Looking into starting raw

[paziqi]

I'm trying to wean my cats off dry right now; I have 5 cats, and they've been fed half on canned and half on dry for quite a while now.  I've been doing research though, and I'm feeling pretty let down by the pet food industry.  I've lost 2 cats in the last 5 years, and I now feel pretty confident that I can attribute their illnesses at least partially to diet.  Of my remaining cats, 1 has been seriously ill and at the point of death, and another suffers from a chronic condition.  Again, I find myself looking at their current diet as a major contributer to their health problems.  So, I think going raw is maybe a good idea.

Of the 5 I have, 1 is pretty much already willing to do raw.  He was a stray up until I adopted him a couple years back, and apparently is used to eating what he can catch.  I breed mice as a hobby, and he gets frozen pinkies as treats when I have them available.  He also seems willing to eat the Nature's Variety raw, though he likes the pinkies better.

I have another boy who I think will transition pretty well.  He likes raw chicken now, but won't currently touch the Nature's Variety.

My other three are all being a bit difficult.  They like their kibble.  So, I can see this is going to be a bit of a process.

I'm not that fond of the nature's variety.  I buy it local, but I'm thinking it sits too long in their cases.  It looks terrible.  I've order a premix to try, but I'm also wondering what other people like?  I don't think I want to try mixing anything from scratch, but what are some good premade diets, or premixes out there now?

 

[Willowy]

Nature's Variety DOES look terrible, no matter how it's stored. . .they pasteurize it with high pressure, which apparently makes it turn gray on the outside. So don't worry about that!

First step, I think, is to get them off kibble and on all canned. Some cats transition directly to raw from kibble, but usually kibble addicts just won't look at raw if they think some kibble is coming. So, since they're willing to eat canned food, go to all canned first, and once they're used to that you can start mixing the raw into their canned food.

There are, fortunately, a lot of pre-made raw brands now. They may not be available locally, though. First question before I go listing all the brands--are you in the U.S.? No point listing U.S. brands if you're not! :lol3:

 

[ldg]

There are, fortunately, a lot of pre-made raw brands now. They may not be available locally, though. First question before I go listing all the brands--are you in the U.S.? No point listing U.S. brands if you're not! :lol3:

Where are you located?

Also, are you feeding timed meals? Because whether or not you transition to all canned as part of the process or not, to make a switch to all raw, all canned, or partial raw and canned, the first, most important step, is removing free fed kibble. :nod:

 

[tobytyler]

Hi Paziqi and welcome to TCS

Congratulations on making the first step.  As a recent raw convert, I have found this site to be invaluable in not only helping make the transition but you can also learn just about anything here.

As mentioned, getting them off kibble is the place to start.  My 13 yo had always been a kibble eater, and I also have two kittens.  The kittens took immediately to raw, the older took a bit more coaxing.  But I am happy to say that it only took us 2.5 days to be kibble free

 and in less than one week they were all happily switched to 100% raw.  I am keeping some cans on hand just in case.  The 13 year old is now eating more at one time than I have ever seen.  He was so used to grazing that he couldn't eat much in one sitting.  He also just loves plain raw chicken wings that he manages without a whole set of teeth, lol. At first I had to feed him many small meals to get him used to dinner time.  He had to realize that there wasn't going to be food out all the time.

If this brand is available in your area and it's something you can afford, Rad Cat is an excellent frozen complete meal that my cats love, even Cricket.  I don't even need toppers for him anymore.   A lot of people are using Hare Today and buying it mail order. You need to supplement that one but everyone seems to love it.  I have not tried it, though.  Stella and Chewy's makes a freeze dried 98% raw food that you rehydrate.  It is very convenient and even picky eater Cricket ate that one right away. 

Good luck and keep us posted!  There are so many members on here who will be glad to help!

 

[paziqi]

Thanks for all the replies.    I am in the U.S., in Michigan, to be specific.  There are a couple of smaller pet food stores in my area, and one petco.  I haven't been in petco in a while, but the only raw carried in the two smaller stores is the nature's variety.  Though, I think I saw the Stella and Chewy's last time I was shopping.  It was in a pouch?  Which I ignored, cause I thought it was another pouched pieces and gravy thing.

