Update On Lily!

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stacydc83

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Morning. So I called the vet, she said to go ahead and give her some miralax. So miralax she will get here shortly. I'll mix it it in with pumpkin since I get pumpkin down easily. The vet tech was alarmed by her lack of poop. She doesn't realize I've been dealing with this constipation without their help for a long time, and its worse now because of her UTI. On the bright side, shes definitely perkier this morning, no signs of blood drips anywhere. And I realized she does listen and know she has to do something, everyone knows she will not drink water willingly from a bowl. I put a bowl in front of her, stuck my finger in the water and rubbed some water on her front teeth, and there she went, and lapped up a decent amount of water. She's gonna get better, I know it. This is just stressing me out so much worrying about her :(
 

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How do I clean it and get the smell of her once I'm allowed to get closer again, when its not so sensitive
maybe a pet antiseptic spray might help? It may not clean the area totally without wiping but maybe getting some spray there help with UTI if not cleaning there was the cause. Or with the smell.
 
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stacydc83

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Morning! I just got up a few minutes ago. Woke up to a t-shirt in the middle of the kitchen, so that means Lily did her hunting, yaye! Its the small things that let me know she'll be ok. AND! WE! HAVE! POOP!!! I heard her digging more a few minutes ago so I listened very carefully, and heard her digging more vigorously, and when she was done i went in there, and poop! YES!! this makes me so relieved!
We gotta give her her antibiotic here shortly. It's still pretty danged hard to get that much medication in her, last night we didn't get the entire syringe down her, she fights so hard, I don't know why. The last time she had antibiotics, when she & Zoe had that diarrhea bit, she took it so easily, now its still a fight, every.single.time. And we're not even half way through the time we gotta give it to her.
Oh, and there weren't many drops of pee in there this morning either, I found two or three decent sized pee balls.
 
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Hello! Thought I'd update again. Still seeing some poop, I saw some yesterday so she's not so blocked up anymore. Only 6 days left of the antibiotics, I'm pretty sure they are working. Pretty sure she's peeing normal again, thank goodness. Still fights us really hard to get the antibiotic down. I sure hope she gets enough, because its SO Hard to get that 2 ML's down her. Only thing that concerns me; she sleeps sooo much here lately, I'm wondering if its a side affect of the antibiotic? I mean, I know she's a lazy cat, but man does she sleep hard for the last week. Mom told me today she spent most of the day under the porch, (its nice and cool under there), and when I left today she was sleeping soundly for several hours before I left. But when I came home she was awake and was getting her "shower" from Mom, but was interrupted when she saw me come in, and wanted to say Hi. <3 Still eating and drinking pretty good though, and not as snarly at Zoe as she was.
I tried cleaning her butt yesterday but didn't get really far, I put waterless cat shampoo on her but, she ran off with it on, and I followed her with a bucket of warm water and wiped off the cat shampoo. I think tomorrow if Mom is willing,when I come home from work, we're going to hold her still, try to cut off as much hair as possible, cut out the poo, and then repeat the shampoo, and wiping down off the butt. I know she's going to hate this SO much I just wish she would realize this was all for her own good.
 
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stacydc83

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Hii. Well I think things are looking up. Does this look a content pain free kitty to you?
20200727_115618.jpg

She was very stubborn this morning with her medicine, needless to say we did NOT get the full dose in this morning she pushed it out her mouth and most of it went on the floor. Hopefully tonight will go in smoother. We're so close to being done with antibiotics. So after that happened, I mixed some pumpkin and the cranberry powder for pets together and gave her a few finger fulls of that. My plan for after were done with the antibiotic, is to give her the nutri-vet uri-ease for cats for about a week, then switch back to the cat lax, and sometimes pumpkin.
She's doing pretty good with poop! There was some in there this morning, and also Saturday night.
I finally got her to walk a little bit today too yaye! She was hanging out on the front porch, so I got her to walk around to the back porch. She even "hunted" a grass hopper.
She's still sleeping a lot, but im thinking the antibiotics could very well be making her more sleepy than usual.
 
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stacydc83

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Hi! I didn't realize its been so long since I've updated on Lily & Zoe! I've still been active on here, reading posts and keeping up, but not updating on my girls! So, we're doing good. Nothing new, or exciting, or changing. Lily is still struggling with constipation, and can't get them to eat better to save my life, she;s still stubborn and I'm still trying to get her to be more active with not much luck. I've been very iffy about supplements with her, ever since she had that horrible UTI back in July. I almost wonder if giving her the catlax reguarly may have triggered it, so I haven't given her any of that. This morning I wasn't happy with her poop situation, 2 days ago she had a decent one, but this morning she had a few balls, so I gave her some pumpkin, mixed with the cranberry powder I'd bought when she had the UTI. I figure it can't hurt, maybe I'll start giving it fairly more regularly just not every single day like I had been for awhile. I add the cranberry for extra health measures, once again, can't hurt right? Oh, I'm almost out of her glucosamine treats. :( She's been getting GNC cat hip & joint, but I'm pretty sure they've been discontinued. Petsmart stopped selling GNC a while back, and right now their not available on Chewy. I saw some other glucosamine treats at petsmart, but who knows if she would eat them. I'm going to email Chewy and see if they plan on getting them back, or if I need to start looking for something different.
I took a picture of them, just so I could give a picture update, they're getting along in the same room so hey thats something, lol! They are ok with being close if they are cleaning themselves.
20200919_145352.jpg

