less dry and more canned. the dry is usually eaten pretty quickly and I leave it, but it is gone within the hour or so til next meal. Wet is down for 30-45 minutes then picked up. So they are pretty much fed only twice a day.

Excellent, so there you go.... all you need is to replace one for the other..... But feed the raw on the other meal from the dry though, just to be on the safe side....
Also, put them on a good probiotic - human is ok, just choose one with 10billion CFU. Open the capsule and sprinkle/mix with the food once a day :nod:

 

[kattiekitty]

Awesome will do, and I was at the supplement store today and didn't get any probiotic. They have animal and human ones. Now another question. I just weighed my male cat. Basically getting on the scale holding him and I had to do a double take! If it is correct and I think it is pretty darn close, he is about 17.5 pounds! I checked against Kattie who got weighed at the vet on friday and sure enough she is 11 pounds. Gosh he has gained almost a pound since his visit in November. He is going on a kitty diet! I am definitely going to reduce the kibble regulate the canned. I was doing calculations as to how much raw to feed per day, now if I wanted him to lose, would he naturally lose on raw as it is low carb, or should I adjust more? I knew he was getting a little tubby as he has loose skin around his front legs, not bad but still!
 

 

[carolina]

Excellent, so there you go.... all you need is to replace one for the other..... But feed the raw on the other meal from the dry though, just to be on the safe side....
Also, put them on a good probiotic - human is ok, just choose one with 10billion CFU. Open the capsule and sprinkle/mix with the food once a day :nod:

cutting the kibbles is always a good idea, if you ask me, on all aspects!
The best thing to do, is to weigh them often, and start feeding a bit more, then adjust it down. You don't want to lose weight too fast, that's not healthy.... Per my holistic vet, not more than 1lb per month. I started feeding Bugsy over 6lbs a day, then quickly realized that was way too much- he was gaining weight, instead if losing. From there, I started cutting: 5.75, 5.5, 5..... Now finally 4.8, which is way below 2% of his weight.
On raw, you feed by weight.... 2-4% of weight, in oz. So, for your 17.5 lbs, 2% would be 5.6 oz a day, or 3 meals of 1.87oz.
For 3%, you would feed: 8.4ozper day/ 2.8 per feeding....
Frankly is justbtoo much imho.

None of my kitties eat 3.%....
You will be astonished ar the health changes you will experiencel!

 

[kattiekitty]

Well, update this morning! Kattie loves the NV chicken too. I mixed half a medallion in with some TOTW grain free canned but kinda put it on top. She ate all of the raw and left the canned lol. Oscar on the other hand snubbed it again. He is going to be difficult. In the mean time I will continue to alternate canned and raw for Kattie and eventually get her completely on raw. In more of my research I found a company called Darwin's natural Pet Products. They do raw dog and cat foo. Apparently they are based in the Seattle Tacoma area and that qualifies for free shipping. They ship every 4 weeks or so and for 2 cats it is about 110.00 a month and 70 for the dog to be half raw half regular food. Not too bad. I still really like the looks of the rad cat in terms of quality. Just figuring the budget out if I'm going to commit. Another thing I was thinking is that my parents have a deep freeze at their house and I see them every week. I could potentially store surplus food there and bring it home when I come home. We shall see... I'm just excited that Kattie likes the food so much!
 

 

[feralvr]

HI - just dropping in ! so glad to hear the your Kattie loves the raw, so far!! I think we all have that one or two who seem to give us a hard time about converting. :lol3: My cats also love the NV organic chicken and the regular chicken (has turkey). I also LOVE Rad Cat. Rad Cat lamb and turkey are responsible for my four fussies turning the corner to becoming true carnies!! My Walden and Wendall were converts from day one. Perla, my princess, still gives me some trouble. I have not ordered from Darwin's yet. I am using about six other brands and am happy so far with those. They seem to be working! Hare Today is a favorite over here as well. Maybe you should see about getting some Rad Cat for Oscar !!!

 

[kattiekitty]

Funny thing is I tried the Rad Cat turkey first with Oscar lol. He sniffs it and looks at me like, "Where's my real food?" lol. I think I will have to take it slower with him, but Kattie is doing well, and she is my main concern to get off the regular food. My other is costwise as I think I will at least temporarily be buying raw, canned and dry. The canned and dry will go slower having only one cat eat it but it would be simpler to have them both on just one thing. I won't give up though, I converted 3 die hard seedaholic birds to a mixed fresh diet so I know stubborn animals. Took me over a year to get my cockatiel to even look at veggies and fruits, now he eats his kale enthusiastically lol.

 

 

[kattiekitty]

Well the raw is going pretty well. She eats a raw meal in the morning and a grainfree canned in the evening.  I do have an 1/8 of a cup of dry down from 10 at night which gets eaten within a few hours, but keeps everyone quiet during the night. Oscar is doing a little better and has licked the radcat now. He is still eating dry and canned. His dry food is up away from Kattie cause I don't want her eating it in case it is contributing to her allergies. I am working on it, but know that when they go stay with my parents, they are probably going to get canned and dry.

 

[mrsgreenjeens]

So...what exactly are they eating.  The radcat?