should I euthanize healthy kittens in a litter with panleukopenia?

[Meowmee]

Nilo's story is, indeed, incredible! I read through the link you posted. She worked unbelievably hard to save those kittens!!! But based on her updates, those kittens also got a ton of veterinary care: antibiotics, blood tests, many many medications and vitamins. The veterinary care she got them would have costs thousands of dollars here, which was out of the question for the rescue group I was working with. So that leaves me still wondering if there's anyone who has seen panleuk kittens survive without extensive veterinary care. From what I've read, it seems impossible.

Yes she did an amazing job, kudos to her.
Yes, it would need care. I’m not really familiar with it. I’ve tried googling, but I can’t get an idea of how many kittens survive if they are given care vs not. I think it’s a low number even with care, but some do survive with care, and then also what I pointed out about rabies is probably true for panleukopenia also.

There could be kittens who get it who don’t get very ill and who recover because their immune system fights the virus off. I don’t think testing is usually done on kittens who survive viruses who don’t become very ill. So, it might be hard to know, most outdoor cats are usually just vaccinated for that- some when they are kittens the first time and second time. I guess it could be an issue in catteries with high numbers of cats too. But I guess there has to be some sort of exposure from somewhere in the first place. I would have to read more about it.

It seems like from what you and others said the policy here if you’re not going to give care is to euthanize because they don’t wanna spend the money to give them care since a high percentage die anyway, which is sad.

I was wondering after reading the merck manual information how old the kittens were when they came to your house? It says kittens who become infected before they can be vaccinated which is younger than 4 weeks don’t usually survive, but they also will have some immunity from the mother, whether from vaccination or if the mother was infected and survived, but it says there is no way to know how long maternal immunity will last.

The highest chance of survival for unvaccinated cats or kittens seems to be If treatment is started within 48 hrs. But again, no one can say for sure.

 

[KittyCat_chitchat]

Just in case it helps even just one kitten survive, Kitten Lady has a video about panleukopenia here.

 

[Meowmee]

Just in case it helps even just one kitten survive, Kitten Lady has a video about panleukopenia here.

Great video… it seems like it can be treated at home under dvm supervision with sub q fluids, antibiotic and the other things kittenlady mentions. Plus there are comments from others who saved their kittens also with home treatments.

 

[Meowmee]

Nilo's story is, indeed, incredible! I read through the link you posted. She worked unbelievably hard to save those kittens!!! But based on her updates, those kittens also got a ton of veterinary care: antibiotics, blood tests, many many medications and vitamins. The veterinary care she got them would have costs thousands of dollars here, which was out of the question for the rescue group I was working with. So that leaves me still wondering if there's anyone who has seen panleuk kittens survive without extensive veterinary care. From what I've read, it seems impossible.

Here are more videos about treating at home less expensively, Miss K says they saved an entire litter with her method.


Another 7 kittens who survived… but some got iv fluid at dvm. Kitten lady said she gives sub q fluids which is a lot less expensive. Miss K it seems, just gave lots of fluid pedialite, and fluid foods I think.

 

[Kwik]

This definitely was not a question of disability, simply a question of whether exposure means that 100% of them will die without treatment, or only 98% (or some other number less than 100%). The many vets I talked to seem to think it's close to 100% and pretty universally believe kittens should be euthanized. I was wondering if anyone here had seen kittens recover from it without expensive veterinary care.

Years ago a friend of mine was in very much the same situation you are in and 3Vets suggested euthanasia of the litter of 4,2little kittens dies and the other 2 seemed to not show any symptoms so those 2 were brought 2 a 4th Vet who did a snap test which they both tested positive,to confirm he repeated blood & fecal testing- one was positive and one was not,my friend kept the positive kitten who underwent treatment,survived the parvoviral infection and did well .....:the " healthy " kitten never got sick and was adopted by someone

Only one out of 4 Vets said not to euthanize at least until they show symptoms as he told her he had seen kittens pull through with treatment and he started treatment on her kitten because she tested positive

I had a parvo puppy who survived without treatment-I was a kid and my parents view at the time was if he is meant to survive he will- I guess he was?I took him home from death row in my jacket ,I used to help out at the City pound

I believe the statistics show 80% fatality rate without treatment and between 68% and the same with......my Vet,the one that suggested the 2kittens be tested and retested for confirmation always says 50/50 despite what statistics are..... that's when I first met him,through my friend 25yrs ago

 

[IzzysfureverMom]

But wait, did those kittens have panleukopenia? That is my question: without hospitalization, do kittens with panleukopenia ever survive?