I am trying to get them onto scheduled feedings.  We were sort of on a schedule before, in that I'd feed them twice a day, and if they ate all of what they were given, they wouldn't get anymore until the next feeding.  I'm trying to leave it down now and pick it up after half an hour, I'm just a bit nervous.  My one girl had hepatic lipidosis a couple years back, and she's not big on eating a lot in one sitting.  I keep worrying that she's not getting enough, so then I leave some out for her again.  I know, it defeats the purpose, but after fighting through fatty liver disease once, I'm in no hurry to go through it again. 

I was also wondering, would it be bad for them to do a partial raw/partial whole prey thing?  Since I breed the mice anyway, I think I could probably bump that up to cover a quarter to half of their feeding needs.  But would that mess with their digestion or nutrition?

 

[tobytyler]

Thanks for all the replies.    I am in the U.S., in Michigan, to be specific.  There are a couple of smaller pet food stores in my area, and one petco.  I haven't been in petco in a while, but the only raw carried in the two smaller stores is the nature's variety.  Though, I think I saw the Stella and Chewy's last time I was shopping.  It was in a pouch?  Which I ignored, cause I thought it was another pouched pieces and gravy thing.

I am trying to get them onto scheduled feedings.  We were sort of on a schedule before, in that I'd feed them twice a day, and if they ate all of what they were given, they wouldn't get anymore until the next feeding.  I'm trying to leave it down now and pick it up after half an hour, I'm just a bit nervous.  My one girl had hepatic lipidosis a couple years back, and she's not big on eating a lot in one sitting.  I keep worrying that she's not getting enough, so then I leave some out for her again.  I know, it defeats the purpose, but after fighting through fatty liver disease once, I'm in no hurry to go through it again. 

I was also wondering, would it be bad for them to do a partial raw/partial whole prey thing?  Since I breed the mice anyway, I think I could probably bump that up to cover a quarter to half of their feeding needs.  But would that mess with their digestion or nutrition?

Of course you can do the partial raw/whole prey thing.  There is also a link at the very top of the forum for some guidelines from Auntie Crazy. That will give you somewhere to start and answer your questions about prey, etc.   You can even feed part canned, part raw, part prey.  There are members doing that. The main thing is getting them off the kibbles. 

The feeding schedule here is morning, when I get up, then noonish, then 4 -5 pm and then around bedtime.  I had to start with more just to get Cricket used to eating a full meal.  I am hoping to get this down to three times daily but I have kittens.

Yes, Stella and Chewy's is in a pouch.  They sell small pouches and also a 12 oz size.  You add warm (not hot so you don't cook it) water and it rehydrates in 3 minutes. 

 

[ldg]

Of course you can do the partial raw/whole prey thing.  There is also a link at the very top of the forum for some guidelines from Auntie Crazy. That will give you somewhere to start and answer your questions about prey, etc.   You can even feed part canned, part raw, part prey.  There are members doing that. The main thing is getting them off the kibbles. 

The feeding schedule here is morning, when I get up, then noonish, then 4 -5 pm and then around bedtime.  I had to start with more just to get Cricket used to eating a full meal.  I am hoping to get this down to three times daily but I have kittens.

Yes, Stella and Chewy's is in a pouch.  They sell small pouches and also a 12 oz size.  You add warm (not hot so you don't cook it) water and it rehydrates in 3 minutes. 

I don't know if shipping would be prohibitive to where you are, but there's also http://www.hare-today.com or http://www.mypetcarnivore.com/ Hare Today has very reasonable shipping costs if you're within their delivery area, and as they're located in western PA, I would think you fit that bill. And My Pet Carnivore is based out of Gary, IN.

For those that don't work from home, most feeding raw provide a meal before work, one after work, and then one more before bed. At least three meals a day is really ideal.

I'm so sorry about the fatty liver. The good news with timed, individual feedings is that you know exactly how much everyone's eating. What you might want to consider for the transition (to whatever you decide) would be to remove the kibble during the day, and leave down a measured amount at night. :dk:

And although it's expensive to use long term, the Stella & Chewy's freeze dried food can be fed without rehydrating it in place of kibble. It's meant to be rehydrated, but as part of a transition, or as a supplement to wet food or raw food meals, it might be an option as a food you can leave out. :dk: Some people use automatic feeders - there are some that can accommodate frozen raw (it dethaws and you set the timer so they can access it when it's ready).

Of course.... all of these still leave you wondering how much she's actually eating.