And my time hop showed me an adorable picture from four years ago, a picture of Lily as a baby, and then Zoe as a baby, 8 and 4 years ago
FB_IMG_1600541057732.jpg
 
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stacydc83

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BIG UPDATE!
Hi! So, we went to to vet this morning, a new vet, one MUCH closer to home. We went because she was showing signs of a UTI again. She does have a UTI, but she also has Stones :( And my little Lily was so stubborn, she would rather pee on herself, than give them a a sample while she was there. She was there for several hours today.
They can't tell what kind of stones, but definitely stones. They did ex-rays, and instead of prescribing me an 180 antibiotic (like last time) they gave her the shot antibiotics. Hopefully that'll start working soon because she's obviously hurting
They emailed me an estimate of a surgery they can do, to remove the stones, you know, only $1800. I don't have that kind of money, but I'll try my best to come up with it, if it will permanently fix the problem and make her feel better. Just $1800, yowzer. They also said diet "could" help, to help dissolve the stones, but its a very strict diet, and Lily would most likely not follow it. Plus its no guarantee.
I did like her new vet though, she actually LISTENED. I brought up her constipation issues and hair ball issues. She said miralax is fine to give, and I can try metamucil (fiber) mixed with her food. And she definitely ok's pumpkin, she said that's good for her, for fiber and moving hairballs along. And that there are two different routes I can take, either a very low fiber diet, or a very high fiber diet. I opt for the high fiber, because she has so much hair reguarly in her.
I'm just so overwhelmed with everything. What should she be eating, how to get her drinking more, and how to come up with the money for this surgery. I'll talk to the vet more tomorrow, and update more then.
 

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WMM201

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This is a great list of resources. My vet office has little signs for CareCredit, so patients can have their care financed. Does Lily's vet have that option? I wonder if you can talk to their business manager to create a payment plan, maybe with a larger first payment/deposit, so you have more time to pay off the entire balance of the surgery. Poor Lily and her stones :(
 

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You know obesity is a big factor for both kidney stones and UTI. If you haven't already the next time you are at the vet maybe you two can re-evaluate her calorie intake too.

I'm sorry you are both going through this. I hope she feels better soon. 🍀
 

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Let us know what else you find out from the vet. When was her last urinalysis - before this most recent vet visit? If it wasn't that long ago, I would be surprised that there has been such a huge accumulation of stones over a short period of time to warrant surgery. The fact that the vet suggested urinary care food as a possible way to dissolve the stones would tell me the vet suspects they are struvite, not oxalate. Oxalate stones will not dissolve with specialized foods and would require surgery (Feeby had this done about 11 years ago for oxalate stones).

It is really imperative that a urinalysis/urine culture be done, just so you know what type of stones they truly are and if the antibiotic is the correct one to resolve a UTI (not all antibiotics work on all infections). If at all possible, there are kits you can buy in order to try to collect sterile urine on your own. It involves a specific type of non-absorbent litter, a clean litter box, and a sterile syringe to draw the urine out of the litter. The urine collected in the syringe can then be taken to the vet for proper testing. Otherwise, another vet stay may be in order to gather the urine. Feeby had to stay one time for hours in order for the vet to attempt to collect urine, she didn't end up 'cooperating' with them until I came to pick her up and take her home. The vet took one more try, by gently squeezing her bladder, to get urine before we left - and, it worked!!

There are multiple urinary care foods on the market, so I can't imagine why she would have to be restricted to just one - which might make it easier to try to treat the stones with food. I don't recall if somewhere in this thread if trying a water fountain to get her to drink more water was already suggested. There are also fountains that mimic water dripping from a faucet that work better for some cats than the standard fountain. Adding water to canned food is also something worth trying.
 
