Best Guess on this kitty?

[obpilot]

Hi, I want to post pictures of a cat that I rescued from our neighborhood.

For many reasons I believe him to be an "exotic". That is to say, having some of the hybrid cat breed(s) in him. His color is brown/bronze and his striping and spotting very distinctive.

Bengal Rescue took a look and did admit the possibility of Bengal blood - he has that sort of "face" although the ears aren't quite right I don't think.
The wild cat look though, if you know what I mean is pretty strong. Myself, I'm thinking he is BYB Bengal parent or even (shocking as this sounds) some idiot letting 2 pure breeds "mix" ... just wondering what the heck it could be?

He was not altered when I found him. He has perfect box and house habits thought his energy is high. He does not seem to know how to play nice with other cats, and was instrumental in terrifying my cats into not coming home. (Hence part of the reason I removed him from the street). He was injured with 2 bites to his front leg, he would have lost it had I not interceeded and brought him inside for vet care.

I named him Ronin Amun Kazhak (Ronin = Masterless Samuri, Amun = Egyptian God "the divine which is hidden" and Kazhak = nomad in Russian)

But he responds best to the name sound "Ziggy or Siggy" so I think that used to be his name. He wasn't microchipped but was obviously pampered and cared for well. He did quite outstandingly well with kittens underfoot - which made me wonder had he come from a breeder situation? Where he would be used to getting on with litters of kittens?? (As top cat of course!)

I will see about posting pics for people to comment on. Maybe someone will recognize what he might be dervied from or at least the color! (Bronze is really what I consider him to be - brownsih with blackish).

I am pretty desperate to adopt him - he likes to sleep with me, and be with me all the time, but with my other cats so terrified and hating him and vice versa - they can't mix. This means he gets left alone alot. I am working on the adoption - maybe someone here will fall in love with his looks! (They are striking in person, but don't photograph as well as I'd like).

Okay, now let me see about posting a picture. Any hints on how to do that here?

 

[GoldyCat]

First of all, welcome to TCS!

There are several stickies at the top of the "New Cats on the Block" forum. Under "Threads for Newbies" you'll find a link on How to Post Pictures. Hope this helps.

 

[obpilot]

Posting a pic as soon as I can of Ronin. I think now he may be an Egyptian Mau - EMRO has some "real" ones from the streets of Cairo and I've seen some breeders websites and boy, that IS what he looks like - and a bronzy color too...

Love to see what folks here think of him. He's a really sweet boy to his humans once he gets used to you, just not into other cats so much. Very defensive and likes to chase, pounce on and bite them on the butt and base of tails. Of course, then I have to deal with bite wounds

He listens well though and I think he is quite intelligent and willful sometimes. Stubborn almost? And he talks and rahuus and mrrrrups and so on to me .. whole conversations we have sometimes...

 

[obpilot]

http://i1139.photobucket.com/albums/...ninplaying.jpg

I don't know if this will work, there should be photos in the album.

Hopeful I can figure it out!

 

[obpilot]

http://s1139.photobucket.com/albums/...ontandface.jpg

http://s1139.photobucket.com/albums/...bodynohead.jpg

http://s1139.photobucket.com/albums/...DAmunronin.jpg

 

[northernglow]

Without papers he's a brown spotted tabby domestic shorthair (a.k.a black spotted tabby in some parts of the world as that's what he genetically is). I can't see any Mau in him, Bengal mix would be more likely.

 

[cat person]

I would say Bengal mix from your picture's and your description of his behavior. But I agree with NorthernGlow, I do not see the Egyptian Mau in him.

He sounds like a very energetic cat like my Loki, who is a F3 Savannah (nonstandard color). Bengals are like that as well.

 

[obpilot]

Ah, brown spotted tabby. I can see that. I've never seen one quite with his under color of orangy. That's where the part Bengal came in. And yes, the probably has some of that. I hate owners of pure breeds who don't fix and let roam outside. And bet you that is where this little boy came from.

