The fine line between pet ownership, rescue, and hoarding...

[cococat]

I love animals and am deeply committed to them for life having the best care possible (even during my life ups and downs such as moving, lay off's, health issues, etc.) and knowing that about myself I have strict personal limits. These are our personal household limits. Others are different because not everyone is the same.

I can and have worked with rescues and breed specific rescues, but I do not foster. 1 cat is my household limit. 3 active smart working breed dogs (which I train and work with) is a limit, 2 is just fine too. And the reptiles also have a limit and they take up a lot of space, I couldn't imagine making them live in small spaces and not giving them a high quality of care for their species. I like birds and might consider one big bird if I lived in a tropical place where it had a nice outside enclosure available year round *maybe*. If I am living in a tropical place I probably wouldn't want the worry that a bird brings, they can be somewhat tricky.
I have always lived on acreage and love horses, but don't want the responsibility horses would bring. I am lucky to live next door to many horses and they are friendly, so that is pretty great.

Our household is not at the max limit at this time and that is fine. I also have a minimum. I know this is a cat board and I do love my kitty so much but it is doubtful I could ever live without 2 dogs for a long period of time. I completely adore working with and sharing my life with dogs.

 

[hissy]

Sorry, I have to respectfully disagree with this statement

Hoarders are people who do not care about the animals and never have enough.

Having been involved in several seizures, I can attest that some hoarders do indeed love their animals, but they get in over their head and don't know the boundaries (spaying and neutering being one and vaccinating another) so then their group gets unhealthy and starts reproducing, inbreeding etc and the whole thing goes to hell in a handbasket. They will scream they love their babies- and in their heads will firmly believe they are giving them the best life "Otherwise they would be dead." I have heard that statement so many times.

 

[cococat]

Originally Posted by hissy

I can attest that some hoarders do indeed love their animals

Yes their idea of love is different than other animals lovers ideas of what that really means.

 

[elayman]

Originally Posted by cococat

Yes their idea of love is different than other animals lovers ideas of what that really means.

Definitely a twisted love that obsesses into abuse via the owners need for control, lack of self-worth, a fear of loss/death, an abusive childhood and lots of other underlying issues.

But I agree hoarders aren't necessarily filled with rage or total lack of compassion -- unlike intentional animal abusers.

 

[strange_wings]

Originally Posted by LDG

Hate to be an anal-yst about this, but I am an analyst by trade and happen to be rather anal about things.

One of those things is semantics, and a "hoarder" is not just someone who cannot properly care for their animals. That is someone in over their heads. Hoarding is a disease with a definition, it is not something subjective.

See, this is why I keep saying there is no fine line between hoarding and non hoarding. I don't know how anyone could think there is?

And I agree with hissy. It's not that they don't care it just that they don't realize the harm they cause. As I said earlier, they look around and don't see things the same way most other people do.

 

[ldg]

Originally Posted by hissy

Sorry, I have to respectfully disagree with this statement

Hoarders are people who do not care about the animals and never have enough.

Having been involved in several seizures, I can attest that some hoarders do indeed love their animals, but they get in over their head and don't know the boundaries (spaying and neutering being one and vaccinating another) so then their group gets unhealthy and starts reproducing, inbreeding etc and the whole thing goes to hell in a handbasket. They will scream they love their babies- and in their heads will firmly believe they are giving them the best life "Otherwise they would be dead." I have heard that statement so many times.

You're right. I misspoke. But "hoarding" is definitely more than just getting in over your head with the animals. That is my point. Here is the definition by HARC:

Originally Posted by The Hoarding of Animals Research Consortium

What is the difference between hoarding and sheltering or rescuing?
Animal hoarding is a complex behavior that results from a variety of psychological and behavioral deficits that may limit a person's ability to care for themselves or others. Although hoarding may start out as a seemingly benevolent mission to save animals, eventually the needs of the animals become lost to the person's needs for control. The resulting compulsive caregiving is pursued to fullfill unmet human needs, while the real needs of the animals are ignored or disregarded. Sometimes hoarders act as individuals, and other times they masquerade as animal rescue activities. They should never be confused for these legitimate and worthwhile efforts.