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stacydc83

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Hi again. Thank you for the responses. My mind is spinning, I'm just so confused on what to do. I talked to the vet. I'm going to give some food a try tomorrow, Hills Urinary care. Its insanely expensive, but what isn't anymore? Her take, is get Lily on a "urinary food she will eat" and give that for a few weeks, and then proceed with the surgery. I don't understand why they are so set on surgery, when they don't know what KIND of stone. At her last visit back in July, they couldn't get a urine sample either. And couldn't yesterday at the new vet. So why is the surgery the definite response to this if no one really knows what kind of stone she has? And even after surgery, she has to stay on this type of food. This is Lily we are talking about, she is so picky to eat ANYTHING, what makes you think she will magically accept this dry food, and possibly wet food? And what about her suppplements? does that mess with the food? Pumpkin is important, and so is the miralax. and hairball treats. Stuff she needs to stay regular. The vet called me at 730, I was very impressed that she called after hours, and stayed on the phone with me for at least 20 minutes, so I know she cares, and wants what is best for Lily. She also said its okay for Zoe to eat it too, since they both share the same dry food bowl.
All I know is I have a girl thats hurting, and is looking at me for help. I feel so helpless not knowing what I can do to make her feel better. How long does the antibiotic shot take to start to clear up the current infection? I know it took a few days with the oral antibiotic, I thought the shot antibiotic would work faster, but maybe not. I just want her to feel better, and to have a better quality of life, and for us to figure all this out.
Oh, and to answer about the care credit, unfortunately, that is not an option. I had it a few years ago, paid it down, then became jobless, then two years ago when my car was broken into, that was stolen, and I was sent to collections. So this will be an out of pocket thing. I just have to figure out how to get the 1800. :( My head hurts. I've barely been able to eat today, then felt a little calmer, but then after talking to her again, stress is back up. She's definitely still hurting, she's sleeping quite a bit, but I remember last time the antibiotics made her super sleepy. Once she;s a little better, I want to give her some miralax because I know the infection has made it harder to poop, so I know she's getting good and blocked up. And really want to clean her up too, the bloody smelly mess is back there again, but I don't dare try touching her anywhere right now.
 

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This is Lily we are talking about, she is so picky to eat ANYTHING, what makes you think she will magically accept this dry food, and possibly wet food? And what about her suppplements? does that mess with the food? Pumpkin is important, and so is the miralax. and hairball treats. Stuff she needs to stay regular.
Write down everything so you have a list to ask when you talk to the vet 💗
If you have to handfeed her, would that work?

And really want to clean her up too, the bloody smelly mess is back there again
Give it a try, she might let you.
 
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I really, really think that another vet opinion is necessary here (from an entirely different practice, to avoid colleague bias). Or, you need to pin this vet down into explaining to you exactly why surgery seems to be the only option. Maybe if you make her explain it to you in more detail, you will at least see some logic to what she is saying. Did this vet try the bladder 'squeeze' method to extract any urine that might have been in Lily's bladder? Or, did she even suggest using a needle to aspirate some urine from her bladder? I know it doesn't sound pleasant, but her urine really needs to be analyzed and cultured.

It is possible, even with struvite stones, that there are just too many or they have melded together into larger stones, that dissolving all of them with urinary care foods just isn't an option. That is another question to discuss with the vet.

Antibiotics by injection are usually expected to last in a cat's system for about two weeks; so, just as a general rule of thumb, it could take half that time for you to notice an improvement in Lily. As stated before, without a urine culture to know which antibiotics would be the most effective for Lily's type of infection, the antibiotics may not entirely eradicate the infection. That being the case, she may need more antibiotics after this injection wears off. Another question to ask the vet... Btw, a urinalysis is generally performed after the antibiotics are completed, to ensure the infection is gone.

Also, because Lily's body obviously produces stones, the urinary care food after surgery is used to help prevent future stones from developing, as well as aiding in dissolving any that might begin to develop if they are struvite. Feeby was on urinary care food for 10 years after her surgery for oxalate stones to help prevent the development of new ones. She would still be on that food today, if she hadn't decided to reject it. She has been stone free (knock on wood) since her surgery back when she was about 5 yo.

There are several possible food options for urinary care - two of which are prescription: Hills and Royal Canin. Both come in dry and canned. There is also two non-Rx foods that I am aware of: Purina One Urinary Tract Care and Wysong Uretic, also both dry and canned. You could at least discuss these with your vet and if, for some reason, she opposes them, ask her to explain why. Better yet, compare the ingredients/PH data in all of them to see for yourself how close they are. I am pretty sure that eating any of these foods will NOT preclude you from giving Lily her supplements.

Admittedly, most of the years Feeby was on urinary care food, it was the dry version - I only added the canned versions a few years back. But, now, I am of the mindset that cats with known urinary tract issues are better off with canned/wet foods. And, tbh, if you could get Lily to eat mostly canned and get her to drink more water, urinary care food may really not be all that essential. However, at this stage of the game with Lily, routine urinalyses going forward are an absolute 'must' to keep an eye on additional stone formation/bladder health.

It's great that the vet is so willing to call and talk to you and to listen, but you need to take advantage of that by asking questions - multiple times if need be, so you don't wonder why she says the things she says. Sorry this is so long, but I hope you find it helpful.
 
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