For certain, someone put a real tiger in his tank, LOL. He does like to fly up and down stairs, and tear around at speed and take off from the tops of chairs and leap straight up into the air to grab toys and feathers...

He's quite interactive and playful and demands attention. Very talky too. I feel badly he doesn't get on with the others. I don't think he is "mean" I think he is trying to get out and be dominant and aggressive so that HE won't be picked on.

One time he got out, he flew at my little Yum, pounced on her full claws out and dashed away. He didn't bite, but he had full on claws out. Thankfully they had been trimmed so she didn't get scratched. After the pounce, he dashed into the living room floor all crazy but not aggressive. I think he was playing!!!

The second time, he flew downstairs ahead of me out of his "room" (he got out by accident) and saw Yum and flew at her, she tried to get away, I heard growing and yeowl, and then I yelled "NO" and he froze, and she got away. I grabbed him, he was aroused and nipped me as I hauled him upstairs back to his room. He KNEW he wasn't supposed to bite her!! It turns out he got her (bit) in her tail (theres an abcess now alas).

So I don't trust him. He did that to each of my cats in turn. He particularly hates my Siamese / tabby mix Frodo who is a gentle boy and not really aggressive at all. (Blue eyes, with siamese colored tabby markings and white patches, a lovely looking kitty from a traditional style Siamese girl found in a feral colony!!) Frodo boy is terrified of him.

My little silver tabby girl (a total tiny adorable girl kitty) is also afraid of him. When he was intact he would chase her, but I think he didn't bite her,
just tried to mate her maybe?). She's getting a bit better about tolerating him being out in the deck enclosure and her being on the deck...

Anyway, thanks for the information. He is truely a beauty in motion (he slinks along like a jungle cat, LOL. And his back is so long that he has this funny "hump" sometimes that a regular cat's back doesn't have. He has flashes where he just looks so ... wildcat like. Then you look hard, and he looks like a regular cat again. Its subtle but it defnitely is there.

Can't imagine not looking for this boy desperately if he were mine, and as cherished and spoilt as he seems to be. (He knows kitty milk, he knows kitty treats and toys - including laser pointer, he is good at the kennels, cat shows and vet. He sleeps on your head or feet and only gentle mouthing and sucking of your hair!)





Sadly he isn't getting any better with exposure to my kitties while in his
"outdoor enclosure". When the weather turns, he can still be out in it, I have a nice kitty kabin for him with snuggle diskie. And at least in the enclosure he can look around and get fresh air. Its only 6.6.4 but large enough to give him some perching spots and room to jump in.. I had hoped if he got exposed to my cats around him and they knew he was "safe" and he knew he was "safe" they would / could come to terms. And although he doesn't puff tail or show arousal of fear or aggression - and neither do mine - if I release him he will go bananas and try biting them all on their butts.

 

[obpilot]

Ah, brown spotted tabby. I can see that. I've never seen one quite with his under color of orangy. That's where the part Bengal came in. And yes, the probably has some of that. I hate owners of pure breeds who don't fix and let roam outside. And bet you that is where this little boy came from.

For certain, someone put a real tiger in his tank, LOL. He does like to fly up and down stairs, and tear around at speed and take off from the tops of chairs and leap straight up into the air to grab toys and feathers...

He's quite interactive and playful and demands attention. Very talky too. I feel badly he doesn't get on with the others. I don't think he is "mean" I think he is trying to get out and be dominant and aggressive so that HE won't be picked on.

One time he got out, he flew at my little Yum, pounced on her full claws out and dashed away. He didn't bite, but he had full on claws out. Thankfully they had been trimmed so she didn't get scratched. After the pounce, he dashed into the living room floor all crazy but not aggressive. I think he was playing!!!