Any legitimate shelter, rescue or sanctuary puts the needs of the animals first, recognizes when capacity to provide care is exceeded, and takes the required steps (stopping intake, increasing adoption, increasing staff or resources) in order to provide proper care. Two model sanctuaries show what is required to put the needs of animals first in a caregiving setting [Click here for Best Friends Sanctuary] and [Click here for Farm Sanctuary]. Both organizations encourage visitors, volunteers, and transparency. The diagram at the right illustrates the difference between competent caregiving and substandard care.

Here is the FAQ link: http://www.tufts.edu/vet/hoarding/abthoard.htm#A1

They provide a standard of care table. Here is the link to that: http://www.tufts.edu/vet/hoarding/pi...vefreedoms.jpg

From the HARC FAQs website: "This diagram explains our current thinking about how animal hoarding arises and its relationship with trauma and attachment" Here is a link to that image http://www.tufts.edu/vet/hoarding/picts/wrkngmodel.jpg

 

[ldg]

I'd like to add that I believe true animal hoarders are people who begin with good intentions. But they have a psychological disorder that does not enable to them to "care" in a traditional sense of the word. It is a dysfunctional love, a dysfunctional care, and one that "needs" more animals above and beyond any rational capacity for the welfare of the animals.

Rescuers who get in over their heads, IMO, are in a completely different category.

 

[hissy]

I know of a lady who has over twenty ferals. She has them crammed into a small enclosure behind her home and only has two litter boxes for them. I have reported her several times, but she is feeding them- she is giving them limited vet care and as I was told "With all the strays and ferals in the area, I am not going to waste my time with twenty that are being cared for."

Here they simply do not care about the cats. Until people can decide that cats have actual worth and stop giving away "free" kittens or talking about getting rid of them- they will always be looked at as cast-offs in the shadows and not as animals of value.

 

[white cat lover]

I have 10 cats living in my house, and 8 farm/outdoor cats. All are S/N & receive regular vet care. (I realize many don't like outdoor cats. Yes mine have accidents & get injured once in awhile, but no one's been hit by a car since they've been fixed, they get medical treatment, and I think the fact that two of them are 16 & 18 years old respectively goes to show you can have well care for outdoor cats live long lives.)

No matter how much I loved a couple of shelter kitties, they ended up euthanized - no matter how much I wanted to bring them home to literally save their lives, I'm at my limit - indoors & outdoors.

Logic tells me if I had to do it all over again, I wouldn't have 10 indoor cats. But what was I going to do - let Tabitha die outdoors, unable to survive any longer? Let Lola be euthanized at the shelter, only because she has seizures? Let Gumby be euthanized at the shelter, because she was a 6 week old black/feral kitten?

I spend hundreds every month in food & litter, and thousands every year in vet bills. As my population ages, dentals are needed for more & more of them. Every penny I can spare goes into savings for their future vet bills. I can't afford to move because I have to care for them. I made a choice, right or wrong - and I'll still with it until they go over the Rainbow Bridge.

 

[white cat lover]

Originally Posted by hissy

I know of a lady who has over twenty ferals. She has them crammed into a small enclosure behind her home and only has two litter boxes for them.

And here I felt guilty for keeping Fafeena & Squishy in their enclosure (6'w x 12'l) attached to the shed (12' x 12') most of the time, with several hours outdoor time every day. So guilty I moved them to be in the garage this summer, with free outdoor access during the day, so long as there weren't many vehicles coming/going. Those poor ferals.

 

[furryfriends50]

Well, I take care of 20-30 barn cats every day (the number depends on how many show up that night!). The latest four were dumped at the farm and I would like to get them adopted out once kitten season is over at the shelter I work at. All but one of them loves it here...she would be much better off being an only cat. All of them at our farm are raw fed which takes care of most any health problem before it occurs

My family has two house cats, Mikey and kitten who we still can't figure out a name for. Mikey is Mr. Faking Illnesses....he was just in at the vet because we were sure he had somehow gotten an abcess on his rear leg and they couldn't find anything. He's done this before

The two of them are also raw fed.

There are 9 cats/kittens at the dairy farm I work at as well. Jezebel is one of them whom I finally caught to get her spayed. I have her six 5 week old kittens at our house (they aren't counted in the 'total' above) until they are old enough to get fixed and hopefully adopted out. Everyone there eats about 99% wet food.

All of the cats/kittens are fixed...unless they aren't old enough to have been yet! Trust me, I know my limits. I wish I didn't have to be taking care of the 5 week old kittens on top of everything else but I had finally managed to trap there mom and they needed somewhere to go for a few weeks!