Yes. The mother and kittens had panleukopenia . This was vet verified. In this case they were not hospitalized and did receive SubQ for a time in their foster home. I should say one of the kittens back legs did not work well at first, but they did a lot of exercising of them. Then he could stand, then walk, and eventually run. All the exercise was done at the foster home. They definitely did not have to most severe CH but had some disabilities.All of them ate from elevated bowls, some needed adaptations for the litter box or getting up to a bed. The question I think always comes back to quality of life. It is about the cat. Can they have quality of life? With or without adaptations? With these decisions I always think am I doing this for me or them?

 

[dorianscats]

@ Meowmee The videos are great! I wish I'd found them earlier in this whole process. Even the video with the woman who saved 7 kittens on her own at home got antibiotics and antiemetics from a vet, and I don't know if the foster group I was working with would have paid for that. But that would be a LOT plus subQ fluids or syringe feeding would be WAY cheaper than hospitalization, which is the route most people go and was out of the question budget-wise. I've bookmarked them in case I find myself in this sad situation again!

 

[Meowmee]

@ Meowmee The videos are great! I wish I'd found them earlier in this whole process. Even the video with the woman who saved 7 kittens on her own at home got antibiotics and antiemetics from a vet, and I don't know if the foster group I was working with would have paid for that. But that would be a LOT plus subQ fluids or syringe feeding would be WAY cheaper than hospitalization, which is the route most people go and was out of the question budget-wise. I've bookmarked them in case I find myself in this sad situation again!

Yes it was amazing to me. Kittens can survive even from this deadly virus if they are cared for at home and it would be a lot cheaper and, as Miss K pointed out easier on them than being hospitalized.
I liked her tip about the sterilization too to put everything in the sunlight for 24 hours. Of course you would have to be careful that it didn’t rain. I wonder if there’s some sort of light treatment that you can do inside that would do the same thing.

I don’t know what people used to do years ago, but I do remember the general feeling at that time. Probably would’ve been to try and care for them at home as best you could if you couldn’t afford it and just see what happened. Of course, if they’re suffering a lot and going to die then you would want to euthanize.

 

[Meowmee]

@ Meowmee The videos are great! I wish I'd found them earlier in this whole process. Even the video with the woman who saved 7 kittens on her own at home got antibiotics and antiemetics from a vet, and I don't know if the foster group I was working with would have paid for that. But that would be a LOT plus subQ fluids or syringe feeding would be WAY cheaper than hospitalization, which is the route most people go and was out of the question budget-wise. I've bookmarked them in case I find myself in this sad situation again!

Also, I forgot to mention this, but some people don’t know about this. If a Dvm RX antibiotics or any other such drug, they can give you the prescription. You can go to a regular pharmacy and fill it there and use a GoodRx coupon and save a huge amount of money. I also did fluids when my cats had kidney disease and saved a lot of money by buying it in bulk with good rx at a pharmacy, but you could also buy a smaller amount and save them, for small kittens you wouldn’t need a lot of fluid. I think I also got the lines and the needles that way, but I can’t remember now I may have gotten them at the DVM.

I will give you an example. I was able to get enough clindamycin pills, some liquid clindamycin. And two huge bottles of Zofran to treat all three of my cats for toxoplasmosis infection for four weeks. I got all of that for around $100 with a savings of over $2000!

that was versus seven days of clindamycin pills for one cat and four cerenia pills from an ER hospital for $63!!!

Recently, I got more clindamycin pills because I wasn’t sure if I had enough to give Xena another four weeks.

I got enough to treat all of them again for $16.95 this time because I signed up for the GoodRx gold which gives even more discount on many medssince I may use that for myself to have an online doctor appointment if I can’t get to the doctor.
Anyway, for little kittens, you probably wouldn’t be able to give them a capsule so I assume you would be giving them a liquid or maybe Dvm would give you shots.

I don’t know exactly what those ladies in the videos were doing, I think they both said anti emetic and antibiotic shots maybe.

Another thing you can try is looking on sites where people are giving away medical things they don’t use anymore because some people will give away fluids and things like that they were using for their cat. Usually though they will donate them to a shelter. So you could try shelters too and see if they have any left over. Obviously with fluids you should only use an unopened bag because of possible transmission of infectious diseases.