The second time, he flew downstairs ahead of me out of his "room" (he got out by accident) and saw Yum and flew at her, she tried to get away, I heard growing and yeowl, and then I yelled "NO" and he froze, and she got away. I grabbed him, he was aroused and nipped me as I hauled him upstairs back to his room. He KNEW he wasn't supposed to bite her!! It turns out he got her (bit) in her tail (theres an abcess now alas).

So I don't trust him. He did that to each of my cats in turn. He particularly hates my Siamese / tabby mix Frodo who is a gentle boy and not really aggressive at all. (Blue eyes, with siamese colored tabby markings and white patches, a lovely looking kitty from a traditional style Siamese girl found in a feral colony!!) Frodo boy is terrified of him.

My little silver tabby girl (a total tiny adorable girl kitty) is also afraid of him. When he was intact he would chase her, but I think he didn't bite her,
just tried to mate her maybe?). She's getting a bit better about tolerating him being out in the deck enclosure and her being on the deck...

Anyway, thanks for the information. He is truely a beauty in motion (he slinks along like a jungle cat, LOL. And his back is so long that he has this funny "hump" sometimes that a regular cat's back doesn't have. He has flashes where he just looks so ... wildcat like. Then you look hard, and he looks like a regular cat again. Its subtle but it defnitely is there.

Can't imagine not looking for this boy desperately if he were mine, and as cherished and spoilt as he seems to be. (He knows kitty milk, he knows kitty treats and toys - including laser pointer, he is good at the kennels, cat shows and vet. He sleeps on your head or feet and only gentle mouthing and sucking of your hair!)





Sadly he isn't getting any better with exposure to my kitties while in his
"outdoor enclosure". When the weather turns, he can still be out in it, I have a nice kitty kabin for him with snuggle diskie. And at least in the enclosure he can look around and get fresh air. Its only 6.6.4 but large enough to give him some perching spots and room to jump in.. I had hoped if he got exposed to my cats around him and they knew he was "safe" and he knew he was "safe" they would / could come to terms. And although he doesn't puff tail or show arousal of fear or aggression - and neither do mine - if I release him he will go bananas and try biting them all on their butts.

 

[callista]

Wow, he sounds like he's got a heavy dose of the kitten crazies. Some cats stay crazy like that well into middle age; others settle down once they're out of the first couple of years. And of course there's the Bengal angle...

The more you can tire him out with play, the better!

 

[cyndersmom]

Looks like an ocelot mixed with something else. My 16 yr old brandy is an ocelot cross siamese and looks like this could be her sibling. hope that helps..

 

[missymotus]

Originally Posted by cyndersmom

Looks like an ocelot mixed with something else. My 16 yr old brandy is an ocelot cross siamese and looks like this could be her sibling. hope that helps..

Presuming you mean Ocicat, not Ocelot. Ocicats are relatively rare but I suppose it might be possible there's some Oci somewhere mixed in...the spotted tabby pattern is in many breeds and domestic cats too, spots don't automatically mean Bengal or Oci mix

As NG said, without papers he's a brown spotted tabby domestic.

 

[obpilot]

Hum. I had wondered if there was Siamese in him, because he talks so much. And is long and slinky in build - but not anorexically so like the current Siamese style - more like the Intermediate style Siamese (not trad and not modern). I'm thinking Bengal really and I wondered what a bengal crossed to Siamese might come out looking like?

I think he had a pure parent of some kind, mixed with a regular DSH. After all, my Frodo pi came from a pure Siamese mother, and so did his brother. His brother came out "pure chocolate point" while Frodo was patched tabby in the colors of a Siamese (white with sandy brown, chocolate and very dark brown) with lovely blue eyes. You never can tell how the genes will mix.

The feral wildness I see from the corner of my eye is what makes me think he has some hybrid breed in there somewhere. And of course, the hump on his back when sitting - it is quite a bit different from regular cat's. And then there's that lovely cougar like thick rope tail that is so delightful to look at - no skinny tail, or tapering tail, instead this tail that looks like a mountain cat's with ticking and stripes on it!!