 

[tobytyler]

I don't know if shipping would be prohibitive to where you are, but there's also http://www.hare-today.com or http://www.mypetcarnivore.com/ Hare Today has very reasonable shipping costs if you're within their delivery area, and as they're located in western PA, I would think you fit that bill. And My Pet Carnivore is based out of Gary, IN.
For those that don't work from home, most feeding raw provide a meal before work, one after work, and then one more before bed. At least three meals a day is really ideal.
I'm so sorry about the fatty liver.

The good news with timed, individual feedings is that you know exactly how much everyone's eating. What you might want to consider for the transition (to whatever you decide) would be to remove the kibble during the day, and leave down a measured amount at night.

And although it's expensive to use long term, the Stella & Chewy's freeze dried food can be fed without rehydrating it in place of kibble. It's meant to be rehydrated, but as part of a transition, or as a supplement to wet food or raw food meals, it might be an option as a food you can leave out.

Some people use automatic feeders - there are some that can accommodate frozen raw (it dethaws and you set the timer so they can access it when it's ready).
Of course.... all of these still leave you wondering how much she's actually eating.

Oh thanks for the tip about the automatic feeder!  I have one that I haven't used for years, and I did think it would come in handy for the raw.  But using is to defrost sounds awesome.  Aren't we all so full of good ideas here?

 

[ldg]

I'm really not sure how they get used for raw - I think some people (or feeders? :dk: ) use ice packs or something when feeding raw or canned with them? :dk:

 

[tobytyler]

I'm really not sure how they get used for raw - I think some people (or feeders?

) use ice packs or something when feeding raw or canned with them?

Yes, they have a little gel ice pack that fits in the bottom which would be perfect for putting food in parially thawed and then set it to what ever time you want it to open up.  The one I have has two feeding compartments. I used it for canned when I couldn't be home for mealtime.

 

[otto]

Don't get discouraged if it takes a while with some. My Jennie and my Queen Eva took to raw immediately, but Mazy has been a slower process. I started back in May with Stella&Chewy's, and have gradually progressed to where I am now, feeding a combination of canned, boneless prey model (calcium supplemented) and commercial raw (Rad Cat). Mazy is doing great but still needs a 'garnish' on her prey model meat chunk servings.

My cat have always been fed canned food, on a schedule, so I didn't have to worry about that step.

Good luck, and you're going to be very happy with the results. Just don't worry if it takes a while.

 

[tobytyler]

There are a couple of smaller pet food stores in my area, and one petco.  I haven't been in petco in a while, but the only raw carried in the two smaller stores is the nature's variety.  Though, I think I saw the Stella and Chewy's last time I was shopping. 

 My one girl had hepatic lipidosis a couple years back, and she's not big on eating a lot in one sitting.  I keep worrying that she's not getting enough, so then I leave some out for her again.  I know, it defeats the purpose, but after fighting through fatty liver disease once, I'm in no hurry to go through it again. 

When I was buying Wellness canned food, I just assumed Petco would be way cheaper than the locals.  Man, was I wrong!  Petco was almost $5 more per case than mom and pop!!!

  Also, they were charging $20 more for an identical water fountain! I havent been back since,but am wondering if they are selling Stella and Chewy's and for how much?  I am paying $24.99 for 12 oz, plus if you buy 12 you get one free. 

I am fortunate my fairly local place also has a wonderful selection. 

Sorry about your girl. I hope she has fully recovered.  My Cricket could only eat very small meals very slowly.  It took a few days to work him up to eating 4 meals because he was used to grazing.  I still worry about Cricket getting enough food because of his age.  He needs to ideally gain about 1/2 lb.  But he has been such a trooper and I am so proud of him.  I really didn't expect him to get off the kibble so quicky because he had free fed his entire 13 years!  

 

[paziqi]

When I was buying Wellness canned food, I just assumed Petco would be way cheaper than the locals.  . 

Sorry about your girl. I hope she has fully recovered.  My Cricket could only eat very small meals very slowly.  It took a few days to work him up to eating 4 meals because he was used to grazing. 

I know, it seems like Petco should be cheaper, but they are not.  They usually have a better selection though.  But I do like my smaller mom and pop stores.

She has recovered quite well.  Fatty Liver is something you want to avoid at all costs, I can tell you.  But one nice thing to come from it; she was always kind of distant from me, but after being mostly sequestered, and force-fed for almost 2 months, she became very loving towards me.  She's my lap kitty now.  I think having so much one on one time with me really made a difference for her.

We tried an experiment last night.  I gave each of them a couple small pieces of chicken thigh with their meal.  4 out of the 5 ended up eating the chicken, so I am feeling pretty happy.