 

[Kwik]

Also, I forgot to mention this, but some people don’t know about this. If a Dvm RX antibiotics or any other such drug, they can give you the prescription. You can go to a regular pharmacy and fill it there and use a GoodRx coupon and save a huge amount of money. I also did fluids when my cats had kidney disease and saved a lot of money by buying it in bulk with good rx at a pharmacy, but you could also buy a smaller amount and save them, for small kittens you wouldn’t need a lot of fluid. I think I also got the lines and the needles that way, but I can’t remember now I may have gotten them at the DVM.

I will give you an example. I was able to get enough clindamycin pills, some liquid clindamycin. And two huge bottles of Zofran to treat all three of my cats for toxoplasmosis infection for four weeks. I got all of that for around $100 with a savings of over $2000!

that was versus seven days of clindamycin pills for one cat and four cerenia pills from an ER hospital for $63!!!

Recently, I got more clindamycin pills because I wasn’t sure if I had enough to give Xena another four weeks.

I got enough to treat all of them again for $16.95 this time because I signed up for the GoodRx gold which gives even more discount on many medssince I may use that for myself to have an online doctor appointment if I can’t get to the doctor.
Anyway, for little kittens, you probably wouldn’t be able to give them a capsule so I assume you would be giving them a liquid or maybe Dvm would give you shots.

I don’t know exactly what those ladies in the videos were doing, I think they both said anti emetic and antibiotic shots maybe.

Another thing you can try is looking on sites where people are giving away medical things they don’t use anymore because some people will give away fluids and things like that they were using for their cat. Usually though they will donate them to a shelter. So you could try shelters too and see if they have any left over. Obviously with fluids you should only use an unopened bag because of possible transmission of infectious diseases.

Believe it or not my Vet told me a good deal on syringes (1000 sterile individually sealed )in all sizes on Walmart online back when my cat needed daily insulin and while I was looking - the odd thing was I found they also sell needles! Go figure?

 

[di and bob]

We had distemper run through our feral colony years ago, most of the kittens died, but one mother and two of her kittens survived. They are the 3 cats I have now and they also have leukemia. They got no special care. The vet came in and did vaccinate many kittens, but these three were the neighbor's cats at the time and missed out. I didn't see them for about a month, so they were sick, and they looked terrible when they finally showed up. But they survived! The cats that survived in my group were mainly the older ones. But these three somehow got through it. So yes cats CAN survive, but rarely. But it does happen! I myself would not euthanize, but I would if they are obviously suffering. as long as you could give them water with a syringe a drop at a time, and maybe some high calorie supplement you can buy at any pet store usually in a tube, you could thin it down with water, they may survive. It is sickening to see them want to drink but can't.......

 

[Kwik]

We had distemper run through our feral colony years ago, most of the kittens died, but one mother and two of her kittens survived. They are the 3 cats I have now and they also have leukemia. They got no special care. The vet came in and did vaccinate many kittens, but these three were the neighbor's cats at the time and missed out. I didn't see them for about a month, so they were sick, and they looked terrible when they finally showed up. But they survived! The cats that survived in my group were mainly the older ones. But these three somehow got through it. So yes cats CAN survive, but rarely. But it does happen! I myself would not euthanize, but I would if they are obviously suffering. as long as you could give them water with a syringe a drop at a time, and maybe some high calorie supplement you can buy at any pet store usually in a tube, you could thin it down with water, they may survive. It is sickening to see them want to drink but can't.......

After living many years and seeing many things and experiencing so much I know without a shadow of doubt that NOTHING is impossible-I myself survived Stage IV colon cancer and was given a grim prognosis,was told to get my affairs in order- that was 11 yrs ago..... I'm still here

D dorianscats I agree wholeheartedly with di and bob and personally would not euthanize unless their was suffering

I don't want to give you false hope but I would like to give you HOPE still,"where there is life there is hope"

 

[di and bob]

Thank you, Kwik! I, too, haev seen so much.... I ahev seen cats with HORRIBLE injuries, ears ripped off, etc, hit by cars, and have survived. Cats are SO tough! But that doesn't mean we can't help them through it when we can. Food and water and a safe place to stay goes a long way.....

 

[Kwik]

Thank you, Kwik! I, too, haev seen so much.... I ahev seen cats with HORRIBLE injuries, ears ripped off, etc, hit by cars, and have survived. Cats are SO tough! But that doesn't mean we can't help them through it when we can. Food and water and a safe place to stay goes a long way.....

You are always such an encourager- your contributions,kindness and support to others is priceless