Anyway, I do hope he learns to calm - I have to play every night with him for 30 minutes before bed. I close everyone else up in their rooms or let them out and close the pet door, then we roam around playing. Non stop till he tires. Sigh. That's why I need to get him a home of his own!!

 

[missymotus]

Originally Posted by obpilot

Anyway, I do hope he learns to calm - I have to play every night with him for 30 minutes before bed

Good luck with that

All my cats are Ocicats, the almost 5 year olds are just as active as the young kittens.
We do 3 play sessions a day here. Before work, after work and before bed, in between they race around amusing themselves. Never a dull moment that's for sure!

 

[nekochan]

Originally Posted by obpilot

The feral wildness I see from the corner of my eye is what makes me think he has some hybrid breed in there somewhere. And of course, the hump on his back when sitting - it is quite a bit different from regular cat's.

I've met some domestic cats that are pretty wild...and of course the ones that were born as ferals.
What do you mean by hump on his back?

 

[callista]

Check out the last photo in that second set--he's a very long cat with a slender build. That and the cat's flexible spine will naturally lead him to arch his back a little when he walks, and the short fur makes it more obvious.

I see people trying to figure out whether their unusual-looking cat has purebred ancestry, and it makes me think of the differences between dog breeds and cat breeds. Dogs have been bred to certain styles of body and behavior for ages--Great Dane to Chihuahua--you wouldn't even know they were the same animal if you didn't watch them and see the obvious doggyness. Cats, on the other hand, have been primarily selected for their natural, wild behavior--catching mice and looking pretty lounging in a sunbeam, which any cat can do whatever its pattern is.

A purebred dog has a pretty narrow selection of genes, as far as doggy genetics goes. You create a breed--say, a collie--by breeding out all the non-collie genes, so that when you got a proper modern collie, you couldn't, however you tried, get the collie's wolflike ancestor back.

Cats on the other hand are much, much closer to their small wildcat ancestors. They haven't had that huge selection pressure. Purebred cat breeds are usually much "younger" than purebred dog breeds. As a result, the cat gene pool is close to the wildcat gene pool. One generic mixed-breed cat looks very much like another, within a range of colors, body shapes, and personalities. And cats of no particular breed have always been the largest portion of the domestic cat population.

Not so with dogs. Because dogs have been bred for specific tasks, the largest part of the domestic dog population is made of purebred dogs and mixes of purebred dogs. The thing that gets closest to the "generic dog" is probably the Australian dingo or the members of the long-standing feral dog packs where those exist. Those dogs aren't near as common as "generic cats". So, when you adopt a mixed-breed dog, you can usually see that it's got purebred ancestry back one, two, three generations. You'll almost never get "generic dog", the way you would probably get "generic cat" if you picked a non-purebred cat at random.

Unlike mixed-breed dogs, non-purebred cats still have a lot of the same traits that they got from the wildcat. They've got in them all the genes that make up the Siamese and the Persian and the Bengal and the Abyssinian. Through random combinations, a kitten can be born that looks Bengal, but hasn't ever had a Bengal in his family tree. You can get a Siamese lookalike with a single pointed cat on the family tree a hundred years back. Unlike dogs, cats haven't been bred into little sub-species. Even the purebred cats are almost all Generic Cat, with a few special traits that are concentrated and exaggerated to give them their unique look and personality.

That's the interesting thing about cats, you see--as far as domestic animals go, they didn't need to be changed nearly as much to fit into human society. People keep small wildcats successfully as pets, and with much less adjustment than one would have to make to keep a wolf rather than a dog. A cat brings with it so much of the wild that you might as well have a tiny panther in your lap.

 

[jen]

Did you say you had him neutered? Because if not that could help his behavior towards your other cats... Also where are you located? In case you decide you cannot keep him I might know someone interested if I can resist him myself!!