 

[otto]

Originally Posted by white cat lover

I have 10 cats living in my house, and 8 farm/outdoor cats. All are S/N & receive regular vet care. (I realize many don't like outdoor cats. Yes mine have accidents & get injured once in awhile, but no one's been hit by a car since they've been fixed, they get medical treatment, and I think the fact that two of them are 16 & 18 years old respectively goes to show you can have well care for outdoor cats live long lives.)

No matter how much I loved a couple of shelter kitties, they ended up euthanized - no matter how much I wanted to bring them home to literally save their lives, I'm at my limit - indoors & outdoors.

Logic tells me if I had to do it all over again, I wouldn't have 10 indoor cats. But what was I going to do - let Tabitha die outdoors, unable to survive any longer? Let Lola be euthanized at the shelter, only because she has seizures? Let Gumby be euthanized at the shelter, because she was a 6 week old black/feral kitten?

I spend hundreds every month in food & litter, and thousands every year in vet bills. As my population ages, dentals are needed for more & more of them. Every penny I can spare goes into savings for their future vet bills. I can't afford to move because I have to care for them. I made a choice, right or wrong - and I'll still with it until they go over the Rainbow Bridge.

I love this post.

 

[trimph1]

I agree with the above post quote. We have 2 furry friends who live indoors with us--both were abandoned at our farm by so-called human beings in bags of one sort or another. Both needed care at the start because of various issues stemming from animal abuse

Outside, in/at/outside of our driveshed, we have at least 20 ferals living out there--depending on whether they show up at night when I do headcounts. We have had, so far, seen a few of these furry fellows get picked up by certain people who would take them in and actually would look after them really well. But. I've also had one sort of odd duck show up who had admitted to me she had at least 50 of them in her mobile trailer home!

There was no way I could let any one of those fellows be with her---I did phone up our animal care and control people here who did eventually find good homes for them ---I just worry that no one--again--looks after the people who have these issues

All these cats are looked after. I even spend time with them by playing with them and by just plain being there---I learn so much from them

 

[cococat]

Most people don't have this issue and either don't have pets or take care of their pets. However, there is a small population that does have hoarding tendencies I think. I say its a fine line because most of the people didn't just one day magically have all these animals/lacking care, it was a gradual process, some shorter than others, some longer. It would be good if the hoarding could be controlled/managed/helped before it got to the point it caused trouble for all parties involved.

 

[bellaandme]

The most I ever had has been five at one time. As much as I love cats and would like them in every corner of my apartment..I just can't. If I can't afford to take care of them then it's not fair to the cat/cats.
To me, it's even more than the cost of food, litter, toys and vet bills. It's TIME and ATTENTION that they need. If I can't hold and love and kissy-face each one of the cats every day then I think I'm neglecting them. If you can afford to care for and love on a slew of kitties then I'm all for it!!!

 

[Primula]

Originally Posted by white cat lover

I can't afford to move because I have to care for them. I made a choice, right or wrong - and I'll still with it until they go over the Rainbow Bridge.

We are in the same situation as you (and others who have posted). We literally cannot spend a day away from our house because of our cats. And we could never sell because of the outdoor cats. None of our cats is used to other people. I don't know whether they would even let anyone else feed them (I suppose they would). So we are tied down because of the cats, but what can you do? You cannot upsticks and leave them to their fate.

 

[abbycats]

We Have 6 wonderful little cats. We had 8 and one passed away at 18 years old, and we lost another one to old age this year. We took on an outside stray for 5 years. We had him fixed and vetted. He was an outdoor cat who adopted us on his conditions. He didn't want to be a part of our household so he slept outside and thats theway he wanted it. When we moved to Omaha he went outside and never came home. It broke my heart I search the humane societies website for him to this day. I have 2 elderly cats that are starting to show signs of kidney disease. Our limit is at 6 but if one needed me I wouldn't turn my back on it.I have a very active bengal cat that makes up for about four cats. As long as you have time and dedication to the care for your animals I don't consider that a hoarder.My mother called me a hoarder because of my 6 cats. She is only using assumptions because she has never come to visit me. Our cats are well taken care of and we love them very much. Yes I do think about rescueing a kitten from the shelter and it makes it hard for me because I have been looking at the cats at the shelter in case BW ever shows up there.